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post #91 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 11:34 AM
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I don't know about Win 7 Media Center, but Vista could control an IR blaster to allow use of DIsh/DirectTV.

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post #92 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by RSaunders View Post

I've been a mostly happy ReplayTV user for ages. My three lifetime boxes have survived all the ups and downs. Old as they are they provide a much better DVR experience than the Comcast or FIOS DVRs that I can get from my local cable companies. Given the long sad tale going on over in the shutdown thread, I'd like to start a different discussion.

What's the right solution in a post-DNNA world?

Choices I've heard:

A = Use WIRNS and Schedules Direct ($) to go into the electronic program guide business myself with an old Windows PC. This may or may not work when the DNNA activation and time servers go down, but at least we'll be able to talk about activation on the AVS forum once it's no longer theft.

B = Switch to SageTV, or MythTV, or some other PC hardware/software PVR.

Pro's of A = Keep using ReplayTV hardware, IR control of cable box, good GUI
Con's of A = Might not be possible, it's getting hard to find HDDs, ...

Pro's of B = New supplier might be good
Con's of B = New supplier might be bad (like Comcast/Scientific Atlanta and Verizon FIOS/Motorola)

Surely the great hive mind that is the AVS Forum can outline the real options and pros/cons. I use my ReplayTVs is a traditional way, I record seasons of shows and watch them later because I only have limited time to watch TV, I'm not attentive enough to track all the schedule changes, and I like to ship commercials. I'm not burning shows to DVD or sharing them across my home LAN. I have space in my audio/visual cabinets for a ReplayTV set top box, and hardwired LAN connections. My cable could be HD via HDMI, but frankly I find SD from clean analog is adequate for most TV. I've got a nice little rack of computer stuff in the basement, and 1 or 4 more PCs could have a happy home there. I probably can't sell the wife a keyboard in the Living Room.

Thanx in advance.

With release of the time key yesterday, replay just became the most cost effective recording device available. Barring a really nasty unrecoverable HD failure - where one couldn't transfer to "the next drive", your existing boxes may be good to go for 2030.

We'll be adding HD recording capabilities here soon - but our Replays stay. One of the best investments we ever made. Very difficult to beat.
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post #93 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 09:01 PM
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Ok.
So
We can keep our replays running, use WIRNS and DVarchive to serve shows. This is great news.
To migrate to HD, what... I want to ADD tech, without rip and replace.

Using my satellite boxes (DISH), I see Media Center / MediaPortal as an option. With the dish boxes my only "capture" device is the Hauppage Colosus or HDpvr. Both are recognized as tuners on Win7....

So, if I add something like this, I'd need to use Wreck's batch file in some way to convert the HD to "replay medium Q" and dump it into a dvarchive for the replay TV's to see it...

OR, I rip and replace.
If I do that, I'd preferably build one Host server - and use clients to watch live/pause live / view recorded TV...

Arrgh.
Replay has done so well for me - with 5 units,and 2 spares...
But what to do!
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post #94 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 09:11 PM
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Ya, tough call. By the time I finish this project the Replays will probably be revived!

I've not been able to get Comm Skip to work, so just dumped Win7 and the SSD, tried to setup the 5.5TB Raid as the sole drive but the mobo won't allow a single volume over 2TB to be bootable, soooo, back to SSD, and a clean install of Win7pro 64bit, then add tuners, then add cable card, verify everything and finally add commercial skip following instructions carefully.

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post #95 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChampaignWalt View Post

nope, it won't work with directv or Dish

Depends on what your "tuner" is - The Hauppage Colossus or HD Pvr will do it - they're recognized by WMC now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Rempalski View Post

Ya, tough call. By the time I finish this project the Replays will probably be revived!

I've not been able to get Comm Skip to work, so just dumped Win7 and the SSD, tried to setup the 5.5TB Raid as the sole drive but the mobo won't allow a single volume over 2TB to be bootable, soooo, back to SSD, and a clean install of Win7pro 64bit, then add tuners, then add cable card, verify everything and finally add commercial skip following instructions carefully.

No chance the SSD is your problem....
It's probably the installation order of the apps you are using.
Have you looked at mediaPortal?... a possible alternative...
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post #96 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 09:21 PM
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No the SSD was not related, I had changed most of the default folders in DTB and ShowAnalyzer and they just wouldn't work, I was not able to un-install DTB, so rather than waste more time I decided to re-install the OS and be more carefull, loading only essential apps first.

While I was at it, I thought I'd use the SSD elsewhere as I won't really need super fast booting in a TV applance that will stay on all the time, but that was also a no go so I put it back.

Edit - Media Portal looks cool but I don't think it will support a Ceton4 CableCard quad tuner, so no HD I think.

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post #97 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigjohns View Post

Depends on what your "tuner" is - The Hauppage Colossus or HD Pvr will do it - they're recognized by WMC now.



No chance the SSD is your problem....
It's probably the installation order of the apps you are using.
Have you looked at mediaPortal?... a possible alternative...

I thought we were talking about the ceton 4 tuner cablecard

I started with a 3060. Later sold it and replaced it with a 4k and later added 2 5k units. Still love 'em and am resisting HD.
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post #98 of 262 Old 07-07-2011, 09:59 PM
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Colossus is a decent HD capture device but not really there yet for DVR automation. Last I heard it still needs a total reboot every 13 hours or so... crashes. HD PVR is probably worse than that.

Ed, you know you are having great fun playing with toys. If you ever get tired of playing you can surely go back to the Replays.

Likely the biggest drawback to the cetons is when they hork on your DRM machine key (which seems to be the default behavior) you loose all those recordings forever. So you don't want to leave any DRM'd recordings on there for long. Any TiVo HD is probably a safer HD capture device for cablecard. You offload/unwrap the files and then process for commercial advance and/or archive. For the recordings flagged "do not move" I think you can use some other tool. But I better not get in over my head talking TiVo or BrettStah will come crashing in here to correct me.
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post #99 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 12:02 AM
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Hi Ken, 11 years later and you are still biting ankles! Yes, I like to play, but my head hurts right now, I wish I had a better handle on DTB's folder structure relationship with 7MC and ShowAnalyzer...

I'm OK with the occasional loss of TV (but all eggs in this big basket would hurt more than a single Replay crash). I almost never offload TV content for anything, we just collect and watch in spurts. I chose a raid volume for the TV content hoping that a single drive failure wouldn't mess with the DRM.

Does the Ceton just flake randomly and trash everything, or does it need to be provoked in some way to do this nasty thing??

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post #100 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 04:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Doyle View Post

We'll be adding HD recording capabilities here soon - but our Replays stay. One of the best investments we ever made. Very difficult to beat.

If you don't care about HD, sure. But that's what made them obsolete in my house. Tivos or WMC are a better solution now.
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post #101 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 05:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigjohns View Post

Ok.
So
We can keep our replays running, use WIRNS and DVarchive to serve shows. This is great news.
To migrate to HD, what... I want to ADD tech, without rip and replace.

Using my satellite boxes (DISH), I see Media Center / MediaPortal as an option. With the dish boxes my only "capture" device is the Hauppage Colosus or HDpvr. Both are recognized as tuners on Win7....

So, if I add something like this, I'd need to use Wreck's batch file in some way to convert the HD to "replay medium Q" and dump it into a dvarchive for the replay TV's to see it...

OR, I rip and replace.
If I do that, I'd preferably build one Host server - and use clients to watch live/pause live / view recorded TV...

Arrgh.
Replay has done so well for me - with 5 units,and 2 spares...
But what to do!

I wish there was some easy way to merge those .xml and mpeg2 files into a single mkv. I'm past 10,000 replay recordings now and cringe when I throw away those xml files. They would have been useful
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post #102 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 06:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Rempalski View Post

...I'm OK with the occasional loss of TV (but all eggs in this big basket would hurt more than a single Replay crash). I almost never offload TV content for anything, we just collect and watch in spurts. I chose a raid volume for the TV content hoping that a single drive failure wouldn't mess with the DRM.

Does the Ceton just flake randomly and trash everything, or does it need to be provoked in some way to do this nasty thing??

Either/and/or...I was following that closely when they were released and it was about every other post then. But the all-eggs-in-one-basket concept is the same today. It's not simply missed recordings when it crashes, it's risking all the locked recordings at all times. You'd think raid would be safe but something as innocuous as windows update or a bad driver can bring the whole thing down. As you are seeing now it's designed with a hair trigger. That's why you never use windows update on a *working* HTPC scenario without testing first on an identical image and of course you don't use that boot for anything else where you'd need to keep it up to date or install random software.

The good news is the eggs most at risk are only the locked down recordings and it shouldn't affect those from the other tuners. It could be your important channels aren't locked now but even if they aren't don't get too comfortable because the cableco can (and does) change flags at will, sometimes in error. OTA tuners are less prone to errant flags. But that's why I think the whole ceton thing is a bad idea from the start. TiVo has some of the flag problems but they have worked hard to avoid the nuke-all-user-recordings-every-other-month scenarios, and there is always good hacking going on in the underground to retain more control of things.

Ed if you look at all the hoops you are jumping through now with your technical expertise (and top notch hardware) you can see why the media center thing just not for the masses as a serious TV recording platform.
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post #103 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenL View Post

Colossus is a decent HD capture device but not really there yet for DVR automation. Last I heard it still needs a total reboot every 13 hours or so... crashes. HD PVR is probably worse than that.

Ed, you know you are having great fun playing with toys. If you ever get tired of playing you can surely go back to the Replays.

Likely the biggest drawback to the cetons is when they hork on your DRM machine key (which seems to be the default behavior) you loose all those recordings forever. So you don't want to leave any DRM'd recordings on there for long. Any TiVo HD is probably a safer HD capture device for cablecard. You offload/unwrap the files and then process for commercial advance and/or archive. For the recordings flagged "do not move" I think you can use some other tool. But I better not get in over my head talking TiVo or BrettStah will come crashing in here to correct me.

Ken - where are you getting that cool info?
I need to have SOMETHING that tunes /captures from my DISH boxes. I'll NEVER give COMCAST another dollar, willingly.
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post #104 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigjohns View Post

Ken - where are you getting that cool info?
I need to have SOMETHING that tunes /captures from my DISH boxes. I'll NEVER give COMCAST another dollar, willingly.

Well Colossus will be it. And (shhhh!) if you use the original driver you can still capture HDMI from the Dish boxes at this point, even playback/capture HD recordings with HDMI. The only reason I know is because I was just getting ready to get my Colossus when we first found out about the end-of-days.

You can read all about it in the Forums here and a few other specialized forums linked from those. I've followed the HD pvr since it came out and never got one because of the flimsy plastic hardware with a few ongoing USB/thermal/driver issues. I've been waiting for the Colossus since it was first announced. Of course in using that special driver it has the bug where it will crash hard (something like that) after 13 hours of recording or buffering.

The reason I need it is I have literally terrabyte after terrabyte of encrypted HD Dish recordings that depend on my dish account household key and those do go belly up on rare occasions. Luckily mine hasn't had a hitch in 4 years... unlike those cetons. But I can play those files on any (compatible) dish recorder on my account. I maintain the internal drive on my ViP722 much like the replays so I'm still on my original 722. Most of that huge archive is unremarkable like unwatched whole seasons of shows I will never watch but there are some gems in there I've collected and I need to offload. I've recorded plenty to replays but I really need the HD files as well, thus a Colossus. I already put together a hexacore box with the full height slot just for the Colossus but haven't gotten started yet with my big capture project.

So yep Colossus is what you want, but I really see it more for just offloading (decrypting) true keeper HD files (from all my various HD recorders) since my 722 already has unlimited encrypted storage which is organized well.

In the meantime the Replays should still do their current job we know and love so well.
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post #105 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 06:53 PM
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post #106 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 07:06 PM
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With the external storage feature. Plug in the drive send the files there. You can use an unlimited number of external drives.
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post #107 of 262 Old 07-08-2011, 10:27 PM
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So much fun! The cable guy came, we dropped in the M-Card into the Ceton4. It fired up pretty easily and the HD looks very good. I was able to record 4 HD shows at once, plus 4 analog channels at the same time.

Issues,

1 - I have a small display in the equip room, connected to the mobo's DVI out and the HDMI Port to the TV. Both outputs are set to 1080P/Mirror so both see the same thing. Works great till you try to watch any HD content. TV then has blank screen with "display doesn't support content protection or similar garbage... Pulled the DVI cable, made the TV primary display and everything was OK. So now I need a way to split this dumb a$$ video so both displays will pass HDCP.

2-While the Ceton can record 4 HD streams, the cable co. is using "switched video" on some channels (like 100 out of 400). Apparently the non-mainstream channels (like food network HD?) are basically not streamed continiously. This switched system basically pipes you those channels only when you tune to them, this saves a bunch of bandwidth. The bare Ceton gives a blank screen when tuned to one of these channels, but they seem random by their distribution. This means that another box is required (looks like a cable modem) connects to the cable, and plugs into the computer's USB port. Now when the Media center tunes to one of those switched channels, this new box transmits the request up the cable. It all works pretty magically. Some of these boxes support only 2 streams, so I may need 2 of them to record 4 switched streams at once.

So much closer to done but a few more bits to work out, I have to say that the media center interface is not bad at all when used with a remote.

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post #108 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 05:21 AM
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Actually this is the fun part of new toys.

2)The tuning adapter(s) should be easy... except for when they crash and also need to be rebooted. That should be somewhat rare though.

1) Wonder if that may be some indication of what the protection flags are on your channels? Nah, I'm sure M$ enforces inconvenience on anything media and HD.

But next will be to check those protection flags before you do a lot of recording. And convert those *protected* files right away to something else you can still at least view after the next time you have to start over from scratch.
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post #109 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 07:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenL View Post

1) Wonder if that may be some indication of what the protection flags are on your channels? Nah, I'm sure M$ enforces inconvenience on anything media and HD.

Nah, I'm sure MS doesn't enforce inconvenience like that.

How am I sure? I know--because I have and use a 7MC setup.

It's amazing the FUD that's thrown about in an otherwise reliable place like this.
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post #110 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 08:10 AM
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...It's amazing the FUD that's thrown about in an otherwise reliable place like this.

I think you mean this and dozens other posts like that?

It means we are apparently relevant again (in the new iconic era) to have trolls roaming through obsessed with trashing Replays night and day while pushing some other product.

We've seen it all before although perhaps BrettStah was right about everything except he didn't know it from actually using a Replay.
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post #111 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 08:45 AM
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Nobody is "trashing" Replays.

Some, on the other hand, seem dedicated to trashing anything Microsoft--even the good stuff that actually works--by way of making FUD claims despite having no knowledge of the product itself.
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post #112 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 09:31 AM
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Zot - Bam - Pow... got that out of your systems?, I love Replays, but this thread is about viable plan B's, back to buisness.

I'm finding 7MC really nice to use, live channel changing is pretty quick compared to Replays and Cable Box, guide scrolling is bullet fast.

These switched adapters are interesting. They are motorola boxes and seem re-sync very fast when I pull the plug or disconnect the cable. Next test is to determine if I need 2 of them to record 4 switched channels at once or if one can handle it. My Cox cable folks don't know anything about this setup, they told me that their M-card was only 2 channel streams, but I can record 4 HD Channels (the full streaming, unswitched ones). The Ceton manual expressly spells out NOT to use the R/F pass thru on the switch adapter, and that many adapters only handle 2 streams, hence 2 adapters.

BUT, my biggest issue now is how to get fully functional mirrored video to the TV and PC Display. If I un-plug the TV and just use the PC Display on DVI output, I can do everything except watch any flagged digital channels, which seems to be most of them, but not all.

Are there HDCP HDMI Splitters? Maybe get one of those and a new small PC display with HDMI input and drive both screens that way??? Has anyone split an HDMI signal with HDCP and drove two displays???

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post #113 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 09:32 AM
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I'm kind of dissappointed BrettStah didn't see fit to come back and gloat.

He stopped relentlessly trashing replays mid 2004. By 2005 looks like he must have lost those DirectTiVo's in the hurricane (?) so then he trashed Cox Cable for while as he likely drooled over the Series 3 (?) then he apparently went with vanilla DirectTV HD with no TiVo in the house(?) Wow.

For those who don't remember or weren't around the typical BrettStah post padding spree went something like this and much like with adam1991 this was all taking place in ReplayTV & Showstopper PVRs.

He always had to *correct* any FUD or misinformation (anywhere on the web) about TiVo. (any reference which wasn't a gushing endorsement)

Hmmm so BrettStah disappears about the same time adam1991 trails in... scratches head...
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post #114 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Rempalski View Post

...I can do everything except watch any flagged digital channels, which seems to be most of them, but not all.

Yeh sorry Ed (BTW I have been using Media Center for years for everything but recording TV and have seen plenty of the gotcha's... CableLabs takes that to a whole new extreme)

But that sure looks like some clue just as I suspected when it displays some channels but not others.
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post #115 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Rempalski View Post
BUT, my biggest issue now is how to get fully functional mirrored video to the TV and PC Display. If I un-plug the TV and just use the PC Display on DVI output, I can do everything except watch any flagged digital channels, which seems to be most of them, but not all.
Isn't the DRM designed to prevent exactly what you want to do: view "protected" contact on a non-registered "insecure" DVI based display?

You may have no choice but to get a HDMI monitor in order to display DRM protected stuff.

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post #116 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Reden View Post
Isn't the DRM designed to prevent exactly what you want to do: view "protected" contact on a non-registered "insecure" DVI based display?

You may have no choice but to get a HDMI monitor in order to display DRM protected stuff.

Robert
What about using an analog monitor?
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post #117 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenL View Post
With the external storage feature. Plug in the drive send the files there. You can use an unlimited number of external drives.
I thought Dish charged $15 per drive to activate them?

I could do "dish dvr" if their scheduler posessed even a little show intelligence and you could watch from room to room...

but my media center project starts today...
Experiment 1:
MSI G41Tm mother board and a Gen1 Core2Duo chip, 2gb ram, and a Hauppauge HD PVR...

Anyone know off the top of your head:
1 - can you put PCIe 1x devices in PCIe 16 slots if you have extra 16 slots?
2 - any audio cards that have Optical audio INPUT?

John
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post #118 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by KenL View Post
I'm kind of dissappointed BrettStah didn't see fit to come back and gloat.

He stopped relentlessly trashing replays mid 2004. By 2005 looks like he must have lost those DirectTiVo's in the hurricane (?) so then he trashed Cox Cable for while as he likely drooled over the Series 3 (?) then he apparently went with vanilla DirectTV HD with no TiVo in the house(?) Wow.

For those who don't remember or weren't around the typical BrettStah post padding spree went something like this and much like with adam1991 this was all taking place in ReplayTV & Showstopper PVRs.

He always had to *correct* any FUD or misinformation (anywhere on the web) about TiVo. (any reference which wasn't a gushing endorsement)

Hmmm so BrettStah disappears about the same time adam1991 trails in... scratches head...
Oh, puh-leeze. Your paranoia is beneath you.

So is your failure/refusal to go back and see my history here...
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post #119 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigjohns View Post

What about using an analog monitor?

I beleive an analog monitor is not permitted for DRM controlled content. It's called the "analog hole" and they insisted it be plugged.

For a system to be approved for cablecard, it must be DRM locked all the way to the display. That's why only certain closed systems can be used with DRM locked cablecards.

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post #120 of 262 Old 07-09-2011, 08:35 PM
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Progress!

I found that the Intel mobo integrated graphics (DVI-D and HDMI) each work just fine with "protected" content IF used seperately. As soon as you connect both HDMI and DVI to their respective displays, the Mobo shifts the DVI output to DVI-Analog (no longer "safe" for DRM) and with both screens set to be Mirrors of the same screen they both now fail.

The solution was to return the PC display and get another that accepts HDMI 1080p. Then I got an active HDMI splitter (that supports HDCP) and connect only the PC's HDMI to the splitter and the TV and PC display from there. Now picture and sound are mirrored and all is good. Of course in honor of making this the fun project it's been, I had to get a DOA splitter from Frys the first time and got to spend time with the return line crowd... only to get "sorry sir, we don't have any more", really? I walked the guy to the isle and pointed to the units on the shelf, problem solved...

I torture tested the Tuners, and found that the Switch adapter (aka MTR 700 per the cable guy) supports 4 simultaneous streams to be recorded. I recorded 8 shows at once and tried exceeding the tuner count, MC politely lets you know and gives choices on what to dump.

Next stop is to setup an X-Box extender and also take another stab at loading the commercial skipping plug-in's.

Still a project but I'm pretty happy so far.

"Beneath the surface of the mud...... there's more mud still.......Surprise" -- CSN
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