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post #1 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 06:22 AM - Thread Starter
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My 7 year old HP Slimline unexpectedly died after a power outage, it's probably the power supply, but I figure I might as well look at getting a whole new setup. It's time. I looked into getting one of those low powered Foxconn boxes with the E-350 APU, but they are going for around $150 right now. I already have the SSD which I will be transferring over to the new computer, so if I can build my own for around $200 or not much more and get better performance I figure I should do that. I think the best bet would be one of the AMD APU processors, but I'm not sure which one would be best. I'm not doing any gaming, basically my absolute requirements for video are:

Does vector adaptive deinterlacing for 480/1080i content
Upscales non 1080p videos to 1080p using an advanced scaling method comparable to Lanczos/Spline

I have an AMD 5450 card on my now dead pc, and it does VA deinterlacing but the DXVA scaling on non 1080 content is bad. It looks like bicubic which is blurry.

AMD A6-5400K Trinity 3.6GHz (3.8GHz Turbo) Socket FM2 65W Dual-Core Desktop APU (CPU + GPU) with DirectX 11 Graphic AMD Radeon HD 7540D AD540KOKHJBOX
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113282

AMD A6-3650 Llano 2.6GHz Socket FM1 100W Quad-Core Desktop APU (CPU + GPU) with DirectX 11 Graphic AMD Radeon HD 6530D
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103943

The first one is a dual core clocked higher and the next is a quad clocked lower. They are both $69. Which would fit my needs better? Could I even get away with something like the $39:

AMD A4-3300 Llano 2.5GHz Socket FM1 65W Dual-Core Desktop APU (CPU + GPU) with DirectX 11 Graphic AMD Radeon HD 6410D
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819106013

I've never built a system before, but I'm assuming I would need a motherboard like the:

ASRock FM2A55M-DGS FM2 AMD A55 (Hudson D2) Micro ATX AMD Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157332

Any case recommendations? I'm assuming it will have to be a Micro ATX case? I want something similar in size to my old Slimline, or smaller. I'll be using this for XBMC, WMC, and basic web browsing. No gaming/encoding/photoshop. My budget is a hard $250, and I'd like to get it closer to $200 if possible (remember, I already have a hard drive). So I need:

Processor
Motherboard
Case/Power supply
RAM (thinking 8GB)

Thanks for the help!
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post #2 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 08:37 AM
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Dig around for one of renethx's charts here for madVR capabilities with those APUs...he's done a great job of sorting that out.


Personally, I'd go FM2 dual core to at least allow a Richland upgrade later, but that's as far as you'll get with that socket. Getting last gen FM1 will save you some $$ but will lock you in. There are a few affordable matx htpc style cases. mitx setups are smaller but the boards and cases are generally pricier. Ram is pricier now, and you could always scrimp with 4gb with your stated usage.
Remember that the cheaper cases come with generic PSUs if included. I prefer name brand PSUs.
one nice case: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163174

Will you be needing an optical drive?
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post #3 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 08:47 AM
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On sale for 10% off, that A6-5400K looks like a pretty good deal. If you can go micro-ATX I'd pick Trinity over Llano. If you're going to play with madVR/SVP though, A6-5400K is pretty weak. I'd also stay away from 100W TDP APUs in mini/micro-ATX builds due to the heat and power draw.

 

 

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post #4 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 08:54 AM
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Why are you only considering AMD ?

I say get a MILO03 Silverstone case and a cheap $20 coolermaster 460watt PSU ( since your on a tight budget).

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post #5 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 09:45 AM
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Intel is a more robust CPU for the money:







I'd guess that the integrated graphics in the Intel should be sufficient for basic playback with no difference in quality versus the AMD chip, but the capability and speed of the CPU would be increased on Intel. If the GPU was not good enough on the Intel it's unlikely the AMD would be the proper solution as well- in which case your better off just adding a GPU card. The determining factor is how serious do you need to be with MadVR, or whatever upscaling programs you choose ? There is no system that is going to run SVP well- my 4770k I7 can'd do it without a GPU card.

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=G2020BOX $59.99 minus 10% coupon code = $54

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=G1610BOX $42.99 minus 10% coupon code = $37.50

Keep in mind you can add a silent Low profile 6450 card as cheap as $9.99. (I've seen recently) A normal price is only $29 like this one :http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121439

For $10 more you get a 6570 : http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102994

I'd guess a $38 Intel and a $30 GPU card might do what you want better than a $75 AMD CPU.

Here's an idea:

Case+ PSU $40 : http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811154087
CPU $38 http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?name=G1610BOX
Mobo $62.99 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157356
4GB DDR3: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820226285

You can save 10% on the memory:


Or if you wanted 8GB you could upgrade for $52: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148544&nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL061113&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL061113-_-EMC-061113-Index-_-DesktopMemory-_-20148544-L0A




40+38+63+33= $174. (4GB no GPU card)
40+38+63+33+30= $204 (with GPU 6450 card)
40+38+63+52= $193 with 8GB DDR3 1600mhz
40+38+63+52+30= $223 (GPU card and 8GB DDR3)

If you wanted to push your budget you could go with the higher CPU and higher 6570 GPU card:
40+54+63+52+40= $249 biggrin.gif

That is what I would do with your $250 firm budget. A G2020 + a 6570 Radeon GPU card, 8GB DDR3 1600mhz, and Asrock M-ATX Mobo with HDMI, Sata3, USB3.0, and a 3.0 x16 slot.

You can run that system on a crappy 275 watts PSU if your budget is firm. I would not be scared to do it.

If you want to have your cake and eat it too- You could find a way to go with this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811163174
11-163-174-TS?$S300W$

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post #6 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 09:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

Why are you only considering AMD ?

Probably this...
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

Does vector adaptive deinterlacing for 480/1080i content
Upscales non 1080p videos to 1080p using an advanced scaling method comparable to Lanczos/Spline

 

 

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post #7 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

Why are you only considering AMD ?

Probably this...
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

Does vector adaptive deinterlacing for 480/1080i content
Upscales non 1080p videos to 1080p using an advanced scaling method comparable to Lanczos/Spline

You can't do that with a 6570 or 6450 Radeon card for $20 or $30 ?

*** I should have noted that the 6570 card has an alternate slim line half height backplate (you can/must remove the VGA port)

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post #8 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

You can't do that with a 6570 or 6450 Radeon card for $20 or $30 ?

Probably this...
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

I have an AMD 5450 card on my now dead pc, and it does VA deinterlacing but the DXVA scaling on non 1080 content is bad. It looks like bicubic which is blurry.

biggrin.gif

 

 

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post #9 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

You can't do that with a 6570 or 6450 Radeon card for $20 or $30 ?

Probably this...
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

I have an AMD 5450 card on my now dead pc, and it does VA deinterlacing but the DXVA scaling on non 1080 content is bad. It looks like bicubic which is blurry.

biggrin.gif

I was not aware the integrated GPU in AMD these days had capabilities beyond a cheap stand alone 6450 or 6570 card, or a modern Intel integrated GPU.

I am admittedly less interested and knowledgeable about AMD these days. (I used to be a fan boy back in socket 939 times wink.gif )

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post #10 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

I was not aware the integrated GPU in AMD these days had capabilities beyond a cheap stand alone 6450 or 6570 card, or a modern Intel integrated GPU.

I am admittedly less interested and knowledgeable about AMD these days. (I used to be a fan boy back in socket 939 times wink.gif )

I don't know about the lower-end GPUs in the APUs the OP is asking about but in the higher-end, it's does very well with the type of de-interlacing the OP is asking for.

http://us.hardware.info/reviews/3202/35/amd-a10-5800k--a8-5600k-full-review-trinity-for-desktops-video-quality

Personally, if I were build an HTPC and my goal was to watch interlaced video, I'll be going with the A10-5700 or A8-5500 to get the best GPU I can *if* I didn't want a discrete video card in my HTPC (I personally do not). I have an A8-3820 in my living room HTPC. I've always found lower-end AMD not quite to my liking.

I went with an A8-3820 because my i3-2100 setup had what I can only called "weirdness" going on with 1080i (CBS football). No weirdness with the A8-3820. It has the best integrated Llano GPU and is 65W TDP.

 

 

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post #11 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 12:29 PM
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"weirdness"

I like that term.

I used to like Sandy Bridge video but after living with Ivy and Haswell, as well as AMD GPU cards- I've discovered I don't quite care for it as much as I once did.

It's really small things I doubt anyone else would ever notice. I'd guess I could call it "weirdness" too.

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post #12 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 12:45 PM
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The Master has checked into this thread. ^

ReneThx,

I'd be curios to hear your thoughts on a G1610/20 + 6570 GPU card or even Radeon 6450 card?

$38 + $30 seems like a reasonable total of $68 for someone looking for a low budget system.

I've seen GPU 6450 low profile cards going for $9.99 and $14.99 after rebate more than a few times. The 6570's go as low as $20 sometimes.

I'm not 100% on the difference between them and an AMD built in GPU these days. I was always under the impression the card on an Intel chip was better, but I've never tested myself.

I do like the 0-255, 3D, and better refresh rate on the cards historically. (Like on Sandy bridge days) Seems like with newer AMD and Intel(Haswell) perhaps the advantages of a GPU card are going the way of the dinosaurs.

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post #13 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 12:49 PM
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A6-5400K is on-sale 10% off at Newegg: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113282 $69.99 - $7 = $62.99. That seems like a good value given the requirements and looking at the prices of the other AMD APUs.

 

 

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post #14 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 12:52 PM
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How about bumping up the Ivy CPU one step ? Worth it ? Noticeable gains ?

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post #15 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

A6-5400K is on-sale 10% off at Newegg: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113282 $69.99 - $7 = $62.99. That seems like a good value given the requirements and looking at the prices of the other AMD APUs.

I think this is solid deal^ If your certain it would work and you don't need more $62 gets you a lot of GPU for a HTPC. My preference is for something with more robust CPU performance (speed) but I do a little more with my HTPC than just use it as an XBMC appliance.

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post #16 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 01:01 PM
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BTW there is a huge difference (in my eyes) between Level 3 (BiCubic75+AR / Lanczos3+AR) and Level 4 (BiCubic75+AR / Jinc3+AR) in upscaling SD/HD to FHD. A question is, is there an iGPU solution for Level 4? The answer is Yes: A10-5800K/6800K (with iGPU overclocked > 1.1GHz) + DDR3-2400. Of course Intel Iris Pro 5200 too (but too expensive to justify it). The upcoming AMD Kaveri APU will be the final answer.
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post #17 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
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How about bumping up the Ivy CPU one step ? Worth it ? Noticeable gains ?

MadVR uses shader cores to execute its algorithms via DirectX API. CPU is less important.
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post #18 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

My 7 year old HP Slimline unexpectedly died after a power outage, it's probably the power supply, but I figure I might as well look at getting a whole new setup. It's time. I looked into getting one of those low powered Foxconn boxes with the E-350 APU, but they are going for around $150 right now. I already have the SSD which I will be transferring over to the new computer, so if I can build my own for around $200 or not much more and get better performance I figure I should do that. I think the best bet would be one of the AMD APU processors, but I'm not sure which one would be best. I'm not doing any gaming, basically my absolute requirements for video are:



Any case recommendations? I'm assuming it will have to be a Micro ATX case? I want something similar in size to my old Slimline, or smaller. I'll be using this for XBMC, WMC, and basic web browsing. No gaming/encoding/photoshop. My budget is a hard $250, and I'd like to get it closer to $200 if possible (remember, I already have a hard drive). So I need:

Processor
Motherboard
Case/Power supply
RAM (thinking 8GB)

Thanks for the help!

First of all, why spend all the money when you can just fix it? Get yourself a PSU tester or a paperclip and multimeter and check if your PSU is indeed down. Check if it is just a blown fuse. Check if it boots without GPU. If only your motherboard is dead, it is quite easy to replace it with another mini-ITX motherboard (assuming you have s3000 slimline) and reuse the case, even the PSU.
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post #19 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 06:06 PM
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My Triple Core APU crushes any entry level graphics card, especially with 1600Mhz memory which I have, I have a 1GB buffer.... The other 3GB are for the system which only used between 1.8-1.9GB. APU's work just fine, no extra cards to install, runs cool, I have my fans turned ALL THE WAY DOWN, inaudible period. The hum that's left is coming from my Buffalo External Drives...

This laptop is Trinity powered (Asus), runs cooler than my older HP with AMD Dual Core and crushes every PC in the house including my sister's vaunted Mac Book (i5). Its also quite and powerful.

Blah, Blah, Blah Intel.

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post #20 of 120 Old 06-12-2013, 11:13 PM
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With the introduction of Smooth Motion and the advancements on the 3dlut calibration (both add some processing time to the video), it is something to also consider. After tweaking my A6-5400k + DDR3-1866, I can use it with Level 3 with little dropped frames on 720p content. But I think a A10-5800k will definitely be more future-proof for new stuff that madshi might be developing! :-)
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post #21 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 01:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the suggestions guys. It's been a real help. The charts about GPU levels and MadVR are interesting, but they don't really apply to me because I don't use MadVR, and I probably never will unless they figure out a way to integrate it into XBMC. I use XBMC for all my Blu-ray rips, mkv, XBMC Video Addons, ect, and I use WMC for recording and live tv. I guess what I need to know is if there is going to be any improvement in dxva scaling/deinterlacing/IVTC/menu fluidity/overall picture quality upgrading my current fanless 5450 video card to a 6570, or using the APU in the AMD A6-5400K in non-MadVR situations, ie XBMC, WMC, or watching Youtube/ESPN in a browser? If not, I'm probably better off going with the $20 cheaper Celeron G1610 that actually benches 452 points higher than the A6-5400K, and re-using my old 5450 into the new build. To be honest I've never heard of the Celeron G1610 until now, but it seems to just be an i3 with less cache, no hyper-threading, and some of the graphics features disabled (which would be made up with the 5450 I presume).

Is there going to be any improvement in dxva scaling/deinterlacing/IVTC/menu fluidity/overall picture quality upgrading my current fanless 5450 video card to a 6570, or using the APU in the AMD A6-5400K in non-MadVR situations, ie XBMC, WMC, or watching Youtube/ESPN in a browser?
I could either do this with 2 different builds. A super cheap Intel setup, or a still cheap but slightly more expensive AMD setup.

Intel
Intel Celeron G1610 Ivy Bridge 2.6GHz LGA 1155 55W Dual-Core Desktop Processor $42@Amazon
MSI H61M-P31/W8 LGA 1155 Intel H61 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard with UEFI BIOS $48
Is there any point in spending $10 more on the LGA 1155 B75 motherboard if I don't really care about Sata 6 (doesn't make any real world difference from what I hear) or I don't have any USB 3.0 drives? The AMD 5450 would make up for lack of HDMI.
Crucial Ballistix Sport 8GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory $47
Do I have to buy dual channel 4x2, or can I just get one 8GB stick for now so I can upgrade to 16GB in the future if needed? I would hate to have to throw away ram if I upgraded down the line since there are only 2 slots on these motherboards. 1 stick is cheaper than 4x2 as well.
APEX MI-008 Black Steel Mini-ITX Tower Computer Case 250W Power Supply $40
or
APEX DM-387 Black Steel Micro ATX Media Center / Slim HTPC Computer Case w/ ATX12V Flex 275W Power Supply $39@Amazon
64GB Crucial SSD $0
AMD 5450 $0
DVD Burner (may not even install, haven't used it in over a year) $0
Total $177

AMD
AMD A6-5400K Trinity 3.6GHz (3.8GHz Turbo) Socket FM2 65W Dual-Core Desktop APU (CPU + GPU) with DirectX 11 Graphic AMD Radeon HD 7540D $60
ASRock FM2A75M-DGS FM2 AMD A75 (Hudson D3) SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX AMD Motherboard $58
or
MSI FM2-A75MA-E35 FM2 AMD A75 (Hudson D3) HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX AMD Motherboard $60 Sold Out at the moment
Crucial Ballistix Sport 8GB 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory $47
APEX MI-008 Black Steel Mini-ITX Tower Computer Case 250W Power Supply $40
or
APEX DM-387 Black Steel Micro ATX Media Center / Slim HTPC Computer Case w/ ATX12V Flex 275W Power Supply $39@Amazon
64GB Crucial SSD $0
DVD Burner (may not even install, haven't used it in over a year) $0
Total $205

Either of these systems would smoke a similarly priced E-350/E-450 pre-built system, no?

From what I understand the Intel cpu should run a little cooler, but overall I don't know how big a difference it would make. I like the design of the Apex MI-088 Mini tower, but do you think the compact design could cause problems for this setup? How do these options stack up? Any other suggestions/comments to add? Also really interested in the real world non MadVR differences between these GPUs. I'm hoping to buy in the next day or 2. Thanks!
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post #22 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 01:54 AM
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Quote:
any improvement in dxva scaling/deinterlacing/IVTC/menu fluidity/overall picture quality

No, not at all. DXVA = algorithms in the driver, that's fixed throughout the entire AMD graphics cards (= Bilinear in chroma/image upscaling).

If you are going to stick to DXVA, Celeron is a better choice, with DDR3-1600 and a B75 chipset mb (ASRock B75M).
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post #23 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 03:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

No, not at all. DXVA = algorithms in the driver, that's fixed throughout the entire AMD graphics cards (= Bilinear in chroma/image upscaling).

If you are going to stick to DXVA, Celeron is a better choice, with DDR3-1600 and a B75 chipset mb (ASRock B75M).
Really? I thought the higher end cards 6570 on up had better default scaling abilities? At least that's so according to an XBMC dev-

http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=127174&pid=1390867#pid1390867
Quote:
The patch is not in master because as reported it has problems on NV cards (video goes black when changing scaling methods during playback) but I can neither test or attempt to fix it because everything around me is Ati.

There are some factually incorrect statements in that avsforum post (or my 6570 is an exception). If your card has the power you can do DXVA Best and Lanczos/Spline scaling. At least it works with my HD 6570 without any issues. Not sure about the 5450, but I guess it still should have enough power to do it at least with SD videos. Also with DXVA scaling my HD 6570 does definitely better than bilinear (it looks like something between Spline and Lanczos).
He's quoting your chart by the way. I don't know if he's right or wrong, but I'm assuming he knows what he's talking about reading his posts. If he's wrong (or blind) why would AMD limit high quality scaling on cards that have enough shader power to handle it? I'm using his patch, and I can watch 720p files upscaled to 1080p with Lanczos/Spline using DXVA, so the cards can certainly handle it, even the 5450. Without his patch, upscaled DXVA videos look like blurry crap.

The G1610 can't even do advanced deinterlacing (similar to vector) can it? Even if it could, DXVA Best deinterlacing is busted on XBMC. It simply doesn't work, the screen goes black.
http://forum.xbmc.org/showthread.php?tid=147171

If all this is true, it seems like neither Intel nor AMD can do high quality scaling AND high quality deinterlacing in all of the scenarios I'm looking for. Should I look at Nvidia cards then, or is there nothing that is going to suit my very specific playback requirements?
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Originally Posted by pixelation 
First of all, why spend all the money when you can just fix it? Get yourself a PSU tester or a paperclip and multimeter and check if your PSU is indeed down. Check if it is just a blown fuse. Check if it boots without GPU. If only your motherboard is dead, it is quite easy to replace it with another mini-ITX motherboard (assuming you have s3000 slimline) and reuse the case, even the PSU.
I definitely thought about this at first. I have a weird form factor power supply though. The only replacements I could find were from Athena Power...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Description=hp%20slimline%20power%20supply&Submit=ENE
All the reviews complained of a loud fan and poor reliability. I thought about getting a Pico PSU, but do I really want to spend $50-60 on something that might not even have enough juice to power my system? I have an AMD BE-2300 processor. If anyone has any suggestions I'd love to hear them.

Also found some more that look like they would fit but they are pretty pricey for what you get.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007657%20600014011&IsNodeId=1&name=Mini%20ITX

Here's a picture of the inside of my tower. I removed the cpu cooler but you can see that it fits right under the power supply. Not much room at all.

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post #24 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Intel HD Graphics in IVB / Haswell (even in Celeron) is good for madVR DXVA2, that's equivalent to Level 3 in PQ. The basic difference is:

- Intel HD Graphics: uses ASICs (mainly), it's closer to "appliance", lower power consumption, no room for other algorithms but Intel's own.
- AMD: uses shader units; it's versatile, user programmable, higher power consumption.

In Intel NUC vs AMD's equivalent (Kabini-based), this is very important. Intel NUC (in particular Haswell-based) will be superior. Kabini's 2 Compute Units (= 128 Radeon cores) is too weak to do something interesting.

I think this quote might help answer your questions. AMD uses shader units which can be powerful but not as efficient. It depends in the different tasks.

If your only trying to playback with XBMC internal player and no extras like MADVR then the Celeron would actually work well without a GPU card.

unless your getting picky about resolution and refresh rates / drop frames - or your trying to get silly accurate with it, you don't need a GPU to use the simple integrated player.

We assumed your looking for MADVR I think.

For internal XBMC player a AMD or Intel chip should work fine. Newer chips do a little better with the drop frames (both AMD and Intel Haswell) but if coarse you always pay more for better. I'm reading between the lines that your a little more simple in your demands and expectations than I originally assumed.

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post #25 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 08:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

I think this quote might help answer your questions. AMD uses shader units which can be powerful but not as efficient. It depends in the different tasks.

If your only trying to playback with XBMC internal player and no extras like MADVR then the Celeron would actually work well without a GPU card.

unless your getting picky about resolution and refresh rates / drop frames - or your trying to get silly accurate with it, you don't need a GPU to use the simple integrated player.

We assumed your looking for MADVR I think.

For internal XBMC player a AMD or Intel chip should work fine. Newer chips do a little better with the drop frames (both AMD and Intel Haswell) but if coarse you always pay more for better. I'm reading between the lines that your a little more simple in your demands and expectations than I originally assumed.
Pretty much. I'm not trying to do all kinds of fancy scaling with MadVR Jinc ect. I just want something that can do Lanczos3/Spline36 stable, and can do vector adaptive deinterlacing (or the equivalent for each manufacturer). The problem with the Intel GPU is that it can't do advanced deinterlacing in XBMC. According to reports the video won't even play. I still watch a lot of 1080i content, and vector adaptive deinterlacing on these sources is absolutely wonderful. Motion adaptive looks soft and has jagged edges. This seems to be an XBMC specific problem, and if they can't get it figured out then I can't use Intel graphics right now. There have been multiple posts on the subject but all the devs ever say is "post logs" and then nothing ever comes out of it.
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post #26 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 08:24 AM
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I think you'd like mpc-hc

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post #27 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 08:33 AM - Thread Starter
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I think you'd like mpc-hc
I have MPC-HC, it plays fine but it doesn't hold a candle to XBMC when you have like 500 movies and tv shows stored. And no, I don't want to launch an external player when the remote control functionality isn't as good.

I found this post from renethx and it about sums up Intel iGPU with XBMC
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

There are lots of pictures (most of them are pointless, unfortunately) and posts. Here is a quick summary of my own. smile.gif

Summary of Intel iGPU + XBMC

1. Intel iGPU's decoder and deinterlacer are broken in XBMC so that you have to disable DXVA2.
2. Then the video playback is completely in software mode and PQ is identical no matter what GPU you use, Intel, AMD, NVIDIA. Decoding is done by CPU and all DI/post-processing tasks are done by CPU (maybe pixel shaders of GPU) with XBMC's own algorithms.
3. As a result, you will see higher CPU usage than DXVA2 mode. I saw at HD AVC video playback with Celeron G530 2.4GHz,

- ~10% with DXVA2 on (often with heavy pixelation, that's the reason why DXVA2 has to be off)
- 40%-60% CPU usage with DXVA2 off

Deinterlacing is poorer than DXVA2 mode (at least in benchmarks) and often results in stuttering. Read also

- DI in DXVA2
- DI in non-DXVA2.

So the conclusion is pretty clear (to me smile.gif ): avoid Intel iGPU for XBMC. Llano (I recommend A6-3500) is a better choice (or add a discrete card for the best PQ).

Update: I found that A6-3500 is already one of the most popular CPU+GPU in the XBMC community. No need of my recommendation. wink.gif

Summary of Intel iGPU's hardware deinterlacer

Intel iGPU does deinterlacing by a fixed function of GPU called "Media Sampler" + Intel graphics driver's algorithm. It works under one of:

- Any DXVA2 video decoder + EVR (e.g. WMC/WMP, TMT, PowerDVD, MPC-HC with built-in decoder + EVR [CP])
- Any video decoder outputting NV12 with correct interlaced flag (e.g. ffdshow Video Decoder) + EVR
- Intel QuickSync video decoder (the latest build) + any video renderer
- Any video decoder + madVR

Deinterlacing quality is more or less equivalent to AMD's Vector Adaptive.

Problems? Personally I don't see any.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1416082/intel-hd2000-igpu-testing/0_100#post_22142764
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post #28 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 08:39 AM
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You know you can use XBMC to surf you media and configure XBMC to use mpc hc as the player instead of its own player ... Right ?

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post #29 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 11:31 AM
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I wish madVR worked with CableCard TV frown.gif

 

 

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post #30 of 120 Old 06-13-2013, 11:35 AM
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What do you use for your player ? Your an XBMC guy right ? (or MB? I forgot) Do you use internal players ? Or MPC-HC ?

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