Theory About Intel's HDMI Quantization Range Setting (Full 0-255) - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 207 Old 10-08-2013, 01:58 PM
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I am just wondering, after following along for quite a long time if I have things set correctly. I followed this thread and have utilized the script to change the registry settings for 0-255 and the picture looks real good with deep blacks but is a bit on the "warm" side for some content.

I have an nVidia GT 430 GPU and have every thing set to 0-255. If I set the GPU driver to 16-235 the image is washed out but changing settings in MadVR and / or LAV Video do not change what is perceived on screen too much. Did I do something wrong?

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post #92 of 207 Old 10-08-2013, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike99 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetLow View Post

Ivy Bridge rate accuracy not so bad as you may think smile.gif :


What program are you using that displays this data?

If you are using MadVR hit CTRL J on your keyboard.

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post #93 of 207 Old 10-08-2013, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post


Is that a custom resolution or the default 23hz preset?

Custom, this DTD: F9 1C 80 40 73 38 2C 40 7E 2C 45 80 00 00 00 00 00 1E

One thing I can't do - make near 48Hz view: Samsung firmware give very strange reaction on that rate on input, (although, AFAIK, panel work at this rate internally on near 24Hz input).

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post #94 of 207 Old 10-08-2013, 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

If you are using MadVR hit CTRL J on your keyboard.

Thanks for the reply.
However I'm not using MadVR. I'm using WMC7 and also have MPC-HC on the HTPC. While MPC-HC and CTRL J displays the frame rate, I did not see anything about how often a frame was dropped or repeated. Can this data somehow be extracted or determined using MPC-HC?
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post #95 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 04:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike99 View Post

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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

If you are using MadVR hit CTRL J on your keyboard.

Thanks for the reply.
However I'm not using MadVR. I'm using WMC7 and also have MPC-HC on the HTPC. While MPC-HC and CTRL J displays the frame rate, I did not see anything about how often a frame was dropped or repeated. Can this data somehow be extracted or determined using MPC-HC?

That information is only displayed with the Madshi's Video Renderer, MadVR. You won't get it with EVR (CP) or any other of the renderers in MPC-HC.

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post #96 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 07:56 AM
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Is this anything to do with video drops? I've a i7 3770k, but I can't find this control panel on my Win 7 64. If I change on my NVidia Control Panel to 0 - 255, my issues with frame drops will be gone? By now, I must change to 23 Hz sample rate, but after 2 hours of video on PowerDVD 11, there is a frame drop. What can I do to avoid this? Thank ou

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post #97 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vgtex View Post

Is this anything to do with video drops? I've a i7 3770k, but I can't find this control panel on my Win 7 64. If I change on my NVidia Control Panel to 0 - 255, my issues with frame drops will be gone? By now, I must change to 23 Hz sample rate, but after 2 hours of video on PowerDVD 11, there is a frame drop. What can I do to avoid this? Thank ou

Worrying about one frame drop that you will not see in two hours run time is ludicrous.

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post #98 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vgtex View Post

Is this anything to do with video drops? I've a i7 3770k, but I can't find this control panel on my Win 7 64. If I change on my NVidia Control Panel to 0 - 255, my issues with frame drops will be gone? By now, I must change to 23 Hz sample rate, but after 2 hours of video on PowerDVD 11, there is a frame drop. What can I do to avoid this? Thank ou

There is a separate thread about 23.976 support. Only the Haswell CPUs has precise 23.976 support without frame drop. All the earlier versions of Intel iGPU suffers from this frame drop.
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post #99 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post


All the earlier versions of Intel iGPU suffers from this frame drop.

By default, but not always ;)

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post #100 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post


There is a separate thread about 23.976 support. Only the Haswell CPUs has precise 23.976 support without frame drop. All the earlier versions of Intel iGPU suffers from this frame drop.

Sorry for my ignorance, but are you saying to me that if I keep my i7 Ivy Bridge, I'll continue to see frame drops? Note that I'm usying a VGA Geforce GTX 780 to output video through a HDMI cable to a receiver Denon X1000. But I need a final word: IF I change my processor to a Haswell CPU, I'll never see frame drops again? By usying a VGA to output video and not on board Intel graphics, I'll be able to end with my problems only changing CPU to a Haswell? (these Haswell fits on a 1155 socket motherboard). Thank you! 

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post #101 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 02:35 PM
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post #102 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 02:55 PM
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Yes, I already read a lot of this thread, but I'm asking if changing my processor to a Haswell, but still usying this Nvidia Geforce VGA, I can end with frame drops. Because I don't see a final way to solve my issue. I read that post, but I can't understand the relation with processor, 'cause it seems that these issues are only a VGA fault. Am I right? Or changing processor to a Haswell but keeping the Geforce VGA will solve my problem?

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post #103 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vgtex View Post

Quote:
Yes, I already read a lot of this thread, but I'm asking if changing my processor to a Haswell, but still usying this Nvidia Geforce VGA, I can end with frame drops. Because I don't see a final way to solve my issue. I read that post, but I can't understand the relation with processor, 'cause it seems that these issues are only a VGA fault. Am I right? Or changing processor to a Haswell but keeping the Geforce VGA will solve my problem?

Those are not related. It is Haswell iGPU that produces no frame drops all by itself.

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post #104 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 03:52 PM
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Does anyone have any comments on this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

I am just wondering, after following along for quite a long time if I have things set correctly. I followed this thread and have utilized the script to change the registry settings for 0-255 and the picture looks real good with deep blacks but is a bit on the "warm" side for some content.

I have an nVidia GT 430 GPU and have every thing set to 0-255. If I set the GPU driver to 16-235 the image is washed out but changing settings in MadVR and / or LAV Video do not change what is perceived on screen too much. Did I do something wrong?

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post #105 of 207 Old 10-09-2013, 06:38 PM
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Did you adjust the brightness (black level) and contrast (white level) on your display?
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post #106 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 01:28 AM
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madshi,

What is THE gpu you can recommend when I m looking for perfect playback of video content (Blu-Ray content) on my HTPC? I use MPC-BE, madVR, LAV filters and my display device is a Sony VPL-VW1000ES projector.

ps. If you would like to see the VW1000 no problem, we both live in Holland wink.gif
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post #107 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 04:50 AM
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Is that 4K ?

-

"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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post #108 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

What is THE gpu you can recommend when I m looking for perfect playback of video content (Blu-Ray content) on my HTPC? I use MPC-BE, madVR, LAV filters and my display device is a Sony VPL-VW1000ES projector.

ps. If you would like to see the VW1000 no problem, we both live in Holland wink.gif

Depends on whether you want madVR to upscale to 4K for you, and if you do, whether you only need support for 24p, or whether you also need 60p. In the latter case you might need a GPU monster, at least if you want to use Jinc. With a lesser algorithm, a mid range GPU might suffice. But I can't really say for sure, haven't tested that myself.

(Hamburg here, not Holland.)
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post #109 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

Does anyone have any comments on this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

I am just wondering, after following along for quite a long time if I have things set correctly. I followed this thread and have utilized the script to change the registry settings for 0-255 and the picture looks real good with deep blacks but is a bit on the "warm" side for some content.

I have an nVidia GT 430 GPU and have every thing set to 0-255. If I set the GPU driver to 16-235 the image is washed out but changing settings in MadVR and / or LAV Video do not change what is perceived on screen too much. Did I do something wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jim2100 View Post

Did you adjust the brightness (black level) and contrast (white level) on your display?

Yes, but it is still "warm". I actually like it that way but it seems a little too black sometimes. If I adjust the display too much, it effects how Live/Recorded TV looks in the native WMC player so I backed that down a bit. Maybe I need to go through some calibration but within MadVR or LAV so it doesn't effect the WMC player. Any suggestions on how to do this?

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post #110 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 05:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

Depends on whether you want madVR to upscale to 4K for you, and if you do, whether you only need support for 24p, or whether you also need 60p. In the latter case you might need a GPU monster, at least if you want to use Jinc. With a lesser algorithm, a mid range GPU might suffice. But I can't really say for sure, haven't tested that myself.

(Hamburg here, not Holland.)
didn t knew that madvr can upscale 2k to 4k. How do i config madvr to do this? Also, my purpose is only to play 1080p23 blu-ray content so no high frame rates needed.

I thought you where from Holland by the way! Sorry ;smile.gif

There s also another problem: the Sony vw1000 is supposed to have issues when you feed it with rgb but i cannot find out what these exact issues are. All i know is that with my intel hd2000 gpu the vw1000 does not change anything when setting it (the vw1000) to LIMITED or FULL. I think i can confirm if something is wrong by installing the amd card tonight and set the amd card on full rgb output and after this toggle full and limited on the vw1000. If this does not make any difference something is i think wrong with the vw1000. Are you following me on this a little bit and does this makes any sense?
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post #111 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

didn t knew that madvr can upscale 2k to 4k. How do i config madvr to do this?

You simply configure your GPU to output 4Kp23, and then set the media player to zoom.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

There s also another problem: the Sony vw1000 is supposed to have issues when you feed it with rgb but i cannot find out what these exact issues are. All i know is that with my intel hd2000 gpu the vw1000 does not change anything when setting it (the vw1000) to LIMITED or FULL. I think i can confirm if something is wrong by installing the amd card tonight and set the amd card on full rgb output and after this toggle full and limited on the vw1000. If this does not make any difference something is i think wrong with the vw1000. Are you following me on this a little bit and does this makes any sense?

I've heard about that there might be some problem, but I don't know what it is, and without having such a projector, obviously I don't know how to check. Maybe you want to donate your projector to me, so I can test with it? That would help madVR development... biggrin.gif

You should be able to test which problem there is exactly, by testing with black & white level test patterns / videos.
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post #112 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 07:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post


Those are not related. It is Haswell iGPU that produces no frame drops all by itself.

Thanks for your reply. So, if I finally change my CPU for a brand new Haswell, but at the same time, still outputting video by a GTX 780, will I have frame drops? Or will I need a HTPC solution ONLY with Haswell, without this VGA like this article did  http://www.anandtech.com/show/7007/intels-haswell-an-htpc-perspective/10 ? Sorry, but I still afraid of buy new components without total sure. Thank you! 

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post #113 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 07:37 AM
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The problem described before only applies when use the video output from the motherboard which is connected to Intel's iGPU. If you have problem with video output of your NVidia card, that's totally unrelated. You will have to ask advise from NVidia owners.

BTW, Haswell CPU has a totally different socket, Socket 1150. It won't be compatible with your Ivy Bridge motherboard's 1155 socket. In other words, you will need a new motherboard if you buy a Haswell CPU.
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post #114 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

The problem described before only applies when use the video output from the motherboard which is connected to Intel's iGPU. If you have problem with video output of your NVidia card, that's totally unrelated. You will have to ask advise from NVidia owners.

BTW, Haswell CPU has a totally different socket, Socket 1150. It won't be compatible with your Ivy Bridge motherboard's 1155 socket. In other words, you will need a new motherboard if you buy a Haswell CPU.

Thank you. And, yes, I know that. I'll have to change my MB. But I had hope if changing CPU, would end with my problems. Are you telling me that if I change CPU but keeping this VGA, I'll not end my issues? This is a innerent issue from Nvidia cards? Geforce can't display 23.976? So there is no need to change my CPU and MB because my Nvidia VGA will be for SURE, NOT display 23.976? Thank you

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post #115 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 09:31 AM
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Read the other thread I linked before. There should be some information about NVidia. Your CPU of choice won't have anything to do with it.
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post #116 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

Read the other thread I linked before. There should be some information about NVidia. Your CPU of choice won't have anything to do with it.

I already read it. If a Haswell CPU will not give me 23.976 with my Nvidia card, then I assume that I can't solve my issue. A custom resolution for 3D playback is impossible. Thank you, anyway 

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post #117 of 207 Old 10-10-2013, 10:29 AM
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You are not understanding this. You don't need a GPU with Haswell at all.

As a sidebar, I can hardly see justifying the cost of a new MB and CPU to get rid of one frame drop every 2 hours that you will not notice anyhow.

At any rate, this thread is not for this as it is for quantization range setting 0-255 specifically on intel iGPU's.
bryansj and assassin like this.

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post #118 of 207 Old 10-11-2013, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

You simply configure your GPU to output 4Kp23, and then set the media player to zoom.
I've heard about that there might be some problem, but I don't know what it is, and without having such a projector, obviously I don't know how to check. Maybe you want to donate your projector to me, so I can test with it? That would help madVR development... biggrin.gif

You should be able to test which problem there is exactly, by testing with black & white level test patterns / videos.

Madshi,

I did some more thinking about the intel output range. I have information which I m not quite sure what this tells me:

First of all, the Quantization Range Setting IS available with the latest Intel Driver. So when I put the Quantization Range Setting on FULL I go to my projector and I can switch between AUTO, LIMITED and FULL is that exact order. Ok, so I put the Quantization Range Setting on FULL. I have a black background on my desktop. When I switched from AUTO to LIMITED on my previous Sony projector (Sony VPL-HW50ES) I could see the desktop go grey when going to LIMITED setting on the projector (which is a good sign). When I go from AUTO to LIMITED on my VW1000 projector the screen blancs out for a few seconds. So something DOES happen but the LIMITED setting on the VW1000 does not make my black desktop look grey.
Ok, so now I set the Quantization Range Setting of intel on LIMITED: When I switched from AUTO to FULL on my previous Sony projector (Sony VPL-HW50ES) I could see the desktop go grey when going to FULL setting on the projector (which is a good sign). When I go from AUTO to FULL on my VW1000 projector the screen blancs out for a few seconds. So something DOES happen but the FULL setting on the VW1000 does not make my black desktop look grey.


!!#@*@, I don t know if I understand my post myself either smile.gifsmile.gif
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post #119 of 207 Old 10-11-2013, 12:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

So when I put the Quantization Range Setting on FULL I go to my projector and I can switch between AUTO, LIMITED and FULL is that exact order. Ok, so I put the Quantization Range Setting on FULL. When I switched from AUTO to LIMITED on my previous Sony projector (Sony VPL-HW50ES) I could see the desktop go grey when going to LIMITED setting on the projector (which is a good sign).

Sorry, but something is wrong there. If you set the GPU to "FULL" and your projector to "LIMITED", a black desktop should not be gray. The opposite should be true: Dark gray should become black. Light gray should become white. Shadow and highlight detail should both be lost.
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post #120 of 207 Old 10-11-2013, 06:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanderdvd View Post

...
First of all, the Quantization Range Setting IS available with the latest Intel Driver.
...

The latest driver is IMHO 3257, right?
Where, in the display control app do you get a quantization range setting? in display, or video? (maybe you could post a screen shot?, I'll do so, when get back to the system in question).
I only ever see --Input Range-- Full/Limited, which is a big question mark for me on it's own.
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