Hot switching between Intel IGP and dedicated graphics card - AVS Forum
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Old 08-11-2014, 10:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Hot switching between Intel IGP and dedicated graphics card

First of all I want to say a massive thanks to @renethx for all his efforts and informative posts on this forum and @madshi for all his efforts with madvr.

Through past posts its been determined than intel integrated graphics provides the best dxva scaling as intel has dedicated hardware scaling circuits unlike nvidia and amd. Intel also has dedicated de-interlacing hardware meaning it won't affect rendering performance with madvr.

With my current graphics card, I've set-up madvr with hot-keys for the different luma up and downscale algorithms and when I pause a frame I can switch between them. It has already been determined that AMD uses bilinear to upscale and from my comparison this appears to be the case. Whats noticeable is how much this softens, blurs and degrades the picture. It makes 720p on a 768p screen look awful. Unfortunately I can only take advantage of madvr using mpc-hc which is unable to stream from youtube or vimeo. Using an Intel IGP, while I wouldn't be able to gain access to other madvr features such as error diffusion or svp, and better scaling algorithms such as jinc or nnedi, for all other sources of video that can't take advantage of madvr that is anything online based (netflix, vimeo, youtube, dailymotion, hbo go, bbc iplayer etc), the results for upscaling would be much better.

Intels IGP however isn't powerful enough to run jinc for luma and chroma, at least with anti-ringing, and for upscaling 1080p to 4k. I would require a dedicated graphics card from nvidia or amd which is powerful enough for luma doubling or at least jinc3+ar luma+chroma. Since no motherboards have hdmi2, and displayport can't output 23.98hz,24hz,29.97hz, hdmi would also need to be used, so hopefully a graphics card in future will have hdmi2 and hevc decoding. A powerful graphics card is also very power hungry.

An ideal solution would be to use the IGP from intel a majority of the time, but I believe so long as a graphics card is installed it'll draw power? The 750ti according to techpowerup idles at 4w. If I could connect the same tv via the motherboard and graphics card and switch between the two depending on the situation without having to restart, but during use that would be ideal.

Does anyone know about the possibility of connecting the same display via graphics card and motherboard and hot switching between the two? Or if it's even possible to use the intergrated graphics once you've installed a graphics card?

Thanks
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Old 08-11-2014, 10:53 PM
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It sounds like you are looking for this http://lucidlogix.com/products/virtu...0-for-windows/

This may work well for you in the case of looking for different benefits from different GPU paths


The software is not too popular given that for a long time it was pitched to offer power saving benefits to those using an intel processor with decent-enough igpu for most tasks and a dGPU for advanced tasks. It didn't make much impact because "integrated mode" (where you were supposed to save power) ends up leaving the dGPU in idle mode which was within 2-3% of the power consumption you would see if you just ran the dGPU in the standard desktop configuration without Lucid Virtu running at all. Also, dedicated and integrated modes didn't give as good of gaming performance as you got directly with standard dGPU configuration and the only benefit at that point was virtu v-sync (which GPU vendors built in to their software anyway)

However, I don't know too many people who've tested using something like this to offload madvr tasks to your dGPU with all output flowing through your iGPU hdmi connection (which is what they refer to as "integrated mode")

As a starting point, if you are willing to fiddle with the software a little, I think you can end up having application profiles and that would be easier (in my mind) than hot switching hdmi outputs with a harmony -- assuming it will work favorably
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Old 08-12-2014, 02:32 AM
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I think GPUs with HDMI 2.0 support should come soon enough. That said, I'm not sure why DisplayPort wouldn't support 23.976Hz. That surprises me. Technically, it should be quite possible. Have you tried to create custom resolutions or to use an EDID override or other things like that? I've no experience with DisplayPort, though, so I can't really say for sure...

About netflix, vimeo etc: Are you sure that those are really using the built in scaling and deinterlacing capability of the GPU? Well, I have to say I don't know if they do. Maybe yes, but I kinda doubt it.
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Old 08-12-2014, 09:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I think GPUs with HDMI 2.0 support should come soon enough. That said, I'm not sure why DisplayPort wouldn't support 23.976Hz. That surprises me. Technically, it should be quite possible. Have you tried to create custom resolutions or to use an EDID override or other things like that? I've no experience with DisplayPort, though, so I can't really say for sure...

About netflix, vimeo etc: Are you sure that those are really using the built in scaling and deinterlacing capability of the GPU? Well, I have to say I don't know if they do. Maybe yes, but I kinda doubt it.
On youtube when it says accelerated video rendering I assume anything flash based is using the enhanced video renderer. I also assume the main browsers do as well, they was a bug on google chrome when it came to downscaling where it used nearest neighbor on some amd graphics cards but its been rectified now.

Earlier in the apple store, I tried a macbook pro with retina display, most use the iris pro now, I logged on to vimeo which has plenty of 720p videos and the full screen players gives you the option of switching between scaled and native resolution (on hidpi displays, its still scaled). When switching between scaled and unscaled the pictures were equally sharp although it the fullscreen image was coarser indicating the lanczos algorithm was likely in use. I couldn't find the macbook pro with nvidia graphics, I think they were all in use so I went to the 27 inch imac and loaded a 1080p vimeo video with title graphics and the familiar bilinear upscaling greets you.

I don't know if silverlight uses dxva scaling, I notice when Netflix starts streaming although the resolution is low, the image isn't as blurry but is more pixellated and aliased. It's certainly far slower than flash or html5.

Intel's dedicated de-interlacing circuits won't make a difference in a dedicated gpu for madvr, but I think we should all petition amd and nvidia to include dedicated hardware scaling and deinterlacing circuits like Intel. I don't think they will as they cater mostly to gamers.

As nice as the macbook pro with retina displays are, and even if those with intel igpus have decent scaling, since they can't take advantage of madvr I am afraid I won't be spending so much for one!
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Old 08-12-2014, 09:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_Slayer View Post
It sounds like you are looking for this http://lucidlogix.com/products/virtu...0-for-windows/

This may work well for you in the case of looking for different benefits from different GPU paths


The software is not too popular given that for a long time it was pitched to offer power saving benefits to those using an intel processor with decent-enough igpu for most tasks and a dGPU for advanced tasks. It didn't make much impact because "integrated mode" (where you were supposed to save power) ends up leaving the dGPU in idle mode which was within 2-3% of the power consumption you would see if you just ran the dGPU in the standard desktop configuration without Lucid Virtu running at all. Also, dedicated and integrated modes didn't give as good of gaming performance as you got directly with standard dGPU configuration and the only benefit at that point was virtu v-sync (which GPU vendors built in to their software anyway)

However, I don't know too many people who've tested using something like this to offload madvr tasks to your dGPU with all output flowing through your iGPU hdmi connection (which is what they refer to as "integrated mode")

As a starting point, if you are willing to fiddle with the software a little, I think you can end up having application profiles and that would be easier (in my mind) than hot switching hdmi outputs with a harmony -- assuming it will work favorably
Thanks for the link I had come across the software while researching this, I believe the main aim for the software is for those who want to use the quicksync features during gaming.

I think the basic edition should do the job although I would be stuck with the hdmi 1.4 connection on the mothrboard or displayport and wouldn't be able to take advantage of the hdmi 2 of hardware hevc decoder in a later graphics card.

For those who have intel gpu's and a seperate graphics card I'd be grateful if you could try connecting a single display to both motherboard and gpu and try switching in the control panel.

Thanks
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Old 08-12-2014, 11:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leonccyiu View Post

Does anyone know about the possibility of connecting the same display via graphics card and motherboard and hot switching between the two? Or if it's even possible to use the intergrated graphics once you've installed a graphics card?

Thanks
Of course you can use iGPU while having a dGPU installed in your system.

You can also select which GPU is used via control panel, not with keyboard shortcuts but selecting the GPU and the monitor port connected (I don't know if there are shortcuts for this)

You can do that by enabling in BIOS multiple renderers, connecting the two GPUs in different ports of a single display and using Windows 8 or better.

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