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-   -   HD 4600 (i3 4340) Crashing w/Win 7 & 8 (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/26-home-theater-computers/1528654-hd-4600-i3-4340-crashing-w-win-7-8-a.html)

testudoaubreii 04-23-2014 06:28 AM

Hello,

I am building an HTPC and I was able to successfully install all of my components. Here they are:

Gigabyte H87N Wifi
i3 4340
2 x 2 GBs Patriot Signature Line 1600
Corsair 430w
Cooler Master Elite 110

I was able to install Windows 8. However, when I installed the driver for Intel HD 4600, my HTPC crahsed upon boot-up. It would get to the Windows logo and then just go to a black screen. The computer would not shut off, just black screen. I was able to boot into safe mode and uninstall the HD 4600 driver. I was able to boot back into Windows, but as soon as I installed the HD 4600 driver it would crash. So, I decided to revert back to Windows 7 SP1. I got the same exact results. I don't know what to do.

Is there some sort of issues running HD 4600 integrated graphics with Windows? I could just get a discrete GPU, but that kind of defeats the purpose of using the HD iGPU of Intel for a small HTPC build.

Thank you in advance for any and all help, suggestions and advice.

Testudo


goros 04-23-2014 06:47 AM

If you are crashing it's from some sort of hardware instability. You aren't crashing, you are just getting a black screen.
You need to update your BIOS for the motherboard to the latest iteration and then go into the bios and make sure your settings are correct.
The first step would be to make sure your default video source in the bios would be the igpu. There should be an option to select it. There may also be an option for hdmi vs dvi vs rgb.

Sent from my Note3 via Tapatalk

testudoaubreii 04-23-2014 09:12 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by goros View Post

If you are crashing it's from some sort of hardware instability. You aren't crashing, you are just getting a black screen.
You need to update your BIOS for the motherboard to the latest iteration and then go into the bios and make sure your settings are correct.
The first step would be to make sure your default video source in the bios would be the igpu. There should be an option to select it. There may also be an option for hdmi vs dvi vs rgb.

Sent from my Note3 via Tapatalk

Thanks for your response!

 

Yeah, everything is up to date, but I will double check the BIOS settings. Could it be the motherboard, at all?


goros 04-23-2014 12:04 PM

Unlikely. It's a setting somewhere.

Sent from my Note3 via Tapatalk

jhughy2010 04-23-2014 12:26 PM

You updated the BIOS? Also, are you sure you are installing the correct driver? I thought i3 was HD4400?

I've had nothing but trouble with the Intel integrated. I replaced with a discrete Nvidia due to poor audio drivers using HDMI output to my AVR.

One way to make sure you are installing the correct drivers is to Uninstall all gpu drivers and then let Windows install the drivers.

testudoaubreii 04-23-2014 04:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

You updated the BIOS? Also, are you sure you are installing the correct driver? I thought i3 was HD4400?

I've had nothing but trouble with the Intel integrated. I replaced with a discrete Nvidia due to poor audio drivers using HDMI output to my AVR.

One way to make sure you are installing the correct drivers is to Uninstall all gpu drivers and then let Windows install the drivers.

Thanks!

 

Yeah, I have the correct BIOS installed. I booted into safe mode and uninstalled the driver and then let Windows install it, but still got the same result. I don't think it is my mobo, since I can boot into safe mode and because I can use it just fine without the driver installed. However, I am sending back everything! I am pretty fed up with it. I have built many computers, but this one has definitely has given me the worst trouble. I have no idea what is going on.


Foxbat121 04-23-2014 05:20 PM

I'd guess the problem is with the RAM sticks. Last two PCs I built, I have to replace the RAM sticks both times. Luckily, I have Micro Center near by. So, shopping and returns are easy.

Without the driver installed, the video card probably doesn't access to the RAM that hard (IGPs use system RAM as its memory buffers). So, the problems won't show up right away.

The new PC motherboards are getting rather picky about these new DDR3 memory sticks.

jhughy2010 04-23-2014 09:26 PM

Don't send the stuff back yet. As mentioned remove one memory stick at a time to see if problem persists with just one stick.

Believe it or not you'd have these problems if not worse with a pre built.

I recently helped a friend troubleshoot an igpu issue. After weeks of troubleshooting what fixed it was a reformat and fresh install.

Edit: I think my friend had a driver conflict issue. New drivers interfearing with old. Old not being removed completely.

testudoaubreii 04-24-2014 06:06 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

I'd guess the problem is with the RAM sticks. Last two PCs I built, I have to replace the RAM sticks both times. Luckily, I have Micro Center near by. So, shopping and returns are easy.

Without the driver installed, the video card probably doesn't access to the RAM that hard (IGPs use system RAM as its memory buffers). So, the problems won't show up right away.

The new PC motherboards are getting rather picky about these new DDR3 memory sticks.

Thanks for your reply.

 

I was actually thinking about this last night. I sent my i3 and the Patriot Signature Line sticks back this morning and I have an i5 and Crucial Ballistics sticks coming in this morning. I am going to do a fresh install and see what happens. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

Don't send the stuff back yet. As mentioned remove one memory stick at a time to see if problem persists with just one stick.

Believe it or not you'd have these problems if not worse with a pre built.

I recently helped a friend troubleshoot an igpu issue. After weeks of troubleshooting what fixed it was a reformat and fresh install.

Edit: I think my friend had a driver conflict issue. New drivers interfearing with old. Old not being removed completely.

Thanks for your reply.

 

I am going to do a fresh install when my new components get in today and see what happens.


jhughy2010 04-24-2014 07:55 AM

Awesome. Which i5 did you go with? I hope this solves the problem for you.

I will however say again that I have had nothing but problems with Intel igpu, particularly regarding audio and HDMI output to a reciever, and this is what forced me prematurely to purchase an Nvidia GTX750ti. No problems with the Nvidia card.

Foxbat121 04-24-2014 08:47 AM

Nah, Intel IGP is no better or worse than any other GPU brands out there when connected to an AVR. I have some brief experiences (I don't connect PCs to AVR or TVs often) with two Intel iGPUs, one is 1st Gen Core-i5 and another one is 3rd Gen Core-i3. Both worked fine with proper driver installed.

You will see similar problem threads for NVidia and AMD GPUs connected to AVR. No GPU is perfect. PC in general is not designed well for HT use.

testudoaubreii 04-24-2014 09:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

Awesome. Which i5 did you go with? I hope this solves the problem for you.

I will however say again that I have had nothing but problems with Intel igpu, particularly regarding audio and HDMI output to a reciever, and this is what forced me prematurely to purchase an Nvidia GTX750ti. No problems with the Nvidia card.

I got the Intel Core i5-4670K and Crucial Ballistix Sport 8GB Kit. I hope that it does, too lol. Thanks.
 

I am looking at some mini GPUs right now. I have a miniITX board and case. I am looking that the GeForce GTX 650. I am going to try the iGPU first, but I may resort to the mini GPU. However, I will not be hooking the HTPC up to an AVR, or to the TV for that matter. I will have an HDMI hooked up for video, but I have the Logitech Z506 PC speaker system that I will be using for audio. It is not the best thing in the world, but it is something that my wife can tolerate lol. 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

Nah, Intel IGP is no better or worse than any other GPU brands out there when connected to an AVR. I have some brief experiences (I don't connect PCs to AVR or TVs often) with two Intel iGPUs, one is 1st Gen Core-i5 and another one is 3rd Gen Core-i3. Both worked fine with proper driver installed.

You will see similar problem threads for NVidia and AMD GPUs connected to AVR. No GPU is perfect. PC in general is not designed well for HT use.

I am going to have the HTPC hooked up to the TV via HDMI. Audio will be pushed through the onboard sound to a Logitech Z506 speaker system. I just want the PC to play video through the CPU/iGPU. 

 

My components just arrived, but I am at work so I cannot do anything yet. I am going to have to wait until I get home. It sucks! I want to check it out now. Do you guys think that I need a dedicated GPU for an HTPC?

 

I will be doing a fresh and clean install, so hopefully all will go well.

 

Thanks!


Foxbat121 04-24-2014 09:11 AM

For HTPC duty, your IGPU is more than enough.

I had very bad experiences with two Gigabyte motherboards and one Gigabyte NVidia Graphics card in the past. So I personally will avoid Gigabyte products like plague. ASUS/ASRock and Intel are the only brands I trust as far as motherboard goes.

testudoaubreii 04-24-2014 09:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

For HTPC duty, your IGPU is more than enough.

I had very bad experiences with two Gigabyte motherboards and one Gigabyte NVidia Graphics card in the past. So I personally will avoid Gigabyte products like plague. ASUS/ASRock and Intel are the only brands I trust as far as motherboard goes.

Cool.

 

The last few computers that I have build were built with Gigabyte mobos and GPUs. I never had a problem with the brand. I may have to switch it up a bit, though, if this doesn't work out.


Orange14 04-24-2014 11:21 AM

FWIW, I've built two HTPCs and one workstation all with i-3 3225 CPUs running off the integrated graphics and they all work without a hiccup.  did you install the graphics driver off the Gigabyte disk or from the Intel site?  Usually the drivers on the disk are out of date.


jhughy2010 04-24-2014 11:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

Nah, Intel IGP is no better or worse than any other GPU brands out there when connected to an AVR. I have some brief experiences (I don't connect PCs to AVR or TVs often) with two Intel iGPUs, one is 1st Gen Core-i5 and another one is 3rd Gen Core-i3. Both worked fine with proper driver installed.

You will see similar problem threads for NVidia and AMD GPUs connected to AVR. No GPU is perfect. PC in general is not designed well for HT use.

I think your "nah" is a pretty naive one especially considering your "brief experience" with a PC to AVR.  Also, PC's are plenty designed for use with Home Theater systems.  What do you think a BD player is?  How about a Roku?  Are they not mini PC's?  

 

Intel has stated themselves that their current driver lineup has instability issues in regards to audio bitsreamed via HDMI to an AVR or pre/pro.  The problem Intel faces is that they don't make previous versions of their drivers available to the end consumer, nor does Intel really care much for that matter considering their vast majority of consumers are not enthusiasts.  

 

Nvidia and ATI on the other hand have a larger consumer base of enthusiasts especially ones that consider bitstreaming audio to an outside source.  Yes, they have all had their fair share of problems and that is not an arguable point.

 

So before you say "nah, they are no better, no worse" or "PC in general is not designed well for HT use."  know what you are talking about and who you are talking too....  


Foxbat121 04-24-2014 12:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

I think your "nah" is a pretty naive one especially considering your "brief experience" with a PC to AVR.  Also, PC's are plenty designed for use with Home Theater systems.  What do you think a BD player is?  How about a Roku?  Are they not mini PC's?  

Intel has stated themselves that their current driver lineup has instability issues in regards to audio bitsreamed via HDMI to an AVR or pre/pro.  The problem Intel faces is that they don't make previous versions of their drivers available to the end consumer, nor does Intel really care much for that matter considering their vast majority of consumers are not enthusiasts.  

Nvidia and ATI on the other hand have a larger consumer base of enthusiasts especially ones that consider bitstreaming audio to an outside source.  Yes, they have all had their fair share of problems and that is not an arguable point.

So before you say "nah, they are no better, no worse" or "PC in general is not designed well for HT use."  know what you are talking about and who you are talking too....  
Just because you can't get your system to work, or afraid to get it to work, doesn't mean it never worked or won't work for anyone else. I have used it briefly on my HT systems and bitstream worked fine for me. That's all I can say. Now to use it as a BD player never crossed my mind though both my PCs had BD drive in them. I personally can't imagine anyone want to do it that way. A BD player is not a PC (they have dedicated chip to do most of the processing), easy to configure and use and in most cases better PQ than a PC. Best of all, it only costs less than $100, far cheaper than any PC.

There are numerous threads about audio not working after wake up or EDID needs override for both NVidia and AMD cards. On top of that, difficult to configure/match color spaces is another problem. That's another debate altogether.

Stay on topic on this thread, there is no reason for OP to abandon IGP if he can make it work.

jhughy2010 04-24-2014 04:33 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post


Just because you can't get your system to work, or afraid to get it to work, doesn't mean it never worked or won't work for anyone else. I have used it briefly on my HT systems and bitstream worked fine for me. That's all I can say. Now to use it as a BD player never crossed my mind though both my PCs had BD drive in them. I personally can't imagine anyone want to do it that way. A BD player is not a PC (they have dedicated chip to do most of the processing), easy to configure and use and in most cases better PQ than a PC. Best of all, it only costs less than $100, far cheaper than any PC.

There are numerous threads about audio not working after wake up or EDID needs override for both NVidia and AMD cards. On top of that, difficult to configure/match color spaces is another problem. That's another debate altogether.

Stay on topic on this thread, there is no reason for OP to abandon IGP if he can make it work.

I don't think that I am "afraid" to get my system to work.  That is a very juvenile statement to make.  I didn't intend to partake in an argument on this thread with you but inadvertently have entered one because of your outlandish statements on this subject including the fact that you think someone could be "afraid" of getting a system to work (what does that even mean anyway?).   

 

I have an Intel HD4600 series iGPU that worked fine MOST of the time.  With an updated driver from Intel everything about the chip went downhill fast including but not limited to the ability to have audio after wake.  I'm not arguing the fact that there is no reason for the OP to abandon if Intel's integrated graphics chip.  I'm simply stating that there are numerous users here and on other forums that have had very annoying issues when utilizing the Intel's integrated graphics as not only the processor for video but the platform for bitstreaming audio whether it be to a display or an AVR.

 

There are thousands of users on this forum who extensively use their HTPC as a BD player.  I doubt "it's never crossed [your] mind..." I can imagine why many would opt for this over sluggish BD players.  HTPC's are just as easy to configure, have just as good, if not better PQ than a BD player, and best of all, don't cost much more than a BD player (after all, you already are an owner of a PC... all you'd need to make it a BD player is the ROM drive... which BTW is much cheaper than a BD player last time I checked, but than again I don't personally care to have a dedicated BD player I can't imagine why anyone would want to do that).  Lastly, a dedicated BD player is not a PC (you're absolutely right in that), however, every dedicated BD player is a computer in some way shape and form, and every PC has the capability of being a BD player :)

 

With staying on topic with the OP, I doubt his iGPU was the culprit in this particular problem anyway.  It's likely a memory issue but I guess we can debate about that too. 

 

Foxbat121 if you want to continue to debate about "fear" regarding getting a systems to work or iGPU problems, HTPC not sufficient as a BD player etc. than I'd be happy to partake as well as many others here on the forums.  Please start a new thread for it and provide the link.  


Foxbat121 04-24-2014 04:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

I have an Intel HD4600 series iGPU that worked fine MOST of the time.  With an updated driver from Intel everything about the chip went downhill fast including but not limited to the ability to have audio after wake.  I'm not arguing the fact that there is no reason for the OP to abandon if Intel's integrated graphics chip.  I'm simply stating that there are numerous users here and on other forums that have had very annoying issues when utilizing the Intel's integrated graphics as not only the processor for video but the platform for bitstreaming audio whether it be to a display or an AVR.  

But that problem lies with any GPU. Just check this recent thread here http://www.avsforum.com/t/1525251/no-audio-when-htpc-comes-out-of-standby. The OP of that thread has a NVidia GPU. This further proves my early statement about PCs are not well designed for HT.

testudoaubreii 04-24-2014 04:48 PM

Alrighy. I installed my new CPU and RAM and I am getting the same effin' results. I really do not know what this is all about. This is one of the most frustrating things that I have encountered while building a machine. I swear, I am about to throw this GD thing out of the window.

 

Sorry...the venting is over. I seriously do not know what the problem can be, though. Motherboard? A BIOS setting? I am at a stand still with this thing.


jhughy2010 04-24-2014 06:18 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foxbat121 View Post

But that problem lies with any GPU. Just check this recent thread here http://www.avsforum.com/t/1525251/no-audio-when-htpc-comes-out-of-standby. The OP of that thread has a NVidia GPU. This further proves my early statement about PCs are not well designed for HT.
I'm sorry but saying that no key PC is suitable for home theater use is it completely ignorant statement. I have had bluray player not give video after I press pause and come back after an hour or so. So do you mean to tell me that the Blu ray player is not suitable for home theater use? no, this is far from the truth. Every component in a home theater system has the potential to cause problems. The no audio when waking from sleep is an HDMI handshake issue.

jhughy2010 04-24-2014 06:23 PM

I'm sorry to hear that replacing the memory in the processor did not fix the problem. Did you by chance completely reinstall windows? If you did, I'm beginning to think that there is a problem with your motherboardand it's ability to communicate with the igpu when you install the Intel graphics driver. Is there a video card that you can install in the meantime?

Edit... I read some reviews on your motherboard on newegg.com there seems to be a few people that report other issues but not the same issue that you are having.I will read through some of the Amazon reviews later on tonight and look for a duplicate of this problem.

sharangad 04-24-2014 06:46 PM

Check to see if another video output is active with the login screen.

It's possible the logon screen is rendering on another output.

arnyk 04-24-2014 08:53 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by testudoaubreii View Post

Alrighy. I installed my new CPU and RAM and I am getting the same effin' results. I really do not know what this is all about. This is one of the most frustrating things that I have encountered while building a machine. I swear, I am about to throw this GD thing out of the window.

Sorry...the venting is over. I seriously do not know what the problem can be, though. Motherboard? A BIOS setting? I am at a stand still with this thing.

Most motherboards have a jumper for resetting all BIOS settings back to default settings. Default settings are pretty conservative and are sort of a "one size fits all" thing. That's a good starting point.

Until you load the driver for your specific video system, Windows treats it like its a generic display adapter. If loading a specific driver breaks your machine, its likely that the problem is with the video system or the driver.

The symptom you are having could be as simple as having set a display resolution that is more than your display device can handle.

This may help:

http://www.go4expert.com/articles/reset-screen-resolution-windows-7-t24243/

jhughy2010 04-24-2014 09:21 PM

I'm wondering if there is a way you can get an older version of Intel's display driver.  It is interesting to me that every time you install the driver you have this same symptom.  


Orange14 04-25-2014 06:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

I'm sorry to hear that replacing the memory in the processor did not fix the problem. Did you by chance completely reinstall windows? If you did, I'm beginning to think that there is a problem with your motherboardand it's ability to communicate with the igpu when you install the Intel graphics driver. Is there a video card that you can install in the meantime?

Edit... I read some reviews on your motherboard on newegg.com there seems to be a few people that report other issues but not the same issue that you are having.I will read through some of the Amazon reviews later on tonight and look for a duplicate of this problem.

I have the Ivy Bridge version of the same MoBo and did not have any problems setting up the video driver for an i3-3225.  IIRC I had a problem with one of the PCs I built when I tried to do a driver update from the Intel site and got a black screen.  I just rolled back to the previous driver and didn't try to trouble shoot anything since it was just an HTPC application and it would do 1080 video just fine.  Driver problems are just the worst thing to deal with IMO.


testudoaubreii 04-25-2014 07:24 AM

Thanks everyone for the replies.

 

Yeah, that is what I think it is, a driver problem. I can go 1920 x 1080 without the HD 4600 driver. It is a generic VGA driver that installs before the HD  4600 driver is installed. I do not go over 1920 x 1080, so I know that the HD 4600 and my ASUS PB238Q can do that resolution. I don't know what to do. I am about to RMA the motherboard, just to see if that is the issue. I mean, it can't be too much more. I have tried the F7 approach in BIOS/UEFI and everything else under the sun, but I get no positive result. 


Dark_Slayer 04-25-2014 08:14 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by testudoaubreii View Post

Thanks everyone for the replies.

Yeah, that is what I think it is, a driver problem. I can go 1920 x 1080 without the HD 4600 driver. It is a generic VGA driver that installs before the HD  4600 driver is installed. I do not go over 1920 x 1080, so I know that the HD 4600 and my ASUS PB238Q can do that resolution. I don't know what to do. I am about to RMA the motherboard, just to see if that is the issue. I mean, it can't be too much more. I have tried the F7 approach in BIOS/UEFI and everything else under the sun, but I get no positive result. 

Have you updated the Intel chipset drivers for the motherboard from the manufacturer's downloads page? http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4733&dl=1#dl

Intel Management Engine and Intel INF?

Windows typically takes care of the graphics driver on it's own


Also, do you know if your board is rev2 or rev1.x?

testudoaubreii 04-25-2014 08:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_Slayer View Post


Have you updated the Intel chipset drivers for the motherboard from the manufacturer's downloads page? http://www.gigabyte.us/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4733&dl=1#dl

Intel Management Engine and Intel INF?

Windows typically takes care of the graphics driver on it's own


Also, do you know if your board is rev2 or rev1.x?

Thanks for your reply.

 

I have downloaded all of the drivers from Gigabyte's site. I cannot install IME for some reason. I thought that is was weird that Windows did not download the drivers right away. Usually, they do that during the installation process. I have to download the internet/network drivers to a USB drive from another computer. I haven't had that problem when installing Win 7 before. 

 

This last time around, Windows installed the generic VGA driver, but when I update it I get the black screen after the Windows logo. 

 

I have Rev 2.0. I am thinking about RAM'ing the board and getting the Gigabyte Mini ITX GA-B85N. I built a machine with the GA-B81 before and did not run into this problem, so I figure I may give it a go. Are there any other mini ITX mobos with a UEFI that may give me better results...assuming that it is a mobo/driver incompatibility? 

 

Thanks!


jhughy2010 04-25-2014 08:48 AM

If you do decide to return the board you might consider the Z87 chipset. In all honesty I'd probably return the board as well. Also, did you try and contact Gigabyte tech support?


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