Guide to Building a HTPC, Workstation and Server - Page 117 - AVS Forum
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post #3481 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 02:22 PM
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Thanks for the reply renethx,

The E6400 = intel Core 2 Duo E6400 (2.133 Ghz). I will be upgrading my main PC to a Quad core so this CPU will be spare. So a system based on this would be handy!

Thanks again.
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post #3482 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 02:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post

Does anyone here know if the Asus P5B-Plus mobo has any SATA ports that support PMs (port multipliers)?

The only Intel ICH that supports PM is ICH9R (command-based PM) used in P35/G33/G35. No PM support by ICH8R or ICH10R.
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post #3483 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 02:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudwiggle View Post

Thanks for the reply renethx,

The E6400 = intel Core 2 Duo E6400 (2.133 Ghz). I will be upgrading my main PC to a Quad core so this CPU will be spare. So a system based on this would be handy!

Thanks again.

- E6400
- any decent mb (e.g. GA-G31M-S2L)
- Radeon HD 4550

is as good as an AMD system. If you use a discrete graphics card, there is not much difference between Intel and AMD as for video playback.
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post #3484 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 02:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defcon View Post

I'm waiting for the Nvidia MCP7A (Geforce 9300/9400) based motherboards for Intel which sound like they will have all the features of the G45, and a faster IGP. Also hoping it will solve the issues with G45 and there will be cheaper boards and more options.

From the articles I've read the chipset is supposed to come out any day now, if anyone has any information please do post here. Thanks!

Latest information:

Fudzilla - MCP7A-S is Geforce 9x00 for Intel: A long delayed chipset (September 22, 2008)
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post #3485 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mudwiggle View Post

...The system will ONLY be used for media playback (no gaming, transcoding etc) using Vista MCE, powerdvd 8 and other possible players such as MPC HC, and KMPlayer...

Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

If you use a discrete card, Athlon X2 is enough.

Renethx, I fit the same scenario as Mudwiggle's question, to take it one step further... Could the X2 work if combined with the SidePort memory on the GIGABYTE GA-MA78GPM-DS2H ? Or would I be selling myself short by not just buying the Phenom? I really like the low power of the X2, and the price.

Thanks for all your time on this thread, it's been an amazing help.

Clint
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post #3486 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 04:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clint1079 View Post

Renethx, I fit the same scenario as Mudwiggle's question, to take it one step further... Could the X2 work if combined with the SidePort memory on the GIGABYTE GA-MA78GPM-DS2H ? Or would I be selling myself short by not just buying the Phenom? I really like the low power of the X2, and the price.

If you want the best PQ from both HD and SD contents, you should go with Phenom+780G (with or without SidePort memory) or a discrete card (HD 4550 or higher, or HD 3470 or higher). Athlon X2+780G (or 790GX)+SidePort memory is better than Athlon X2+780G (or 790GX) without SidePort memory, but is still inferior to Phenom+780G and discrete graphics.
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post #3487 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 04:59 PM
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Quick question...

Is the Intel G43 chipset a good one or better go with the G45? Basically all I want the HDMI for is getting 6 or 7 channel LPCM HD Audio out of the computer (and maybe bitstream the HD codec when I get a better receiver)...

I looked but couldn't find much on ghe G43.

Thanks!

I should clarify that I will probably be using the ATI HD4550 video card for component video output while at the same time using HDMI for the audio. I think.. that will be a low-profile video card, right?

tooooooo many numbers!
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post #3488 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 05:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebberry View Post

Is the Intel G43 chipset a good one or better go with the G45? Basically all I want the HDMI for is getting 6 or 7 channel LPCM HD Audio out of the computer (and maybe bitstream the HD codec when I get a better receiver)...

I looked but couldn't find much on ghe G43.

Thanks!

I should clarify that I will probably be using the ATI HD4550 video card for component video output while at the same time using HDMI for the audio. I think.. that will be a low-profile video card, right?

Neither you can use Intel HDMI audio along with HD 4550 (under Vista; see this article) nor you need to do so (as HD 4550 supports 5.1/7.1 LPCM HDMI audio).

Just use HD 4550 with any decent combination of CPU and mb, Intel or AMD.
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post #3489 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 07:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Neither you can use Intel HDMI audio along with HD 4550 (under Vista; see this article) nor you need to do so (as HD 4550 supports 5.1/7.1 LPCM HDMI audio).

Just use HD 4550 with any decent combination of CPU and mb, Intel or AMD.

Ok, so the (yet to be released) HD 4550 will offer a low profile AND HDMI? Is this a DVI->HDMI dongle thing? All the low profile cards I have seen yet will have a DVI soldered on and a VGA connector on a seperate bracket.
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post #3490 of 19195 Old 09-22-2008, 08:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebberry View Post

Ok, so the (yet to be released) HD 4550 will offer a low profile AND HDMI? Is this a DVI->HDMI dongle thing? All the low profile cards I have seen yet will have a DVI soldered on and a VGA connector on a seperate bracket.

Yes. Use an ATI-proprietary DVI-HDMI dongle (if it does not come with the card, you have to buy it, $10).
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post #3491 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 02:20 AM
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Hi All,

I've been planning to get a HTPC at last, and have to make a decision on the platform. There seem to be two options;

C2D E5200 + Gigabyte G45
X2 5000 (or X3 8450) + Gigabyte 780G (Cant find an EE X2 on my country )

Can you please tell me which you would choose, in terms of picture quality, h/w support for decoding especially? I've read some articles but couldnt find a detailed comparison of HD3200 and X4500HD.

Thanks already
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post #3492 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 03:20 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikeNeGerek View Post

C2D E5200 + Gigabyte G45
X2 5000 (or X3 8450) + Gigabyte 780G (Cant find an EE X2 on my country )

Can you please tell me which you would choose, in terms of picture quality, h/w support for decoding especially? I've read some articles but couldnt find a detailed comparison of HD3200 and X4500HD.

- HA: X2+HD4550 = X3+HD3200 = E5200+X4500HD = X2+HD3200
- PQ: X2+HD4550 = X3+HD3200 = E5200+X4500HD > X2+HD3200 (PQ of DVD and interlaced HD contents, mostly HDTV)
- 3D: X2+HD4550 > X3+HD3200 > E5200+X4500HD = X2+HD3200
- HDMI audio: X2+HD4550 = E5200+X4500HD (7.1 LPCM) > X3+HD3200 = X2+HD3200 (2 LPCM)
- Power consumption: X2+HD4550 = X3+HD3200 > E5200+X4500HD = X2+HD3200 (difference is ~20W)
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post #3493 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 06:14 AM
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Ok I changed my mind. I choose the OrigenAE S16v case. Configuration is:

OrigenAE S16V Zwart, Geen Voeding
GigaByte GA-MA790GP-DS4H
Corsair TWIN2X2048-6400C4 2 GB, PC6400, 800 MHz, 4, Kit Of 2
AMD Phenom X4 9550 2.20 GHz, 3600 MHz, 2 MB, Boxed
Scythe Processorkoeler Ninja Mini Aluminium, Koper
Corsair VX450 450 Watt , 20+24 Pins
WD Caviar GP 1 TB, 7200 Rpm, 16 MB, S-ATA II/300
Lite-On DH-4O1S 4 X, 12 X, SATA, Bulk, Zwart
Microsoft Windows Vista 32 Bit Home Premium, UK, OEM
Digital Everywhere DVB-C FloppyDTV
Digital Everywhere CAM AlphaCrypt DVB-C

Does the configuration fit the case?

I wonder if the Scyte Zipang fits the case. If you look at the knowledge base from OrigenAE (http://www.origenae.com/support/inde...=kb&article=46) you'll see the maximum height is 130mm. The Zipang is 112 mm in height. Does the width of the cooler cause any problems? Never configured a pc myself...
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post #3494 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 06:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

- HA: X2+HD4550 = X3+HD3200 = E5200+X4500HD = X2+HD3200
- PQ: X2+HD4550 = X3+HD3200 = E5200+X4500HD > X2+HD3200 (PQ of DVD and interlaced HD contents, mostly HDTV)
- 3D: X2+HD4550 > X3+HD3200 > E5200+X4500HD = X2+HD3200
- HDMI audio: X2+HD4550 = E5200+X4500HD (7.1 LPCM) > X3+HD3200 = X2+HD3200 (2 LPCM)
- Power consumption: X2+HD4550 = X3+HD3200 > E5200+X4500HD = X2+HD3200 (difference is ~20W)

Hmm, X3+HD3200 seems to be the best solution. (Or E5200+HD4550 but HD4550 is not avaliable here).

Thanks, i'll post my results when i complete the system.
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post #3495 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 12:42 PM
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Hey all,

A friend recommended I get input from this forum on the computer I am planning on building.

I wish to build a multi-purpose desktop for media, low-end gaming (blizzard games and such), and just general computing for office type stuff. I want to be able to play hi-def movies off a server and blu-ray movies on a new sony 37 inch hdtv lcd.

Here is what I am planning on building:
1. Antec NSK4480 Black/ Silver 0.8mm cold-rolled steel construction ATX Mid Tower Computer Case 380W Power Supply

2. Seagate ST3640323AS 640GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive

3. MSI N8400GS-TD256 GeForce 8400 GS 256MB 64-bit GDDR2 PCI Express x16 HDCP Ready Video Card

4. Crucial Ballistix Tracer 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model BL2KIT12864AL1065 - Retail

5. GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3L LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard

6. Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80570E8400

7. ARCTIC COOLING Freezer 7 Pro 92mm CPU Cooler - Retail

8. LG Black Blu-ray/HD DVD-ROM & 16X DVD±R DVD Burner SATA Model GGC-H20L - Retail

Note: Having good HD movie and blu-ray playback is very important to me.

Also, will the motherboard soundcard be enough to support good surround sound?

Thanks for any input!
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post #3496 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BackLash83 View Post

Ok I changed my mind. I choose the OrigenAE S16v case. Configuration is:

OrigenAE S16V Zwart, Geen Voeding
GigaByte GA-MA790GP-DS4H
Corsair TWIN2X2048-6400C4 2 GB, PC6400, 800 MHz, 4, Kit Of 2
AMD Phenom X4 9550 2.20 GHz, 3600 MHz, 2 MB, Boxed
Scythe Processorkoeler Ninja Mini Aluminium, Koper
Corsair VX450 450 Watt , 20+24 Pins
WD Caviar GP 1 TB, 7200 Rpm, 16 MB, S-ATA II/300
Lite-On DH-4O1S 4 X, 12 X, SATA, Bulk, Zwart
Microsoft Windows Vista 32 Bit Home Premium, UK, OEM
Digital Everywhere DVB-C FloppyDTV
Digital Everywhere CAM AlphaCrypt DVB-C

Does the configuration fit the case?

I wonder if the Scyte Zipang fits the case. If you look at the knowledge base from OrigenAE (http://www.origenae.com/support/inde...=kb&article=46) you'll see the maximum height is 130mm. The Zipang is 112 mm in height. Does the width of the cooler cause any problems? Never configured a pc myself...

Here is a picture of S14V. The main difference between S16V and S14V is that PSU is vertically laid in S16V so that there is more space for a ATX mb. I am not sure if Zipang fits or not.
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post #3497 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 03:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zammeran View Post

Hey all,

A friend recommended I get input from this forum on the computer I am planning on building.

I wish to build a multi-purpose desktop for media, low-end gaming (blizzard games and such), and just general computing for office type stuff. I want to be able to play hi-def movies off a server and blu-ray movies on a new sony 37 inch hdtv lcd.

Here is what I am planning on building:
....

Note: Having good HD movie and blu-ray playback is very important to me.

Also, will the motherboard soundcard be enough to support good surround sound?

Thanks for any input!

- MB: GA-EP43-DS3L unless you need LPT/COM ports (more SATA ports and USB ports)
- Graphics card: Radeon HD 4550, $39-$49 (September 30) if you use multichannel LPCM

If you use S/PDIF (Dolby Digital and DTS), the onboard audio is enough.
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post #3498 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 03:56 PM
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Hello:

I recently bought a new LG GGC-H20L and tried to run a Blu-Ray disc with TMT. The end result was stuttering video that was painful to watch. When viewing the CPU Performance in Task Manager, it was at 100%

I currently have a Core 2 Duo E6420 with a NVidia GeForce 8600 GTS (256 MB) in my HTPC.

My first question is: Do I need to do anything software related to fix the problem, or is it time to upgrade? I have hardware accelleration enabled in TMT.

If it's time to upgrade, I want to make damn sure my upgrades offer a flawlwess Blu-Ray experience. Not so much perfect audio (I realize the whole HDMI lossless audio issue), but definitely video. I don't do any gaming on this system; ONLY HTPC duties.

I was thinking of a small upgrade to a Core 2 Duo E8500 and an ATI Radeon HD 4850 (512 mb - Asus) to ensure no problems with my Blu-Ray playback.

Any comments on this upgrade would be much appreciated. Let me know if this is enough (or if it's overkill - pplease add suggestions for hardware). If I can get away with only upgrading the video card, let me know.

I am ready to make a purchase and need some advice.

Thanks
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post #3499 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sevendustweb View Post

I recently bought a new LG GGC-H20L and tried to run a Blu-Ray disc with TMT. The end result was stuttering video that was painful to watch. When viewing the CPU Performance in Task Manager, it was at 100%

I currently have a Core 2 Duo E6420 with a NVidia GeForce 8600 GTS (256 MB) in my HTPC.

My first question is: Do I need to do anything software related to fix the problem, or is it time to upgrade? I have hardware acceleration enabled in TMT.

Do the following:

- update the graphics driver; the current version is 175.19 (here)
- update TMT; the latest patch is here
- overclock CPU to > 2.5GHz

There is not much difference between GeForce 8600 GTS and Radeon HD 4850 in BD playback. Changing the graphics card to Radeon HD 4xxx is meaningful only when you need multichannel LPCM. Even in this case I don't recommend HD 4850 if you don't do games, HD 4650/4670 is enough for BD playback.
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post #3500 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 04:42 PM
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I have downloaded all the new drivers / patches and the same problem occurs. I overclocked my processor (C2D E6420) to 2.6 ghz, but the same thing happens:

My CPU is pegged at 100% and won't let up for a second when TMT is running. Any suggestions?

The second I double click on the TMT icon, my CPU spikes. It won't quit spiking until I restart my computer. If the Radeon doesn't perform much better (if any) than the GeForce for Blu-Ray, do you think my best bet would be to upgrade my CPU?

The spiking is very weird. I tried it with the discs "21" and "Smart People" and got the exact same result every time.
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post #3501 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 04:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikeNeGerek View Post

Hmm, X3+HD3200 seems to be the best solution. (Or E5200+HD4550 but HD4550 is not avaliable here).

I forgot to say that HD 4550 is not released yet, expected on September 30.
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post #3502 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sevendustweb View Post

I have downloaded all the new drivers / patches and the same problem occurs. I overclocked my processor (C2D E6420) to 2.6 ghz, but the same thing happens:

My CPU is pegged at 100% and won't let up for a second when TMT is running. Any suggestions?

The second I double click on the TMT icon, my CPU spikes. It won't quit spiking until I restart my computer. If the Radeon doesn't perform much better (if any) than the GeForce for Blu-Ray, do you think my best bet would be to upgrade my CPU?

The spiking is very weird. I tried it with the discs "21" and "Smart People" and got the exact same result every time.

You have to fix the spike problem. 2.6GHz is fast enough, upgrading CPU won't fix it. Doesn't uninstalling both driver and TMT then reinstalling them fix the problem? Have you tried PowerDVD (the trial version is fully functional)? The last resort may be clean reinstall OS.
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post #3503 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 06:43 PM
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so you recommend these instead of what I proposed?

Thanks
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post #3504 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 06:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zammeran View Post

so you recommend these instead of what I proposed?

Depends on your needs (LPT, 7.1 LPCM etc.).
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post #3505 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 08:09 PM
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First, terrific guide. Thanks.

I have some questions. :P

Is PAP required to bitstream DTS-MA/DTHD for rips/m2ts without AACS? If the stream is not protected, I suppose output untouched LPCM or bitstream should be doable without PAP given a proper software player?

Is bitstream possible for other containers such as TS or mkv?

If I don't care about GPU/hardware assisted video decoding,a quad core Intel cpu should be able to handle 100% of the bluray today?

Does smooth output 1080p23.97/24/25/30 or 1080i50/60 have anything to do with decoding or just a issue of communication between software and IGP HDMI drivers?

HDPLEX
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post #3506 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 09:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lymzy View Post

Is PAP required to bitstream DTS-MA/DTHD for rips/m2ts without AACS? If the stream is not protected, I suppose output untouched LPCM or bitstream should be doable without PAP given a proper software player?

Is bitstream possible for other containers such as TS or mkv?

If I don't care about GPU/hardware assisted video decoding,a quad core Intel cpu should be able to handle 100% of the bluray today?

Does smooth output 1080p23.97/24/25/30 or 1080i50/60 have anything to do with decoding or just a issue of communication between software and IGP HDMI drivers?

First, there is no player that bitstreams TrueHD/DTS-HD MA, AACS or non-AACS. Second every player downsamples audio to 16bit/48kHz, AACS or non-AACS. (The only exception is TMT bundled with Xonar HDAV1.3.) Third, bistreaming TrueHD/DTS-HD MA requires a proprietary interface, not supplied by Windows, according to CyberLink. So discussing bitsreaming these formats is almost meaningless right now.

A quad-core, or even a dual-core of higher clock, can handle BD without HA.

Smooth playback of 1080p/24 does not depend on decoding (easy), but on player, driver, OS etc.
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post #3507 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

First, there is no player that bitstreams TrueHD/DTS-HD MA, AACS or non-AACS. Second every player downsamples audio to 16bit/48kHz, AACS or non-AACS. (The only exception is TMT bundled with Xonar HDAV1.3.) Third, bistreaming TrueHD/DTS-HD MA requires a proprietary interface, not supplied by Windows, according to CyberLink. So discussing bitsreaming these formats is almost meaningless right now.

A quad-core, or even a dual-core of higher clock, can handle BD without HA.

Smooth playback of 1080p/24 does not depend on decoding (easy), but on player, driver, OS etc.



Thanks for the swift reply.

So the hardware is ready, what lacking is the software ( decoder, player, driver, and OS).


Why current player would downmix to 48khz/16bit for unprotected stream/container is beyond me.

HDPLEX
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post #3508 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 11:10 PM
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Because they are on to us and know there is no such thing as a "protected" stream anymore (if there ever was)?

(Still, I don't see why they'd let themselves get locked into a license agreement like that for unprotected material. Seems weird to me.)

I do not speak officially in any sense for
Intel Corp., Technology Manufacturing Group
but I do work there.
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post #3509 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by archibael View Post

Because they are on to us and know there is no such thing as a "protected" stream anymore (if there ever was)?

(Still, I don't see why they'd let themselves get locked into a license agreement like that for unprotected material. Seems weird to me.)


Is it that hard to write a third party driver for bitstream?

I am still using a SoC 8635 based HDMI 1.3 streamer. It seems to me I have to wait at least another year for them to sort this mess out on the HTPC.
Things really have not changed much from a year ago.

HDPLEX
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post #3510 of 19195 Old 09-23-2008, 11:48 PM
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Here is a picture of S14V. The main difference between S16V and S14V is that PSU is vertically laid in S16V so that there is more space for a ATX mb. I am not sure if Zipang fits or not.

Here is a picture of a S16V case. This mobo is fitted with a Ninja Mini CPU cooler. I cannot find the answer.
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