Tivo spys on viewer habits. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
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And the proof is in the link

Proof Tivo spy's

I though they didn't spy on usuage. Which make me think real
hard, "Is replay doing the same thing?"
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post #2 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 12:28 PM
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This isn't anything new. Tivo not only spies on what you watch, they know every button you pressed which gets reported during the nightly call to the mothership.

I'm not sure exactly what ReplayTV does, but they do know what you record and watch, it's in the Licencing Agreement you made when you first setup the ReplayTV. At least, I'm pretty sure it is. Supposedly they don't report what you watch to anyone and there is no name next to shows watched, just an ID#.

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ReplayTV 5080 - 00004-54831-79633
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post #3 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 01:37 PM
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I believe TiVo has an option that a user can opt-out on being spied on by TiVo. for those that are worried about this kind of thing;)

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post #4 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 02:49 PM
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myreplay is a goldmine of information if they are using it. personally, i don't care if they do sell it to subsidize the operation of replay. it is just aggregate data, individual data is of no use anyway since most cable is one way -you get what you are sent- broadcasts, nothing interactive.
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post #5 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 03:32 PM
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Tivos collect data locally, then it's "anonymized" to the ZIP code level, and then (if you haven't opted out) uploaded to the Tivo mothership. Once there, they can only tell what ZIP code the data came from.

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post #6 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 06:42 PM
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Then everyone in the same zip code gets the same "suggestions" ---- Tivo knows what each box is watching - thats how it (Tivo server) makes suggestions.....all the other bs floating around about anon info - yeah I believe it!:D
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post #7 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 08:40 PM
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I would welcome it, especially anonymous info. There have been several great shows that I've had cancelled, but if Tivo/ReplayTV stats would have been used, the outlook might have improved. I remember at the Buffistas site, when they cancelled Firefly last year, there was a report that Firefly was actually one of the most "Tivo'ed" shows; if the networks would have taken that seriously, that show might well have been left alive...

Plus, all this talk about Replay being in financial trouble, this is a decent way out. As long as we're aware of it, what's the harm?
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post #8 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 09:20 PM
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I think as long as it's anonymous, it's great. The way they used to do these types of things was with special boxes that were installed in people's houses. I have no idea how many of those are around, but im sure there are more tivos and replays, or at least there will be some day.
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post #9 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Grubgoat

Plus, all this talk about Replay being in financial trouble, this is a decent way out. As long as we're aware of it, what's the harm?
What "talk" would that be?? You mean a year ago when Sonic Blue went under?

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post #10 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 09:47 PM
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I was just looking at the Privacy Policy in my Replay 5060 today. They mention "personal" and Non-personal" information, if I recall the wording. They stated that they have or will share non-personal info which does not include anything to identify you as you. (such as email, name, address, phone).

The info screen also indicates that to date, they have not shared personal data, (but I'm not sure how old that statement is.) They also said that you will have the ability of "opting out" of sharing personal info if they decide to use it in the future.
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post #11 of 21 Old 02-02-2004, 09:49 PM
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Heh! D&M in financial trouble. :D I do think its likely that the Replay line will cease and D&M will merge it into Escient making it a no starter for average folks.

As for aggregate data...well I don't think it hurts anyone. The big problem is that there are really so few Replay users that the data isn't all that useful.

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post #12 of 21 Old 02-03-2004, 01:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by gizmo91
[b]Then everyone in the same zip code gets the same "suggestions" ---- Tivo knows what each box is watching - thats how it (Tivo server) makes suggestions.....
The "Tivo server" does not generate suggestions. That's done by each individual DVR which does of course know what you watch. But it doesn't share that info with Tivos servers in any way that can be traced back to specific boxes.
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post #13 of 21 Old 02-03-2004, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by adone36
What "talk" would that be?? You mean a year ago when Sonic Blue went under?
Both the article about "Tivo in trouble" posted a week or so ago, and the whole thing about the 3-year/lifetime subscription, where alot of people were complaining that the "greedy" people who demanded lifetime service were going to bankrupt the Replay service. I realize their owner has money, but this is one more thing to make ReplayTV profitable, and thus guarantee its survival (or at least that DNNA won't give up on it)...
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post #14 of 21 Old 02-03-2004, 01:16 PM
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Except that Tivo can become the new Nielson... I bet there is lots of money in know what people watch and don't watch. Plus companies that purchase advertising would like to know if their ads are being watched or skipped--can you say, "mo money."?

Except, of course, in paranoid delusions for those that believe.
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post #15 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by WannabeSQ
I think as long as it's anonymous, it's great. The way they used to do these types of things was with special boxes that were installed in people's houses. I have no idea how many of those are around, but im sure there are more tivos and replays, or at least there will be some day.
Quote:
Originally posted by Amazingly Smooth
Except that Tivo can become the new Nielson... I bet there is lots of money in know what people watch and don't watch. Plus companies that purchase advertising would like to know if their ads are being watched or skipped--can you say, "mo money."?
how many "Nielsen families" are there? According to the Nielson website there are:

5,000 households in the national People Meter sample, approximately 20,000 households in the local metered market samples, approximately 1,000 metered homes for our national and local Hispanic measurement, and nearly 1.6 million diaries are edited each year.

There are probably 750,000 tivos out there. The number of tivo families is significantly less due to multiple ownership. As of right now, I would say the tivo is much more accurate than the nielsons in the demographics represented by tivo purchasers.

Tivo, Replay or any other pvr service would have to cover a whole lot wider range of people to ever replace the nielsons. Cost of both machine and service will prevent this from happening any time soon.
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post #16 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 07:34 AM
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You seem to forget that, while the Nielsen family sampling strives to reflect a cross-section of the viewing public, the Tivo population represents a more tech savvy representation of the viewing public (as well as other factors) and this would severely skew any demographics that may be derived.

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post #17 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 10:11 AM
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Yeah.... it is skewed to those with $$$$

Guess people don't want to market to those only...

Except, of course, in paranoid delusions for those that believe.
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post #18 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 11:47 AM
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JJON did say "I would say the tivo is much more accurate than the nielsons in the demographics represented by tivo purchasers. " (emphasis mine)

I once knew someone who was in a Neilson Household. They had to log much more data than the tivo... like who is in the room (and when folks come/go) so they can get the demographics right. Even guests were supposed to log in/out.

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post #19 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by JJON2121
There are probably 750,000 tivos out there. The number of tivo families is significantly less due to multiple ownership.
Actually, there are over a million TiVo receivers.

/carmi
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post #20 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Reden
JJON did say "I would say the tivo is much more accurate than the nielsons in the demographics represented by tivo purchasers. " (emphasis mine)

I once knew someone who was in a Neilson Household. They had to log much more data than the tivo... like who is in the room (and when folks come/go) so they can get the demographics right. Even guests were supposed to log in/out.

Robert
Here is that great distinction between accuracy and precision. While Neilsen may collect more data (precision), it is not as likely to be accurate. My parents were a Neilsen family, and I know that they often filled in their diary much later from memory, not while they were actually watching. From what I understand, that is somewhat common.

Those statistics that TiVo gathers are both accurate and precise (when someone fast forwarded over a comercial, or stopped to watch it again). That is why Neilsen is using TiVo equipped households for some of its data gathering.

/carmi
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post #21 of 21 Old 02-04-2004, 03:54 PM
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And the money just keeps rolling in... (to Tivo)

http://money.cnn.com/2004/02/04/tech....reut/?cnn=yes

Except, of course, in paranoid delusions for those that believe.
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