DVICO Fusion 5 HDTV tuner - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john12345 View Post

Has anyone noticed if the Fusion 5 has better reception over the previous Fusion cards?

Have you tried reading this thread? That's what this thread is about!
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post #182 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 06:02 PM
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I'm picking up my new HTPC tonight w/o the Fusion 5 Gold working properly. I spec'd out all the components but the guys that built it for me didn't get the F5 working within MCE05. They did get it working out of MCE and with the ATI Theater 550 installed, both NTSC and ATSC receiving acceptable signals. They're waiting for newer or better drivers from Fusion before the second attempt.

My question is, what combination of drivers, software, hardware etc. got the Fusion 5 working within MCE05?

My systems consists of:
Silver Stone LC14-M
ASUS mobo P5WD2
Intel 640 3.2 mghz
ATI X800 XL
Fusion 5 Gold Plus
ATI Theater 550
Corsair memory model?? fast
MCE 2005

other good stuff that's probably irrelevant.

If I don't get this tuner up and running in a few days, I'll probably send it back to Digital Connection for a myHD 130 or an ATI HD Wonder. Gotta have my hi def!!!!!

Patrick
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post #183 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 07:43 PM
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A copy of what I posted on Alt.tv.tech.hdtv on 6/7


I received the FusionHDTV5 Gold Plus PCI card on 6/3/05. I first tried it in
my existing Media Center PC which currently has a MyHD MDP-120 card in it. I
then compared the performance of the new card to what I was getting with the
MDP-120. Actually I compared it to the reception I was getting with a
Samsung SIR-T165 OTA tuner, which I had previously determined had reception
virtually identical to that of the MDP-120.

A little background on my location.

I live in Saratoga, CA, which is 45-50 miles from the broadcast tower
(Sutro) in San Francisco. Our house is located in the foothills of the Santa
Cruz mountains. We are located in a valley behind several peaks that lie
between us and the broadcast tower. We are also under the flight path for
SFO. We have ample opportunity for multipath. I have tried many antennas at
different parts of the house, and am currently using 2 horizontally stacked
4248 long yagis, combined and then sent through a 7775 pre-amp. Everything
is mounted on a rotator. On good days this would get me quite a few of the
channels from San Francisco, along with several stations from Sacramento and
from the east bay hills. I can also get pretty regularly stations
broadcasting from Fresno, which is substantially further than these other
towers.

Last night I did the following test:

I first went through lots of channels using the FusionHDTV5 card and
recorded signal strength and reception quality. I then took the cable off
the card and attached it to the SIR-T165 and went through the same channels.
I did not hook up a monitor to the SIR-T165, but determined whether the
signal locked based on the front panel indicators.

** My appologies for the table - just couldn't get it to look like it does when composed - this "word processor" doesn't like multiple spaces......**


CHANNEL FusionHDTV5 SIR-T165

19 25-30 N N
24 62-67 S~ N
29 50-56 N N
30 64-70 S ~S
52 * 75-80 S N
43 60-65 S~ N
45 55-60 N N
49 * 100 S S
50 60-65 ~ N (caused a reboot)
56 77-84 S S~
57 80-90 S S
51 * 60-65 ~ N
47 * 20 N N

Legend:

N = No Lock
S = Solid steady lock (Even wife will watch)
~ = Intermittent lock but never steady (wife wonders why I waste my time and money on this stuff)
~S = Intermittent bouts of steadiness (wife finds something else to do)
S~ = Mostly solid with bouts of Intermittent break-ups (wife will watch, but complain)
* = From tower other than Sutro (San Francisco) without rotating antenna

I would summarize the results as follows: With the SIR-T165 (and likely the
MDP-120) I got a watchable signal (S~ or S) on 3 stations. With the HDTV5 I
got 7 watchable stations. I would say the HDTV5 is definitely an improvement
over the 4th generation tuners.

One caveat - The antenna was recently re-mounted after suffering wind
induced re-orientation. I did not optimize the vertical height of the
antenna before doing these tests (position has a huge influence on reception
here) so I expect to get all of the channels working well, except for 47,
after some optimizing tweaking. On the first night that I tried the card the
conditions were very good, and I was able to get a watchable signal on every
channel except (19 and 47). Needless to say I was very impressed that first
night.

I also want to test my 4228 antenna with this tuner. I'll do that after
repairing the damage from a 25' tumble off my balcony.

I'll report again after some more testing.
--
Jeff Kingsley

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post #184 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 08:28 PM
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"My appologies for the table - just couldn't get it to look like it does when composed..."

Jeff, that's what the "code" formatting option is for (I think).

Code:
CHANNEL    FusionHDTV5    SIR-T165

19           25-30 N         N
24           62-67 S~        N
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post #185 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 09:00 PM
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TPeterson, Thanks for the education...

I've re-done a small portion of my previous post in its new, more readable form.


Last night I did the following test:

I first went through lots of channels using the FusionHDTV5 card and
recorded signal strength and reception quality. I then took the cable off
the card and attached it to the SIR-T165 and went through the same channels.
I did not hook up a monitor to the SIR-T165, but determined whether the
signal locked based on the front panel indicators.

Code:
CHANNEL          FusionHDTV5          SIR-T165

19                25-30    N             N
24                62-67    S~            N
29                50-56    N             N
30                64-70    S            ~S
52 *              75-80    S             N
43                60-65    S~            N
45                55-60    N             N
49 *              100      S             S
50                60-65    ~             N (caused a reboot)
56                77-84    S             S~
57                80-90    S             S
51 *              60-65    ~             N
47 *              20       N             N
Code:
Legend: N = No Lock
        S = Solid steady lock (Even wife will watch)
        ~ = Intermittent lock but never steady (wife wonders why I waste my time and money on this stuff)
        ~S = Intermittent bouts of steadiness (wife finds something else to do)
        S~ = Mostly solid with bouts of Intermittent break-ups (wife will watch, but complain)
        * = From tower other than Sutro (San Francisco) without rotating antenna
I would summarize the results as follows: With the SIR-T165 (and likely the
MDP-120) I got a watchable signal (S~ or S) on 3 stations. With the HDTV5 I
got 7 watchable stations. I would say the HDTV5 is definitely an improvement
over the 4th generation tuners.
--
Jeff Kingsley

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post #186 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 09:23 PM
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Thank you jkingsley4 for taking the time to gather and post this info. I also have a Samsung 165 and find that with the latest firmware (needed so I can adjust the RGB signal l/r) that more and more channels are causing lockups on the box. I have to disconnect the signal and change the channel to get it to come back.

I ordered the fushion5 in hopes this problem would be fixed and have one less box in the rack!
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post #187 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Collins View Post

They did get it working out of MCE and with the ATI Theater 550 installed, both NTSC and ATSC receiving acceptable signals.

How were you able to tune to ATSC with the ATI Theater 550 installed? That card is only capable of recieving NTSC....

Nevermind....read it again....I tired.
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post #188 of 2932 Old 06-11-2005, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Platup View Post

Has anyone tried the RC3 drivers with a Fusion 3? Rumor has it that the RC2 & 3 show the signal meter correctly in MCE.

I just tried using what I believe is RC3 (the files posted on digitalconnection for the Fusion 5) with my Fusion 3, and I don't see signal strength listed in MCE. I can still tune HD channels from within MCE, but the strength shows as "unknown" in the DTV setup.
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post #189 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 08:36 AM
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Hi Cliff Watson

Cliff is your short review of the Gen 5 tuner stand the same? You reported that the performance was the same as early tuners. I was hopping for much better Urban in house performance and was sadden to see your short review. Anything else you can share about the LG gen 5 thanks again.
Later:

HDTV is clear get the picture
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post #190 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 08:51 AM
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Can someone with the Fusion 5 please comment on setting it up in MCE?

I have MCE and am thinking of purchasing this card. I have read varying reports about whether or not you need an existing MCE compatible NTSC tuner.

I want to know if anyone has setup the Fusion 5 in a fresh install of MCE with success - both digital and analogue. If so, did you have to setup another tuner card first?
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post #191 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdallaire View Post

Hi Cliff Watson

Cliff is your short review of the Gen 5 tuner stand the same? You reported that the performance was the same as early tuners....

He did not report that! He said that the MDP-130 (which has substantially newer hw than 120/100) is not tangibly different from Fusion 5. Both are better than "early tuners" by all accounts.
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post #192 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingstud View Post

Can someone with the Fusion 5 please comment on setting it up in MCE?

I have MCE and am thinking of purchasing this card. I have read varying reports about whether or not you need an existing MCE compatible NTSC tuner.

I want to know if anyone has setup the Fusion 5 in a fresh install of MCE with success - both digital and analogue. If so, did you have to setup another tuner card first?

There's no way I know of. You have to have an MCE compatible analog tuner set up first.
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post #193 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 09:57 AM
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Thanks TPeterson
I did not know what gen the MDP-130 was. I thought he was comparing an older gen card. Good to know that these cards are better. I am still looking for that multipath gem as I still have issue's 8 miles from towers so I need multipath help.

HDTV is clear get the picture
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post #194 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 09:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Here's some favorable feedback from a poster in the HDTV Hardware Forum:
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxeng View Post

This past week I received my Digital Connections DVICO FusionHDTV5 with LG 5th generation chip. NICE! I don't have the horsepower on the computer to view HD with it (it is only a P3 850), but the SD streams are watchable. The big difference I saw was when it did a channel scan, it picked up stations that have good signal over my location, but because I use a CM4228 antenna, multipath prevents locks in certain directions. The Fusion5 for the first time told me there were signals there and in 80% of the cases, locked on the PSIP data. One station was 180 degrees behind my antenna and 90 miles to boot and the card told me there was a digital signal there. Movement of the antenna about 30 degreess and the PSIP data started showing up! No other receiver I have (I have a 2nd, 3rd and 4th generation receivers) has EVER told me there was a signal there unless I was pointing at the station. Same thing for a local low power station that I have to have the antenna pointed at to be able to pick it up.

I also was able to pick up off the side of the antenna several stations with PSIP data at 60 miles. WIth some movement of the antenna to increase the signal strength, but not directly on them as usual, their SD channel came in very watchable.

Just from these very rudimentary tests, I would say the LG 5th gen chip is a noticable improvement when it comes to multipath. Of course if you don't have the signal strength to start with, it is no better than any other receiver. I need need to get a P4 to run it and then try more experments.

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post #195 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Schauer View Post

Here's some favorable feedback from a poster in the HDTV Hardware Forum:

Steve,

I can often detect PSIP during a channel scan using MDP-130 and a CM 4228 antenna. Under the best of conditions I can also lock and decode channels from 125 miles away.

As foxengr indicated, without signal strength multipath rejection is worthless.
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post #196 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 11:18 AM
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Does anyone with a FusionHDTV5 live somewhere where multipath is a big issue? I'm looking for a 1st hand review of how well the multipath rejection really works (i.e. before I spend money, what's everyone's opinion on the likelyhood of it solving my issues). I'm pretty sure my reception problems are due to multipath issues. I live in an urban area where I should hope I would get wonderful reception (Raleigh, NC), but I can only get ABC solid. My signal strenth jumps all over the place (+/- 10dB typical, sometimes dropping to 0dB, sometimes going to 30dB+, usually around 19dB for most channels ) with my FusionHDTV3.
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post #197 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 01:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Sounds like multipath. Unfortunately it'll cost you $100 to find out if the F5 will help you out.
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post #198 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 01:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Watson View Post

Steve,

I can often detect PSIP during a channel scan using MDP-130 and a CM 4228 antenna. Under the best of conditions I can also lock and decode channels from 125 miles away.

As foxengr indicated, without signal strength multipath rejection is worthless.

I use a 4228 too. It's a pretty directional antenna - I'm not sure if that means it's more or less prone to introducing multipath problems. Seems like it would be less if you're pointed at the strongest multipath'd signal, but more if different stations are bouncing in from different directions.
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post #199 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 01:26 PM
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Directional antennas reduce susceptibility to mulitpath.

Jeff
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post #200 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 01:43 PM
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Just dropping by to see if anyone has tried using my program here- http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=511835 with the Fusion5. I just looked through the new drivers and I think my program should work with it. I know some of you have mentioned problems with DVICO's app and my program may be able to help you figure out it if their program or drivers still need fixing. If my program doesn't work, I would have no problem to add support for the Fusion5. If anyone could let me know, I would appreciate it.
Thanks.

WatchHDTV.net- FREE HDTV tuning software
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post #201 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 07:04 PM
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doesnt work for me dude . Maybe im not setting up the channels right.
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post #202 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 08:03 PM
 
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a little off topic
but anyone know the minimum requirements for HDTV playback in MCE

I want to pick a Fusion 5 Lite and not sure if my PC is up to it

2.4 GHz, 768 PC800, 6800 standard
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post #203 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 08:23 PM
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I have Fusion 5 Lite working on a 2.4 GHz CPU.
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are you using MCE with it Cliff?

if you could try this out and let me know the results with MCE
I would be either spending money at digitalconnection or not spending
LOL

well I am going to be picking up a M audio Rev 5.1 either way so just more money
LOL
and want to purchase everything at once
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post #205 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 08:47 PM
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I'm using WinXP and that is the same thing under the MCE frontend.
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post #206 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 08:53 PM
 
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I just was not sure since MCE uses VMR9 only
if this would increase the load on the CPU as I figure my GPU is fine
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post #207 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 09:25 PM
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I think most of VMR9 is done by the graphics card.
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post #208 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 11:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kny3twalker View Post

a little off topic
but anyone know the minimum requirements for HDTV playback in MCE

I want to pick a Fusion 5 Lite and not sure if my PC is up to it

2.4 GHz, 768 PC800, 6800 standard

Fusion 3 and MCE run great in HDTV on my 2.4e P4, 512MB, Radeon 9600. I can record and playback simultaneously without a problem.
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post #209 of 2932 Old 06-13-2005, 11:42 PM
 
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well ordered both
and glad I waited for some replies about my Fusion questions
the M audio was 10 dollars less than yesterday

thanks Cliff
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post #210 of 2932 Old 06-14-2005, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etk29321 View Post

Does anyone with a FusionHDTV5 live somewhere where multipath is a big issue? I'm looking for a 1st hand review of how well the multipath rejection really works (i.e. before I spend money, what's everyone's opinion on the likelyhood of it solving my issues). I'm pretty sure my reception problems are due to multipath issues. I live in an urban area where I should hope I would get wonderful reception (Raleigh, NC), but I can only get ABC solid. My signal strenth jumps all over the place (+/- 10dB typical, sometimes dropping to 0dB, sometimes going to 30dB+, usually around 19dB for most channels ) with my FusionHDTV3.


There was a comment within the thread about how well the F5 worked vs. the F3 (by jeffspam, page 4). Yeah, I'm also wondering how well the F5 performs compared to the earlier Fusion cards.
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