Is DNNA Slimming Down Access Lines for Dial-up? - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 76 Old 11-17-2011, 11:32 AM - Thread Starter
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While I do not like the fact there are less dial-in numbers, I do not see it as a means to get rid of users like me. I see it as either cutting back on their costs or something to do with the network being used.

I use old fashioned dial-up because AT&T DSL is somewhat dicey where I live (on the coastal hills above Pacifica, CA) and the other option is the pricey cable option from San Bruno Cable. There are a lot of complaints about SB Cable and no matter what choice I will eventually make, it will end up churning extra fees. This is due to the huge software files that Apple requires to be downloaded (the last major software update was over 800mb). I usually download late at night and use a special software download program to handle it (iGetter, which does quite well).

As for long distance, AT&T's large bill last month made me look into other long distance options. Now I have some choices in that regard to kick AT&T to the curb for long distance service.

Mark
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post #62 of 76 Old 11-19-2011, 07:42 AM
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I've use Vonage with a Panasonic PV-HS2000 ReplayTV ShowStopper for years without any issues. I dial an out of state number because its faster and vonage doesn't charge for long distance.
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post #63 of 76 Old 11-29-2011, 08:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeyboy View Post

For some unknown reason, the alternate numbers don't appear to work. A work around to finding a free Primary number is to go to ]www. earthlink.com[/ and search for their local access numbers applicable to your phone number. You will likely find one or more. Then input that number into your replaytv phone setup as if it was your home phone number. When the replay dials in it will probably find that number and maybe more primary numbers you can select for it to dial into. This is how you can possibly find free numbers for call in!

We used this method years ago and I used it again recently to enable my brothers replays to come up with a free local Primary number.

Dang, I was About to give you a Big Hug.. but, alas, my only two numbers that showed up, seem to connect, but, not getting guide info.. one number is that old number I used for Years.. both are Alt #'s ... my ATT phone bill has been Horrible last two months.. I Must DO something!
any other suggestions? thanks!
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post #64 of 76 Old 11-29-2011, 09:46 PM
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I lost my local alternate number so was forced to use the primary number in San Diego. That was a toll call costing 18cents a minute. Not too bad except I have four showstopper 2000's.(figure about an hour each night!) I called att told them what I had and that they would be calling in each night for about an hour total. The rep said the best thing for me was unlimited long distance. after about two weeks I received a letter from them stating I was using my phone line for dial up internet acess and that was not allowed. I called them and explained that I was using my phone line for my 4 tivo type devices to call in nightly and get their guide info. They said ok never mind. About a month and a half later I tried to make a long distance call and it was intercepted by their "fraud department" I left two messages and then spent another two and a half hours talking to various people in att. I was told by one supervisor that tivos were not allowed to use this service. The following day I finally talked to Nancy from the fraud department and was told tivos were exempt and she unblocked my line. The funny thing was even with my long distance service blocked my boxes (all 4) phoned in nightly for another two weeks after they blocked me. I told Nancy I did not trust att any more and was going to buy a magic jack plus and reconsider keeping my att service. I now have a magic jack plus hooked into my house wireing. I unhooked the phone line coming into the box outside and I now have unlimited long distance paid for 6 years for around $180.00 including the cost of the magic jack plus. My showstoppers have been working great now for a week. I received an automated phone call from att asking how they did with my last contact with them. I gave them very negative feedback and then was asked if I wanted to be contacted by att personally. I replied yes! Well guess what that was last Tues. and I have not heard a thing from them. I would urge anyone who has high speed internet to get a magic jack plus and tell ma bell to keep their long distance service. I will likely keep my land line but cut back to basic service as magic jack will not work in a power outage. I have had a regular magic jack for over two years but you have to keep your computer on for it to work. The new magic jack plus will plug directly into your router once you get it set up on your computer. Sorry for this post being so long!
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post #65 of 76 Old 11-30-2011, 09:29 AM - Thread Starter
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[quote=cajon;21278422]The rep said the best thing for me was unlimited long distance. after about two weeks I received a letter from them stating I was using my phone line for dial up internet acess and that was not allowed. I called them and explained that I was using my phone line for my 4 tivo type devices to call in nightly and get their guide info. They said ok never mind./QUOTE]

This is where reading the terms and conditions are important. I selected a residential AT&T plan for home/long distance plan. About a week or so after signing up for the plan, I got a letter saying I was making Internet connections forbidden by contract. I spoke with an AT&T rep about it and they were surprised. I went back and looked up the terms and conditions and sure enough that residential plan specifically excludes any Internet connection. And dialing up to retrieve the epg every night constitutes an Internet connection. I quickly changed my rate plan to one that allows such connections but costs more (a monthly fee and 5 cents per minute). Until the alternate numbers changed, I had no problem.

When I added a phone line and combined services, the AT&T person put me back on that old residential plan. I had to call back after getting all the paperwork to have it removed. From what I gather, most AT&T customer service representatives do not know that little exclusion about Internet connections. So the moral here is to read the terms & conditions before signing up or right after getting the materials (usually by email these days). AT&T does post the terms & conditions for their rate plans on their site.

As for the "fraud" issue, they assume you knew the terms and are violating them. So from their point of view, you are trying to use a low cost residential plan to access the Internet violating the rules. They are absolutely unforgiving on this point and make no exceptions no matter what a customer service rep says on the matter. The customer service rep has no authority to waive terms such as these. Consider it a lesson learned, as Harvey says on People's Court. Always check the terms & conditions to make sure you do not violate any rules.
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post #66 of 76 Old 11-30-2011, 04:00 PM
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My issue is the fact that I told the first att rep that I had "tivo type" devices and they had to phone in nightly to get their guide info. He was the one that chose that plan for me. I was up front as to what I wanted the service to do. The person in New Jersey (Nancy) with the "att long distance monitoring group" AKA fraud dept said "tivo type devices are exempt". I no longer trust att and that is why I bought a magic jack plus. One other thing, I never received anything from att reguarding my new long distance plan. Still waiting for my phone call from att re my survey call.
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post #67 of 76 Old 11-30-2011, 06:42 PM
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Wow, here I was all Happy, and come to post my story.. and, I'm reading these last couple of stories.. NOT GOOD.. .. but, my guy, gave me Credit, for the last TWO months, and, yes, I told him, it was a 'tivo-like' devise... call was very Simple, I wasn't asked to sign anything or answer Yes to any questions.. so, I guess, Time, will tell for Now, its Over $100 credit... now I'm on, $14 a month 'unlimited' long distance... I'm kinda Hoping this at least gets me thru December, so I can find out if google talk will extend for free another year or not.
Question.. would UNplugging the Showstopper, and ONLY let it update once a week work out Better? my guide was GONE yesterday, I called the primary #, it took 40 min ( whats that? 40 min X 18 cents a min.. $7.20 ugh even Once a week, is More than I want to spend... yes, get the alt #'s working pls!
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post #68 of 76 Old 11-30-2011, 10:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cajon View Post

My issue is the fact that I told the first att rep that I had "tivo type" devices and they had to phone in nightly to get their guide info. He was the one that chose that plan for me. I was up front as to what I wanted the service to do. The person in New Jersey (Nancy) with the "att long distance monitoring group" AKA fraud dept said "tivo type devices are exempt". I no longer trust att and that is why I bought a magic jack plus. One other thing, I never received anything from att reguarding my new long distance plan. Still waiting for my phone call from att re my survey call.

Again what is said and what is actually in the terms/conditions are two separate things. In the one I viewed (AT&T California), it clearly states Internet connections of any kind are not allowed on that particular residential plan. There is no exemption for dvr nightly connections. Now I got the terms and conditions after I placed the order (it came via email,per my selection). I did not read it until after I got the notice of violation, which is my fault. However it is clear not all customer service reps know those terms and can make statements about a Tivo exemption that are not true. That is a lack of education on AT&T's fault. If you never got the terms/conditions that I believe is a violation of federal law (they are required to disclose all terms). So you could possibly file a complaint with the FCC (or state regulatory agency if applicable).

The upshot is this: unless you get changes to the actual terms/conditions in writing what a customer service agent says on the phone has no weight.

It does suck, I grant, that they do not have a dvr exemption. It forces us to use more expensive plans and to be creative in dialing into local access numbers to avoid in-state long distance charges. For now, thanks to advice in this forum, AT&T is no longer getting any local long distance fees from me when dialing in for the nightly Replay update.
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post #69 of 76 Old 12-01-2011, 07:47 AM
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If you have to make a LD call for guide data, *DO NOT* call an in-state number. Give a different phone number and choose an out of state number. There is no reason to pay 18cpm!

(your lineup is based on zip code, so dialup number won't matter)

Good to hear the Magic-Jack+ works well for data. I'm currently using a Ooma and it's hit and miss. (but good enough to never be out of data).

As far as AT&T complaints go, post it on twitter. I got contacted pretty quick, I sent him my phone # and we had a nice chat. The guy I got was american and very knowledgeable. Unfortunately, he wasn't able to help resolve the stupid policy, but he did understand the issue.

Robert

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post #70 of 76 Old 12-08-2011, 07:45 PM
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well, today I got my agreement in the mail, Sure enough it Says " Can not be used to access the internet"

I don't wanna start a chitstorm, but, IS, getting tv guide info, EVEN accessing the internet? I think not... perhaps, they want to discourage 24/7 usage? I don't think calling for guide info is really even against this agreement? other thoughts?
HOW did you get found out/informed that you can't use them?
thanks

[quote=medtaylor;21280148]
Quote:
Originally Posted by cajon View Post

The rep said the best thing for me was unlimited long distance. after about two weeks I received a letter from them stating I was using my phone line for dial up internet acess and that was not allowed. I called them and explained that I was using my phone line for my 4 tivo type devices to call in nightly and get their guide info. They said ok never mind./QUOTE]

This is where reading the terms and conditions are important. I selected a residential AT&T plan for home/long distance plan. About a week or so after signing up for the plan, I got a letter saying I was making Internet connections forbidden by contract. I spoke with an AT&T rep about it and they were surprised. I went back and looked up the terms and conditions and sure enough that residential plan specifically excludes any Internet connection. And dialing up to retrieve the epg every night constitutes an Internet connection. I quickly changed my rate plan to one that allows such connections but costs more (a monthly fee and 5 cents per minute). Until the alternate numbers changed, I had no problem.

When I added a phone line and combined services, the AT&T person put me back on that old residential plan. I had to call back after getting all the paperwork to have it removed. From what I gather, most AT&T customer service representatives do not know that little exclusion about Internet connections. So the moral here is to read the terms & conditions before signing up or right after getting the materials (usually by email these days). AT&T does post the terms & conditions for their rate plans on their site.

As for the "fraud" issue, they assume you knew the terms and are violating them. So from their point of view, you are trying to use a low cost residential plan to access the Internet violating the rules. They are absolutely unforgiving on this point and make no exceptions no matter what a customer service rep says on the matter. The customer service rep has no authority to waive terms such as these. Consider it a lesson learned, as Harvey says on People's Court. Always check the terms & conditions to make sure you do not violate any rules.

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post #71 of 76 Old 12-09-2011, 07:34 AM
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You're really not asking that question, are you???

Tony
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post #72 of 76 Old 12-09-2011, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by adone36 View Post

You're really not asking that question, are you???

well, Yes, color me stupid, but, HOW can they identify a Showstopper dialing in daily?

thanks for any Positive replies...
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post #73 of 76 Old 12-09-2011, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redw000d View Post

well, Yes, color me stupid, but, HOW can they identify a Showstopper dialing in daily?

They can identify it because your ShowStopper is calling a phone number where a modem answers.

DNNA does not run their own dial-up service, but leases internet dial-up access from others (like earthlink). Your telco doesn't care that it's a ShowStopper making the call. They care about the number you are calling... and your SS is calling a dial-up internet service provider.

Cheers!
-DOug
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post #74 of 76 Old 12-09-2011, 05:33 PM
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Really? .. I had NO idea.. .. Ignorance is Bliss...

so, do I Wait for them to contact me, angry and pissed off? or, do I need to get a magicjack or other solution? .. I Do feel like Showstopper/whoevertookthemoverafter has let us down..

is this group getting smaller, and smaller?? like the last of the pearl habor survivors?

I'm open to reading others suggestions.. too old to Fight the system...

thanks for info



Quote:
Originally Posted by dstoffa View Post

They can identify it because your ShowStopper is calling a phone number where a modem answers.

DNNA does not run their own dial-up service, but leases internet dial-up access from others (like earthlink). Your telco doesn't care that it's a ShowStopper making the call. They care about the number you are calling... and your SS is calling a dial-up internet service provider.

Cheers!
-DOug

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post #75 of 76 Old 12-09-2011, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redw000d View Post

Really? .. I had NO idea.. .. Ignorance is Bliss...

so, do I Wait for them to contact me, angry and pissed off? or, do I need to get a magicjack or other solution? .. I Do feel like Showstopper/whoevertookthemoverafter has let us down..

DNNA (the company that runs the guide service) has not let us down, per se. Telephone companies are the ones that are forcing terms that prevent you from using their service to connect to an internet service provider.

Quote:


is this group getting smaller, and smaller?? like the last of the pearl habor survivors?

I'm open to reading others suggestions.. too old to Fight the system...

thanks for info

Yes. The group is getting smaller. If you already have broadband at home, you may as well try the magic jack...

I'd still play the ignorance card if they catch you...

Cheers!
-Doug
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post #76 of 76 Old 12-13-2011, 01:29 PM
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It did occur to me that, with a 1 week program guide, I could get by without dialling every night.

I'm unplugging the phone line for about 5 days at a time - doesn't seem to make any difference.
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