ESXi wanted - Any gurus on here? - Page 4 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!



Forum Jump: 
 5Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 08:46 AM
Member
 
Dysfnctnl85's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post

So, can I just change the number of cores and memory in the ESXi virtual machine setup? Will the OS just recognize it or does this kind of thing require me to re-install the OS?

Thanks!
The short answer is you can.

The long answer is this is not advisable. In terms of the guest OS, it's as if you are swapping out the CPU and thus can introduce instability. In addition, adding more cores to the VM does not increase VM performance.

I would spend some time looking at the CPU utilization on both the guest OS and on the host. I imagine disk latency and memory pressure is a much larger concern than CPU performance.
Dysfnctnl85 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 08:50 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Thanks!

I haven't had any performance issues so far, just preparing as we'll be using Quickbooks more often going forward (started a new business last month). The OS runs on an SSD, so disk latency shouldn't be much of an issue.

I suppose I can back up the VM, change the cores and see if it produces any problems. If it does, then I can just restore and decide later if its going to be worth it to re-install the OS. Upping the memory shouldn't cause any instability I would think.

Thanks again.
ncarty97 is offline  
post #93 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 09:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
EricN's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 1,399
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 154 Post(s)
Liked: 241
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dysfnctnl85 View Post
The long answer is this is not advisable. In terms of the guest OS, it's as if you are swapping out the CPU and thus can introduce instability. In addition, adding more cores to the VM does not increase VM performance.
That conclusion doesn't follow from the link you posted. They were testing a fixed number of cores in different #sockets * #corespersocket configurations. All else being equal, adding more cores will increase vm performance in cpu-bottlenecked tasks.

Your "thus can introduce instability" claim is FUD. The whole point of virtualization is being able to adjust the allotted resources as needed. Windows Server VMs on ESX have supported hotplugging ram and cpu since 2003.
EricN is offline  
post #94 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 09:40 AM
Advanced Member
 
rc05's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
Posts: 582
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 85
That article is more about the difference between choosing 4 sockets with 1 core each (for example) rather than 1 socket with 4 cores. Nothing at all to do with a general performance increase when adding cores, which will indeed increase if more cores are added (hyperthreaded cores not as much).

In any case, I have added/removed cores on all sorts of VMs and never encountered any issue.
rc05 is offline  
post #95 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 09:42 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Thanks guys. A short follow up, can someone give me a quick primer on cores vs sockets? I think I get the general concept, but I'm not sure. Thanks
ncarty97 is offline  
post #96 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 10:23 AM
Senior Member
 
shortcut3d's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 479
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Liked: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post
Thanks guys. A short follow up, can someone give me a quick primer on cores vs sockets? I think I get the general concept, but I'm not sure. Thanks
A socket is a whole physical processor. A core is an additional execution unit on a physical processor.

VMware treats them virtually the same from a performance aspect. The distinction is more for OS and application software vendor licensing. For example, Microsoft desktop OSes have been traditionally limited to two physical CPUs. You can have many more cores per CPU, so to maximize your system utilization/performance you would use a combination of sockets and cores.
ncarty97 likes this.

Last edited by shortcut3d; 07-17-2014 at 10:31 AM.
shortcut3d is offline  
post #97 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 10:24 AM
Advanced Member
 
rc05's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
Posts: 582
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 85
Part of it was licensing, where software would be licensed "per socket". So if you had a 2 socket system with 4 cores each, you could present a single socket CPU with 8 cores to the VM, and only have to pay for one license.

That article linked specifies that if you can, give VMs 8 single core sockets instead of a single socket with 8 cores (for example).
ncarty97 likes this.
rc05 is offline  
post #98 of 152 Old 07-17-2014, 11:40 AM
Member
 
Dysfnctnl85's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricN View Post
That conclusion doesn't follow from the link you posted. They were testing a fixed number of cores in different #sockets * #corespersocket configurations. All else being equal, adding more cores will increase vm performance in cpu-bottlenecked tasks.

Your "thus can introduce instability" claim is FUD. The whole point of virtualization is being able to adjust the allotted resources as needed. Windows Server VMs on ESX have supported hotplugging ram and cpu since 2003.
It's not a question of whether or not VMWare supports it, it's about the guest OS.

It's not FUD. Modifying the hardware running Windows can result in HAL issues. I could not in good conscience tell OP to do this and as a result OP has to repair Windows -- that's not fun for anyone. It's just a risk worth noting. I've successfully altered cores and vCPUs without issues in the past, but I've also had bad experiences and needed to perform repair installs of Windows. YMMV.

The article discusses NUMA architecture, which is important in understanding how the hypervisor treats vCPUs and virtual sockets. VMWare best practices documentation discusses this in detail and warns of overcommitting vCPUs. Adding cores or vCPUs to a guest OS does not guarantee increased performance and can negatively impact the performance of multiple VMs by creating contention among them.

Monitor the existing VM and find its pain points. Adjust accordingly.
Dysfnctnl85 is offline  
post #99 of 152 Old 07-19-2014, 08:43 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Dark_Slayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 3,438
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 625 Post(s)
Liked: 415
I had heard assigning all VMs a single virtual core in esxi allows it to allocate virtual cores as necessary rather than needing manual reassignment

Is that correct?
Dark_Slayer is online now  
post #100 of 152 Old 10-07-2015, 07:02 AM
Advanced Member
 
mrted46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 883
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 30 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Is anyone having issues with esxi on windows 10? On a windows 10 machine when I run a host, it seems like the mouse doesn't line up to where it should be. For example, if I open a console on a VM, my mouse could be at the top to close a webpage but it is registering about 2" below that. This only happens on my Windows 10 laptop not on any other machine.

Does anyone else have this?
mrted46 is offline  
post #101 of 152 Old 10-07-2015, 07:13 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
I'm going to move one of my machines to Win10 this weekend to give it a test run. If no one else has answered, I'll install the the vSphere client on there, give it a test and report back.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #102 of 152 Old 10-07-2015, 07:16 AM
Advanced Member
 
mrted46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 883
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 30 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post
I'm going to move one of my machines to Win10 this weekend to give it a test run. If no one else has answered, I'll install the the vSphere client on there, give it a test and report back.
Thanks!

What version of Esxi are you on? I forgot to mention I am on 5.1
mrted46 is offline  
post #103 of 152 Old 10-07-2015, 08:21 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
I'm on 5.1

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #104 of 152 Old 11-02-2015, 07:29 PM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Sorry for the radio silence on this. The machine I was going to test Win10 on didn't work. Video card is just too old (though the machine is actually pretty new). I hacked in a Vista Driver and it did bring up Win10, but there were some text issues. Going to pick up a low end video card that supports Win10 and try it again soon, maybe this weekend.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #105 of 152 Old 11-10-2015, 07:26 AM
Advanced Member
 
mrted46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 883
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 30 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post
Sorry for the radio silence on this. The machine I was going to test Win10 on didn't work. Video card is just too old (though the machine is actually pretty new). I hacked in a Vista Driver and it did bring up Win10, but there were some text issues. Going to pick up a low end video card that supports Win10 and try it again soon, maybe this weekend.
Just tried on another win10 machine and same thing happens.

There is a disconnect between the image of the mouse and where it is registering. When you click it clicks in the right spot, but when there is a menu where you need to hover over something for another part of the menu to show up, it does not work. Wierd issue.

Wonder if there is a fix of some sort. It is more of an inconvenience than anything.
mrted46 is offline  
post #106 of 152 Old 11-10-2015, 07:37 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
I finally got Win10 running on that machine, but I had to go out of town for work. Once I'm back I'll try it again. Maybe there is a setting or something.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #107 of 152 Old 11-20-2015, 09:28 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
So, finally got back and caught up. Installed vSphere Client and test a couple of my VMs. Not experiencing the issue you are talking about at all.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #108 of 152 Old 11-20-2015, 02:03 PM
Advanced Member
 
mrted46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 883
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 30 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post
So, finally got back and caught up. Installed vSphere Client and test a couple of my VMs. Not experiencing the issue you are talking about at all.
Thanks for testing for me. I wonder why I am having it.

It happens on any win10 machine I use.
mrted46 is offline  
post #109 of 152 Old 11-20-2015, 02:09 PM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Are the video drivers on these machine actual Win10 drivers? I had a lot of problems before i upgraded my video card and one of them was that their was mouse lag. This was just in using Windows in general. When I switched the video card to one that Win10 supported, they all went away.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #110 of 152 Old 11-20-2015, 02:48 PM
Advanced Member
 
mrted46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 883
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 30 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post
Are the video drivers on these machine actual Win10 drivers? I had a lot of problems before i upgraded my video card and one of them was that their was mouse lag. This was just in using Windows in general. When I switched the video card to one that Win10 supported, they all went away.
Yea they are all up to date, the problem only occurs within the Vsphere client. I even updated to the newest version of the client too.

It's more of a nuance than anything, for example my mouse can be hovering 2" above the task bar on the bottom but it will show me information about the program as if my mouse was hovering there..when I click it does register in the right place. I hope I am explaining it correctly.

The only real problem I have is where you need to select from Menu's and sub-categories. Where you would hover over the category so the sub-category would appear, it wouldn't appear because windows thinks the mouse is 2" lower.
mrted46 is offline  
post #111 of 152 Old 11-20-2015, 03:33 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TornadoTJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 6,769
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1308 Post(s)
Liked: 402
Do you have the VMWare tools installed? Sorry if you said this already, I may have missed it.
TornadoTJ is offline  
post #112 of 152 Old 11-23-2015, 10:01 AM
Advanced Member
 
mrted46's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 883
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 30 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by TornadoTJ View Post
Do you have the VMWare tools installed? Sorry if you said this already, I may have missed it.
Yes I do, on all windows based VM
mrted46 is offline  
post #113 of 152 Old 11-25-2015, 07:19 AM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Man, having some major problems with my rig. Since I built it, every once in a while, I'd loose total network connectivity to both the host and all VMs. It was still running, just no way to connect. It was rare enough that I didn't worry about it too much. I was using the onboard realtek NIC, which I know people had reported problems with, so I bought an Intel dual NIC and use that instead, but no change.

Well, I just set up PLEX on another VM and now it is happening every night. I installed the WHS2011 client on that VM and it backs up nightly. Going to disable the nightly backup and see if that might be causing the increased problem at least. I've posted on the VMWare community forums, but it took well over a week to get even a response and nothing was particularly useful so far. Very frustrating.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #114 of 152 Old 11-25-2015, 12:49 PM
Advanced Member
 
rc05's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
Posts: 582
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by ncarty97 View Post
Man, having some major problems with my rig. Since I built it, every once in a while, I'd loose total network connectivity to both the host and all VMs. It was still running, just no way to connect. It was rare enough that I didn't worry about it too much. I was using the onboard realtek NIC, which I know people had reported problems with, so I bought an Intel dual NIC and use that instead, but no change.

Well, I just set up PLEX on another VM and now it is happening every night. I installed the WHS2011 client on that VM and it backs up nightly. Going to disable the nightly backup and see if that might be causing the increased problem at least. I've posted on the VMWare community forums, but it took well over a week to get even a response and nothing was particularly useful so far. Very frustrating.
Which version of ESXi are you running?
rc05 is offline  
post #115 of 152 Old 11-25-2015, 01:04 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TornadoTJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 6,769
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1308 Post(s)
Liked: 402
Also, are you using E1000 or VMXNET 2 or VMXNET 3 NIC type? It may not matter, but I'm curious.
ncarty97 likes this.
TornadoTJ is offline  
post #116 of 152 Old 11-25-2015, 01:19 PM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by rc05 View Post
Which version of ESXi are you running?
5.1

Quote:
Originally Posted by TornadoTJ View Post
Also, are you using E1000 or VMXNET 2 or VMXNET 3 NIC type? It may not matter, but I'm curious.
My WHS2011 and first W7 VM are using VMXNET 3. The Plex VM I set up is using E1000 though, so maybe that's what's causing the increase in these problems occuring. I'm going to change it to VMXNET 3 and see if that at least gets it back to where it was. Thanks!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #117 of 152 Old 11-25-2015, 01:22 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TornadoTJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 6,769
Mentioned: 10 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1308 Post(s)
Liked: 402
And interestingly enough, I just noticed my W7 VM is on E1000. I don't know how that happened, I never use E1000. I'm doing some massive copies right now and I noticed it was running slow, then you asked this question which made me think to check mine. I should be getting more than ~45 MB/S on my gigabit card. :P
ncarty97 likes this.
TornadoTJ is offline  
post #118 of 152 Old 11-26-2015, 06:09 PM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Well, for the first time in several days, my setup didn't crap out last night! Hopefully it repeats tonight too.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
post #119 of 152 Old 12-04-2015, 12:03 PM
AVS Special Member
 
robnix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2,593
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 588 Post(s)
Liked: 460
Quote:
Originally Posted by TornadoTJ View Post
And interestingly enough, I just noticed my W7 VM is on E1000. I don't know how that happened, I never use E1000. I'm doing some massive copies right now and I noticed it was running slow, then you asked this question which made me think to check mine. I should be getting more than ~45 MB/S on my gigabit card. :P
The VMXNET3 adapater is more stable and performs much better then that E1000 and the E1000e. Good article here:

http://rickardnobel.se/vmxnet3-vs-e1...-e1000-part-1/

Looky here!
robnix is online now  
post #120 of 152 Old 12-04-2015, 01:12 PM
Advanced Member
 
ncarty97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 75 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Well, it seems that the trigger for my problem is WHS2011 doing a backup. I don't think WHS2011 backing up IS the problem itself, but triggering it. Pretty much any time my PlexVM runs the backup service during the night, I wake up to a non-responsive server.

Part of me thinks, F it, just back up the VMs and upgrade to the lastest ESXi and see if that resolves the issue. I already have a backup of the ESXi host anyway (since its just a flash drive), so going back should be easy enough.

If I just had a couple days I could do this undisturbed....

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Carty Custom Builders, LLC
ncarty97 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Home Theater Computers

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off