Convolver DSP plug-in for Windows Media Player 10 - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 326 Old 01-17-2006, 02:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Simon, Thanks for the report. Can't see anything obviously wrong.

Do you have a single blank line at the end of your config file?

Please zip and send me the config and pcms (jrp a t dial dot pipex dot com) and I will fix this.

In the meantime, you should be able to use your filter.wav without any config file.
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post #182 of 326 Old 01-17-2006, 04:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Clarification of some diagnostics

Planning rigour limited to 1 minute per path

Planning rigour resets to Measure, to avoid lengthy startup times
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post #183 of 326 Old 01-17-2006, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sime_george View Post

My convolver-config.txt is the following :

44100 2 2 0
c:\\left_rps.pcm
0
0.0
0.0
c:\
ight_rps.pcm
0 <---
1.0
1.0

For the benefit of others, the 1 after right_rps.pcm should be a 0, as amended above (as we are selected the first channel from a single-channel pcm)
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post #184 of 326 Old 01-18-2006, 10:18 AM
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I'm a bit confused about the use of Convolver with TheaterTek.

Can TheaterTek upconvert all DVD sources to 7.1? If so, how?

The reason I ask is this: I am thrilled with the prospect of doing DRC for my home theater. But I have read in many places that Pro Logic IIx is by far the best way to get 7.1 from DVD or music sources. As we all know, there are no current PC software offerings that do IIx. That's why I currently pass thru S/PDIF using TheaterTek and my M-Audio Revolution card to my Rotel Receiver.

So, in the opinion of the experienced Convolver users here, is it worth the tradeoff to get DRC and sacrifice Pro Logic IIx?

And actually, I'll probably have to make a sacrifice on the video side, as well. I currently use ffdshow. Probably won't have the processing power to use both. True?

Also, in my implementation, would it be better to use Convolver as an ffdshow plugin, or as audio postprocessing in TheaterTek?

This is all very confusing.
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post #185 of 326 Old 01-18-2006, 11:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Welcome to the bleeding edge.

A couple of things:

convolver can only process pcm, not compressed formats such as DD or DTS, which need to be decoded first. This would then generate analogue output, not SPD/IF output, although you could try to reencode it, but the whole process would probably do more harm than good to your sound.

Convolver is efficient and will get more so, so you should be able to run it with video no problem
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post #186 of 326 Old 01-18-2006, 11:57 AM
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jrpavel,

Thanks for the quick response.

I already understand your point, so let me reiterate my question in a different form.

The way I see it, I have 2 choices:

A) Use the best alternative for 7.1 performance. That's Dolby Pro Logic IIx. The only way to currently achieve this is to pass the S/PDIF signal from the HTPC to my receiver. In this case, I get the "best" decoding, but can't get DRC.

B) Take advantage of Convolver for DRC. Here I use TheaterTek/ffdshow/Convolver to get DRC (plus bass management, crossovers, etc.), and pass analog signals to my receiver. In this case I get DRC, but sacrifice the "best" 7.1 decoding.

My first question for the people who use DRC is which scenario is better? Both involve tradeoffs. My gut tells me that correcting for room problems would give a far greater acoustic benefit than the difference between Pro Logic IIx and other algorithms to get 7.1. But I'm not sure, that's why I ask the question.

My other questions, which assume the "experts" would choose choice "B" above, are:

1) Can TheaterTek even give me 7.1? If so, How?

2) Is it better to use Convolver from within ffdshow, or as postprocessing in TheaterTek audio options?

Hope this clarifies my questions.

Thanks,
Phil
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post #187 of 326 Old 01-18-2006, 03:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Phil,

Thanks. It does.

on AvB The short answer is that I would agree with your hunch.

It may well be that no one has done the comparison that you are contemplating. Getting stereo right is hard enough! And to make matters worse, your receiver may have different characteristics for different input types.

To make matters more complex still, you really ought to be applying to two filters (one for the left ear and one for the right) to get the theoretical best for each speaker, although a single filter may give good sound in practice.

I can't remember enough about TT to know how to get 7.1 out of it (particularly with a 5.1 DVD) so that may well be a show stopper.

On your last question I have not done a comparison between ffdshow and TT.

If you had time to experiment, you could document your findings (including how to set things up) on www.duffroomcorrection.com

Sorry not to be able to resolve your questions: like I say we're at the bleeding edge...
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post #188 of 326 Old 01-18-2006, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrpavel View Post

Phil,

I can't remember enough about TT to know how to get 7.1 out of it (particularly with a 5.1 DVD) so that may well be a show stopper.

I'm pretty sure the short answer is that it doesn't. I think Andrew has stated that even with the Audio Pak TT only does 5.1 analog.

Brian
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post #189 of 326 Old 01-21-2006, 05:15 AM - Thread Starter
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https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=387169


Removed residual SIMD code that led to "Unexpected exception" notifications on non-Pentium 4 cpus. Thanks to Simon George for fix

Accept raw 64-bit float format filter files (.dbl). (Internal processing is still 32-bit.)
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post #190 of 326 Old 01-28-2006, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Available from https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=389095

See http://convolver.sf.net for usage details.

Some of the constituent libraries have been updated.
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post #191 of 326 Old 02-01-2006, 04:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Convolver 2.24 Released

More small optimizations
Time-limited tuning corrected
Corrected bug introduced in 2.23 for multi-partition convolution

See https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=390156 and http://convolver.sf.net
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post #192 of 326 Old 02-05-2006, 04:27 PM - Thread Starter
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See http://convolver.sf.net

Download from https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=391204


More small optimizations

Removed the requirement that config files must end with a final blank line.

Fixed bug when new filter incompatible with current playback setup is selected.
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post #193 of 326 Old 02-08-2006, 02:16 PM
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Hello all!

First of all, I would like to thank JR for the tremendous work he has done on his plug-in software so that we Windows users can have access to DRC. Although I have not yet used your plug-in, I can see that you have put in a lot of time.

I am a total newbie to DRC and have read all the information I could in this thread and other threads in this forum and have learned a tremendous amount. I am very technical and computer savy but I have to honest and say that I am very confused as to how to configure and setup my custom built HTPC for DRC. There is a ton of information everywhere but no one has compiled it in one concise how to go guide along with one software solution to set it all up on a computer. I for one would be willing to pay good money for such a software solution but at the moment, there does not seem to be any such solution around.

I have read Jones Rush's guide. It is long and complicated. I'm not sure how to work the guide for 5.1 channels. Then once I have this IR file, I'm sure how to use it in the convolver.

Here is my wish list:
-Easy software for the creation of the room specific IR file for multiple channels in windows.
-A realtime convolver driver for windows that would apply the IR file for all sound output to the sound card.

I'm looking to process all sound output by my HTPC. This would be MP3 music, CD's, DVD'S, games, TV played through my tuner card. My HTPC currently uses MCE and it seems that no one has figured out how to have the plug-in work in MCE.

At the very least, it would be great if there was a how to guide that would walk your through from the creation of the IR file to playing corrected sound in Windows. I have looked at the one on JR's website and it pretty good at explaining how to use the plug-in but it's not a start to finish guide.

This technology is so exciting and I can't wait to get it setup on my PC. I am willing to do my share of the work if someone would be willing to work with me. I can't help with the programming (I only know how to program in VB) but I can help with the testing and the creation of the how to the how to guide once I know what I am doing.

Any help that can be brought my way is highly appreciated.

Sergio
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post #194 of 326 Old 02-08-2006, 02:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Sergio, Thanks for your interest.

I suggest that you look first at www.duffroomcorrection.com.

It explains how to generate impulse responses (using rec_imp + DRC and the Jones Rush guide, or you could try Room EQ Wizard). You will need to create impulse responses a channel at a time. Convolver will then apply them. If you want to get cleverer, you can try impulse responses from the left channel to the left ear and then left channel to right ear and get Convolver to combine them.

I would start with stereo, before trying 5.1 (where you may also want to add bass management, or other filtering).

I suspect that you will struggle to apply filtering to MCE, because it does not seem to have the hooks, despite the fact that there is a DirectShow version of Convolver. Having said that I have not looked hard for any.

MCE does, however, use WMP, I think for music, so you may be able to get part of the way.

Depending on your sound card, you may be able to use something like http://www.console.jp/eng/index.html and ConvolverFilter if you want to insert a permanent filter.

Happy to work with you to get something going.

It would be good if you were able to document your journey on the duffroomcorrection Wiki so that others can benefit from your experience, posting here when you get stuck or need others' views.
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post #195 of 326 Old 02-08-2006, 03:21 PM
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Thank for the info....

I guess the first step is to generate impulse responses for my speakers. I will go thru the guides and programs you suggested. I will then try to use your plug-in.

I'll document my journey as best I can for others out there.

I'm sure I'll have a ton of questions. I'll post as they come up.
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post #196 of 326 Old 02-08-2006, 04:47 PM
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I finally got around to putting the pieces together to get Convolver working with rec_imp and DRC - Thanks John and Ed !!

I will put up some more details on the DRC wiki in the next few days, but I am still experimenting. I get a noticable change, which sounds a little 'muffled' , and am now experimenting with flat target curves in DRC to lift the top end. My results are not as dramatic as I read "Jones" had - but I have high hopes!!

I am using MCE2005 with WMP10 and Convolver, DRC and rec_imp all latest and greatest releases. My sound card is an M-Audio Transit USB set to bit-perfect passthrough, 44100, 16bit and I am using the ASIO4ALL driver (could not get right levels of latency using the m-audio drivers, which resulted in 'cracking' sounds during the sweep). My microphone is probably a weak link - am using a Radio Shack boundary mic (next stop I will try to correct for the mic).

All of this feeds via S/PDIF into a Marantz 5200 and then to 6.1 B&W (600 series) speakers. I set the Marantz to play 6 channel stereo for my tests (which is independant of this experiment).

The following uses rec_imp to measure 2 channel - a Left then a Right sweep to build left and right files for convolver via DRC.

My batch file looks like this:

Set REC_IMP=c:\\Program Files\\DRC\\Rec_Imp
Set DRC_DIR=C:\\Program Files\\DRC\\DRC
Set CONVOLVER=c:\\Program Files\\DRC\\Convolver
cd %REC_IMP%
rec_imp.exe LeftSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm 44100 20 21000 20 0:1 0:1
move /y LeftSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm "%DRC_DIR%"
rec_imp.exe RightSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm 44100 20 21000 20 1:1 1:1
move /y RightSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm "%DRC_DIR%"
cd %DRC_DIR%
drc.exe --BCInFile=LeftSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm --PSPointsFile=bkHB.txt --PSOutFile=LeftSpeaker-rpsERB.pcm erb.drc
move /y LeftSpeaker-rpsERB.pcm "%CONVOLVER%
drc.exe --BCInFile=RightSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm --PSPointsFile=bkHB.txt --PSOutFile=RightSpeaker-rpsERB.pcm erb.drc
move /y RightSpeaker-rpsERB.pcm "%CONVOLVER%
I have modified the PSPointsFile to be Flat (I think!):
0 -20.0
10 -10.0
20 0.00
400 0.00
12800 0.00
20000 0.00
21500 0.0
22050 0.0
And my convolver config file is:
44100 2 2 0
c:\\Program Files\\DRC\\convolver\\LeftSpeaker-rpsERB.pcm
0
0.0
0.0
c:\\Program Files\\DRC\\Convolver\\RightSpeaker-rpsERB.pcm
0
1.0
1.0
Note that I am using the ERB config file for DRC - just an experiment at this stage to try to 'lift' the higher frequencies.

I am not there yet, but the batch file make it easier for me to conduct my experiments.

I would appreciate any input on the above !
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post #197 of 326 Old 02-08-2006, 05:01 PM - Thread Starter
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A further suggestion, to check your setup, try convolving a perfect dirac delta function filter with the playback channels (ie, 1 followed by some 0s). This should result in no change to the playback stream. (I attach one.)

You might email me some sample pcm files to have a look at.

Good luck...

 

PerfectDiracDelta-44100-1-1023.zip 0.240234375k . file
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post #198 of 326 Old 02-09-2006, 02:17 AM - Thread Starter
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In this release:

Added ability to delay output channels. This necessitates a change for existing config files. (The second line is a list of output channel delays in ms. Just set it to a row of 0s to start with.)

Removed initial noise after calculating optimum attenuation in some circumstances.

ConvolverCMD fixes.
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post #199 of 326 Old 02-10-2006, 04:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hjb View Post

I finally got around to putting the pieces together to get Convolver working with rec_imp and DRC - Thanks John and Ed !!

snip

greatest releases. My sound card is an M-Audio Transit USB set to bit-perfect passthrough, 44100, 16bit and I am using the ASIO4ALL driver (could not get right levels of latency using the m-audio drivers, which resulted in 'cracking' sounds during the sweep). My microphone is probably a weak link - am using a Radio Shack boundary mic (next stop I will try to correct for the mic).

snip

rec_imp.exe LeftSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm 44100 20 21000 20 0:1 0:1
move /y LeftSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm "%DRC_DIR%"
rec_imp.exe RightSpeakerImpulseResponse.pcm 44100 20 21000 20 1:1 1:1

snip

I would appreciate any input on the above !



Hi,

if you recognize cracking sounds during the sweep then the reason may be a soundcard working at 48 kHz samplerate despite the setting of 44100.

I have got this result also with some soundcards and Adobe Audition as another possibility to record a logsweep.

A lot of soundcards only have a frequency clock of 256*fs with fs=48 kHz. So for 44100 kHz a samplerate conversion on the fly is done during playback and recording. This leads to the described effect.

See also the appropriate chapter in the documentation of DRC.

So today I do all recordings in 48 kHz (or 96 kHz). And then I do the samplerate conversion for the filter generation in a separate step. See again DRC docs.

Uli
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post #200 of 326 Old 02-10-2006, 06:12 AM
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Interesting - I'll play around with 48k and see if it makes a difference - I did manage to get this working with the ASIO4ALL drivers which removed the cracking at 44.1k.

Also, if I move to 48k, I presume I would have to convert 48k reponse and filter back to 44.1 which would be another step.
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post #201 of 326 Old 02-14-2006, 04:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Added ability to delay input channels (eg, for cross-talk cancellation applications).
This necessitates a change for existing config files.

ConvolverFilter issues corrected

Fix for perftest when running 0 paritions

Greater safety when settings changed


See https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=393670
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post #202 of 326 Old 03-01-2006, 04:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Added dithering and noise shaping capability (more types of noise shaping to come)

Fixed initialization when no filter set

More optimization

See http://convolver.sf.net and https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=397861
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post #203 of 326 Old 03-06-2006, 01:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Added more noise shaping types

Corrected scaling of 32-bit PCM samples

Some ergonomics tweaks to application of ConvolverFilter settings
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post #204 of 326 Old 03-09-2006, 01:05 PM - Thread Starter
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This is a bug fix/tweak release:

ConvolverWrapper pin negotiation and buffer length fixes
Dropdown list fixes
Dithering and noise shaping fixes
Moved to mingw-compiled libsndfile 1.0.14
wisdom.fftw deposited only in startup directory
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post #205 of 326 Old 03-12-2006, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vairulez View Post

for theatertek it's very simple :
andrew added an option called the audio-postprocessor. You can add there any directshow filter having a merit of do_not_use+1 and that can take in input/output pcm interleaved.
The filter is inserted in the graph after the audio decoder and before the renderer

Can someone explain this for a dummy?

Please
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post #206 of 326 Old 03-13-2006, 01:47 AM - Thread Starter
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It means that ConvolverFilter and ConvolverWrapper can be used to modify (convolve) Theatertek's output.

See convolver.sf.net, www.duffroomcorrection.com and www.theatertek.com for more details, if you have not already done so.
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post #207 of 326 Old 03-13-2006, 06:25 AM
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Well done on the Convolver development!

I know what to use it for, but not quite how to get it installed.

I am testing various players to see if it is possible to assemble a system that can play back all formats exept SA-CD - with a convolution engine in the chain. DVD-Audio seems to be the hardest part to get in place.

So far I've been successfull in following your step-by-step guides for the WMP and the Zoomplayer. But I haven't sorted out how to link the convolver to Theatertek or jrmediacenter.

I've browsed all there is to browse over at theatertek site, and I have identified "audio-postprocessor". But I haven't sorted out how to add Convolver or any other directshow filter. And what does "... having a merit of do_not_use+1..." mean?
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post #208 of 326 Old 03-13-2006, 01:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Convolver works with JRiver Media player via the DX host plug-in (http://accessories.jrmediacenter.com...ccessories.php)

TheaterTek should detect ConvolverWrapper/Filter on the basis of their "merit" which is a property of a plug-in invisible to the user.

console is another way of getting convolution into the chain (www.console.jp)

If you were able to provide additional walkthroughs I would be happy to add them to my site.
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post #209 of 326 Old 03-13-2006, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BerntR View Post

Well done on the Convolver development!

I know what to use it for, but not quite how to get it installed.

I am testing various players to see if it is possible to assemble a system that can play back all formats exept SA-CD - with a convolution engine in the chain. DVD-Audio seems to be the hardest part to get in place.

DVD-Audio? Good luck...

I believe the only way to play them on a PC is using Windvd with a SB Audigy soundcard. Is this still the case?

Loving my Electric Bike!!
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post #210 of 326 Old 03-13-2006, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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This release:

More robust approach to setting changes while convolver is running
Sync ConvolverWrapper variable buffer size changes
Internal changes (eg, use boost numeric casting functions, FastArray tweaks)


See https://sourceforge.net/project/show...ease_id=401324
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