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post #1 of 17 Old 11-25-2016, 01:28 PM - Thread Starter
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4K confusion

I just bought a Samsung UN65KS9000FXZA SUHD TV to replace my aging 60" Sony HDTV. I have a CORE-i3 HTPC with a Radeon 7700 graphics card. Audio and switching are handled by an Onkyo Pro PR-SC885 preamp/processor. While I may be able to upgrade the graphics card to HDMI 2.0 with the ability to handle 4K material, the Onkyo has older HDMI inputs and can't handle 4K video. I've been looking into getting a Nvidia Shield, but from what I'm reading, the Samsung may be able to handle streamed 4K content better than the Shield. That leaves me with the dilemma of how to process the HD audio from the streamed source. The Samsung only has a Toslink output so it's limited to DD or DTS 5.1 audio. I'm not where I can even think about upgrading my pre/pro yet so that's not a viable solution, even though it may be the best one.

How does one feed the HD audio from a Shield to an audio system to get full 5.1 or 7.1 HD audio? What kind of workaround are people using in this situation?
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post #2 of 17 Old 11-25-2016, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
I just bought a Samsung UN65KS9000FXZA SUHD TV to replace my aging 60" Sony HDTV. I have a CORE-i3 HTPC with a Radeon 7700 graphics card. Audio and switching are handled by an Onkyo Pro PR-SC885 preamp/processor. While I may be able to upgrade the graphics card to HDMI 2.0 with the ability to handle 4K material, the Onkyo has older HDMI inputs and can't handle 4K video. I've been looking into getting a Nvidia Shield, but from what I'm reading, the Samsung may be able to handle streamed 4K content better than the Shield. That leaves me with the dilemma of how to process the HD audio from the streamed source. The Samsung only has a Toslink output so it's limited to DD or DTS 5.1 audio. I'm not where I can even think about upgrading my pre/pro yet so that's not a viable solution, even though it may be the best one.

How does one feed the HD audio from a Shield to an audio system to get full 5.1 or 7.1 HD audio? What kind of workaround are people using in this situation?
The video out of the Shield is lousy. Get yourself an Nvidia gtx10xx and and a HDMI 2.0x avr. Your JS9000 deserves better than the Shield. I have a 78JS8600 and a 43KS7000. Both are fed by Nvidia GPU. My Shield never gets turned on.

I am using JRiver with madvr on the PCs. The Sheild video is ugly.
The PC attached to the KS is using an Omega Claro plus audio card. I never tried HD Audio out of that card but I think JRIVER would decode it and send it out on the analog jacks.

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post #3 of 17 Old 11-26-2016, 06:57 AM
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The video out of the Shield is lousy. Get yourself an Nvidia gtx10xx and and a HDMI 2.0x avr. Your JS9000 deserves better than the Shield. I have a 78JS8600 and a 43KS7000. Both are fed by Nvidia GPU. My Shield never gets turned on.
OP is obviously interested in 4K streaming. Your advise here didn't offer that option at all (no 4K YouTube or Netflix).
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post #4 of 17 Old 11-26-2016, 08:18 AM - Thread Starter
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My primary concern is how to get HD audio to my older pre/pro without having to buy a new one. The HDMI standard in the pre/pro is only 1.3, IIRC, so it can't handle the latest 4k signals. The smart functions in the Samsung TV can stream the 4k video, but I want to be able to process the audio using my existing hardware. I don't want to have to shell out $1-2k for a new pre/pro just to pass through the video and get the same audio processing that I have now. Is there a decent streaming box that can handle 4k streams that has a quality video output? I'm wondering if I can get by with using something like that and then split the output so the audio can be fed to my pre/pro and the video can go to the TV.

I just did some searching and it looks like the Roku Premiere+ might be what I'm looking for. It handles 4k with HDR and it's only $99. I just missed a Black Friday deal on it for only $69 but with Cyber Monday coming up I may still be able to get a better price. Now I have to see if I can find an HDMI splitter with HDMI 2.0a and HDCP 2.2.

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post #5 of 17 Old 11-26-2016, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
My primary concern is how to get HD audio to my older pre/pro without having to buy a new one. The HDMI standard in the pre/pro is only 1.3, IIRC, so it can't handle the latest 4k signals. The smart functions in the Samsung TV can stream the 4k video, but I want to be able to process the audio using my existing hardware. I don't want to have to shell out $1-2k for a new pre/pro just to pass through the video and get the same audio processing that I have now. Is there a decent streaming box that can handle 4k streams that has a quality video output? I'm wondering if I can get by with using something like that and then split the output so the audio can be fed to my pre/pro and the video can go to the TV.

I just did some searching and it looks like the Roku Premiere+ might be what I'm looking for. It handles 4k with HDR and it's only $99. I just missed a Black Friday deal on it for only $69 but with Cyber Monday coming up I may still be able to get a better price. Now I have to see if I can find an HDMI splitter with HDMI 2.0a and HDCP 2.2.


This is probably your best bet, but it isn't cheap. https://www.hdfury.com/shop/splitter...60-444-600mhz/

I wouldn't waste your money on a roku. I have the ultra and hate it. The UI is terrible. The amazon fire tv and chromecast ultra both also do 4K. I have the fire tv and like it. I don't have any experience with the chromecast.
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post #6 of 17 Old 11-26-2016, 11:03 AM - Thread Starter
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I picked up a Roku Premiere+ on ebay. The Ultra didn't get great reviews and the Premiere+ does pretty much everything the Ultra does. In fact, the Premiere+ was preferred over the Ultra in just about every comparison I checked. I'm trying to find a reasonably priced HDMI 2.0a splitter. I looked at the HD Fury and it's ridiculously overpriced.

Found this splitter that should do the trick:

https://www.pulse-eight.com/p/177/1x...dcp-22-support

It's still a bit pricey, but right now there aren't many options for splitters with HDMI 2.0a compliance. I found lots of them for 2.0, but not 2.0a. The Pulse-Eight splitter is also compatible with 2.0b. I ordered one and it's coming from the UK.

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post #7 of 17 Old 11-26-2016, 05:49 PM
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Most of the 4k streaming in your sammy tv (netflix/amazon/youtube) can only do dd/dts/5.1. There is no dts-ma or dolby ma coming from those apps. One exception is vudu.

For these, just use Toslink / optical from the tv to the old receiver. Most 4k blu-ray players have two hdmi out's for those us who have not upgraded their receivers. One hdmi (4k hdr video) goes to your sammy 4k tv, the other (audio stream) hdmi goes to your old 1.3 hdmi receiver.
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post #8 of 17 Old 11-27-2016, 06:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Most of the 4k streaming in your sammy tv (netflix/amazon/youtube) can only do dd/dts/5.1. There is no dts-ma or dolby ma coming from those apps. One exception is vudu.

For these, just use Toslink / optical from the tv to the old receiver. Most 4k blu-ray players have two hdmi out's for those us who have not upgraded their receivers. One hdmi (4k hdr video) goes to your sammy 4k tv, the other (audio stream) hdmi goes to your old 1.3 hdmi receiver.
I haven't looked into the features offered by all of the 4k streaming services yet, but I figured I'd probably sign up for Netflix and then go with Amazon Prime to gain access to their library as well. Are you saying that the best audio I can expect from them will only be 5.1? That would be a shame if that's the case. Is this a limitation of the apps on the TV or the streaming services themselves? I may have to look into Vudu if they offer HD audio.
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post #9 of 17 Old 11-27-2016, 09:05 AM - Thread Starter
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I decided to check out the AV preamp/receiver forum and see what's available. I got a recommendation for a Marantz AV7702 that was just what I was looking for. I found a great deal on it as it was a closeout from last year but it supports HDMI 2.0a, HDCP 2.2, and HDR so I'm golden. It's the mkii model BTW, not the basic model.
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post #10 of 17 Old 11-27-2016, 12:28 PM
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You could also have used two of the outputs from a new video card - one to provide video directly to your TV, and one for sending the audio to the receiver you currently have. In fact you could use the HDMI 2.0 from a GTX1060 to the Samsung TV for 4 K video, and even use the motherboard's onboard HDMI to provide hi-res multichannel audio to the older receiver. Might have been a tad less expensive for now.
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post #11 of 17 Old 11-27-2016, 02:09 PM - Thread Starter
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You could also have used two of the outputs from a new video card - one to provide video directly to your TV, and one for sending the audio to the receiver you currently have. In fact you could use the HDMI 2.0 from a GTX1060 to the Samsung TV for 4 K video, and even use the motherboard's onboard HDMI to provide hi-res multichannel audio to the older receiver. Might have been a tad less expensive for now.
True, but streaming apps for a PC are pretty lame compared to standalone boxes like the Roku Premiere+. I've taken the plunge for a new pre/pro so that solves the audio problem. I've attempted to cancel the order for the HDMI splitter so I've got my fingers crossed that I caught it in time. I may eventually upgrade the video card to support 4k, but for now the HTPC will be used primarily for recording TV and streaming movies and videos from my server. 4k is still developing with respect to program material and streaming services are about the only source for the time being. Using the Roku Premiere+ gives me the ability to stream 4k while still maintaining my HTPC setup,
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post #12 of 17 Old 11-27-2016, 02:33 PM
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True, but streaming apps for a PC are pretty lame compared to standalone boxes like the Roku Premiere+. I've taken the plunge for a new pre/pro so that solves the audio problem. I've attempted to cancel the order for the HDMI splitter so I've got my fingers crossed that I caught it in time. I may eventually upgrade the video card to support 4k, but for now the HTPC will be used primarily for recording TV and streaming movies and videos from my server. 4k is still developing with respect to program material and streaming services are about the only source for the time being. Using the Roku Premiere+ gives me the ability to stream 4k while still maintaining my HTPC setup,
I hope you get many many hours of enjoyment with the new setup!
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post #13 of 17 Old 11-28-2016, 06:51 AM
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Like you I decided to go ahead and get a new receiver. Costco is having a special on a Yamaha TSR-7810. While I could have gotten some extra time using my current receiver what it lacked was the ability to plug it into my home network, Bluetooth, Dolby atmos, DTS-X and wifi including MusicCast which can do many things that need Sonos.

I will still need to get a Blu ray player and UHD TV which I intend to get in 2017.

Anál nathrach, orth’ bháis’s bethad, do chél dénmha
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post #14 of 17 Old 11-28-2016, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
My primary concern is how to get HD audio to my older pre/pro without having to buy a new one.
What streaming services offer HD audio? I'm not aware of any. I know Vudu offers Atmos, but it's with a DD+ bed, not TrueHD.
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post #15 of 17 Old 11-28-2016, 07:44 AM
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All the streaming services top out at DD+.
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post #16 of 17 Old 11-28-2016, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
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All the streaming services top out at DD+.
Well, that sucks. I guess I should have dug into them a little deeper before taking the plunge with a new pre/pro. I could have stuck with my old one and just used the Toslink output from the TV to process the audio to my surround system.
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post #17 of 17 Old 11-28-2016, 02:13 PM
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Well, that sucks. I guess I should have dug into them a little deeper before taking the plunge with a new pre/pro. I could have stuck with my old one and just used the Toslink output from the TV to process the audio to my surround system.
Unless you have a top of the line speaker setup and a golden ear, DD+ is just fine IMO.
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