Does anyone in this forum actually get up and put in a disc ???? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 10:51 AM
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Exactly. Mastered in 4k is not a 4k disc. Is there even a player that is something the average Joe can obtain? Last I knew these players cost more than a car and were running north of $20k. So let's be realistic here. How much as an UltraHD movie on Ultraviolet disc? What content is available right now?

When 4k is mainstream the ability to rip it will come not much after that.

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post #92 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damelon View Post

But we're talking about people reading this forum, which is an HTPC forum to begin with, so we're also not talking about companies making their own high end HTPCs or end users who couldn't figure them out. It does take more work to use a HTPC than a blu ray player out of the box to be sure. And there is a little bit of upkeep too, but as for the vast majority of HTPC users here, they don't really care about that.

My original point was not at all talking about people reading this forum who built their own computers - you might be, I wasn't. I was talking about the ultra high end - the ones running Lumagen Radiance processors and buying AudioQuest HDMI cords - they're not only trying to squeeze every last bit of performance but also want turn key systems that offer reliability higher than a PC. Doctors, corporate executives, pro athletes, Hollywood types - people without time or inclination to screw around with wondering why the image jumps every few minutes or why Media Browser is refusing to open. They're not going to think about whether their movie has forced subtitles in a foreign language and how to place them correctly on a 2.35:1 screen when ripping.

If they are ripping they're probably using Kaleidescape or Mozaex, putting them in a networked changer like Crestron's ADMS, and more likely they're putting a disc in a player.

I like doing this stuff - I like using Mondo posters or finding original theatrical ones to put in Media Browser, understanding codecs and containers, or creating a launcher in WMC to my VCR. Most people with money to spend on high end gear don't have any interest here.
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Originally Posted by damelon View Post

Never once had a Cinavia issue with MKV playback on my HTPC.

You wouldn't, unless you were using PowerDVD, Total Media Theater, or WinDVD to play your mkv. You need to rip to ISO to watch a 3D bluray without compressing it into a side by side mkv. And since you have limited options on playing that ISO given Cinavia and other restrictions the path of least resistance is to put a disc in a player.

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post #93 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

Exactly. Is there even a player that is something the average Joe can obtain? Last I knew these players cost more than a car and were running north of $20k. So let's be realistic here. How much as an UltraHD movie on Ultraviolet disc? What content is available right now?

When 4k is mainstream the ability to rip it will come not much after that.

They're $700 and come with ten movies

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post #94 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:12 AM
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I still use my Sony S5000ES player.....mostly when a new BD is purchased and I haven't had a chance to rip it to my HTPC.

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post #95 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsoccer33 View Post

My original point was not at all talking about people reading this forum who built their own computers - you might be, I wasn't. I was talking about the ultra high end - the ones running Lumagen Radiance processors and buying AudioQuest HDMI cords - they're not only trying to squeeze every last bit of performance but also want turn key systems that offer reliability higher than a PC. Doctors, corporate executives, pro athletes, Hollywood types - people without time or inclination to screw around with wondering why the image jumps every few minutes or why Media Browser is refusing to open. They're not going to think about whether their movie has forced subtitles in a foreign language and how to place them correctly on a 2.35:1 screen when ripping.

If they are ripping they're probably using Kaleidescape or Mozaex, putting them in a networked changer like Crestron's ADMS, and more likely they're putting a disc in a player.

I like doing this stuff - I like using Mondo posters or finding original theatrical ones to put in Media Browser, understanding codecs and containers, or creating a launcher in WMC to my VCR. Most people with money to spend on high end gear don't have any interest here.

So why bother making these points in the HTPC forum in the first place?
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You wouldn't, unless you were using PowerDVD, Total Media Theater, or WinDVD to play your mkv. You need to rip to ISO to watch a 3D bluray without compressing it into a side by side mkv. And since you have limited options on playing that ISO given Cinavia and other restrictions the path of least resistance is to put a disc in a player.

AnyDVD makes Cinavia protection useless so you can play that ISO or MKV file just fine. Also, there's no need to convert to SBS, MakeMKV rips a 1:1 copy of the MVC stream just fine. PowerDVD and Steroscopic player both play MVC MKV files.

Looky here!
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post #96 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toys7505 View Post

I still use my Sony S5000ES player.....mostly when a new BD is purchased and I haven't had a chance to rip it to my HTPC.

Careful - you're staying on topic eek.gif

Looky here!
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post #97 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by robnix View Post

Careful - you're staying on topic eek.gif

Don't do that!!! Quick, link to some un-related thread before it is too late!
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post #98 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 11:56 AM
 
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post #99 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pittsoccer33 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

Exactly. Is there even a player that is something the average Joe can obtain? Last I knew these players cost more than a car and were running north of $20k. So let's be realistic here. How much as an UltraHD movie on Ultraviolet disc? What content is available right now?

When 4k is mainstream the ability to rip it will come not much after that.

They're $700 and come with ten movies

With literally thousands of movies to chose from, they pick these?
Code:
The Amazing Spiderman
Battle Los Angeles
Salt
That’s My Boy
Total Recall (2012)
Bad Teacher
The Other Guys
The Bridge on the River Kwai
The Karate Kid (2010)
Taxi Driver

For $700 you get the player pre-loaded with these movies but what if I want to watch an actual good move? There's only 2 on this list that I would really want to watch. Can I delete the others off the HDD and load the ones I want? You do realize that what Sony is selling here is essentially an HTPC that they call a server, right? You don't get up and put a disc in this device either as it comes pre-loaded with content on a HDD.
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The player will have a server wholly on no-additional cost on lease that comes packed with 10 native Ultra HD resolution films. If you get bored with the films, then don’t be upset as there are also other options like sports clips to enjoy 10 full-length feature movies presented in native 4K for the home are as follows:

I am still trying to figure out that ill-constructed sentence.

http://technozigzag.com/gadget-watch/sony-4k-ultra-hd-video-player-with-10-ultra-hd-films/89

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post #100 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 02:12 PM
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what about sound quality? I am very new to this, and use my htpc to play blu-rays and dvds with a mytek usb dac connected to my compute -r 2 channel, direct to amps - the computer is my preamp/processor - nothing else in the chain, with very high quality interconnects. There is no stand alone player that could provide this sound quality - the Oppo doesn't come close, and that doesn't include the ability to upgrade the dac. It is the HTPC which provides the ability for audiophile sound quality for movies.
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post #101 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 03:17 PM
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Hollywood is trying get rid of discs. Their ultimate goal is for the viewer to pay for every view.

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post #102 of 124 Old 08-09-2013, 03:24 PM
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So long as the quality is not diminished. It makes no sense to have a 4k TV and a 7.1 HD Audio AVR just to stream crap. I don't think the infrastructure is there for this but the CableCo's will be biting at the bit to charge for that data transfer. I don't care what the delivery method is but if Hollywood thinks that they can charge per view they should pay a little more attention to what happened to the music industry because a certain segment of the population will always find a way around that.

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post #103 of 124 Old 08-20-2013, 03:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

So long as the quality is not diminished. It makes no sense to have a 4k TV and a 7.1 HD Audio AVR just to stream crap. I don't think the infrastructure is there for this but the CableCo's will be biting at the bit to charge for that data transfer. I don't care what the delivery method is but if Hollywood thinks that they can charge per view they should pay a little more attention to what happened to the music industry because a certain segment of the population will always find a way around that.

I think you will need fiber or some type of 100mb sec service. I have 20mb service from Comcast now- and you would need something quite a bit better to pull off 4k or decent bit rates.

What is the full bitrate of DTS-MASTERHD + 1080p off a bluray ? It's much higher than most internet can go.



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post #104 of 124 Old 08-21-2013, 05:37 AM
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What is the full bitrate of DTS-MASTERHD + 1080p off a bluray ? It's much higher than most internet can go.

 

That's apples and oranges. I'm sure they would use a much more efficient codec. Even today if you compare the low-rate streams to Blu-ray they do a decent job without much bandwidth at all. Certainly not Blu-ray quality but given x times the bandwidth I'm guessing they could get to the point the source material was the limiting factor. Netflix's Super HD is around 7Mb/s... what if they tripled that...

 

His comparisons are always interesting...

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1459687/argo-itunes-vs-vudu-vs-blu-ray#post_22998450

 

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post #105 of 124 Old 12-10-2013, 04:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

That's apples and oranges. I'm sure they would use a much more efficient codec. Even today if you compare the low-rate streams to Blu-ray they do a decent job without much bandwidth at all. Certainly not Blu-ray quality but given x times the bandwidth I'm guessing they could get to the point the source material was the limiting factor. Netflix's Super HD is around 7Mb/s... what if they tripled that...


His comparisons are always interesting...
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1459687/argo-itunes-vs-vudu-vs-blu-ray#post_22998450



I can often see and hear a difference between a BR rip myself. Bit rate really does matter. So does video processing.

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post #106 of 124 Old 02-08-2014, 09:09 AM - Thread Starter
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I have been using ISO format a lot more since mediabrowser3 Theater supports it well

I actually added a new category and media collection called "ISO".

The only thing I'm struggling with is how I should manage the duplicates. The best solution I can come up with is different user accounts that either show or don't show the ISO collection. Not at all ideal though.

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post #107 of 124 Old 02-10-2014, 03:06 PM
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I have ripped my DVD collection and a few of my Blu-Ray collection, but I just don't have the space for all the blu-rays. I've been converting the DVDs which I originally ripped in ISO to mkv, stripping out previews and converting to h264 which will typically cut my files from 3-6GB down to 800-1000mb.
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post #108 of 124 Old 02-10-2014, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fallen Kell View Post

I have ripped my DVD collection and a few of my Blu-Ray collection, but I just don't have the space for all the blu-rays. I've been converting the DVDs which I originally ripped in ISO to mkv, stripping out previews and converting to h264 which will typically cut my files from 3-6GB down to 800-1000mb.
Huh? The size of an uncompressed main feature only on a DVD is somewhere between 3.5 and 7 GB. I've just ripped about a thousand of them.
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post #109 of 124 Old 02-10-2014, 03:36 PM
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converted...
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post #110 of 124 Old 02-10-2014, 03:49 PM
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Doh. I've left my glasses at work and misread.
Still, storage is so cheap it seems pretty pointless to reduce DVDs especially for the time it takes.
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post #111 of 124 Old 02-11-2014, 12:32 PM
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I converted all my DVDs to h264 also. Each ones takes only 20-30 min to convert and that's with a serious bottleneck of saving to my server on the opposite side of the house via a powerline connection. And when you can set up a queue in Handbrake to just run a bunch of them in a row when you're sleeping or at work, it's really no more effort than it would be to keep the full rips. With around 500 DVDs I reckon this method has saved me >2TB so far (2GB ave per h264 vs 6-7GB ave for the full rip). Not much to some people but until I win lotto and start finding loose $100 blls in my sofa cushions it's worth it to me.
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post #112 of 124 Old 02-11-2014, 12:49 PM
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I'll still play a disk on occassion. Mostly because I'm fortunate enough to have a local video store with an extensive selection of Criterion blurays, which at their price point I always like to rent first instead of buying blind. I don't ever pop in a disk for a movie I own though. Waiting for the disk to load and getting past all the forced preview nonsense isn't worth it to me even if I already know what I want to watch. More often I'm just browsing and prefer the XBMC interface to be able to search by genre or a particular director's movies, etc. Much more convenient than maintaining and paging through my old media binders to find what I want.

I can totally understand people who still prefer disks. But some on this thread are making HTPCs sound a lot more difficult than they are. My HTPC is a NUC running OpenElec and sure there was a little bit of a learning curve to start. Once I got the setup and config to my liking though there's been virtually nothing to maintain after that. I just turn it on and it works like any other component.
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post #113 of 124 Old 02-11-2014, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A9X-308 View Post

Huh? The size of an uncompressed main feature only on a DVD is somewhere between 3.5 and 7 GB. I've just ripped about a thousand of them.

I noticed this over the weekend and started ripping my DVDs using Video/Audio Copy via DVDFab. Some of the earlier rips were coming out at 1 gig and looked horrible on my 46inch Sony, but the 1:1 rips looked normal, plus they rip in 25 minutes.

I'm doing the same for my BD Rips and they come out between 30 to 45 gigs depending on what's involved regarding video and audio formats, but my goal is to place these videos in a NAS. I've cut back on Ripping Blu Rays for now and continued on with regular DVDs because of Space limitations, but once I get my NAS set up I'll begin to move everything over to a Raid configuration. I've just received my replacement Seagate 3TB Drive under warranty and I don't want to go through this process of Ripping Discs again. Other than possible bandwidth issues, I don't feel the need to compress DVDs any further.
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post #114 of 124 Old 02-11-2014, 03:26 PM
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That's fine if you want to keep full rips of your DVDs and not convert them. Just FYI though, there's no reason you have to sacrifice quality. If yours came out looking bad then I'm sure that's a result of the software you were using or the particular settings you selected. I use Handbrake CQ 19 on all my DVDs and I haven't had one yet where the converted file looks any worse than the full rip.
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post #115 of 124 Old 02-11-2014, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
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Just FYI though, there's no reason you have to sacrifice quality.
We'll have to agree to disagree on this. Using my projector and a THX (close) sitting position, I have no trouble picking the compressed versions on almost all titles.
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post #116 of 124 Old 02-12-2014, 07:25 AM
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Well yeah, okay. If you've got a projector or very large display and you're sitting close to it then I could imagine the difference then can be more noticeable. But the poster I was responding to was talking about watching on a 46" TV, I assume from normal viewing distance. For that kind of usage you should definitely be able to Handbrake your videos and not see any difference. Just have to play around a bit to find the right CQ.
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post #117 of 124 Old 02-12-2014, 09:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElJimador View Post

But the poster I was responding to was talking about watching on a 46" TV, I assume from normal viewing distance. For that kind of usage you should definitely be able to Handbrake your videos and not see any difference. Just have to play around a bit to find the right CQ.
I can also tell the difference on my 50" Panny.
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post #118 of 124 Old 02-12-2014, 09:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Try a 100" 1080p Image.. the difference is there. Some don't care and the trade off of quality to smaller storage size is worth it. If you care more about the cost of storage than how good your movie looks that's a personal decision. But the quality loss is there. It's impossible to shrink a 30GB BR to under 10GB and not have some degree of quality loss. It you care about it is another story.

When a 3TB drive costs $99 (technically they call 3TB 3000GB for some reason now)

So the math is easy. 30GB movies would be 3000 divided by 30GB each movie. 100 movies for $99. That is a dollar a movie to store you movie in full quality. That's nothing compared to the cost of a movie, if you are going to spend the time and money getting a full quality BR because you enjoy the superior quality you might as well keep it the best it can be for only $1. Storage is cheap.

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post #119 of 124 Old 02-12-2014, 09:19 AM
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Sure, I still get up and put in discs pretty often, for both movies and music. Music in our house mostly plays via the Sonos , but when I really want to sit and enjoy something, I do about half and half CD via CD player and lossless format via Sonos to music receiver.

 

On movies it's 70% Netflix, Amazon, etc. but there again when we want to watch a big effects new release, or when I'm planning to watch a really interesting old release with great sound and visuals, we go get the Blu-Ray or even the plain old DVD, which always beats the download quality from Vudu, Amazon, Netflix et al.


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post #120 of 124 Old 02-12-2014, 11:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A9X-308 View Post

I can also tell the difference on my 50" Panny.

Then unless you're sitting right in front of it like a monitor I definitely think you'd just need to try a better CQ setting. I understand you have no interest in that yourself and that's fine. But I really doubt most people would see the difference in a file converted correctly on a 50" TV at normal viewing distance.
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