Haswell i3 mini-ITX runs much cooler than expected - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 29 Old 02-01-2014, 12:34 PM - Thread Starter
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I finally got some Haswell parts and decided to see how they would behave in the smallest case that I have, the Iwill SH-55

flae6t.jpg

I installed the following hardware:
  • ASUS H81T/CSM motherboard
  • Core i3-4130 (Haswell) CPU
  • 64GB Samsung mSATA SSD
  • Dynatron CPU cooler

I fully expected there would be no way this setup could stay cool in this case. I've tried with each new generation of Intel processors and temps have always been higher than I would feel comfortable with on a day-to-day basis. Very much to my surprise Prime95 never sent the temps over 70C and watching video it's right around 35C. I had no idea the new Haswell chips ran so cool. I've never seen anything like this in mini-ITX desktop parts. I don't even have the little 50mm case fan hooked up.

Imagine Haswell i3 in a 7.75 x 7.75 x 2.17 inch (197 x 197 x 55mm) case!

Next up is to try the new RC6 USB receiver I got with the cases. If the ASUS motherboard can supply power to the USB header when off, that'll allow the PC to be turned on from off.
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post #2 of 29 Old 02-01-2014, 02:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Lucky day! The ASUS board has a feature where you can switch on USB "charging" in S5 which maintains power to the USB header and therefore the IR receiver. I am able to turn this PC on from off with a remote. The IR receiver is RC6 compatible which is so much better than the old proprietary receivers. It's able to control the power switch by virtue of having the power switch run through the IR receiver. So, as long as there's power it can receive commands include on/off.

 

 

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post #3 of 29 Old 02-02-2014, 11:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Fitted a 2.5" HDD today and there's room for 1 x 2.5" HDD so it can have 1 x 2.5" HDD + 1 x mSATA. The ASUS H81T/CSM is a nice little board with tons of features. There's even a USB header intended for an IR receiver. It's not CIR but it's just a 4-pin header leaving 2 other USB headers open. It also has a mini-PCIe slot for a wireless card. This case has ports on the side for antennas.

 

 

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post #4 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 04:52 AM
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I just discovered this Asus MB (ASUS H81T/CSM).
It seems really cool. It's the perfect board for a small htpc and it is also a cheap solution (you save on the pico-psu).
What power adapter does it require?

Dakkar
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post #5 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 06:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dakkar View Post

I just discovered this Asus MB (ASUS H81T/CSM).
It seems really cool. It's the perfect board for a small htpc and it is also a cheap solution (you save on the pico-psu).
What power adapter does it require?

Dakkar

19V with a 7.4mm * 5.0mm tip. That's the typical size for thin mini-ITX as spec'd by Intel. The one I am using is 90W. A lot of HP notebooks take this same size / voltage so aftermarket AC adapters are easy to find.

Examples:
90W
http://www.amazon.com/RAVPower%C2%AE-HP90A-RA-Notebook-Replacement-Pavilion/dp/B00AMBF4US
http://www.amazon.com/Laptop-Charger-Adapter-Supply-Pavilion/dp/B00281T8HK

160W
http://www.mini-box.com/19v-8-4A-160-Watt-AC-DC-Power-Adapter

This is the one I've been using which is very good so it's naturally now out-of-stock: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004IT27PK

 

 

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post #6 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 07:33 AM
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That looks sweet !

Any issue at all while using the system? Any limitation with 3d or high bitrate rip?

What Os/front end are you using ?

If it's working well, I'd love to build one myself. But I can't seem to find that case online, only in barebones kit.

Tnx





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post #7 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 07:59 AM
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where can we buy that case?
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post #8 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 08:05 AM - Thread Starter
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I import them from China and then mod them to install the IR receiver which also comes from China.

I also have a 80mm tall version that fits a slot-load ODD.

1zwkuhx.jpg

 

 

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post #9 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 10:09 AM
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so how do we buy them?
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post #10 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
The ASUS board has a feature where you can switch on USB "charging" in S5 which maintains power to the USB header and therefore the IR receiver.

What is the feature called called and are there other mobo's (atx) with this feature ?
I'm also waiting on Inteset IRS5-01 to see how that works.

Although opinions vary on the full off vs sleep, I'm in the full off corner so I'm waiting on an updated/easy way to accomplish this before upgrading my aging htpc. (staying miles away from imon).
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post #11 of 29 Old 02-03-2014, 10:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcain View Post

so how do we buy them?

I've made them available in the past and run into a lot of issues with people not understanding what they're getting into with such a small case. Even myself it's taken a long time find just the right hardware to go inside it that doesn't cause overheating, space issues, etc. I'd be willing to make some of them available with certain caveats about building in them and what support for other hardware I haven't tested would be.
Quote:
Originally Posted by T0R0 View Post

What is the feature called called and are there other mobo's (atx) with this feature ?
I'm also waiting on Inteset IRS5-01 to see how that works.

Although opinions vary on the full off vs sleep, I'm in the full off corner so I'm waiting on an updated/easy way to accomplish this before upgrading my aging htpc. (staying miles away from imon).

ASUS calls it "Ai Charging" and Gigabyte calls it "On/Off Charge".

 

 

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post #12 of 29 Old 02-05-2014, 12:46 PM
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Hi Stardog,

 

I've ordered the same motherboard so I've got a couple of questions.  Could provide a link or picture of the IR receiver you have please? Also what type of remote are you using? You said that the IR receiver is able to wake the machine from S5, does it also handle the standard codes like play/pause etc?

 

Thanks

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post #13 of 29 Old 02-05-2014, 01:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tavalin View Post

Hi Stardog,

I've ordered the same motherboard so I've got a couple of questions.  Could provide a link or picture of the IR receiver you have please? Also what type of remote are you using? You said that the IR receiver is able to wake the machine from S5, does it also handle the standard codes like play/pause etc?

Thanks

I don't have a link because the IR receiver is something I've imported from a manufacturer I work with in China. They come with the line of cases I order from them.

It is an RC6 (more accurately Microsoft-Philips IR protocol) MCE internal USB receiver so it can accept commands from an MCE-compatible remote control.

The other feature the IR receiver has is you run the PC case's power switch lead through the IR receiver (power button connects to IR receiver, IR receiver connects to motherboard) so as long as the IR receiver has power it can act as a power button via remote control. Modern Gigabyte and ASUS motherboards have a feature where they maintain power to the USB header in S5 (off) and it's configurable in the BIOS. Gigabyte seems to have it on by default, ASUS has it off. For the H81T/CSM, the option is called "Ai Charging" andi it's under the "Peripherals Configuration" in the BIOS' Advanced Configuration.

I tried it out using a Rosewill MCE remote and a Logitech Harmony One which I've programmed to have a MCE activity.

I hope that helps explain how it works.

 

 

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post #14 of 29 Old 02-05-2014, 02:06 PM
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Cheers for your reply.

 

After doing a lot of research, that's how I figured it would have to be set up to do both.

 

Is it this, or something like this?

 

http://www.shop.perfecthometheater.com/IR-receiver-IR-receiver.htm?categoryId=-1

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post #15 of 29 Old 02-05-2014, 02:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tavalin View Post

Cheers for your reply.

After doing a lot of research, that's how I figured it would have to be set up to do both.

Is it this, or something like this?

http://www.shop.perfecthometheater.com/IR-receiver-IR-receiver.htm?categoryId=-1

It's very similar to that, yes.

 

 

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post #16 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 03:28 AM
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Cheers Stardog.

 

I've ordered the following so fingers crossed!

 

http://quietpc.co.uk/st-irpb

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post #17 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 11:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Best of luck. After it's built be sure to come back with pictures, etc.

 

 

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post #18 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

I fully expected there would be no way this setup could stay cool in this case. I've tried with each new generation of Intel processors and temps have always been higher than I would feel comfortable with on a day-to-day basis. Very much to my surprise Prime95 never sent the temps over 70C and watching video it's right around 35C. I had no idea the new Haswell chips ran so cool. I've never seen anything like this in mini-ITX desktop parts. I don't even have the little 50mm case fan hooked up.

FWIW my experience matches yours. I have a 4340 in a larger case (CM130) but all the case fans are unplugged and using a fanless seasonic PSU.
The cooler is the noctua NH-L9i, I have a ramp-by-temperature profile and I have never heard the fan speed up under load. The only time it goes full speed is during POST, its also the only time I can hear it from the couch.

No other moving parts, except for the rare times I actually using the optical drive. Its a cheap but great case, I need the expansion slot and like reusing perfectly good full size parts. SSD boot, media is on my SAN.

Nearly dead silent HTPC ver 2.0: i3-4340 w/ Noctua NH-L9i on Z87E-itx inside CM130 elite, fanless PSU, SSD OS drive
SAN shares via 40GbE tunneled over 56Gb infiniband links
microcenter & ebay = severe risks to my wallet
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post #19 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 11:52 AM - Thread Starter
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^ I notice in your signature you have an A8-3820 HTPC. My livingroom HTPC has an A8-3820 in it. What a great little APU. I have a Scythe Shuriken sitting on top of it and no other fans going. We had some 100F days last summer and I still couldn't hear it. Until Haswell I though it the perfect HTPC CPU though I have no plans to change it out.

Thanks for adding your experience to the thread.

 

 

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post #20 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

^ I notice in your signature you have an A8-3820 HTPC. My livingroom HTPC has an A8-3820 in it. What a great little APU. I have a Scythe Shuriken sitting on top of it and no other fans going. We had some 100F days last summer and I still couldn't hear it. Until Haswell I though it the perfect HTPC CPU though I have no plans to change it out.

Thanks for adding your experience to the thread.

I expected you to have a 4770k @ 5.2ghz in your HTPC. You disappoint me tongue.gif

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post #21 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 09:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I expected you to have a 4770k @ 5.2ghz in your HTPC. You disappoint me tongue.gif

That's in my office PC with the dual GTX 780 setup and 1200W PSU. It spellchecks in MSWord like you can't believe and I am sure I am getting twice as much back in TurboTax.

wink.gif

 

 

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post #22 of 29 Old 02-06-2014, 09:14 PM - Thread Starter
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A couple of more pictures. The first picture I tried the system with the Gelid Slim Silence i-Plus. I did it mostly for measuring clearance with a 28mm CPU. The i-Plus doesn't work well with this motherboard because it blocks the two front USB headers leaving only the single 4-pin header.



The second picture shows how a 2.5" HDD can be installed. Technically, 2 x 2.5" could fit in there but it would completely block the CPU cooler.


 

 

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post #23 of 29 Old 02-07-2014, 05:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

^ I notice in your signature you have an A8-3820 HTPC. My livingroom HTPC has an A8-3820 in it. What a great little APU. I have a Scythe Shuriken sitting on top of it and no other fans going. We had some 100F days last summer and I still couldn't hear it. Until Haswell I though it the perfect HTPC CPU though I have no plans to change it out.

Thanks for adding your experience to the thread.

Heh, I guess I should update my sig, sold that machine a few months back. It will be someone else's media computer when they get around to putting hard drives in it, CM120 can hold 4x3.5" and 1x2.5" if you give up the optical.
I no longer have spinning hard drives in regular computers, they go in the rack where they belong smile.gif

Had to grab the 3820 on ebay because AMD was dumb about selling its lower TDP cpus, I lowballed half a dozen auctions until one finally stuck. They seem to have learned now that they are retail skus, though the 7600 delay makes no sense.

Nearly dead silent HTPC ver 2.0: i3-4340 w/ Noctua NH-L9i on Z87E-itx inside CM130 elite, fanless PSU, SSD OS drive
SAN shares via 40GbE tunneled over 56Gb infiniband links
microcenter & ebay = severe risks to my wallet
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post #24 of 29 Old 02-10-2014, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jbcain View Post

so how do we buy them?

The cases are available on the site now if you're still interested.

 

 

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post #25 of 29 Old 02-13-2014, 05:12 PM
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Stardog quick question...

What are those sticker things called that you've used to cover the IR receiver?
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post #26 of 29 Old 02-13-2014, 07:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Stardog quick question...

What are those sticker things called that you've used to cover the IR receiver?

Lightdims. A brilliantly simple solution. At least until I can get the smoked plexiglass inserts.

 

 

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post #27 of 29 Old 02-14-2014, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by StardogChampion View Post

Lightdims. A brilliantly simple solution. At least until I can get the smoked plexiglass inserts.

Love this idea. I'm ordering some tomorrow. Thanks for the tip.
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post #28 of 29 Old 02-16-2014, 10:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Love this idea. I'm ordering some tomorrow. Thanks for the tip.

You're welcome.

 

 

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post #29 of 29 Old 05-07-2014, 10:14 PM
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I'm glad I saw this thread. I just ordered a Asus H81T/csm and didn't realize that I could use a laptop psu with it.
The company I work for used to use exclusively HP laptops and docks so I should have a 95W power adapter that should work nicely.
If I do I can send the Silverstone 450W SFX psu back, saves a fair bit of cash.

The original posters setup is really close to what I just ordered.
Same motherboard and cpu, just a different case (Silverstone Milo ML06), SSD (120GB msata Crucial M4) and HSF (Noctua NH-L9i)

Using a laptop PSU should make this virtually silent.
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