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post #271 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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I can boot it up later today and see what it shows, but I did NOT do any overclocking and currently don't plan to. The RAM that I bought was on a super NewEgg sale and was too good to pass up vs. regular 1600 RAM.

So no, I am not overclocking it, but the price was right on it so its native 1600 is working great for me.

Mfusick, sorry for not getting back to you on the settings. We have been pretty much out of town every minute that I haven't been at work since I got back from my work trip late last week (which I was obviously out of town for). My parents are moving to Georgia, so we spent last weekend at their house to pack them up, and then we have been gone doing one thing or another including driving 2 hours away last night, tonight, and tomorrow night to see my daughter with the lead in the musical for her college, then family is coming to visit Saturday and Sunday....

Somehow I need to sneak in some time to try to resolve the stuttering as I am sure that we will watch something this weekend.
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post #272 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 07:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

To be clear overclocking can mean a lot of things so it gets confusing. Overclocking is traditionally meant to suggest raising the MHz speed of your CPU but it can mean lots of other stuff too.

By the standard idea you DO NOT need to overclock. You don't have to change your CPU speed or settings at all to use 2400hz ram. This shouldn't create anymore heat or cooling needs at all.

All you need to do to use 2400mhz ram is install it into a motherboard and CPU that support it. For many motherboards 2400mhz is considered a memory OC setting. Others it might be native. But you are not overclocking the ram technically if it's already native 2400mhz ram, you are just enabling the memory OC setting on your motherboard.

To use 2400mhz ram you need to install it into a motherboard and CPU that support it and enable XMP profile on your motherboard bios (or manually set it at 2400mhz)

The advantage to faster ram like 2400mhz with low latency is not just in CPU applications but it helps the integrated GPU too. There is a reason why high end video cards come with huge amounts of GDDR5 RAM and it's not because it's cheap. The the faster ram would help iGPU performance, especially if you overclock the iGPU (from say 1200mhz to 1600 or 1750mhz) which might not be needed to play a movie back but could be beneficial in gaming performance or reaching that next level up in MADVR.

Very interesting, in defining what's consider OC, I thought it was a speed limited number that if you went over you're system could start suffering or something like it.
I do have a question though. In the event of 4K resolution playback would higher MHz help out down the line? I hear allot that certain Mobo, Ram, etc are a bit overreaching.Do you think 4K once it becomes more wide spread, will be taxing on the RAM, and iCPU's ?

Or plainly it's not the wait it works?

Thanks

Dan

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post #273 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 11:30 AM
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Originally Posted by nickbuol View Post

I can boot it up later today and see what it shows, but I did NOT do any overclocking and currently don't plan to. The RAM that I bought was on a super NewEgg sale and was too good to pass up vs. regular 1600 RAM.

So no, I am not overclocking it, but the price was right on it so its native 1600 is working great for me.

So i am very curious at what MHz it boots. Please let me know.

@ Mfusick - oke so you saydespite Nick's processor is not supporting 2400Mhz, just by enabling XMP profile in RAM BIOS setting or just manually set it at 2400mhz and it will work, right?

Of course i am talking about Z87 boards, no matter which brand

I need to know that because i already ordered G.Skill 2400Mhz ARE blue series and it is not possible to cancel (strange, but it is like that here for some components; in other words G.Skill are not that known here like at yours, here most people buy Corsair, Adata and so on...)

So if i buy i3 4130T and ASUS GRYPHON Z87 will it be OK? If you could suggest a bit cheaper Asus board (pls no Asrock) which one would it be? As said before, i don't need to much SATA ports, just 2 for SSD + BD Rom and possibly one x16 Pci Express for graphic adapter.

Thanks,
Martin
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post #274 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Djoel View Post

Very interesting, in defining what's consider OC, I thought it was a speed limited number that if you went over you're system could start suffering or something like it.
I do have a question though. In the event of 4K resolution playback would higher MHz help out down the line? I hear allot that certain Mobo, Ram, etc are a bit overreaching.Do you think 4K once it becomes more wide spread, will be taxing on the RAM, and iCPU's ?

Or plainly it's not the wait it works?

Thanks

Dan

My opinion on 4k is we aren't not ready yet. That resolution will requires a superior solution to HDMI (thunderbolt or display port now can do it) and there is a new HDMI spec coming called HDMI 2.0 that should handle 4k.

To do 4k you will need this so that means you'll likely upgrade your GPU card to a GPU card that does HDMI 2.0 and 4k (possibly 4k 3D which is even newer) so you current ram or motherboard won't matter too much. If you have a decent quad core CPU today all you need to do tomorrow is add the right video card. Having faster better ram that performs better certainly wont hurt anything but I don't thing it's an important part of the equation.

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post #275 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 11:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

I would use JINC 3 + Anti ringing for image upscaling and chroma upscaling. I would use Catmull-ROM for image downscaling. Try that. See what happens.


Also I would play and check with your Smooth Motion setting:



Restart, reinstall or update everything and start there. See what happens and report back.

I think that I started with Jinc 3 Taps, but didn't have the anti-ringing enabled. I checked that box. I also set the downscale to the Catmull-ROM. Smooth motion was already set to that as well.

Still getting about 1 dropped and 1 repeated frame every 10-12 seconds and it is noticeable when watching a movie. I then went into my video card settings and turned off pretty much every video enhancement option. I figured MadVR would just manage it. It was maybe a touch worse, but certainly not better.

I also in the mix updated MBT to the latest and noticed that under the options you can now also select hardware acceleration. I turned that on as well to DVXA2 COPYBACK since that is what I was told to set in LAV.

Still stumped.

I am going to copy a MKV file of a known stutter/judder movie (Fast and Furious 6) to the HTPC. I am going to play it both locally as well as over the gigabit network, but outside of MBT and see if I can get something to behave differently. I need to eliminate some variable since there are a LOT of variables right now.

EDIT: OK that test failed. The only thing that I had that would play the MKV was Total Media Theater 6, but without any codecs installed and such, I was getting video tearing of the image, and nothing was kicking off MadVR so I between the two I couldn't see if frames were being dropped or duplicated.

I tested my network speed though and I am able to copy a file from my media server to the HTPC at a minimum of 101MB/s (808 megabit/s) and many times it would go up to around 110MB/s in my short 2 minute test. So I am getting good throughput on the network from the server.

Just stumped again.
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post #276 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by embeathome View Post

So i am very curious at what MHz it boots. Please let me know.

@ Mfusick - oke so you saydespite Nick's processor is not supporting 2400Mhz, just by enabling XMP profile in RAM BIOS setting or just manually set it at 2400mhz and it will work, right?

Of course i am talking about Z87 boards, no matter which brand

Yup. biggrin.gif It should work by manually setting it to 2400mhz or by activating the XMP profile, which is built into the ram stick and tells the system optimal settings.

You can view this and what settings they are by using something like CPU-Z ID: http://www.cpuid.com/softwares/cpu-z.html

It will likely default to 1600mhz without any changes.

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post #277 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:01 PM
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Oke thx Mfusick, jast pls have a look at last question i asked in the post above and if possible, let me know:

So if i buy i3 4130T and ASUS GRYPHON Z87 will it be OK? If you could suggest a bit cheaper Asus board (pls no Asrock) which one would it be? As said before, i don't need to much SATA ports, just 2 for SSD + BD Rom and possibly one x16 Pci Express for graphic adapter.

And i will order it as it is mentioned above or with any cheaper suggested Asus board which can handle it (Z87).

Thanks!
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post #278 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by embeathome View Post

Oke thx Mfusick, jast pls have a look at last question i asked in the post above and if possible, let me know:

So if i buy i3 4130T and ASUS GRYPHON Z87 will it be OK? If you could suggest a bit cheaper Asus board (pls no Asrock) which one would it be? As said before, i don't need to much SATA ports, just 2 for SSD + BD Rom and possibly one x16 Pci Express for graphic adapter.

And i will order it as it is mentioned above or with any cheaper suggested Asus board which can handle it (Z87).

Thanks!

I wouldn't buy a handicapped T version CPU that's not a great choice , especially if you wanted 2400mhz. It won't use less energy so you might as well get the more powerful version.

I'm on my cell phone or I would link you an Asus board. I like Asus boards. They make plenty that fit your needs. I'm not sure about prices I haven't followed Asus close since I bought my Asus z68 deluxe board. I generally do love the deluxe models, I'd guess the z87 deluxe to be awesome based on my experience with Asus but it's probably overkill for you.

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post #279 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:23 PM
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Good, go ahead, awaiting your suggestions smile.gif I planned T version due to it's low TDP @ 35W only....but if you say more powerfull will not grab more energy/not more heat, then why not?

Asus board - pls not more expensive than Gryphon if possible smile.gif
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post #280 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:28 PM
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The T version does not use less energy than the other versions, it's just handicapped so it performs less. Hardly worth something paying for IMO. The TDP watt rating is mostly bullsh1t, it won't draw any less power playing a video than the normal cheaper i3.

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post #281 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:43 PM
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Oke so whichone would you suggest from Haswell series? i3 4130t costs approx 130 $...
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post #282 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

The T version does not use less energy than the other versions, it's just handicapped so it performs less. Hardly worth something paying for IMO. The TDP watt rating is mostly bullsh1t, it won't draw any less power playing a video than the normal cheaper i3.

Interesting. Do you have a link to anything confirming that?

RAID protection is only for failed drives. That's it. It's no replacement for a proper backup.
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post #283 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 12:51 PM
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Interesting. Do you have a link to anything confirming that?

My word should be enough alone. But if needed yes data exists and I could dig up a link.

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post #284 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 01:01 PM
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My word should be enough alone. But if needed yes data exists and I could dig up a link.

You'll forgive me if I take Intel's word over yours.

RAID protection is only for failed drives. That's it. It's no replacement for a proper backup.
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post #285 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by ajhieb View Post

You'll forgive me if I take Intel's word over yours.

Start here :
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1464148/should-i-wait-for-haswell/100_100#post_23436829

Keep reading^
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Originally Posted by renethx View Post

It is a bit surprising that there are still people who believe the difference of TDP between S/T and normal versons is real. smile.gif Truth is that there is almost zero difference at idle and video playback.

Silent PC Review



My own post.

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post #286 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 01:09 PM
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The reason to get a "T" version CPU is if you need the low profile CPU fan and can get it at a reasonable cost. Having used the intel fan its actually quite decent and of course free with the CPU.
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post #287 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted by assassin View Post

The reason to get a "T" version CPU is if you need the low profile CPU fan and can get it at a reasonable cost. Having used the intel fan its actually quite decent and of course free with the CPU.

And this is not my case smile.gif So which non T Haswell CPU would you guys suggest so i could be able to enable 2400Mhz RAM?
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post #288 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 01:20 PM
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Thanks!

RAID protection is only for failed drives. That's it. It's no replacement for a proper backup.
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post #289 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajhieb View Post

You'll forgive me if I take Intel's word over yours.
Quote:
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Thanks!

You are welcome biggrin.gif glad you trust me over Intel now tongue.gif

And this just after Assassin sorta apologized to me for being right in my server thread about FlexRaid eek.gif

I guess I'm on a roll !

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post #290 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 09:54 PM
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And on top of that the question is i3 or i5?
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post #291 of 364 Old 01-23-2014, 11:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

I would use JINC 3 + Anti ringing for image upscaling and chroma upscaling. I would use Catmull-ROM for image downscaling. Try that. See what happens.


Also I would play and check with your Smooth Motion setting:



Restart, reinstall or update everything and start there. See what happens and report back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nickbuol View Post

I think that I started with Jinc 3 Taps, but didn't have the anti-ringing enabled. I checked that box. I also set the downscale to the Catmull-ROM. Smooth motion was already set to that as well.

Still getting about 1 dropped and 1 repeated frame every 10-12 seconds and it is noticeable when watching a movie. I then went into my video card settings and turned off pretty much every video enhancement option. I figured MadVR would just manage it. It was maybe a touch worse, but certainly not better.

I also in the mix updated MBT to the latest and noticed that under the options you can now also select hardware acceleration. I turned that on as well to DVXA2 COPYBACK since that is what I was told to set in LAV.

Still stumped.

I am going to copy a MKV file of a known stutter/judder movie (Fast and Furious 6) to the HTPC. I am going to play it both locally as well as over the gigabit network, but outside of MBT and see if I can get something to behave differently. I need to eliminate some variable since there are a LOT of variables right now.

EDIT: OK that test failed. The only thing that I had that would play the MKV was Total Media Theater 6, but without any codecs installed and such, I was getting video tearing of the image, and nothing was kicking off MadVR so I between the two I couldn't see if frames were being dropped or duplicated.

I tested my network speed though and I am able to copy a file from my media server to the HTPC at a minimum of 101MB/s (808 megabit/s) and many times it would go up to around 110MB/s in my short 2 minute test. So I am getting good throughput on the network from the server.

Just stumped again.

Bumped so that it doesn't get totally lost...
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post #292 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 01:20 AM
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Sorry Nick for jumping into "your" thread smile.gif
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post #293 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 04:53 AM
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Bumped so that it doesn't get totally lost...

Ok did you try a movie file locally ? And have you tried any other movies ?

Do you want to share a movie with me via Dropbox or BOX (I have empty 50GB FREE account I'll give you my PW) I'll try and play it on my machine and compare the statistics ??

If they are the same that might less us focus on the movie file or a problem with MBT instead of chasing ghosts ?? Just an idea.

Or I could supply you with a video I have that I know to be a good one and see what happens when you play it back

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post #294 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by embeathome View Post

And on top of that the question is i3 or i5?

Easy answer is get the one you can afford and fits your budget or that you want to buy or you want to own the most.

You'll never regret getting the superior i5 quad core even if you don't use it or need it immediately. Sometimes there is value in knowing you have it just in case you might need it, and knowing it should remain viable and capable longer. The speed increase from the more powerful CPU is also a bonus.

There isn't really much anything I can say to recommend the i3 instead except it costs less. If that is really important to you then the choice is easy. If it's not then your choice should also be easy.

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post #295 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Sorry Nick for jumping into "your" thread smile.gif

No worries. Its all good.
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post #296 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 07:23 AM - Thread Starter
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Ok did you try a movie file locally ? And have you tried any other movies ?

Do you want to share a movie with me via Dropbox or BOX (I have empty 50GB FREE account I'll give you my PW) I'll try and play it on my machine and compare the statistics ??

If they are the same that might less us focus on the movie file or a problem with MBT instead of chasing ghosts ?? Just an idea.

Or I could supply you with a video I have that I know to be a good one and see what happens when you play it back

I moved the file locally, but with my barebones install of just what MBT says it needs, I get video tearing when watching with Total Media Theater 6 since I don't have any codec packs installed. It also doesn't hit MadVR so I can't see the stats by pressing CTRL-J and with the video tearing, I couldn't tell if the video is dropping frames and such.

I get pretty much the same results with everything. Just for consistency I have used the same movie.

My best bet would be testing a known good video with my system. If you have something that runs with little to no dropped and duplicated frames (I usually get 5-6 dropped/duplicated frames right at the start) that I could try, then we can inject it into my server/client environment.

I think that I will also set up my primary desktop PC with a clean install of MBT and try it on that computer as well.

I will be heading back out of town today and probably won't be doing much until maybe tomorrow night late as we are actually staying in a hotel this time (driving home at 2:00am and getting up at 6:15am for work a few days in a row is taking its toll), and then we have family coming over tomorrow afternoon through evening.

Any way to get you to upload something and shoot me a PM with a link? I can kick off the download when we get home and let it run until the relatives leave that night.
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post #297 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 09:26 AM
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YES. I can figure it out. I am sleeping at my parents house tonight again because we are finishing the hard wood floors and since my wife is pregnant with twins we don't want to be near the fumes of the process. It's pretty smelly. I have one more coat to go put on tonight, and hopefully I can be home this weekend. Once I am home I will upload a movie or two into my BOX account which I just signed up for and have never used. I got a 50GB FREE account just for signing up on ipad. If you have an ipad it's a great deal. 50GB of free cloud storage is nice, and you can even marry it to your PLEX (and hopfully soon MB theater) and use the space for cloud storage. This helps by streaming down from their servers which is faster than uploading from your home. So if you are traveling and want to watch something you won't have to worry about your upload speed at your house being a bottle neck. Just sync it before you want to watch it and you should be ok.

Anyways back on topic,

I will try to get to it this weekend and PM you the download link. I will download from the same link and we can compare.

I am currently shopping for a 7870ghz or a R9 270X RADEON card myself right now.

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"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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post #298 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
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I ran home over lunch and tried to do some testing, but not enough time. I updated MBT and MB3 Classic on my primary desktop. I don't notice any dropped frames on this computer. However, I didn't have MadVR installed at first, so I couldn't tell. Then I loaded MadVR and started seeing a lot of dropped frames. Probably need to look into some configuration settings that aren't matching up. So since it isn't an apples to apples comparison of hardware, it isn't panning out very well for a test. Plus I just plain ran out of time.

FYI that the main specs on this machine:
AMD Phenom II X4 965 3.42GHz
Gigabyte GA-MA785GM-US2H mobo
4GB RAM DDR2 800
EVGA SuperClocked 01G-P3-1463-KR GeForce GTX 560 (Fermi) 1GB


vs. the HTPC with:

Intel Core i5 4670K 3.4GHz
ASRock Z87M Extreme4 mobo
8GB RAM DDR3 1600 (overclockable)
ASUS HD7790-DC2OC-1GD5 Radeon HD7790 1GB
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post #299 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 10:43 AM
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same video file ?

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"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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post #300 of 364 Old 01-24-2014, 12:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post

same video file ?
Yes.
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