J. River Media Center 12 Released - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 76 Old 05-12-2007, 09:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Since the other thread was deleted (I understand why, and I'm not complaining at all), I figured I'd just at least post a quick message from a regular user. Just to be clear... Jim did not pay me to make this post (or even ask me to). I just think this is good information for people who don't frequent Interact, but use older versions of MC (or might use some other app they aren't completely happy with). I certainly am an enthusiastic user of MC, but only because it's a great application.

J. River has now released MC12, which includes a whole pile of new features:
  • New "Display View" that replaces Full Screen View and Windowed View with a more streamlined look
  • Major speedups to searching (over 11x faster), sorting (over 3x faster), view switching, and program startup
  • New tag system for streamlined file organization and tagging
  • Background (auto) import with optional folder watching
  • DirectShow Filter Controls (including filter selection on a per media type basis), color controls, and many other video improvements
  • Display Action Window shows small view of player window at all times (very slick once you get used to it)
  • About a million Theater View improvements (including third-party plugin support). Included J. River built RSS reader and Weather plugins.
  • New look (Noire skin), transparency, animations, and other new eyecandy
  • and really a huge number of other improvements

There is a 30-day free trial. The retail price is $40 for a new license, $19.98 to upgrade from Media Jukebox 8.0, or MC9.0+. If you purchase a license, you are welcome to install it on all of your own personal computers without having to buy additional licenses (within reason). I certainly appreciate their liberal licensing policy, and it is one of the main reasons I'm willing to pay for the software.

Oh, and for current MC11 users: You can install MC12 alongside MC11.1 (make sure to have the latest build of MC11.1 first). So, you can try it out without abandoning your working system.

For more information, or for help, come visit us over at the J. River Interact forum.

EDIT: Ha ha... All the threads I post on over here end up deleted (I hope it's not me). Oh well... I'll say it again. Hello all! I've been a lurker here for a long time... I love all the great info available here! So, thanks and keep it up. I always want to stay more involved over here, but I only have so much time for web forum use....

"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."
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post #2 of 76 Old 05-12-2007, 06:16 PM
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Glynor may be a lurker but he is no stalker. Having learned a great deal about A/V from his posts over at the jriver forum, I can tell you with certainty that he has excess time on his hands--thank you, Glynor!

I've used MC myself for about 2 years, from v.10 to v.12, and have seen it pick up about 100% more features in that time frame. For example (and Glynor, you left out this):

--TABS! If you're a Firefox user, maybe even with the "Tab Mix Plus" plugin, then check out MC 12. I start out with a default of 3 tabs open, and VERY light on MEM USAGE:

1. "Playing Now"--My playback queue that saves across sessions.
2. "Top Hits"--My favorite 999 tracks (you can set is to more if you want), updated on-the-fly.
3. "Audio"--my entire library, currently a paltry 20,000 tracks. I think the biggest library on MC is 300,000 tracks, followed by somebody with 299,000, I think. My 20k is a dirt shack compared to the guys over there. And yet, MC is wicked fast!

If you haven't tried it, give it a try for free. For anyone spending meaningful time/attention/money on their hardware, this is software that is up to the challenge.
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post #3 of 76 Old 05-12-2007, 10:36 PM
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To answer a question in a previous post Why JRMC12 over the likes of.. I thought I would relay my experience and why I'm currently a very happy JRMC12 user (note: while I do tend to stick with a product once I find one that suits I will happily move on if something better comes around).

Background: I bought the HTPC concept big time..spend thousands updating the AV Equipment, PC's, etc. I currently have a Yami V2700, 5.1 Axiom Speakers, PS3, Hitachi Plasma, all hooked up with DVI/HDMI & S/PDIF. The HTPC box is built on a quite BTX M'Board Dell box, XP Pro, MS MCE K'B & RC (used to programme my Yami RC), 1GB RAM, 1TB+HDD, nVidia 7600gs, Dvico DVB-T card etc

Needed: I wanted ONE HTPC front end drive the lot AND the Wife & Kids had to be able to use it - just like all regular CE Devices - sounds easy
Why JRMC12 over the others?: As an HTPC front end, they all do pretty much the same thing, but in the end it was a simple combination of media flexibility, great support, and an incredibly powerful Standard View :

1 - Media Support: Well I tried HTPC progs like Nero Home, MS MCE, Media Portal, Sagem, (even just media players like VLC, WMP) but found that while these can be great simple HTPC front ends they tended not to meet my particular needs specifically when it came to Media Support. I was having all sorts of problems getting one program to play my entire library, especially MPG/DTS and anamorphic DV video files. JRMC12 excelled here as you could select, mix and match filters. Eg, for me the Nero Source, Nero Splitter, and nVideo Pure Video codecs are the go for all my MPG files - but I could mix and match another combo if I wanted, something no other HTPC prog I had tried could do.

2 - Product Support & Development: I wanted an active community where you could ask NOOB Q's and get friendly advice as well as the ability to contribute to the ongoing feature set and development of the prog - I want to be able to put forward my requirements and have them integrated into the product. I find the communities, interaction with the Dev, and continual releases from Media Portal, VLC, and JRMC all very good (please don't get me started on Nero.) and with MS you get what you get. For me JRMC12 was NOT initially a good choice as it did not have DVB-T support but the JR folk were more than happy to work at adding this feature and I was a willing tester and guinea pig! Like all things there is a downside as sometimes they seem to prioritise other areas not just the ones I want!!! Eg. I've been begging (yup no shame at all) for JRMC12 to natively support all the buttons on the MS MCE K'B / Remote (I really miss my REC button ) but so far it has fallen on deaf ears.

3 - Standard View: This is a two edged sword for JRMC12 and the HTPC market.after 6months of using the software constantly I am still a Newbie on so many features. Did you know you can reduce the Sibilance from a particular track (or selection of tracks) by assigning a customised EQ setting just to it and no other? I only found that out (thanks to the forum and the third party developer of a plug in) last week and now Internal's - From Paris to Berlin does not sound like a hissing snake! This is just an example of the depth and customisation that can be setup in it Standard View mode then all hidden by running it using the Theater View as an HTPC front end. JRMC12 provides by far the richest, deepest set of options I've seen in similar products - but this does require an investment of time and effort as many of these use their own paradigms that an not (to me) initially intuitive. Eg it took me months to get using Meta Data tags to sort, display, and manage my library over just file names and directories like many other progs.

HTPC project Finished?: Unfortunately not - I am about 95% there.but after all the time, effort and money my HTPC project still falls shorts. One particular bug bear is even after spending thousands I can not quite eliminate the Video Jitter particularly noticeable on Live DVB-T Sport. I've tried all sorts of fine tuning but cannot emulate the fluid motion of even the cheapest DVB-T STB (my latest thinking is it seems to be combination of nVidia's poor PAL support and the way PC's use audio timing). At present, JRMC12's fills my needs very well and I'm enjoying the recent focus on enhancing its HTPC features.now for full MS MCE KB/RC/IR Blaster support, EPG, programmed recoding

Apologies for the long post, at the end of the day there are many options, try them and see what suites YOUR particular needs, but if you are looking for more than a dumbed down HTPC front end you've got to take a look at JRMC12.

Regards
Nathan
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post #4 of 76 Old 05-13-2007, 08:06 PM
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Well it's about time some other JRMC users popped their heads up. I was starting to think I was the only one here that knew how good it is.
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post #5 of 76 Old 05-13-2007, 08:45 PM
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I can tell you that just from an audio stand point is does not get any better than JRMC, the ASIO implementation in this software is the best I have heard, in fact there is probably nothing better.
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post #6 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glynor View Post

  • About a million Theater View improvements (including third-party plugin support). Included J. River built RSS reader and Weather plugins.

I'm trying to get excited by this but there is no indication if they are really going to support third-party plugins and when you ask about it it just gets ignored. Come to think of it that is what really irks me as a long-time JRMC user. The program is really great but 95% of the time you get no response to requests or questions in their forums. This frustration leads me to use other programs...
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post #7 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crbaldwin View Post

I'm trying to get excited by this but there is no indication if they are really going to support third-party plugins and when you ask about it it just gets ignored. Come to think of it that is what really irks me as a long-time JRMC user. The program is really great but 95% of the time you get no response to requests or questions in their forums. This frustration leads me to use other programs...

Most questions are answered within a few hours, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.

The Theater View plug-ins are new in the last 45 days. No documentation exists yet. Please be patient. Check back in a few weeks. If you have a specific idea, please post on Interact.

Jim Hillegass / JRiver Media Center
jriver.com or Owners Thread at AVSForum
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post #8 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jriver View Post

Most questions are answered within a few hours, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.

This has not been my experience at all for the last several years - I must be really unlucky. The process seems to be:

1) Post a question/problem on the forum.
2) Keep your fingers crossed for the next several days hoping you will get a response.
3) When the post gets ignored bump it to the top asking again.
4) Bump it again after several days.
5) Bump with a message inquiring why your post is being ignored and then get frustrated and angry when someone edits your post and tells you that the "forum support system" works quite well (but still doesn't necessarily respond to your issue).
6) Leave the forum all pissed off.


JRMC has the potential to be my main HTPC software but I have gone back to MCE because of some TheaterView issues and the frustrations in getting any answers.
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post #9 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 12:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crbaldwin View Post

This has not been my experience at all for the last several years - I must be really unlucky. The process seems to be:

I find just the opposite, and do try to answer questions myself as much as my free time allows. However, I do notice some things do certainly go unanswered, but I'd say it's usually the exception not the rule. Just some tips for asking questions over there on Interact, though most of these also apply to other support forums I've participated in:

1. Generally, you'll get the best response if you have tried and are using the most recent build of MC before you ask your question. New builds come out so often that if yours is more than a few days old then you are likely not using the newest build. Check for the "sticky" thread at the top of the appropriate board for the newest build.

2. Unfortunately, "sub-forums" and "older version forums" do not get anywhere near the response as the forums dedicated to the "latest versions". Most of us are "early adopters" over there and it shows... For example, I tend to only check in on the MC11 board about once every other month or so. I check the MC12 board at least 1-2 times a day on weekdays.

3. This is true with really all support forums, but try to describe your issue or question with the most specific terminology possible. Screenshots often help. So often I see questions that are extremely vague and don't really make a lot of sense (eg. "Why doesn't sorting work right?" without any description of the users' desire or where they are looking at the sorting or any other details). I tend, personally, to ignore questions like that -- my time is too valuable.

4. Likewise -- I decide whether or not to even open and read a thread based on it's subject line. If the subject is vague or doesn't seem like a question but a "feature request", then I often won't even look at it. Subjects like "How do I do ?" work the best for me.

5. And, like any web forum, search is your friend. I've answered "I get audio but my video is black" about 10 million times personally, and I'm just tired of it. Read the FAQ thread, and search the forum. There's a lot in there!

"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."
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post #10 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jriver View Post

What's your username on our forum?

cncb. I started the Theater View "text display" thread which was impressively handled very quickly (I guess it was a "hot button" issue). However, at the same time I had 2 other threads go totally ignored which unfortunately has been typical.
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post #11 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 12:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crbaldwin View Post

cncb. I started the Theater View "text display" thread which was impressively handled very quickly (I guess it was a "hot button" issue). However, at the same time I had 2 other threads go totally ignored which unfortunately has been typical.

I will say that I have seen 1-2 of your threads go unanswered (now that I know "who" you are).... Like the Shuffle Theater View thread. I just didn't have much of an answer for you -- there wasn't one really.

In that particular case... I saw that as more of a "Feature Request" thread than a "Issue or Question" thread, and since I'm not a developer I don't comment on those threads where I don't have some vested interest.

Not that it is much help now, but...

"Some cultures are defined by their relationship to cheese."
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post #12 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 02:04 PM
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A long time member of the forum, but a recent user of MC. With the new computer build, I decided it was time to start a digital library of my music, which was especially needed since I got my Sansa. I have to say I really like the software.

About the only complaint I have right now is some of the bleeding edge and/or advanced features aren't documented all that well. Also, sometimes it is hard to see what the software is capable of, rather than what is useable out of the box.

Jason
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post #13 of 76 Old 05-14-2007, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glynor View Post

.

... Subjects like "How do I do ?" work the best for me....

glynor

I'm a longtime lurker over at jriver's forum but a big time user of jrmc. I just wanted to send out a huge THANK YOU for all the good help you give - whenever I search over there for how to do something I find a post of yours that explains *clearly* how to do it, i.e., import/playback of .dtswav files (ripped from DTS CDs).

Now I'm trying to figure out to do similar with jrmc using powerdvd's claud.ax for playback of DTS96/24 .dts files (demuxed from DVDs) - but I'm still learning the directshow playback gui in JRMC. If I have question or problem with this I'll head on over to jriver's forum (I'm Bill S over there) and start a How Do I thread and hope you see it!
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post #14 of 76 Old 05-15-2007, 03:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crbaldwin View Post

This has not been my experience at all for the last several years - I must be really unlucky. The process seems to be:

1) Post a question/problem on the forum.
2) Keep your fingers crossed for the next several days hoping you will get a response.
3) When the post gets ignored bump it to the top asking again.
4) Bump it again after several days.
5) Bump with a message inquiring why your post is being ignored and then get frustrated and angry when someone edits your post and tells you that the "forum support system" works quite well (but still doesn't necessarily respond to your issue).
6) Leave the forum all pissed off.


JRMC has the potential to be my main HTPC software but I have gone back to MCE because of some TheaterView issues and the frustrations in getting any answers.

My personal experience regarding "questions/problems" is that the most NOOBish to the most complex is always answered - I've never had one that has not been (and quite often Glynor is one of the posters )

HOWEVER I do have sympathy for the emotions that crbaldwin expresses as many of the "feature requests" style posts fall into the cycle described above (well 1-4 anyway) as you don't know if it has caught the eye of the JRMC folk or not....I try to avoid #5 & #6 as I figure that it is all a balance as every crazy idea and request can not be met (even if I think mine are the most important)!
Thanks
Nathan
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post #15 of 76 Old 05-15-2007, 04:01 PM
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JRMC 12 sees PowerDVD HD filters in the DVD filter selection section but will not use them any chance we will have the ability to use those filters and playback HD DVD / BD in JRMC soon?
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post #16 of 76 Old 05-16-2007, 06:56 AM
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We want to support them. However we have not yet figured out how to. Until then we will not be able to tell you when you can expect it. Sorry.
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post #17 of 76 Old 05-16-2007, 12:53 PM
 
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Mod's edit: Off topic post removed.

PS
I can live with that.
I sent a PM to the moderator, and to David Botts( co-owner of these forums) asking whether I could post the fact that I agreed with part of what crbaldin stated above, and also two suggestions for improvement of JRiver. Since I wanted to quote crbaldwin, I sent a copy to crbaldwin as well. If anyone would like a copy they need only PM me. It may be that I am "personna non grata" and may not post anything, or it maybe that neither David Botts, nor Bob Sorel have had a chance to respond to my PM. JRiver makes a good product. Not perfect, but then there is no perfect product. I think the two suggestions for improvement would benefit all, but then that is Mr. Botts and Mr. Sorel's decision. It is their forum and I am in complete agreement that they decide who and what may be posted to a thread, although I am one to believe that sunlight is a wonderful antiseptic. When there is no sunlight (i.e. moderation deletion), you need to analyze the diminished picture. But darkness is difficult to analyze.
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post #18 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 10:18 AM
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IQ100, where is the part of your post that is on topic? Without a contribution to the thread, your posts will be removed.
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post #19 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 10:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherbona View Post

but I'm still learning the directshow playback gui in JRMC.

Thought I'd mention that, together with Yaobing, I wrote up a nice DirectShow Playback Guide on J. River's wiki that covers a lot about DirectShow in general and the new features in MC12... Unfortunately I can't link to it because I don't have enough posts on AVS yet (as I mentioned, the threads I post in keep getting deleted -- oh well), but it's on the Wiki and it's called "DirectShow Playback Guide".

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post #20 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glynor View Post

Thought I'd mention that, together with Yaobing, I wrote up a nice DirectShow Playback Guide on J. River's wiki that covers a lot about DirectShow in general and the new features in MC12... Unfortunately I can't link to ....

I can. It's here:
http://wiki.jrmediacenter.com/index....Playback_Guide

Thanks, glynor.

(yaobing is a distinguished J. River developer, working on video and TV components)

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post #21 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 12:47 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Sorel View Post

IQ100, where is the part of your post that is on topic? Without a contribution to the thread, your posts will be removed.

1. I agreed with the poster crbaldwin's post #8 above, especially the part that stated "... and then get frustrated and angry when someone edits your post and tells you that the "forum support system" works quite well ..."

I assume validating another AVS experience is an on topic post. If only positive experiences may by documented, then readers get a skewed perspective.

2. In response to someone posting a hard crash experience I posted:
"Well designed software should be able to identify and report to you any corrupt file, rather than coming to a "crashing halt". You should not have to design your own debugging scheme for something as basic as a program including its own check that the data it operates on are in a form acceptable to the program. Does MC12 check files requested to be imported for integrity? Should it? And if MC12 can cause you computer to come to a crashing halt can it do so in manner that will corrupt valuable data? I am not saying that MC12 stands alone in some poor software design, I am only saying there is room for improvement. Although deleting posts and pretending there are no problems is not going to solve any real problems.

Glynor responded to the effect that XP's end task and/or process could be used to recover. To me, only by encouraging reporting and attempting to duplicate a hard crash can these be avoided in the future.

3. Also, I made the following comment, especially appropriate (to me) in that MC12 prides itself on handling very large databases and allows multiple computers in the same home to interact with a single media database:
"Another problem with MC12 is that it does not lock records in a manner that would allow more than one user in a household to tag the database. No simple record locking mechanism."
I continue to believe that tagging large databases benefits from dividing the tagging load among more than one user, and that a needed improvement to MC12 is a simple record locking system.

Is a lot harder authoring posts than deleting them.
But delete away if you must.

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post #22 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iq100 View Post

3. Also, I made the following comment, especially appropriate (to me) in that MC12 prides itself on handling very large databases and allows multiple computers in the same home to interact with a single media database:
"Another problem with MC12 is that it does not lock records in a manner that would allow more than one user in a household to tag the database. No simple record locking mechanism."
I continue to believe that tagging large databases benefits from dividing the tagging load among more than one user, and that a needed improvement to MC12 is a simple record locking system.

I would not have an issue with only one user being able to do the tagging. My only problem is I do not know how to do it. I have my main computer and a HTPC. I would like to do all the tagging on the main computer and have it also be available for my HTPC. Now I have to do it on both.
Another feature of JM12 is Improved network sharing -- first user has r/w access, others have read/only. Right now I have folders shared on the network and have MC12 search those folders for any files that I have shared. I do this for my DVD collection that I have on my server. Is there a better way to do it? or does this new feature have to do with something else? Thanks
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post #23 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 01:27 PM
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I would not have an issue with only one user being able to do the tagging. My only problem is I do not know how to do it. I have my main computer and a HTPC. I would like to do all the tagging on the main computer and have it also be available for my HTPC. Now I have to do it on both.

The way I do it is that I have the library file on a network share and have everyone use that one. That way, everyone can access updates to the library. I think the Thumbnails still need to be copied to the other computer, tho.

Read this.

Jason
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post #24 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 01:37 PM
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The way I do it is that I have the library file on a network share and have everyone use that one. That way, everyone can access updates to the library. I think the Thumbnails still need to be copied to the other computer, tho.

Read this.

Jason

Thanks!! I looked through the wiki and must have missed this.
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post #25 of 76 Old 05-23-2007, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glynor View Post

Thought I'd mention that, together with Yaobing, I wrote up a nice DirectShow Playback Guide on J. River's wiki that covers ..."

Thanks glynor (and jriver and Yaobing as well)! Yes indeed, I had seen that guide and it really really helped me. I'm between direct show 'noob' and 'clumsy' as far as my DirectShow skills, but after playing around (and reading) the end result is with the player's DS interface/gui I was finally able to play back both:

- dtswav files
(dts ripped from so-called DTS CDs, 44.1kHz, containing wav header and originally with wav extension)

- dts files
(files with dts extension, 48kHz DTS extracted from DVDs)

This is probably something easy for others with more DS experience than me, but I could never quite make this happen before so I'm quite happy In fact I'm in surround nirvana since now I can play my multichannel .dts, .dtswav and my DVD-As that I've backed up to my hard drive as multichannel wav/wma-lossless, all from jrmc (just to be clear, jrmc doesn't have DVD-A capability but can play back multichannel wma lossless).

The only thing I haven't been able to do so far is use the powerdvd ds filter (I was hoping to decode DTS96/24 as well, but I'm not sure that would make much difference anyway).

If anyone is interested let me know and I will post my .dts and .dtswav setup/playback steps this weekend.
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post #26 of 76 Old 05-24-2007, 09:55 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Bob Sorel View Post

IQ100, where is the part of your post that is on topic? Without a contribution to the thread, your posts will be removed.

Well, I see my latest post has lasted a while.
Thank you.

Now this post may be OT, so just delete it.
My view is that Interact has improved its past draconian editing practices exactly because people like me have been willing to stick their neck out and "whine" or state their unedited view.

The reader can characterize which.
That is, if the post is available for all to analyze.

The fact is Interact is much improved.

There are a lot of commercial interests always lurking in the background.

My apologies to JRiver, if they feell I have treated them unfairly.
To me, I have NOT.

iq100
delete my ideas my posting some of your own
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post #27 of 76 Old 05-24-2007, 10:13 AM
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Does it support "Receiver only" BDA devices?
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post #28 of 76 Old 05-24-2007, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by vladd View Post

Does it support "Receiver only" BDA devices?

Do you mean the BDA devices that has a "Receiver" filter but not a "Tuner" filter (or the other way around)? Media Center supports such devices (we know at least two such devices that work in MC).
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post #29 of 76 Old 05-24-2007, 01:24 PM
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Yes. Receiver but no Tuner filter. More specifically, are one of those 2 devices the HDHomeRun by any chance?
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post #30 of 76 Old 05-24-2007, 01:50 PM
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I don't remember that name, but you could try reading or searching here:
http://yabb.jriver.com/interact/index.php?board=11.0

Jim Hillegass / JRiver Media Center
jriver.com or Owners Thread at AVSForum
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