Would You Use HDMI Native Res or TV Native Res? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
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I've run my PC connected to a TV for the last 2 years, and I really enjoy it. However, I'm not sure which resolution to run for optimal results.

 

Config:

-PC is connected to the Panasonic X3 plasma TV (http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/TC-P42X3) via HDMI.
-HDMI signal is 1920 x 1080. 1080p
-TV is 1024 x 768. "1080p"

 

Details:

Windows 7 and the GPU (GTX 580) both think 1920 x 1080 is the native display resolution, but when thats selected the screens stretched out a little too far, and I cant see the borders of the desktop due to overscan.

 

At 1024 x 768 (native) there are massive black borders on all 4 sides. When I resize/scale to this res, it looks a bit distorted.

 

No standard res will display correctly; I've tried them all, dozens of them. I've also tried all (every single one) TV and GPU settings. I have to resize/scale a resolution (the GPU will resize/scale any res.) to get it to fit the screen or create a custom res of ~1824 x 1036.

 

So I don't know if I should run at 1920 x 1080 because Windows 7/the GPU thinks its correct or the TV's actual native res or perhaps somewhere in between. Maybe run the desktop at 1832 x 1024 for a large area and render games at ~768p? 

 

If running at a higher than native TV res can provide more image detail, I'd definitely go that route, otherwise I'd go with native to gain some FPS in games. I'm basically trying to determine which will provide the best quality and performance without trying them individually for an extended period of time.

 

I have a ticket in with Nvidia now and they continually shy away from the technical aspects and are of the opinion that simply 1920*1080 should be made to fit screen as it's the "best option."  Any opinions/suggestions are greatly appreciated

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post #2 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 12:24 PM
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For starters set your tv up for pixel mapping.
-Menu
-Picture
-Advanced Picture
-Size
-HD Size 2

That will fix any overscan issues.

When you see black borders at native resolution where do you see it - on the PC desktop or in a video player?

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post #3 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 12:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the reply. There are no size options under advanced picture. The size options seem to be under "aspect adjustments" and they are all greyed out.

 

Screen format options are: full, H-fill, just, zoom, 4:3. Full seems to give the best results. All the others crop/zoom in on the picture.

 

At the TVs native res their are massive black borders (they take up 50%+ of the entire screen in total)  on all 4 sides all the time; in video players, desktop, etc. 

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post #4 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 12:37 PM
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Hmm I guess they changed where that setting is located

How about H Size under aspect adjustments. Size 2 eliminates overscan

My HTPC front end set up
Integration for whole home ATSC, CableCARD, FM radio, Blu-Ray, HD-DVD, DVD, VHS control & capture, video games, and archived & streaming media playback
Mironto's Panasonic plasma black level restoration guide
Restore the initial MLL on a 2009 Panasonic plasma
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post #5 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 12:55 PM - Thread Starter
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it's locked at h-size1 and greyed out.

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post #6 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 01:00 PM
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what resolution are you feeding it when thats grayed out? if its at 1080p, try going to native. if its grayed out at native try changing to 1080p

My HTPC front end set up
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Mironto's Panasonic plasma black level restoration guide
Restore the initial MLL on a 2009 Panasonic plasma
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post #7 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 01:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Never thought of that. Good idea. I'll try it out and update you.

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post #8 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 01:46 PM - Thread Starter
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It's greyed out at 1080p and native as well as all other resolutions I've tried (1280*720 720p/i, 1366*768 1080p/i, 1832*1024). Note that I have it selected for "no scaling" in the Nvidia Control Panel.  I've also tried cycling the inputs and turning the display on/off when changing the res.

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post #9 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 02:05 PM
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If your TV has a VGA input I'd try that as well. It may recognize more resolutions on that port than on the HDMI port. Check your TV's manual for a list of resolutions. I use VGA in my system (for heat reasons), and it looks identical to HDMI.
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post #10 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 03:03 PM - Thread Starter
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There's no VGA port on the TV.  I didn't notice a list of resolutions in the manual, but I'll check it again. Thanks for the suggestions

 

UPDATE: I was able to gain access to HSize and Zoom level. I foolishly didn't realize zoom/hfill had to be selected to modify them. Looking forward to tinkering with it.

 

I also discovered in the manual that the HDMI signal should be set to "1,125 (1,080)/60p"  "67.50 horizontal freq." "60.00 vertical freq." I'm going to try setting up a custom resolution with these parameters and see what happens. (Turns out these are the preset 1920*1080 settings, so they didn't help)

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post #11 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 05:03 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm not sure how to set this up to get 1:1 pixel mapping. I would have thought that setting it to "Just" "H-Size 2" would enable 1:1 pixel mapping. Is this the case with most Panasonic plasmas?

 

It definitely zooms in and worsens the overscan at the default 1920*1080.

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post #12 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 05:23 PM
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In the Nvidia control panel, are you set to perform scaling on the GPU or the display?
It sounds like your TV is reporting that it's 1080p native (which it's not) and the driver is scaling everything to fit inside a 1080p signal - this would give you the massive borders around all edges of the image when you output 1024x768.
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post #13 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
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In the control panel, I set it to "no scaling."

 

I see what you mean. It makes sense that the TV is reporting 1920*1080 when it isnt. Maybe I can change the EDID or whatever it is to fix this.

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post #14 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenileAnimal View Post

In the control panel, I set it to "no scaling."
I see what you mean. It makes sense that the TV is reporting 1920*1080 when it isnt. Maybe I can change the EDID or whatever it is to fix this.
When it's set to perform scaling on the display, do you still end up with large borders around the image if you set your resolution to 1024x768?
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post #15 of 15 Old 11-01-2013, 07:26 PM - Thread Starter
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When set to aspect ratio scaling, there are moderate vertical black bars at the sides. Using full screen scaling, it is overscanned and zoomed too far into the desktop. With desktop resizing enabled in addition to full screen scaling, it seems to display correctly (though it does seem a bit distorted, with a loss of information rendered on the screen).

 

Yet the "native" resolution of 1920*1080 only needs resizing, with scaling adjustments providing no notable change.

 

UPDATE: In case it may help other people with similar issues, I'd add that "full" seems like the best format with this TV, as it does not zoom in/overscan as much as other options. H-Fill and Zooming options did not help.

 

ATM it seems like the best option is running 1920*1080 resized with full screen GPU scaling to give me both a large desktop and flexibility when gaming. While the scaling does not effect 1080p, it does allow you to select pretty much any resolution you want when gaming (with no interruption or reconfig via the GPU menu), and it is automatically made to fill the screen. I can't tell yet if there's any difference between gaming at 1080p or 768p on a 768p TV, but in time maybe a difference will become evident. Note that while the desktop looks wonky at 768p, games for some reason do not.

 

At some point I'm going to contact Panasonic and see if they have any opinion on the matter (doubt it). I'd note that Nvidia was useless in giving any kind of technical explanation. I also plan to look further into updating the display's firmware and modifying the display's EDID at some point in the future. At this point, I'm not sure if a modded EDID will help matters or not.

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