Replay or TiVo? - AVS Forum
ReplayTV & Showstopper PVRs > Replay or TiVo?
bareyb's Avatar bareyb 10:02 PM 12-02-2000
For the last week or so I have been going back and forth between the TiVo forum and the Replay TV forum. I have asked alot of questions and read alot of posts. I think both products are great. Period. I think the Replays quick skip is a must and I like the program grid. Having said that I have chosen to get the TiVo Unit. Mainly becuase of the fact that it can be used as a stand alone unit without programming (it emulates a VCR's manual programming and needs not have any program service). Therefore even if both companies go under (which I doubt) then it won't be a door stop. I also worry that the Replays recent announcement was public relations death (doing it before Xmas seemed like the last insane act of a desperate man). I sure as heck did not want to invest in a sinking ship, and that is what it looked like to me. time will tell on that. I CAN say however, that I perused both this forum and the TiVo forum and I see many more technical problems being complianed about on the Replay than with the TiVo. That was a big factor for me too.

cwoody222's Avatar cwoody222 07:35 AM 12-03-2000
Read the TiVo forum more closely regarding Manual Recording w/o the service.

If TiVo goes under, you'll still need to set the clock...just like ReplayTV.

Plus, I'm pretty sure Richard had said there's no guaranteeds the Manual Record will work w/o service in the future - I *think* SA 2.0s and DirecTiVo have the ability for the company to "disable" Manual Record if they so choose in the future. And I *think* SA 1.3s are safe from this. Go read the forum and Search...I just want you to have all the info...


TWPaulus's Avatar TWPaulus 12:14 PM 12-03-2000
Both replaytv with version 3.0 and tivo with version 1.3 have full vcr like manual recording. Both at this time you have to have net connection to set clock time. It is reasuring to know what RB says about releasing how to manualy doing it if the extreame happens. I assume but have no assurance that replaytv will do the same. I don't think either will give the info before the fact. Even with out a manual time set the clock should keep realive good time but would drift but I think the drift could be adjusted for in the manual setting of the manual record feature. Yes it would be a pain but doable.

Another matter is more important to me. Assuming they fail and release how to set the clock,etc.. What happens if the box loses the channel lineup, or the lineup changes (like you move) or for some reason you have to run setup. Exspecialy if something happens to box that put you back into setup and requires a connection to get out of. Since there is no way of manuly setting a lineup now in either units if any of these thing happen the unit may become a doorstop. In my opoino they should not only give you the manual time set but also give you a manual lineup set but I think they should put out a software update to do above but make the unit act like a manual dvcr and remove any requirments at all of even connecting to a server so no mattter what happens to the unit that it won't get stuck with having to connect at all. http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Tom Paulus
a TV nut that's hard to crack.
forecheck's Avatar forecheck 03:43 PM 12-03-2000
While nobody knows for sure, I would think that if either, or both, Replay and Tivo go under, there would be one last software upgrade that would turn all the machines into "digital VCRs", giving them the same features as the current VCRs. If Replay and Tivo didn't have enough money in their emergency fund to cover the expense, I would bet Panasonic, Phillips, and Sony would help out, because the last thing they want is a product with their name on it that all of a sudden doesn't work. They have a reputation to think about and funding a final software upgrade would be good PR. Now the ReplayTV branded boxes may be a different story...
JHouse's Avatar JHouse 09:15 PM 12-03-2000
These products are so valuable, I can't imagine that someone wouldn't market either a hack or a service which would make the boxes useful in the absence of the original company.

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Joe House
Still happy about 1300 lumen Infocus LP350LP350/Boxlight CD555m DLP's video decoder, de-interlacer and scaler.
DanW118's Avatar DanW118 10:10 PM 12-03-2000
Quote:
Originally posted by cwoody222:
Read the TiVo forum more closely regarding Manual Recording w/o the service.

If TiVo goes under, you'll still need to set the clock...just like ReplayTV.

Plus, I'm pretty sure Richard had said there's no guaranteeds the Manual Record will work w/o service in the future - I *think* SA 2.0s and DirecTiVo have the ability for the company to "disable" Manual Record if they so choose in the future. And I *think* SA 1.3s are safe from this. Go read the forum and Search...I just want you to have all the info...

RB has stated that if TiVo were to go under he would release info on how to easily access a screen allowing you to manually set the clock, also there is no reason why TiVo would make it so you couldn't do manual recordings without the service, they might be able to do it, but in the unlikely case of there demise you will be able to continue to use it. So basically TiVo is a safe buy no matter what. http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/smile.gif


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Dan Wueste
- Colonel, TiVo Army + JAG Corp
- Moderator, AVS Forum - TiVo Coffee House
Lives in the Same House as a Replay.
TiVo, Time has No Meaning there.
TiVolutionary's Avatar TiVolutionary 10:35 PM 12-03-2000
Specifically, I said that there is a way to set the clock without the service, but to tell you how to do it would get you in to the backdoors of TiVo, and once you knew one, you'd figure out them all -- not something we (TiVo) want. If something happened to TiVo (not likely with over 200 Million in the bank) I would release how to do that. In fact, TiVo has been a very customer-responsive company from the beginning, and I imagine that TiVo would do much more than that to soften such a blow for our loyal customers. I don't know, though, because we don't discuss it. When your company is showing growth every quarter, landing new deals right and left, hiring like mad, and having a great time doing it you don't sit around in meetings and say, "Hey guys, what are we going to do if we belly-up?"

As for the Manual Recordings without Service. TiVo has decided to stop subsidizing the cost of boxes for people who don't subscribe to the TiVo Service. One of the ways to make it clear to customers that the box really does require the service is to put a big sticker on it that says "Requires a Subscription to the TiVo Service." We can't do that without disabling Manual Recordings. So, starting with receivers that are manufactured with our 2.0 software on them, they will have such a sticker, and no, you won't be able to create Manual Recordings without the TiVo Service.

Now, can we change that if things go sour? SURE! It's just a bit in the software.

-RB

[This message has been edited by TiVolutionary (edited 12-03-2000).]
Mike Emery's Avatar Mike Emery 09:21 AM 12-04-2000
All I WANT is a "digital VCR"...so since you're essentially saying that the service is more valuable than the unit, people like me (who can scan a TV Guide and highlight everything of interest in a single visit to the head) should look elsewhere?

What about 1.3 units? Will TiVo "uopgrade" the software to disable manual recording sans service? Or are these units to be sought after by rebels such as myself http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif ?

I know you guys are out to make money, but frankly the whole thing kinda sucks...
Philosofy's Avatar Philosofy 11:26 AM 12-04-2000
OK, let's break out the fire extinguishers now. Tivo is NOT taking cheap shots at Replay. I work the demo days, and have been speicifically instructed NOT to mention Replay's financial woes when selling vs. Replay. Why? It's not the way Tivo does business. However, due to the recent plight of Replay, several customers (and retailers) are asking what plans are available should the service go under. Tivo has issued their response. If Replay feels they can do something similar, then they have every right. This thread is a "Replay vs Tivo" comparison (of sorts) and the perfect place to post this information.

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Phil
Part Time Tivo Demo Days Spokesman
jasonl99's Avatar jasonl99 03:21 PM 12-04-2000
Quote:
All I WANT is a "digital VCR"...so since you're essentially saying that the service is more valuable than the unit
That's fine. TiVo's just not going to pay for part of it anymore. Would you be willing to pay, say, an extra $200 for what you want?
riker's Avatar riker 04:31 PM 12-04-2000
Quote:
Originally posted by TiVolutionary:
I don't know, though, because we don't discuss it. When your company is showing growth every quarter, landing new deals right and left, hiring like mad, and having a great time doing it you don't sit around in meetings and say, "Hey guys, what are we going to do if we belly-up?"
[This message has been edited by TiVolutionary (edited 12-03-2000).]
Uh, HELLO? Replay announced a new partnership, plans to open a new studio, advertising deals, and hired new staff just a WEEK before the meltdown. And from listening to the ReplayDudes here, they had a great time doing it. I wouldn't get so cocky if I were you. You still lose money on every box you sell and your business model is no more sound than Replay's. You just had the luxury of being first to IPO and fill your coffers, but that would just keep you afloat a bit longer than Replay.


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-=- Glenn -=-
Philosofy's Avatar Philosofy 04:55 PM 12-04-2000
Quote:
Originally posted by riker:
Uh, HELLO? Replay announced a new partnership, plans to open a new studio, advertising deals, and hired new staff just a WEEK before the meltdown. And from listening to the ReplayDudes here, they had a great time doing it. I wouldn't get so cocky if I were you. You still lose money on every box you sell and your business model is no more sound than Replay's. You just had the luxury of being first to IPO and fill your coffers, but that would just keep you afloat a bit longer than Replay.


Do we really want to start this crap again? http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif

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Phil
Part Time Tivo Demo Days Spokesman
riker's Avatar riker 05:14 PM 12-04-2000
Quote:
Originally posted by Philosofy:
Do we really want to start this crap again? http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/rolleyes.gif
Yes, as no one's properly rebutted the clueless statement.
<pointing fingers> But he started it! http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/smile.gif

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-=- Glenn -=-
sw10025's Avatar sw10025 05:40 PM 12-04-2000
Quote:
Originally posted by riker:
Uh, HELLO? Replay announced a new partnership, plans to open a new studio, advertising deals, and hired new staff just a WEEK before the meltdown. And from listening to the ReplayDudes here, they had a great time doing it. I wouldn't get so cocky if I were you. You still lose money on every box you sell and your business model is no more sound than Replay's. You just had the luxury of being first to IPO and fill your coffers, but that would just keep you afloat a bit longer than Replay.

And just *what* does that say about ReplayTV, might I ask?

Philosofy's Avatar Philosofy 08:34 PM 12-04-2000
Somebody close this thread, its gonna get ugly!
toots's Avatar toots 10:50 PM 12-04-2000
Well, if you ask me (which no one did), the TiVo's a cheap shot, so whaddya 'spect?

Although I did quite enjoy their "Masculine Itch" commercial. 'Course it never mentioned that you could skip the commercial without having to watch the image at high speed if you got a Replay instead.
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