The X-Meridian 7.1 Thread - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 2138 Old 02-15-2007, 04:51 PM
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The encoders are not blocked , and it would not make sense to do so. Re-encoding a source will only decrease its sound quality some. They are more concerned with passing uncompressed data out from the PC over unprotected transports. DTS/DD encoded material is lossy and not a true reproduction of the source. Even if it does sound good.

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Originally Posted by ROBSCIX View Post

That is strange what your saying, now are you talking about a integrated 2.1 set where there is one connection the the sound card? or are you talking about using two connection so you hav a dedicated subwoofer?-I think this is what your refering to becasue this is the reason you would lose the sub under stereo. You can always sugest the fix to Auzen or C-Media.

AVOpus, Speaking of Vista are the digital encoders blocked on the XM 7.1 under Vista DRM? for instance the DD/DTS decoders on the X-fi are blocked by DRM. I understand this to prevent copying the input. This is why I am asking about the realtime encoder output on the XM. I understand your using analog though have you heard anything from the XM community?

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post #92 of 2138 Old 02-15-2007, 05:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Well it's nice to know we haven't lost any features on the X-Meridian under Vista. Based on your Vista experience everything is good with the XM 7.1. under Vista?
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post #93 of 2138 Old 02-16-2007, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abstrakt View Post

I've run into the same issue with XP and find it incredibly frustrating. It looks like there's no way to get 2.1 output with this card short of upgrading to Vista -- which I'd rather not do for the time being. The XP driver will either upmix everything to 5.1 (in 6-speaker mode), or disregard the subwoofer altogether (in 2-speaker mode).

If anyone has found a solution to this problem in XP please let us know. Perhaps there are compatible drivers out there from C-Media that support proper 2.1 output?

Maybe you can try with drivers sets from other c-media based sound cards such as the b-enspirer, inferno or barracuda. I've read in another forum that they are compatible and in some cases the driver version is different...

Have you tried any possible configurations of flexbass? large, small, different crossovers...?

I am in the same situation (two good boxshelf speakers connected to the front stereo output and a subwoofer to the corresponding output working correctly with a x-fi). I was considering the x-meridian but this issue is certainly a pain.
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post #94 of 2138 Old 02-16-2007, 12:23 PM
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Hi

Would like to get some advice regarding the Vista DRC and Meridian 7.1

Is it possible to get the function available.

Regards
Anders
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post #95 of 2138 Old 02-16-2007, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Anders J View Post

Hi

Would like to get some advice regarding the Vista DRC and Meridian 7.1

Is it possible to get the function available.

Regards
Anders

Yes,

I have done this. There was a hack mentioned somewhere in the Vista Audio Processing Explained thread. It worked perfectly. Try to search for it. If you cant find it let me know and I will try to track it down.
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post #96 of 2138 Old 02-16-2007, 05:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janderclander14 View Post

Maybe you can try with drivers sets from other c-media based sound cards such as the b-enspirer, inferno or barracuda. I've read in another forum that they are compatible and in some cases the driver version is different...

I noticed the B-Enspirer XP driver is more recent, so I'll probably try that one. I doubt it'll make any difference though; it appears to be identical in functionality to the one provided by Auzentech.

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Have you tried any possible configurations of flexbass? large, small, different crossovers...?

Yep, I've tried all possible combinations. The root of the problem is that in 2-speaker mode the subwoofer remains mute no matter what. Setting the fronts to small in Flexbass I'd expect the driver to reroute bass to the subwoofer, but no such luck. It kills the selected low frequency range from the fronts, sure enough, but instead of rerouting it to the sub it sends it to a black hole. And with Flexbass disabled or the fronts set to large the result is identical: the bass goes to the fronts, while the subwoofer remains mute.

The only way to get anything out of the subwoofer is to set the card to 6-speaker mode. I guess whoever wrote the driver must have taken "2-speaker" mode literally, only expecting it to be used when two fronts are connected to the card without a subwoofer. But then in 6-speaker mode we run into the aforementioned problem of stereo sources being upmixed to 5.1 no matter what, which is unacceptable to me.

Dazzlercee mentioned earlier that the Vista driver doesn't behave the same way: in 2-speaker mode the subwoofer is still functional, thus enabling proper 2.1 playback of stereo sources. But I'm definitely not upgrading to Vista for the time being... A more likely solution for me will be to dump this card and get an X-Fi Elite.
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post #97 of 2138 Old 02-18-2007, 12:28 PM - Thread Starter
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DO you guys running XP find any issues with the drivers? I mean bad things?
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post #98 of 2138 Old 02-18-2007, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBSCIX View Post

DO you guys running XP find any issues with the drivers? I mean bad things?

It's more of an irritation that if I set the card to 6 speakers, it plays my stereo tracks in all 6 channels...

/Bo
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post #99 of 2138 Old 02-18-2007, 01:30 PM - Thread Starter
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I have noticed aswell when you set the system input to 6 channel that you lose prologic IIX and DTS, does this happen with everybody? In XP even in analog mode I could set the playback as either Prologic IIX or DTS in surround mode. The drive is a beta version though so lets hope that things get sorted out.
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post #100 of 2138 Old 02-21-2007, 07:16 PM
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I just got my X-Meridan today. First look says what a awesome sound card for 7.1 output. Very clean sounding. Great buy, and after some more testing may finally be happy with the sound side of my Home Theater. Next project is to upgrade the 4 year old projector.
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post #101 of 2138 Old 02-21-2007, 11:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBSCIX View Post

I have noticed aswell when you set the system input to 6 channel that you lose prologic IIX and DTS, does this happen with everybody? In XP even in analog mode I could set the playback as either Prologic IIX or DTS in surround mode. The drive is a beta version though so lets hope that things get sorted out.

ProLogic IIx is a 2 channel mode. It's basically an advanced version of Dolby ProLogic , which was also only a two channel input decoding. I think you are referring also to the 2 channel DTS mode as well (not standard DTS). You NEVER want to use these when fed a source that is greater than 2 channels.
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post #102 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 07:08 AM
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OK, I guess I was not completely done with my audio, just order 4 LM4562's to try out to upgrade the OpAmps. Also since there was a $5 handling fee for orders under $25, I added a LT1385 which a couple people mentioned on another forum. Not sure I will even try it, but it was basically free. Considering how happy I was with the stock OpAmps, I am kind of curious how much better the X-Meridian can get.

Having such a quality card that provides clean analog outs and supports all the latest 7.1 formats really saves me from having to abandon my Denon 5800 reciever. Revo 7.1 was functional, but was not anywhere near the quality.
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post #103 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 11:53 AM - Thread Starter
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You will notice improvements in the soundquality. I have tried various amps but have been told the LM4562's are among the best ones to use for the X-Meridian. I tried others and the ALL improved the sound quality over the stock opamps. I should have my amps tommorow. Can't wait. Also, considering how good the quality can get there are a few guys in here that modded the cards electronics and noticed quality increase again.
@AVopus, I never really used these setting for 5.1 material It just surprised me to see them dissapear. It's strange though becasue in the driver for ProLogic IIX and the pane for DTS it shows a surround sound setup. I always though you could use these on 5.1 material if you wanted to. I guess I was incorrect.
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post #104 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBSCIX View Post

You will notice improvements in the soundquality. I have tried various amps but have been told the LM4562's are among the best ones to use for the X-Meridian. I tried others and the ALL improved the sound quality over the stock opamps. I should have my amps tommorow. Can't wait. Also, considering how good the quality can get there are a few guys in here that modded the cards electronics and noticed quality increase again.
@AVopus, I never really used these setting for 5.1 material It just surprised me to see them dissapear. It's strange though becasue in the driver for ProLogic IIX and the pane for DTS it shows a surround sound setup. I always though you could use these on 5.1 material if you wanted to. I guess I was incorrect.

Nope, and you would never want to. DTS and Dolby Digital are the multichannel formats and have discrete information for each speaker. Prologic IIx uses information contained in two channels to direct it to the other speakers.

And you are right.. modding the card by bypassing the capacitors definitely makes another improvement in sound. To truly appreciate this though all elements in your sound system need to be up to nearly this level. You might not notice as much of a difference if another component is the bottleneck. Basically you get even more realism by bypassing the capacitors.
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post #105 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVOpus View Post

You NEVER want to use these when fed a source that is greater than 2 channels.

This is incorrect. If you have a 7.1 channel system and 5.1 channel source material you have to matrix the rear channels somehow. You can use one of the following methods:

Circle Surround II - Used by the M-Audio Revolution 7.1 to matrix a single rear channel that is sent to both speakers. I think it combines the original 5 channels into 2 channels and then creates a 6.1 matrix from the 2 channels.

Dolby Digital EX/DTS-ES - Used by the X-Fi cards to matrix a single rear channel that is sent to both speakers. Both methods are identical. DTS licensed the matrix from Dolby. The original 5 channels are left untouched.

Dolby Prologic IIx - Used by the X-Meridian to matrix two discreet rear channels. The original 5 channels are left untouched.
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post #106 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 01:38 PM
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Rob....

I have read through the other thread on some of the modifications and they sound intregring, but I have almost zero expertise in soldering. I might try them in the future but not right now. For now dropping in the LM4562's will have to due. Since this is mostly for movies, it may not be worth the added trouble.

One thing I am not clear on is the distortion issue. I am running XP Pro. The device volume in control panel is set in the middle and the speakers are at -1db. (for some reason once I take them off of 0db, I can no longer set them back there. No biggie, just odd). I assume this should avoid any of the mentioned distortion. I also assume these settings will be appropriate for when I drop in the new op amps.

Another question, am I losing anything by running the analogs out into the external inputs to my Denon 5800 receiver and using its amps instead of just directly into an amplifer? It sounds clean to me and I get a lot more detail then I was getting with the Revo card, but I was just wondering if I was doing something dumb.
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post #107 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 03:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Well if your using the analog out of the card into the receiver your hearing the quality of the the soundcard and the receiver. Alot of people have this type of setup and you get great sound this way. As for distortion the XM has hot outputs so cranking the cards output to full may cause some distortion depending on your receiver. If you keep the card around 50% for your levels everything should be fine. I don't recommend trying the capacitor mod if your not handy with a soldering iron. It would be a fairly delicate job and would be easy to damagae your card AND would effectivley void your warranty. You may need to re adjust your volume settings when you put in the new amps depending on what they put out for signal level. You should notice a great improvement in sound quality. Make sure you put the new amps in the proper orientation.
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post #108 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdome View Post

This is incorrect. If you have a 7.1 channel system and 5.1 channel source material you have to matrix the rear channels somehow. You can use one of the following methods:

Circle Surround II - Used by the M-Audio Revolution 7.1 to matrix a single rear channel that is sent to both speakers. I think it combines the original 5 channels into 2 channels and then creates a 6.1 matrix from the 2 channels.

Dolby Digital EX/DTS-ES - Used by the X-Fi cards to matrix a single rear channel that is sent to both speakers. Both methods are identical. DTS licensed the matrix from Dolby. The original 5 channels are left untouched.

Dolby Prologic IIx - Used by the X-Meridian to matrix two discreet rear channels. The original 5 channels are left untouched.

Yeah, but my point is that these are already "wrapped" in another mode. You still never want to just select the Dolby Prologic IIx setting. In fact, you cannot in Vista.

Your information is 100% correct though, and good for people to know.
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post #109 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 07:11 PM
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Quote:


This is incorrect. If you have a 7.1 channel system and 5.1 channel source material you have to matrix the rear channels somehow.

or better yet, you can just drive the 6 speakers you have source material for, and ignore the fact that you have 2 more speakers....


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post #110 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmx View Post

Rob....

I have read through the other thread on some of the modifications and they sound intregring, but I have almost zero expertise in soldering. I might try them in the future but not right now. For now dropping in the LM4562's will have to due. Since this is mostly for movies, it may not be worth the added trouble.

One thing I am not clear on is the distortion issue. I am running XP Pro. The device volume in control panel is set in the middle and the speakers are at -1db. (for some reason once I take them off of 0db, I can no longer set them back there. No biggie, just odd). I assume this should avoid any of the mentioned distortion. I also assume these settings will be appropriate for when I drop in the new op amps.

Another question, am I losing anything by running the analogs out into the external inputs to my Denon 5800 receiver and using its amps instead of just directly into an amplifer? It sounds clean to me and I get a lot more detail then I was getting with the Revo card, but I was just wondering if I was doing something dumb.

Your assumptions are correct. That is a damn fine receiver and has a pretty clean analog path. Try to set as many things as you can to bypass.. such as the EQ on the receiver to avoid reprocessing of the signal. If the receiver has a "pure direct" mode then that is what you want to select.

50% should avoid distortion. I can hear it easily on sharp piano notes. If you have any of this material then you might want to use it to test.

The DC coupling mod is certainly worth it, but you need to practice and be willing to accept the fact that you might fry the card. IMO it takes the card into the truly audiophile realm. The output is very, very clean after that mod. You still get a ton of detail with just the card and the LM4562s though. Just get ready for a slightly less bassy sound with the LM4562s. Its a cleaner and more accurate bass.. just not as warm sounding. The detail you will get from the entire range is miles better though.
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post #111 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 07:47 PM
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I've had my X-Meridian and upgraded 2227's OpAmps for a while now and thought I would share my findings. Now bear in mind I have a much more modest setup than many of you here so that is something to consider.

My speakers consist of Acoustic Research S50 mains, SC2 Center, S20 rears and a Velodyne 12" sub. Audio is deliver from the analogue outputs on the X-Meridian to the direct 5.1 channel inputs on my Sony STR-DB930 receiver. All cables are from bluejeans cables.

I really like the sound of my setup, but one thing that has been plaguing me since I first purchased everything years ago is that I find these speakers can be slightly harsh on certain material. Mainly guitar tracks. I love the sound, but it becomes fatiguing after long listening periods.

I like the sound of the X-Meridian out of the box and thought it was a solid upgrade from my previous Audigy2 ZS and felt it was worth the pricetag. After installing the 2227 OpAmps this card is now my favorite HT Purchase! The sound is much richer. It seems more detailed, yet relaxed. Its a nice warm, full sound that is very easy to listen to for long periods of time and I no longer experience that fatique I was getting with my past sound cards!

I am going to do the DC coupling mod this weekend, if it sounds even better with the mod I have to say I think this card is a hell of a deal! AVOpus has also peaked my interest in the LM4562's so I may have to order myself a set of those and give them a listen!

AVOpus - Do you mind me asking where you purchased your LM4562's? I found a couple sites that carry them but most seemed focused on bulk orders, do you have a supplier you would recommend?
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post #112 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DemonOfTheFall View Post


AVOpus - Do you mind me asking where you purchased your LM4562's? I found a couple sites that carry them but most seemed focused on bulk orders, do you have a supplier you would recommend?

http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea...674994&Site=US

Ozy
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post #113 of 2138 Old 02-22-2007, 08:34 PM
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Thank you! I have just placed my order and look forward to comparing them!
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post #114 of 2138 Old 02-23-2007, 09:11 AM - Thread Starter
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I currently have the OPA2227's installed as you do and like the sound of those they have a nice mellow sound that is nice and detailed but laid back. I just got my LM4562's before I came here I will be installing these in abit and listening for the day. I am also interested in the
DC coupling mod. I will post my finds about the LM's when I get to listen to them for awhile.
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post #115 of 2138 Old 02-23-2007, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmx View Post

One thing I am not clear on is the distortion issue. I am running XP Pro. The device volume in control panel is set in the middle and the speakers are at -1db. (for some reason once I take them off of 0db, I can no longer set them back there. No biggie, just odd). I assume this should avoid any of the mentioned distortion. I also assume these settings will be appropriate for when I drop in the new op amps

You can either reset the volume or you can click on the "+" or "-" sign to adjust the volume back to 0dB
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post #116 of 2138 Old 02-23-2007, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by alg7_munif View Post

You can either reset the volume or you can click on the "+" or "-" sign to adjust the volume back to 0dB

Thanks. For some reason scrolling with the mouse it seems to go -2, -1, +1, +2 and I could never find 0.
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post #117 of 2138 Old 02-23-2007, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROBSCIX View Post

I currently have the OPA2227's installed as you do and like the sound of those they have a nice mellow sound that is nice and detailed but laid back. I just got my LM4562's before I came here I will be installing these in abit and listening for the day. I am also interested in the
DC coupling mod. I will post my finds about the LM's when I get to listen to them for awhile.

It seems like you said you ordered those puppies almost a month ago. What did you select the Amish Express method of delivery? Well I look forward to your report. Mine are supposedly on their way.
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post #118 of 2138 Old 02-23-2007, 04:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, it was a group buy deal and the date for the actual order kept getting pushed up. My order was always in but when the order went to the distributor was the issue. I have them now. They are a pretty nice sounding Opamps. I prefer these over all the others I have tried. The clarity of the vocals is just outstading. The bass region is not as big as some of the other amps but it doesn't have to be becasue it hits nice and is very detailed. If you have your on the way you will be very happy with them. I know I am. Other then this I can't really describe what they sound like they are just a very balanced and dynamic souding. Your gonna be very pleased.
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post #119 of 2138 Old 02-24-2007, 05:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVOpus View Post

Your assumptions are correct. That is a damn fine receiver and has a pretty clean analog path. Try to set as many things as you can to bypass.. such as the EQ on the receiver to avoid reprocessing of the signal. If the receiver has a "pure direct" mode then that is what you want to select.

Fortunately on the external inputs, the Denon 5800 bypasses all processing. It is suppose to be even cleaner than the pure direct setting on the other inputs and idiot proof so I don't have to worry about any setting mistakenly turned on. There are better amps out there, but with the state of sound cards, having external volume control is probably advantageous, especially on this card that outputs such high voltage.
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post #120 of 2138 Old 02-24-2007, 07:11 AM
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Are there any recievers that have 2 sets of analog 5.1 or 7.1 inputs out there.

I am building a new HTPC and on my current one I am just sending SPDIF to my Sony unit.

My thoughts were to add the XBOX HD drive and an internal Lite-on or Panasonic, but if that becomes an issue with using both in one box, I was planning on buying a standalone Bray drive and feeding it into a new reviver (haven't yet found one I truly like)

On that front... with the understanding that I am not an audiophile, but more a movie buff who happens to listen to some music via my NAS. What recievers are there out there worth looking at (not looking to break the bank on one but I am willing to look at something up to say 750 - 1k). My wife can't tell the difference between a 128kbps mp3 and lossless audio of the same track so lets let me be the judge of the audio section - lol

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