Should I just start getting WD reds? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 02:06 PM - Thread Starter
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I need to upgrade a couple drives in my HTPC to 4TB.
I have all Samsung and WD greens in there now.

I know the reds are made for NAS. And I am contemplating making my htpc a htpc/nas... but I was thinking if the reds are made to run continuously in a NAS like they are then wouldn't they just be a better choice for either a HTPC or NAS (or combo)?
For only $20 more why ever buy a green again?

edit>>>>actually just checked Amazon. Only $13
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post #2 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 05:46 PM
 
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On amazon, the WD 4TB Reds are $202 each and the WD 4TB Greens are $190...but the Seagate 4TB are $160. The Seagate runs at 5900 rpm while both WD drives run at 5400 rpm. The WD Green is certainly out of the running since it is both slower and more expensive. It then comes down to if you think $42 is worth it to get a drive that is designed to run all the time. My HTPC does not have any of its drives running all the time - they are in fact rarely used (the one with the Live TV buffer and the Recorded TV location is used the most). For me, the Seagate 4TB is the best choice - I cannot say for you. If you have plenty of money, the $42 per drive is worth it. If you like the longer warranty of the WD Red, it might be worth it to you.
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post #3 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 05:55 PM
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I get whatever is cheapest. They are all plenty fast for my htpc needs.
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post #4 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 07:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Let's pretend for a second they were all the same price.... which would you get?
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post #5 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 09:57 PM
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FWIW, I have purchased 8 4TB and 1 3TB Seagate NAS drives in the last 45 days.
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post #6 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 10:06 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordhutt View Post

Let's pretend for a second they were all the same price.... which would you get?

Given the same price I would either buy a Seagate NAS or a WD Red. I would have to compare the two, but I suspect they are very similar.
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post #7 of 67 Old 09-23-2013, 11:38 PM
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What about all the talk in many of the forums about Seagate drives being more prone to failure as compared to WD? Does anyone agree?
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post #8 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 12:38 AM
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The return rates of Seagate and Western Digital HDDs look similar, as measured by hardware.fr. Keep in mind that the newest models are obviously not included in this type of data, since it takes 6 months to a year to find out how well they do after they are first released.

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.hardware.fr/articles/893-6/disques-durs.html&usg=ALkJrhguW36sW5fSt-XhVzTRyQfS3Ee1QQ
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post #9 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 02:54 AM
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I would just buy whatever drive is the cheapest. I don't have any NAS specific drives in my server but I do have two 5 year old 1tb Hitachi drives that have a runtime of over 860 days each. I also have an old Seagate 500gb drive with a runtime of over 530 days.

It would be interesting to know if anyone has any drives older and still running error free.

David
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post #10 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 06:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komalthecoolk View Post

What about all the talk in many of the forums about Seagate drives being more prone to failure as compared to WD? Does anyone agree?
Yes. No. Maybe. Possibly. Doubtful. Take your pick.

Any forum that has more than 1 thread regarding which brand is better will have supporting evidence for either brand. BOTH brands have had models that have problems. BOTH brands have models that happily keep spinning away perfectly fine. It's like asking if GM or Ford makes better cars. Or McDonalds, Burger King, or Wendy's make better burgers. Or if Exxon, BP, or Shell has better gas. You'll find ardent supporters and detractors for all brands insisting that a particular brand is best or worst on the market.

For the record, I prefer Seagates. I have a WD drive that drops offline when it's included in a DriveBender array, but runs fine if it's separate. So I'm going to judge an entire brand based on that one drive that may not even be it's fault.
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post #11 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 07:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I think I have to agree with cdru.
Any brand no matter how good can still have issues and there will always be people fighting for both sides of an argument of who is the best.
I know people who tell me their favorite place to eat and I think that place sucks. Hell, I've had crappy meals at my favorite restaurant before.... anyone can have a bad day.

You can get a DOA or a drive that crashes in a week from any manufacturer. I'm sure that does not happen often but it does happen. I guess the only thing we can really do is weight the cost vs the statistics and hope whichever one is picked that you don't get that rare bad one.
I've had more WD's fail over the years than any other drive but then again that is probably because 85% or so of all the drives I ever bought were WD....

My main logic for asking about the reds was even though I am not definitely getting a NAS setup at the moment. I was thinking that since they are made to run 24/7 that they would last longer in a regular HTPC setup.
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post #12 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 08:14 AM
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FWIW, I have a mix of desktop and NAS drives, WD, Seagate and Samsung, 7200, 5900 and 5400 RPM in my server running 24/7, some for a couple of years now and they all seem fine. These have all been cobbled together over the years from deals I've found and drives I've been given for evaluation.

For me at least, I see no difference in the longevity of any of them based on brand or type. I had a strong bias for a long time against Seagate due to a bad drive experience and what I'd read. My bias doesn't seem to be holding at the moment with 1 x 2TB, 2 x 3TB and 1 x 4TB Seagates all going strong, the first being 2 yrs old, the second two being 1 yr old and the 4TB about 3mo old.

So, I'll echo what others have posted based on my experience to just grab what's on sale. 3TB seems to be the sweet spot for $/TB right now. I am hoping for a 4TB Black Friday deal.

 

 

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post #13 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 02:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordhutt View Post

Let's pretend for a second they were all the same price.... which would you get?
The one with the longer warranty.

The WD Red has a 3yr warranty as opposed to a 2yr with the Green.

I just hate reading about the failure rate with the Red drives frown.gif
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post #14 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 07:19 PM
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Just a word of caution on warranties. I had a drive fail once that had a 2 yr warranty. I started the RMA process. I come to find out since the drive is no longer being made, they won't replace it -- only REPAIR it -- whatever that meant. I also had to pay the shipping. I decided it wasn't worth it. So, look carefully what your remedies are in the case of failure 2-3 yrs down the road.

 

 

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post #15 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Just a word of caution on warranties. I had a drive fail once that had a 2 yr warranty. I started the RMA process. I come to find out since the drive is no longer being made, they won't replace it -- only REPAIR it -- whatever that meant. I also had to pay the shipping. I decided it wasn't worth it. So, look carefully what your remedies are in the case of failure 2-3 yrs down the road.

Good point. What manufacturer was that?
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post #16 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 08:37 PM
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Good point. What manufacturer was that?

Kingston. I have no idea if WD, Seagate, HGST, Samsung, et. al. do the same but it's worth asking before spending the extra money on an extra year's warranty: if you no longer make my model what does a warranty claim get me?

 

 

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post #17 of 67 Old 09-24-2013, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Just a word of caution on warranties. I had a drive fail once that had a 2 yr warranty. I started the RMA process. I come to find out since the drive is no longer being made, they won't replace it -- only REPAIR it -- whatever that meant. I also had to pay the shipping. I decided it wasn't worth it. So, look carefully what your remedies are in the case of failure 2-3 yrs down the road.

That's too bad. I had a warranty RMA on an Agility 3 SSD, and they sent me a Vertex 3

I kind of wonder if I'll get a new Nexus 7 if I RMA my old Nexus 7 for screen separation
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post #18 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 03:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Good point. What manufacturer was that?

Well, I've never bought a Kingston drive before but I can say I have had 2 WD's replaced this year with zero problem.
That is just a horrible company policy there and would keep me from buying their product. If you don't make it any more then it should be replaced with the newest equivalent.
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post #19 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Just a word of caution on warranties. I had a drive fail once that had a 2 yr warranty. I started the RMA process. I come to find out since the drive is no longer being made, they won't replace it -- only REPAIR it -- whatever that meant. I also had to pay the shipping. I decided it wasn't worth it. So, look carefully what your remedies are in the case of failure 2-3 yrs down the road.
EVERY warranty for a hard drive (and probably every other consumer electronic device) states that. I've replaced more that just a couple of drives over the years that were covered by warranty and I always received a refurbished drive back. In at least once case, I received an "upgraded" drive as they did not have any 200GB drives so they sent a refurbished 250GB instead.

I would be extremely surprised if any manufacturer would repair a drive that you sent in and then sent back that very same drive. It takes too long to diagnose, repair, and ship back. You ship the drive back, they toss it on a pile to look at and they ship you a drive back that has already been repaired, tested, and confirmed works.
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post #20 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 10:21 AM
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I am just relaying my experience, what they told me when I made a warranty claim and giving a heads-up. I am not looking to start a flame war, defending/recommending/not recommending Kingston, dissing WD/Seagate/Samsung or warranties, saying manufacturers don't honor warranties, claim that every experience will be like mine, saying your experience couldn't have happened because mine was the opposite, arguing the world is flat, saying they had it coming because they were dressed that way or blaming Bush or Obama.

All I am saying is find out what you get when you pay extra for the longer warranty.

 

 

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post #21 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 11:03 AM
 
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Quote:
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...arguing the world is flat....

But it is:

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php/topic,1324.0.html#.UkMlpHnD-Uk


wink.gif
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post #22 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 11:16 AM
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All I am saying is find out what you get when you pay extra for the longer warranty.
I wasn't trying to be argumentative. I was just pointing out that getting a repaired/refurbished part has always been a part of the warranties for a long time for just about everything electronic.
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post #23 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 11:24 AM
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I wish it were flat. I might be able to get OTA reception.

 

 

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post #24 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdru View Post

EVERY warranty for a hard drive (and probably every other consumer electronic device) states that. I've replaced more that just a couple of drives over the years that were covered by warranty and I always received a refurbished drive back. In at least once case, I received an "upgraded" drive as they did not have any 200GB drives so they sent a refurbished 250GB instead.

This is my experience as well. In my experience, if your drive isn't made anymore, and they no longer manufacture that size, they will always give you a larger one. They will never "Repair" a hard drive you send them and send it back to you, it is way too costly, but you may receive a refurbished drive in exchange. In fact, most companies will even "Cross Ship" you the replacement for a small fee, which means they don't even wait for yours to arrive before giving you your warrantied drive. I've never had a warranty issue with hard drives, but lots of other hardware components (And Rebates) get really quirky/picky. Then again I've returned 5 or so drives and they were all Seagates.

As far as your hard drive argument goes. I have 4 3TB WD Green drives I got for $99. I've had them a while now and none of them have had a problem. I have 2 3TB WD Reds and neither have had a problem. I owned 8 Seagate 1.5TB Drives, and 3 of them failed in the past, but those are older drives. I recently just purchased 2x HGST 4TB Drives because they were on sale for $140. I'm running some lengthly pre-clears on them, and they are normally $200 drives, but they are a lot louder (quite noticable vs inaudable) and run hotter (about 6 degrees oC) than any of my other drives. If you need a drive right away, get what is cheapest, unless they are really close in price. I personally really like my red drives, and would wait to see if they go on sale.
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post #25 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 11:51 AM
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I always find it interesting how anyone can turn their singular experience into "they will always give you a [new/refurbished/larger] one" and "they will never repair".

 

 

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post #26 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 12:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Bad Religion even wrote a song about the 'Flat Earthers'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcC5F8j_-wo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRo0eQTYstc
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post #27 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 01:25 PM
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I spent a little time today reading those forums. I've gotta say "Wow". Not a judging kind of "wow" but a "I had no idea people believe in FE so strongly, wow."

 

 

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post #28 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 02:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komalthecoolk View Post

What about all the talk in many of the forums about Seagate drives being more prone to failure as compared to WD? Does anyone agree?

I disagree. WD is overated these days. Perfectly fine, but merely on par. They are not "superior" like many of the oldschool die hards pretend. I believe they (WD) are losing ground quicker than they are advancing in the big picture of things. Seems like Toshiba (made in the same WD plant) Seagate and Hitachi have some better alternatives these days, and also better prices.

The idea "RED" is superior in reliability is purely a figment of intelligent marketing at WD marketing department. It's a hard drive. Just like the others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lordhutt View Post

Let's pretend for a second they were all the same price.... which would you get?

7200rpm Seagate or Hitachi probably because WD does not make any "good" consumer 7200rpm drives these days.


Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Kingston. I have no idea if WD, Seagate, HGST, Samsung, et. al. do the same but it's worth asking before spending the extra money on an extra year's warranty: if you no longer make my model what does a warranty claim get me?

Should have bought an OCZ wink.gif They upgrade you. (Vertex2 -> Vertex3 biggrin.gif ) (Vertex 3 > Vector )

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Originally Posted by 4th-horseman View Post

That's too bad. I had a warranty RMA on an Agility 3 SSD, and they sent me a Vertex 3

I kind of wonder if I'll get a new Nexus 7 if I RMA my old Nexus 7 for screen separation

I got a Vertex2 upgraded to a Vertex3. I did not complain smile.gif

My original first generation vertex 2 is still running strong too.
Quote:
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I spent a little time today reading those forums. I've gotta say "Wow". Not a judging kind of "wow" but a "I had no idea people believe in FE so strongly, wow."

What forum are you talking about ?

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post #29 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
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7200rpm Seagate or Hitachi probably because WD does not make any "good" consumer 7200rpm drives these days.

What forum are you talking about ?

Since you mention speed... how important is this REALLY.... I mean strictly from a HTPC only computer... no gaming, video rendering or anything else. Simply playing back media.
Does a 7200 really give me any benefit over a 5400?

As for the forum question see post 21.
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post #30 of 67 Old 09-25-2013, 06:15 PM
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Probably not very important for a HTPC only machine. A 5900rpm Seagate 4TB would be the best choice. A 5400rpm GREEN WD or Hitachi would be a good choice. RED would be near my last choice based on price probably.

I was just answering the question. Often times the 7200rpm drives are not just better, but they are cheaper. Cheaper being the important part.

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