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post #181 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 08:42 AM
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yup. it's gotta be all that to be worth $200.
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post #182 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 09:34 AM
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I really wonder when the "review" by firingsquad is so full of garbage.

He thinks the state of the art before ATI was Hauppage. And Survivor is b'cast in HD.

Methinks I read a PR from ATI.
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post #183 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 10:17 AM
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I don't suppose any of these reviews mention a time frame for release, do they? It still shows as "available soon" on the web site.

The last I heard they were shooting for the first part of August. This could be a PR blitz to stem the tide of defectors to the competition until they can actually make this thing available.

Will work for HTPC components.
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post #184 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 11:23 AM
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i may be asking a dum question but how is HD going to come out of that adapter without any component, vga or DVi outputs?

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post #185 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 11:26 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by ttriplett
I don't suppose any of these reviews mention a time frame for release, do they? It still shows as "available soon" on the web site.

The last I heard they were shooting for the first part of August. This could be a PR blitz to stem the tide of defectors to the competition until they can actually make this thing available.

I think I read second week in July in one of those reviews, but maybe I'm wrong.
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post #186 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 11:49 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by RAVEN56706
i may be asking a dum question but how is HD going to come out of that adapter without any component, vga or DVi outputs?

HD output is via your video card, which has to be an ATI 9500,9600,9700,9800 or later.
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post #187 of 4139 Old 06-23-2004, 03:01 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by jimmyv
HD output is via your video card, which has to be an ATI 9500,9600,9700,9800 or later.

Is HD output from these cards 1920x1080i, 1280x720p or some kind of overlay that needs Powerstrip?
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post #188 of 4139 Old 06-24-2004, 08:28 AM
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Hello, have a question - tried searching this thread but like other search attempts at this forum site I am having trouble getting the hang of it.

I have heard that the new ATI HDTV Wonder will not work with Sage 2.0. Wanted to read discussion in this thread about it.

Did a search of this thread for "Sage". No results. Huh? Please, suggestions will be welcome!

BTW, my source for the question came from the review Anandtech did on the HDTV Wonder. Cannot post the article link, but it's at Anand, a very recent review currently listed on Anand's home page, third news from the top.

Thanks again for assistance.
Dave
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post #189 of 4139 Old 06-24-2004, 09:08 AM
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I'm not sure if this is still true, but the limit Sage used to have was that it only worked with cards that had an mpeg decoder on the card, rather than software decoding.

Someday maybe I'll actually WATCH my projector...
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post #190 of 4139 Old 06-24-2004, 09:38 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by madpoet
I'm not sure if this is still true, but the limit Sage used to have was that it only worked with cards that had an mpeg decoder on the card, rather than software decoding.

Not exactly. I think the requirement was for a hardware ENcoder card. Of course this only applies to analog NTSC signals since HDTV signals are already encoded by the broadcaster.

I also hope that Sage will support the ATI HD wonder. I will buy their software the day they announce it. Especially if they can use the analog tuner input on that card for NTSC sources.

Will work for HTPC components.
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post #191 of 4139 Old 06-24-2004, 09:42 AM
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Ah, had it backwards then. It's been a while since I used Sage. Thanks for the correction.

Someday maybe I'll actually WATCH my projector...
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post #192 of 4139 Old 06-24-2004, 07:33 PM
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Man that is compete ********. $200?! What the hell?! I don't need their damn remote, and I'm sure the antenna is garbage.

That plus I would have to spend at least $150 on a graphics card that wouldn't be necessary for my (or most people's) HTPC usage... That effectively makes it cost $350 while being likely not as good as other options that would be much cheaper.
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post #193 of 4139 Old 06-24-2004, 07:57 PM
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"Man that is compete ********. $200?! What the hell?!"

First off, this is full retail, who pays that. For example the 9800 AIW is $399 on ATI, shoppint around gets that down to $298. Secondly, what do you expect when the get customers willing to pay over $500 just for a video card (X800XT). If they feel that $200 is a good starting price point, then let them - you can always discount, much harder to raise the price.

On the flip side, I personally have not seen one reason for me to give up on the MyHD card. While still early, buggy software (when hasn't ATI MC been buggy) and a somewhat proprietory file format (some say just TS in a wrapper (DRM?)).

Failure is not an option. It comes bundled with every Microsoft product
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post #194 of 4139 Old 06-27-2004, 09:25 PM
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I'm need the signal from my HDPC to go via the DVI out to my Sanyo Z2. I'm not sure I have this right but for HDTV using the new ATI HDTV add in card it will somehow send the picture via the PCI buss to the AGP video card? I'm more use to the pass through cable methods. So with this card and the right ATI AGP card I can get OTA HDTV via DVI?

Thanks
Chuck
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post #195 of 4139 Old 06-28-2004, 05:12 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by chuckvb
I'm need the signal from my HDPC to go via the DVI out to my Sanyo Z2. I'm not sure I have this right but for HDTV using the new ATI HDTV add in card it will somehow send the picture via the PCI buss to the AGP video card? I'm more use to the pass through cable methods. So with this card and the right ATI AGP card I can get OTA HDTV via DVI?

Thanks
Chuck

I believe so. That's how the Fusion card works. It's the HDTV tuner and passes the transport stream over the bus to the video card (in my case an ATI 9600 Pro) which outputs the video to your monitor (or z2 in your case) in one of three ways, in a window on the desktop, as the "wallpaper" behind the desktop, or (most useful for dedicated viewing) as full screen. You also have control of resolution and aspect ratios...
With the ATI card either your VGA port or your DVI port can be selected as the main display and (optionally) the other port can be a secondary display which can be different resolution and positioned above, below, left or right of the main display. If both display devices will accept the same resolution/scan rate, you can overlay one on the other displaying the same thing on both monitors/ports.
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post #196 of 4139 Old 06-28-2004, 12:06 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by sdsalsero
It includes a "transcoder" feature which sounds like it encrypts the file (ExtremeTech says the file ends-up a lot bigger). Hello, Broadcast Flag!


Yeah, that's what I'm thinking too. ATI just lost a customer. Now I have to decide between a AccessDTV, MDP-120, or HiPix. lol


DrCR


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post #197 of 4139 Old 06-28-2004, 01:56 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by DrCR_1
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking too. ATI just lost a customer. Now I have to decide between a AccessDTV, MDP-120, or HiPix. lol

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__________

Yes, it looks like I will be another lost customer for ATI.

I am currently using a HiDTV card in my HTPC and was really looking forward to getting a high performance (i.e. NXT2004 chip) tuner card for my 2nd PC. I am crushed to hear that HDTV Wonder will NOT produce standard TP files. Since the HiDTV card is no longer sold or supported, I will likely get one or two MDP-120s before all these products will need to comply with Broadcast Flag rules.

DonP
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post #198 of 4139 Old 06-28-2004, 02:04 PM
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I wonder if there will be a DVB-T version of this card for europe and australia?
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post #199 of 4139 Old 06-28-2004, 05:44 PM
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Ultimately, the drivers still have to provide a transport stream for the demux to use, and using it with any 3rd party software that support DTV would allow saving transport streams.

Personally, I'd much rather end up with program streams anyway, even if it requires a remultiplexing step (it sounds like it's like a built-in HDTV2MPEG2).
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post #200 of 4139 Old 06-28-2004, 10:42 PM
 
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Something is really strange here because at the NAB they took great pride in showing you could save files in virtually any format - and even demonstrated as such.
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post #201 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 05:37 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by HDTVFanAtic
Something is really strange here because at the NAB they took great pride in showing you could save files in virtually any format - and even demonstrated as such.

Given some of the other comments made by the reviewers, I would then say it was possible that these website reviewers didn't spend enough time figuring it out. It's entirely possible that you could save it as a standard .tp or .ts file.

We'll just have to wait 'til they come out and someone who is interested in exploring it in detail gets a chance to report in.

RG
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post #202 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 06:00 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by flashbacck
Overall it's neat. The only thing that bugs me is the video card requirements. They're leaving us folks with Radeon 7000s or 8000s behind. And what about people with nvidia cards? And you can't use an AIW at the same time? Bleh.

it wouldn't be very smart of ATI to make an addon card that works with Nvidias card too. Won't make money that way u know.

I guess the backwards compability is hindered by old technology, and it is easier just to output a card that works with the current line they have.

Cheaper to make workarounds later, if the market really wants it.
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post #203 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 06:16 AM
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Okay... read the thread and apparently I'm not up on all the lingo like I thought I was. I believe I'm wanting to do what everyone else here is wanting to do, and that's make my computer into a Tivo.. except much cooler... which is very possible, from what I understand, with just regular old cable. My question is this, when my cableco (charter) makes us all switch to digital, none of this will work? Is that the QAM question? (that's what I gather anyways... I could be off base). So regardless of whether or not the chanel is broadcasting in HD at that moment, the AIW cards won't work with digital cable?... That's to say you can't just plug the cable straight from the wall into your AIW and have it work... right?

What about plugging in the AIW after the STB? Will that work? I called the cableco last night (yeah ... I know... silly idea) and of course got the normal tech support ******. He looked it up in his book and said that "Tivo type boxes will still work with digital cable", but he said that you'd plug it in AFTER the STB... which as I'm understanding it... you won't be able to change the chanel on the HTPC... only record what is coming through at that moment? Is all this right, or am I headed down the wrong noob path?

Last question, I have the Panasonic PT-47WX53 which does PIP from one source in the back... is that going to still work with a STB?

Thanks guys... sorry for the noob questions...
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post #204 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 10:30 AM
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67SS-

For SDTV digital cable a standard capture card can take output from your digital cable box and play it on your computer. There are a number of options for TIVO-like software.

If you are using a digital cable box then your software must support some means of changing the channel. I use SageTV with 2 capture cards (so I can record 2 programs at once) - a ATI EHome wonder and a Hauppage PVR 250. Sage does support IR blasters for channel changing on cable or satellite boxes. As far as I know the ATI MMC software does not support cable box control.

When it comes to HDTV there are a number of cards available for recording OTA (over-the-air) tv streams. The software for these cards vary, but so far haven't really reached the TIVO-like quality of software such as SageTV.

Cable HDTV is in QAM format and may or may not be encrypted. Unencrypted QAM is in theory possible, but only one card (The Fusion QAM I think) supports this standard and even then not so reliably. The ATI product is not likely to support unencrypted QAM, at least at first.

Encrypted QAM would require a card capable of unencrypting the program stream that would still protect the content enough to prevent unauthorized copying. There is a standard called the cablecard which should allow for such a capture cards. As yet there are not even rumours of a cableCard equiped capture card.

You may ask why not just add a capture card between the HDTV cable box and the computer, like we can for SDTV. This would require real-time compression of the HDTV stream and is out of the realm of consumer hardware at this time.

Good Luck,
Andrew
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post #205 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 11:48 AM
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Okay, but as yet there is no way to get around having the STB? And no way to watch 2 chanels at once like in a PIP type mode or a record one while you watch another kind of thing? You can just watch what is coming through the chanel the STB is set to? Two STB's maybe?

On another note, I haven't heard anyone mention the snapstream beyond TV. Is it any good? Which cards will it work with?

Thanks a lot!!!
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post #206 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 11:51 AM
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Okay okay... another couple questions... I saw where you had said you record two shows at once... is this all done through one STB?

Also, I'm using this system as my DVD player as well and want to output the highest quality to my TV, and would also like to be able to play video games on my TV. Is the 9800 AIW better suited for the job? Or a 9800 with the hauppage setup? I've already got a M-Audio revolution 7.1.. just trying to figure out what else to stick in this thing.

-kid in a candy store.
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post #207 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 11:58 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by 67SS
Okay, but as yet there is no way to get around having the STB? And no way to watch 2 chanels at once like in a PIP type mode or a record one while you watch another kind of thing? You can just watch what is coming through the chanel the STB is set to? Two STB's maybe?

Although Andrew's post was quite eloquently worded and correct, I think it might be a little confusing for those who aren't already familiar with the subject matter. No offense Andrew. Just to make sure we're clear, there is currently no way to take HD output via DVI or analog component from an HD STB and input it to a computer. You can't use an STB cable box to decode HD streams and then capture it on your computer in HD. You can use an STB box to decode the HD streams to standard def and capture that using any PVR/Capture software.

Sean.

EDIT: I take part of that back. I think there are a few options using old DISH network STBs and a possible new way using Motorola cable boxes, but they are Kludge solutions.
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post #208 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 12:15 PM
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I'm not so much worried about the HD quality as I am the ability to record stuff. What about the multiple channels at once deal?
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post #209 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 12:21 PM
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This discussion needs to be moved off the ATI thread... no offense. You're looking for a PVR solution that has ntohing to do with the HDTV wonder.

Someday maybe I'll actually WATCH my projector...
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post #210 of 4139 Old 06-29-2004, 12:25 PM
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Well that's why I was asking on this thread... From what I was gathering from the thread, everyone was hoping that the HDTV Wonder was going to solve some of the issues I was asking about. I was just wanting to clarify.

My bad.
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