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Old 07-16-2011, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by ChampaignWalt View Post
I'm not expert on things like this but can't you just change the windows host file on the wirns box and point the production urls back to the wirns box.
Yeah, I thought about that but I am still using DNNA data with WiRNS (not using Schedules Direct yet) so WiRNS still needs to know how to get to the real servers.

So I need to somehow change the IP address and port that a HTTP GET goes to, but without changing the domain name (it still has to be a *.replaytv.net domain so that WiRNS can recognize it.)

I'm not sure how to go about doing that using LWP in Perl. I was trying to cheat and use a proxy, but it is not working for some reason.

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Old 07-16-2011, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Space View Post
Yeah, I thought about that but I am still using DNNA data with WiRNS (not using Schedules Direct yet) so WiRNS still needs to know how to get to the real servers.

So I need to somehow change the IP address and port that a HTTP GET goes to, but without changing the domain name (it still has to be a *.replaytv.net domain so that WiRNS can recognize it.)

I'm not sure how to go about doing that using LWP in Perl. I was trying to cheat and use a proxy, but it is not working for some reason.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but if you do a net connect to wirns, doesn't wirns already have the program schedule? You can undo the host file change every few days to keep your schedule data is up to date while you test your code. If it works, you could just switch over to Schedules Direct and call it a day because you'll no longer be dependant on the mothership.

I started with a 3060. Later sold it and replaced it with a 4k and later added 2 5k units. Still love 'em and am resisting HD.
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Old 07-16-2011, 08:56 PM
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I could, but I'm not ready for that yet since I still have to proxy the Login.pl and Logout.pl (I am sure they are easy to spoof, but I don't have the time right now to do any more testing/coding).

For now, I'll just wait to see if any Perl guys can offer any tips for me to go further (TD may have some ideas).

Unfortunately next week I will have very little time to do anything with this stuff, so it would probably take someone with good Perl knowledge to come up with some solutions to my problems before I would be able to do anything in the limited time I will have next week.

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Old 07-16-2011, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Space View Post
I don't think I saw anyone respond to this, so here is my response...

I just signed an authctrl file with the universal key (k=0) using the authsign.pl script (by uncommenting the k==0 code in RPTVSign.pm).

I used this with WiRNS on one of my Replays, and it seemed to take it fine. It now says "Authorized forever" and I get no nag screen when exiting Replay Zones. I assume I will not get the nag screens on ReplayGuide and ChannelGuide as well (when 24 hours rolls around).

So it looks like using the universal key with the ReplayTV will work!

Here is the authctrl file I used, you can see that ValidSig2 contains the precious *** Signature Key *** right out in the open .
Code:
regedit setstr SysConfig/AuthCtl ValidSig2 "00000010000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000010000001000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001f0d76d2730d42e380abee0d7dde2711e95f1f3c5f2f47"
Thanks for checking that. I figured it would work, but the proof of the pudding...

Maybe this will become the preferred signature since it's the simpler to use and there is no use for anything else that I can think of (the hash function will "detect" errors).

-Chris

2974247646523704746118934872007814844268287238137130823, don't tell anyone!

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for you're a long time dead."
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Old 07-17-2011, 12:27 AM
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As far as I know, all these messages use the RNS protocol, which is built on top of HTTP which is built on top of TCP.

TCP already has a checksum to detect transmission errors, although it may not be as strong as more modern techniques.

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Old 07-17-2011, 11:14 AM
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Attached are two very simple perl scripts that generate the responses for getca4.pl and vtime2.pl, "generating" an EG signature with k=0; e.g., a trivial response. Note that:

For vtime2.pl, the response is a constant; trivial-vtime.pl just prints that constant.

For getca4.pl, the response is a constant for each individual ReplayTV. trivial-auth.pl computes that response given the args to the getca4.pl GET request (similarly to how 'authsign.pl' worked).

I've tested these both -- they successfully kept the ReplayTV activated. I hooked them up to my RTV-Proxy.pl script with this change
Code:
  if ($request->uri =~ /\\/vtime2.pl/) {
        my $res = HTTP::Response->new(200, "OK");
        warn "faking vtime2.pl for ".$request->url;
        my @cmd = ('./trivial-vtime.pl', q(').$request->url.q('));
        my $auth = `@cmd`;
        $res->header("Connection" => "close");
        $res->header("Content-Type" => 'appplication/vnd.replay.time');
        $res->content($auth);
        return $res;
  }
  if ($request->uri =~ /\\/getca4.pl/) {
        my $res = HTTP::Response->new(200, "OK");
        warn "faking getca4.pl for ".$request->url;
        my @cmd = ('./trivial-auth.pl', q(').$request->url.q('));
        my $auth = `@cmd`;
#        warn "auth cmds >>>".$auth."<<<";
        $res->header("Connection" => "close");
        $res->content($auth);
        return $res;
  }

 

trivial2.zip 1.43359375k . file
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Old 07-17-2011, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

I've tested these both -- they successfully kept the ReplayTV activated.

Actually, I had accidentally changed the order of the regedit commands to not match the value in the parenthesized string used to calculate AuthCtl -- and my unit's activation was disabled. With the fixed version (in the zip above), my unit is now activated again... thus I have high confidence this works.
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Old 07-17-2011, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

Attached are two very simple perl scripts that generate the responses for getca4.pl and vtime2.pl, "generating" an EG signature with k=0; e.g., a trivial response. Note that:

For vtime2.pl, the response is a constant; trivial-vtime.pl just prints that constant.

For getca4.pl, the response is a constant for each individual ReplayTV. trivial-auth.pl computes that response given the args to the getca4.pl GET request (similarly to how 'authsign.pl' worked).

I've tested these both -- they successfully kept the ReplayTV activated. I hooked them up to my RTV-Proxy.pl script...

I would like to try running a script similar to your RTV-Proxy.pl script, as a service in Linux (VBox) running as a guest on a Windows host that is running a WiRNS server that gets guide data from Schedules Direct. The Replays currently get DNS from the WiRNS machine.

The basic idea is to redirect the Replays to the guest's IP for DNS, and have the guest machine's script provide all the signed responses, passing the other requests along to the WiRNS machine. Hopefully, this keeps everything in house.

I am not clear precisely which parts of the script (besides the two "trivial...pl" script calls) need to be altered to achieve what I want. (My Perl experience is pretty limited, although I have managed to modify a couple of scripts in the past.)

the script surely shouldn't need to look for replaytv IPs, as those will soon disappear. When would absolute IP URLs ever appear?

It appears parts of the proxy script are written for specific RTVs. Am I reading that correctly? Do I need that section?
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Old 07-17-2011, 07:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

Attached are two very simple perl scripts that generate the responses for getca4.pl and vtime2.pl, "generating" an EG signature with k=0; e.g., a trivial response. Note that:

For vtime2.pl, the response is a constant; trivial-vtime.pl just prints that constant.

For getca4.pl, the response is a constant for each individual ReplayTV. trivial-auth.pl computes that response given the args to the getca4.pl GET request (similarly to how 'authsign.pl' worked).

...
[/code]

Nice work. Thanks.
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Old 07-17-2011, 08:18 PM
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Nice, jlv, I'll try to take a look at your scripts when I get a chance (very busy this week).

Anyway, you say the vtime2.pl works, however I am not sure if you tested it properly. Please see this message to understand how vtime2.pl works. It may be hard to test it is working without coming up with a way to either create a NTP server that gives out incorrect times, or a way to otherwise alter the clock manually.

I assume you don't need to me send you a copy of my script anymore since it seems like you made the same trivial changes that I did.

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Old 07-17-2011, 08:27 PM
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I think there is a road block to getting the WiRNS 2.1 & Perl script front-end working.

It looks like WiRNS 2.1 only supports Replays communicating with it on the primary port. If I send a Replay looking URL to the secondary port, it just times out and there is no logging on WiRNS. You can not change the primary port on WiRNS (if you do it just sets it back to 80 after a restart).

So unless someone can find a way around this hurdle (using two separate IPs or machines would probably work, but to be honest, I don't want to do that), I think this solution will not work.

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Old 07-17-2011, 08:33 PM
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how about using your router as the target ip address (using your external IP -- not your NAT) and then use port forwarding to bounce it back to your wirns machine to the port of your choice?

I started with a 3060. Later sold it and replaced it with a 4k and later added 2 5k units. Still love 'em and am resisting HD.
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

For vtime2.pl, the response is a constant; trivial-vtime.pl just prints that constant.

I know I am showing my ignorance of digital signatures here, but how can this be a constant if a unique time and random characters are part of the hash used to compute the signature? I am guessing it has something to do with k=0, but don't really understand why that makes the hash irrelevant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

I've tested these both -- they successfully kept the ReplayTV activated.

A failure of vtime.pl would not deactivate the Replay (or have any other detectable result other than not adjusting the date/time on the Replay), so I don't think you really tested that the vtime.pl works correctly (see my other post about what vtime.pl does).
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

I hooked them up to my RTV-Proxy.pl script

Can you update the script attached to that post with the changes you made here?

Thanks

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Old 07-17-2011, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by ChampaignWalt View Post

how about using your router as the target ip address (using your external IP -- not your NAT) and then use port forwarding to bounce it back to your wirns machine to the port of your choice?

Haha, you know I actually thought about that already, but in order for that to work, your router needs to support loopback, and I know there are many out there that do not support that (mine doesn't, at least with existing firmware). Plus that is REALLY a hacky way of doing it. I'd rather just ask Henry to allow us to change the primary port in WiRNS.

Look, this work is mostly just for fun, I am sure WiRNS 3.0 is just around the corner, and all our problems will be solved. I am just doing this as a proof of concept thing, and I think it has already been helpful in finding stuff that will help the development of WiRNS (unless they already knew that they could use the "universal key" and not have to do any math at all in WiRNS, assuming jlv is correct that vtime2.pl does truly work).

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Old 07-17-2011, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Space View Post

I think there is a road block to getting the WiRNS 2.1 & Perl script front-end working.

If you are using WiRNS, I don't see why you'd want to use a separate Perl script. It should be trivial now to produce a WiRNS plugin that handles getca4.pl and vtime2.pl.

(I am guessing Henry is working on this, but he's very evasive when I ask him about it.)
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Space View Post

It may be hard to test it is working without coming up with a way to either create a NTP server that gives out incorrect times, or a way to otherwise alter the clock manually.

I run my own NTP server for the inside of my network... It's not hard to test at all.
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Old 07-17-2011, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

I know I am showing my ignorance of digital signatures here, but how can this be a constant if a unique time and random characters are part of the hash used to compute the signature? I am guessing it has something to do with k=0, but don't really understand why that makes the hash irrelevant.

From the wiki, about the vtime2.pl response:
Quote:


The response has content type application/vnd.replay.vtime; it's actually the raw binary form of an elgemal signature (as used for FileVerification) of the md5hash of the time argument and the r argument, concatentated.

The only thing in the response is the EG signature, and when you use k=0, the EG signature is a constant. You still need to know the private key to generate this constant (and we know it!).
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Old 07-17-2011, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by jlv View Post

It should be trivial now to produce a WiRNS plugin that handles getca4.pl and vtime2.pl.

I can't find any documentation on what the plugin interface is, but I found the source that j.m. posted for the NoSoftwareUpdates plugin. It looks simple to do, but two trivial plugins would be required - one for vtime2.pl, and one for getca4.pl.
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Old 07-17-2011, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by jlv View Post

I run my own NTP server for the inside of my network... It's not hard to test at all.

Ah, cool! Can you describe a little about how you tested? Did you just set the NTP server to the wrong time, then just had the Replay update the time from that server and you saw the wrong time on the Replay?
Quote:
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From the wiki, about the vtime2.pl response:The only thing in the response is the EG signature, and when you use k=0, the EG signature is a constant. You still need to know the private key to generate this constant (and we know it!).

I think what you are saying is that normally (like in the getca4.pl response) both the hash and the signature are returned and verified (so the hash has to be correct), but for the response to vtime2.pl, the hash is not returned to (or expected by) the Replay, so the only important thing is the signature, and that is now a constant because of k=0.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

I can't find any documentation on what the plugin interface is, but I found the source that j.m. posted for the NoSoftwareUpdates plugin. It looks simple to do, but two trivial plugins would be required - one for vtime2.pl, and one for getca4.pl.

Also, the trivial login.pl and logout.pl need to be handled without proxying to DNNA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

(I am guessing Henry is working on this, but he's very evasive when I ask him about it.)

Yes, I've noticed that he is reluctant to talk about it, I am not sure why. I know he was looking for a 64-bit Windows beecrypt DLL, which I think, if I correctly understand what you have been saying here, should no longer be necessary to get this working in WiRNS (or LaHo, for that matter, which Henry knows NOTHING about )

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Old 07-17-2011, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

Look, this work is mostly just for fun, I am sure WiRNS 3.0 is just around the corner, and all our problems will be solved. I am just doing this as a proof of concept thing, and I think it has already been helpful in finding stuff that will help the development of WiRNS (unless they already knew that they could use the "universal key" and not have to do any math at all in WiRNS, assuming jlv is correct that vtime2.pl does truly work).


I pretty much thought that was the case that this is a "proof of concept, tinkering, let me see if I can get this to work" sort of thing. I thought my suggestion would fit in quite well.

I started with a 3060. Later sold it and replaced it with a 4k and later added 2 5k units. Still love 'em and am resisting HD.
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Old 07-17-2011, 11:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

I know he was looking for a 64-bit Windows beecrypt DLL, which I think, if I correctly understand what you have been saying here, should no longer be necessary to get this working in WiRNS (or LaHo, for that matter, which Henry knows NOTHING about )

Henry now has both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of BeeCrypt 4.2.1 DLLs (for Windows, obviously) -- I sent them to him today. And of course, they are not really needed, but possibly interesting none the less.

However, in order to get the right hash for the getca4.pl request, you have to get all the details right, or else the hash won't be right. That's why I provided a "reference" implementation in Perl -- any new implementation can be compared with that one to see if it gets the same results.

TD
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Old 07-17-2011, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by ChampaignWalt View Post

I pretty much thought that was the case that this is a "proof of concept, tinkering, let me see if I can get this to work" sort of thing. I thought my suggestion would fit in quite well.

I'm sorry, I think that came off wrong. Thanks for trying to help. I just meant that I was doing this because I didn't think it would be too difficult and no one else seemed to be doing it (although it was mentioned by t.d., but he did not have the time/setup). Doing the loopback thing would require me to flash my router with new firmware which just makes it that much more complicated.

Anyway, it looks like jlv is looking at making plugins for WiRNS and I am sure that (the sometimes mysterious) Henry will also have a solution for us any day now.

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Old 07-17-2011, 11:56 PM
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If the primary WiRNS 2.1 listening port cannot be changed from 80 to somethings else, then I don't see any practical solution other than binding a second IP address to the NIC -- one for the Perl proxy, and one for WiRNS.

Perhaps WiRNS could be set up to forward the production.replaytv.net requests it does not handle to the Perl proxy, i.e. reverse their order?

TD
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Old 07-18-2011, 12:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t.d. View Post

Henry now has both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of BeeCrypt 4.2.1 DLLs (for Windows, obviously) -- I sent them to him today. And of course, they are not really needed, but possibly interesting none the less.

However, in order to get the right hash for the getca4.pl request, you have to get all the details right, or else the hash won't be right. That's why I provided a "reference" implementation in Perl -- any new implementation can be compared with that one to see if it gets the same results.

TD

TD, I want to thank you for all the fantastic work you have done to get us to this stage; from discovering the signature key, to the documentation of the signed procedures, to the creation of the reference implementation scripts. If it wasn't for you, who knows if DNNA would have released the keys?

So every 4xxx & 5xxx ReplayTV owner who wants to continue to use their machines owes you a debt of gratitude.

Thanks again!!!

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Old 07-18-2011, 12:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t.d. View Post

If the primary WiRNS 2.1 listening port cannot be changed from 80 to somethings else, then I don't see any practical solution other than binding a second IP address to the NIC -- one for the Perl proxy, and one for WiRNS.

Perhaps WiRNS could be set up to forward the production.replaytv.net requests it does not handle to the Perl proxy, i.e. reverse their order?

TD

Yes, I've already mentioned those things here. Callback script(s) (as I called it) would be cool. Although Henry could just add a "vtimecmds" file that is read in similarly to how the "authcmds" file is now, since we now know it can just be a static (although binary) file, although there is not much point.
Just hard coding the vtimecmds in to WiRNS would be the best option.

I am very busy this week anyway, so I guess it is good that I can't proceed. Also, jlv will be looking at making WiRNS plugins, I just wish Henry was less silent on all this, but I am sure he has his reasons...

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Old 07-18-2011, 06:47 AM
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...jlv will be looking at making WiRNS plugins, I just wish Henry was less silent on all this, but I am sure he has his reasons...

If Henry works for "the man" now he may be regretting that non-compete clause.
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Old 07-18-2011, 08:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlv View Post

(I am guessing Henry is working on this, but he's very evasive when I ask him about it.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

Yes, I've noticed that he is reluctant to talk about it, I am not sure why. I know he was looking for a 64-bit Windows beecrypt DLL, which I think, if I correctly understand what you have been saying here, should no longer be necessary to get this working in WiRNS (or LaHo, for that matter, which Henry knows NOTHING about )

Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

Also, jlv will be looking at making WiRNS plugins, I just wish Henry was less silent on all this, but I am sure he has his reasons...

Really, guys?! Have you not read all the posts about lawsuits and angry RTV owners and such?! You really think I want to become involved in all that?! Can you even imagine if I said something about dates and such what would happen if things didn't work out?! Plus, do you think I want to be party to any DNNA or DirecTV action because they are trying to defend themselves?! Heck, you can see that I joined this Forum back in March 2003 when I purchased by very first RTV. Why don't you search and see how many posts I made during that time after I got bawled out for asking something as simple as where to find information on how the RTVs work? I think it took me two years to get over that one! It was fortunate that I found a much calmer crowd over at PlanetReplay or I don't think that y'all would even have me around to be relying on so heavily!

Quote:
Originally Posted by t.d. View Post

Henry now has both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of BeeCrypt 4.2.1 DLLs (for Windows, obviously) -- I sent them to him today. And of course, they are not really needed, but possibly interesting none the less.

Thanks to Tom for providing me that as it saved me a lot of trouble! To be frank, I started on all this about a year ago and already had all my own test software and stuff. And, I'll let you all know that I had things working the weekend after Tom provided me with the key. However, at that time we were still "talking" with DNNA and certainly didn't want to stir the waters. Their making public the key(s) really made a difference. However, we were still "talking" to them. And, that's why WiRNS 2 still proxies to DNNA, even though I was willing to add to serve custom authcmds, which doesn't really change what it does. If I were to change WiRNS 2's vtime2 to return anything that uses the key, then that would change everything (regardless of what y'all think, so I don't want to hear it)...

In addition, if y'all look at the flurry of posts about installing WiRNS on PlanetReplay, you can well imagine that having WiRNS 3 provide vtime2 and getca4 support isn't enough! So, the three WiRNS developers are very hard at work trying to ensure that WiRNS 3 will be the best experience we can provide! Heck, we are the ones that have to support it and try to answer all the support questions! It's a lot to get accomplished in the six weeks that we were given notice!

So, rest assured that WiRNS 3 is in very good shape! I gave y'all the authcmds capability so you could continue with your experiments. If y'all want to make a vtime2 response plugin in the mean time, go for it! The login/logout are completely unnecessary, although you do have to at least respond to them. They don't do anything at all and there's no content in the response. If you have scripts returning vtime2 and getca4 responses, then it couldn't be more trivial to respond to the login and logout...

In the mean time, we really need to devote all our time to getting LaHo working as the people not using WiRNS are depending on that. Since it doesn't involve installation, at least we don't have to worry about that part. But, it has to work quite a bit different than WiRNS in having to provide custom data on demand, so that is a pretty big deal (and I'm not going to comment on it)...

So, we have plans to get a WiRNS 3 beta out just as quickly as possible. Having the BeeCrypt 64-bit DLL was a big deal to us because we really weren't crazy about the fixed constant approach, and we also want to keep things working as they were designed. Although, having to support BeeCrypt is its own can on worms, so we may have to rethink that. For us, having it work the same as DNNA is part of the enjoyment, well at least for me since I was the one who did it! But, I suppose not having to use BeeCrypt at all might be pretty convenient, I'll have to see...

So, I think that's all I'm going to say about it now. I think that if worse comes to worse, that y'all have enough tools to make things work with WiRNS2, making a vtime2 plugin probably wouldn't be all that difficult using j.m's technology as things haven't changed in that regard (and, the WiRNS that he developed it for is posted on SourceForge, so you have that to look at as well). But, barring anything out of the ordinary (and I don't want to jinx myself), I think that Robert's original post of things will be OK should hold up. Y'all really should be thanking him for all the hard work that he's done to make this all come about! He really spearheaded the whole effort even though he wasn't aware of how important the key was (since he has a 3K). But, it truely was his associations that got us a lot of the way to where we are. And, y'all really should thank Ryan, who worked very hard as he did when Zap2It closed up their development access to get us SchedulesDirect approved, for getting us the cooperation that we did! In addition, Glenn has been working the hardest on this whole thing trying to get my code ready for LaHo and trying to work out all the WiRNS installation problems! So, it has been a real team effort, and I just wanted y'all to be aware...

Henry

P.S. I didn't really proof this, so no points off for mistakes!
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Old 07-18-2011, 08:53 AM
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Thanks for the update Henry.

I hope everyone takes a breath, and refrains from jiggling the elbows of the developers. It's enough for me to know (as I already knew) that this was in work.

"Are we there yet, are we there yet, are we there yet?" isn't needed. Just keep reading and we'll know all that there is to know.

Cliff
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Old 07-18-2011, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

I'm sorry, I think that came off wrong. Thanks for trying to help. I just meant that I was doing this because I didn't think it would be too difficult and no one else seemed to be doing it (although it was mentioned by t.d., but he did not have the time/setup). Doing the loopback thing would require me to flash my router with new firmware which just makes it that much more complicated.

Anyway, it looks like jlv is looking at making plugins for WiRNS and I am sure that (the sometimes mysterious) Henry will also have a solution for us any day now.

No need to apologize. My router does loopback, and I've done a little tinkering to see if I could ultimately get rid of the nag screens but I'm clearly not as well versed in this stuff as you or many of the others working to get this all working. I'm just trying to be some help if I can.

Since my router does do loopback perhaps you could have me try it. I have wirns running already and perl installed on that computer. All you need to is give me the idiot-proof steps you'd like to have tested.

(Or we can just wait for wirns 3.0...)

I started with a 3060. Later sold it and replaced it with a 4k and later added 2 5k units. Still love 'em and am resisting HD.
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Old 07-18-2011, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Space View Post

TD, I want to thank you for all the fantastic work you have done to get us to this stage; from discovering the signature key, to the documentation of the signed procedures, to the creation of the reference implementation scripts. If it wasn't for you, who knows if DNNA would have released the keys?

So every 4xxx & 5xxx ReplayTV owner who wants to continue to use their machines owes you a debt of gratitude.

Thanks again!!!

What he said! Thanks!

Henry and everyone else who are working to make it possible for us to continue to use our replays, THANK YOU!

I started with a 3060. Later sold it and replaced it with a 4k and later added 2 5k units. Still love 'em and am resisting HD.
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