Speculation: If RTV happens to go under, and you have monthly payment option.... - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 12:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Aren't you potentially totally screwed? Or would the geniuses here then tell the world how to hack the system and pretend you're activated (thus screwing those that paid $250)? Totally hypothetical I admit... but if you are paying the $10 a month and RTV goes out of business, we all agree that pretty soon the unit will realize that it shouldn't work anymore, and will morph into "expensive hard drive exo-skeleton mode"...
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post #2 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by RandyL712
...pretty soon the unit will realize that it shouldn't work anymore, and will morph into "expensive hard drive exo-skeleton mode"...
Now if only we could get RandyL712 to do that? :rolleyes:
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post #3 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:03 PM
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(actually a wink o' course) ;)
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post #4 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:04 PM - Thread Starter
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as if you aren't aware of the edit button, mr post padder :rolleyes:
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post #5 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:06 PM
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All the more reason to get the lifetime activation. Call any of the ReplayTV phone numbers and you will see they have already bitten the dust.
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post #6 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:06 PM - Thread Starter
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(you know I meant for that to be a wink!) ;)
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post #7 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:08 PM - Thread Starter
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For the record, I've just gotten off the phone with my 'friend' (really just an insider who feels comfortable talking to me) at RTV who's said that they're definately not out of business today :)
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post #8 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:09 PM
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What a meaningful, productive thread.

(you know I love it) ;)
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post #9 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by RandyL712
as if you aren't aware of the edit button, mr post padder :rolleyes:
IMO, the post padder has yet to discover the edit button's functionality.

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post #10 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:15 PM
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uh... just an FYI...

My "speculation" about this possibility (and ways to prepare/avoid it) caused much agitation and subsequently the entire thread was deleted. Then, the moderators posted the two "sticky" topics at the top of the forum about "required activation" and "theft of service". Soooo...

If you want to test the moderators resolve, feel free to continue this thread. :)

Myself, since I know that the interestes of ReplayTV/Sonic Blue have priority over free speech here, and was duely "smited" (smitten?) for my honest effort to explore a topic I felt was of importance, I now steer clear of annoying the forum gods by keeping my posts strictly technical. uh.. except for this one, so forget I said anything...


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Owww!! Not again! :(

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post #11 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:18 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm absolutely not talking about stealing service, and don't want this thread to go in that direction. I'm asking if people choosing the monthly option will be left with a useless box if the ReplayTV motherships should cease to exist. If I have the lifetime activation, it's already been noted that my box will continue to work, I just need to get the guide (which would be attainable). With monthly activation, my understanding is that the box is constantly paranoid - checking with the mothership to make sure I'm still subscribed.
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post #12 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:25 PM
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Vern - the problem is that you can't see the difference between your thread and this thread.
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post #13 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GadgetGuy
All the more reason to get the lifetime activation...
It's obvious the Fat Lady already intoned... and yet GadgetGuy wants to throw good money after bad?

"You got to know when to hold 'em; know when to fold 'em,
Know when to walk away; know when to run."

(well and "the best you can hope for is to die in your sleep") :D
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post #14 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 01:49 PM
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I bought my first unit just a few weeks ago, and because of my skeptical nature, I opted for the $10/month service activation option, at least for the first month. However, I see from various posts that most people believe that if they opt for the “lifetime†activation, their units will continue to work, at least without the channel guide, while those who have opted for monthly service will be left with nothing more than a pretty doorstop.

I browsed around SBLU’s web site, but I see no mention of this nor any other reference to what happens to owners if SBLU no longer offers the service.

What I do see is that:

1 – If you opt for the lifetime activation, you don’t have to pay anything else to receive it.
2 – You need to have the service in order for the ReplayTV to continue working

If you read the “Activation and Service Agreement†on their web site, it reads:

“Your ReplayTV digital video recorder works only by activating and receiving the ReplayTV Service offered and provided by ReplayTV.â€

The service agreement also states:

“if you pay the one-time, up front subscription fee, you will not incur any additional charges to receive the basic ReplayTV Serviceâ€

To me, this just means that they won’t charge you in the future for as long as the basic service is offered. It also sounds like even the lifetime subscribers still need the service for their units to continue operating. It is not a guarantee that the service will always be provided, nor that your unit is permanently “unlockedâ€. If the service is no longer offered, it would seem to me that everyone is screwed.

I hope that I am wrong in my interpretation of this, as it would make the lifetime subscription option that much more attractive. If anyone from Replay is listening, a clarification would be greatly appreciated.
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post #15 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 02:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally posted by bobrlinet
If anyone from Replay is listening, a clarification would be greatly appreciated.
I second that, but I'm doubtful we'd ever get more than what was said here:
Quote:
Originally posted by ReplayLyndon
I can't speculate on what would happen if the company goes out of business. That's not the plan.
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post #16 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 02:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by lizard_boy
the problem is that you can't see the difference between your thread and this thread.
Seems the primary (and only) difference is that I wasn't the one that started this thread. ;)

In the one I started, I was attempting to explore this exact same topic:

What alternatives/repercussions would there be in the event the Replay TV service became unavailable?

Now, you may have interpreted it as something else, but only I know the intent behind my posting. If it was unclear or interpreted incorrectly, then it was either a failure on my part to describe it clearly or a failure on your part to understand it. If the former, then I apologize... :)

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post #17 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by bobrlinet
...I hope that I am wrong in my interpretation of this, as it would make the lifetime subscription option that much more attractive. If anyone from Replay is listening, a clarification would be greatly appreciated.
We've been over this so many times over the last few years... but I seriously doubt BrettStah's dreams (fears?) will come true any time soon. They sure haven't yet. Of course a new wrinkle now is the monthlies, thus the need(??) for this new slightly different speculative thread.

I'd say if people (besides BrettStah) are really tossing and turning... losing sleep @ night over this, they might be better off not using these things? And probably not any other new technology either.

Bottom line: If it means you can no longer afford cat food to eat, instead use a VCR ? :)
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post #18 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ilusion
Seems the primary (and only) difference is that I wasn't the one that started this thread. ;)

In the one I started, I was attempting to explore this exact same topic:

What alternatives/repercussions would there be in the event the Replay TV service became unavailable?
Actually the title of that thread, if it's the one I remember:

"New Software fetches Replay guide info from the web for free!"

and it opened with a $250 (hypothetical?) offer to the first hacker to find an end run around activation. I don't know how anyone could have interpreted that differently?

To be fair, a portion of the rest was a tap dance away from that position. But mostly it was back to the same old "Activation isn't justified" "Why should I have to pay it?".

So now we have 2 sticky's. Explains the situation rather succinctly. :)
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post #19 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 03:00 PM - Thread Starter
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K, done deal. That thread was removed and rightfully so. Let's not discuss that here, or that'll be the same fate, instead of coming up with the proper solution to the questions I've posed...
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post #20 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 03:10 PM
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If SB went under, and all service for ReplayTV was halted couldn't they just upload some new code to all units which would deactivate the need for activation? Obviously you wouldn't be able to get guide information anymore, but the unit would not become a complete doorstop.

PS- If this theory has already been proposed I apologize, I'm at work right now and had to skim the posts.

-Lakanta
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post #21 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by KenL
Actually the title of that thread, if it's the one I remember:

"New Software fetches Replay guide info from the web for free!"

and it opened with a $250 (hypothetical?) offer to the first hacker to find an end run around activation. I don't know how anyone could have interpreted that differently?

To be fair, a portion of the rest was a tap dance away from that position. But mostly it was back to the same old "Activation isn't justified" "Why should I have to pay it?".

So now we have 2 sticky's. Explains the situation rather succinctly. :)
thank you kenny for explaining the difference to (are you there) vern
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post #22 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by RandyL712
...instead of coming up with the proper solution to the questions I've posed...
You mean answers to your questions?

Which is quite simply... we can't conclusively predict @ this time.

The solution of course remains "Just Activate It!" (lifetime perhaps?) :)
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post #23 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by KenL
I don't know how anyone could have interpreted that differently?
It must have been my poor ability to express the idea I had. :( The "future headline" style topic heading was meant to draw attention and inspire speculation, not some ham-fisted attempt to try to hire some hacker to undertake nefarious deeds.

The offer of financial support in that posting stems from my sincere attitude that if you advocate change, you should support such change in whatever way you can. As I am not a programmer of the caliber required, I offered to provide what I could. To my mind, making a clammor for change without offering support is just so much whining....

Unfortunately, It seems my distaste for SB's pricing scheme, joined with my interest in increasing the robustness of the ReplayTV was widely viewed as an incitement to cheat SB out of something, and this was definetly not my intent. It further appears my attemps at clarification were viewed as "tap dancing". :(

Again, I apologize if it was interpreted incorrectly. I'll endeavor to provide more easliy interpreted posts in the future. :) Hopefully, those of you who's posts are always received exactly as they were meant to, can "cut some slack" to those of us who might hit send b4 their post is perfectly formed? ;)

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post #24 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 04:01 PM
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You guys who keep saying that buying the one time activation is the answer must know something I don't. If, say, a magazine to which you subscribed ceases to exist, what make you think your prepaid subscription would be honored and you would keep getting magazines?

Dave W.
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post #25 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by lakanta
If SB went under, and all service for ReplayTV was halted couldn't they just upload some new code to all units which would deactivate the need for activation? Obviously you wouldn't be able to get guide information anymore, but the unit would not become a complete doorstop.
Object example: For Christmas a few years ago, I bought my wife a neat little techno-gadget called a "SportBrain". It's a little electronic device that you wear while excercising that tracks your progress and after Activation dialed into the SmartBrain Company servers and exchanged information (Sound familiar?) so you could track your excercise progress. One day, it went dead as did the company.

Of course, they cared so much about us customers, they made the service available to us after the product was orphaned, right? Ha! They left all their users to dangle while the lawyers argued and the website went dead. Then the site came back and kept promising to reactivate service, missing deadline after deadline. They now claim it'll be back the 16th of this month. I'll believe it when I see it. :mad:

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post #26 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 05:03 PM
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There are too many smart people around here that would keep this product from dying, if in fact SB went under AND ReplayTV wasn't picked up by someone else.

I believe Randy is just baiting people as he already knows the answer to this question. Perhaps he is just bored and wanted to debate, but I'm not even going to try to figure out what's going on in his mind.

Anyhow, Vern, Dave and anyone else worrying about this, look at the accomplishments made by the active (and not-so-active) members of this forum. Without them, we wouldn't be able to upgrade/swap drives, download mpgs off the network or turn your PC into a vitual Replay/archive device. Don't you think some of these people already know how to bypass the subscription code and put guide data into the Replay if needed?

In short, if SB went under, is our Replays are turn into glorified VCRs for a brief time.

PostCount++;
--------------------------------------------------------------
ReplayTV 5080 - 00004-54831-79633
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post #27 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 05:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, I'm all about baiting. How about you knock off your consistently childish insults? I think it's obvious to everyone who's baiting who in your posts.. Back to the topic at hand...

The reason I'm asking is because I'm contemplating getting all new units, 2-4 5000 series boxes. I don't want to:

A) Choose monthly if that means the boxes die should Replay go under.
B) Choose lifetime if that means that when Replay should go under, everyone gets free service, so I wasted $250 / box.

Comprende? I understand its not an easy question to answer.
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post #28 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 07:00 PM
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Hey, don't bring me into this topic KenL... I definitely do not want ReplayTV to disappear as a Tivo competitor. As I've said before, nothing spurs innovation more than competition.

Brett

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post #29 of 81 Old 12-09-2002, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by dave2297
You guys who keep saying that buying the one time activation is the answer must know something I don't.
Perhaps it's because we own the various units?

The answer is that the one time activation puts us theoretically in the same AnchorFree Boat as the Showstoppers, which originally sold w/ included lifetime. In the absence of the mothership we'd likely still have manual recorders, provided we make some effort to set the clock. Monthlies? Who knows... but it's worth noting the new units were never sold to do anything when not activated.

An unlikely scenario @ any rate.

But take the magazine analogy... say you subscribed to a mag. And it comes with a free (or heavily discounted) lectro-d'luxe porcelain throne w/sidecar stand to steady the publication while you sit to read, or simply stare @ the wall, and/or sing folksongs. When finished you simply tear out pages, no corncobs. For the sake of this analogy... let's assume that in order to even gain entry, you must put the current issue of the rag in the stand to unlock it. A simple security measure, preventative to the time-honored stunt of getting just one issue delivered... then keeping the posh throne... sitting there feverishly devouring Readers Digest, even training your parrot to sing opera, all on the original publisher's dime! :(

On the other hand, if you prepay for the magazine, it purges the (no longer necessary) security requirement, i.e. the needing to produce the current issue of the mag to even sit down.

So even if you never receive another issue of the original qualifying periodical... you can still sit upon d'luxe throne for hours on end to think, read Strong Sad's Diary/Mad Magazine, or even take time to knit scarves for polar bears while singing off-key duets with your parrot. For the entire life of the hardware.

Very simple really. :)
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post #30 of 81 Old 12-10-2002, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by RandyL712
Yes, I'm all about baiting. How about you knock off your consistently childish insults? I think it's obvious to everyone who's baiting who in your posts.. Back to the topic at hand...

The reason I'm asking is because I'm contemplating getting all new units, 2-4 5000 series boxes. I don't want to:

A) Choose monthly if that means the boxes die should Replay go under.
B) Choose lifetime if that means that when Replay should go under, everyone gets free service, so I wasted $250 / box.

Comprende? I understand its not an easy question to answer.
Well, the answer to your dilemma is as follows:

SB goes under.
Those with lifetime activation can continue to use their boxes.
Those with monthly subscription can either continue with an expensive paperweight OR send in $250 for a lifetime activation.
The influx of lifetime subscription dollars brings SB out of the grave.
Everyone lives happily everafter.
:cool:

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