Can Replay Video transmit through HDMI? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 18 Old 01-02-2007, 09:53 PM - Thread Starter
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First, I know there might have been something written in this forum on this subject previously, but I cannot currently search the word HDMI as there seems to be some sort of update/upgrade going on with this forums server right now...

The short question is: has anyone had success connecting their Replay audio and video output through a home theater sound system using an HDMI output from the sound system to the TV?

I'm hooking up a Sony DAV-X1 Home Theater to a new 1080P DLP HDTV. I have connected the DAV-X1 unit using HDMI to my TV. I have also connected a Replay 5080 DVR to the DAV-X1 Video 1 input using S-Video known good cables. The output should then be handled by the HDMI connection from the home theater to the TV, I presumed. The problem is that although the Replay audio can be heard through the DAV-X1, the video itself is blank. By the way, I've not upgraded to HD cable, still using my Comcast digital cable box. I have tried to change the progressive signal on the DAV-X1, but no video comes through for the Replay regardless of which setting I use. Incidentally, when the DAV-X1 is set to the DVD mode, the picture comes through using HDMI on the Mitsubishi TV, so I know the HDMI connection is working. When I connect the Replay directly to input 1 of the TV the Replay audio and Video work through the TV, so I know my Replay and its cables are working. Any insights as to why the Replay's video signal will not transmit to the TV via the DAV-X1 using the HDMI cable?
I suppose I could just connect the Replay directly to one of the TV's inputs, and then just use the TV's audio output connection to the DAV-X1 to hear it through the home theater. Still, why have multiple inputs into the home theater if the device connected can't relay it's video output through HDMI? Also, wouldn't I be sacrificing visual and audio quality by not going through HDMI?

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post #2 of 18 Old 01-04-2007, 07:18 AM
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I guess the question is whether the receiver can upconvert a "lesser" (S-video) signal to HDMI. This is usually a function that expensive receivers provide, and cheaper ones, even ones that claim to offer HDMI switching, can only output HDMI/DVI signals via HDMI. Check your manual for details. I did a web search for the DAV-X1 and didn't get a quick answer, it seems most people just use its built-in DVD player.
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post #3 of 18 Old 01-04-2007, 12:13 PM
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yeah, the question is does the receiver you own actually "up-convert" from the component-in or only pass through incomming HDMI signals. It has nothing to do with the Replay.

Just plug the replay into the TV video directly. As far as sound, you could still plug that into your tuner.... or into the TV... or both the tuner and the TV.

I used to have my sound going into my receiver but hated having the receiver turned on just to watch the Replay cuz the receiver generates a ton of heat. so I routed my ReplayTV sound rite to the TV along with the component video. Since the Replay outputs AT BEST component output and your TV is digital, your TV is already going to do the job of up-converting the signal to the best output for the TV.

This space for rent.
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post #4 of 18 Old 01-04-2007, 01:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks. I also couldn't find the info I wanted through my web search. I emailed my question to Sony, and here's the response I got:

Thank you for contacting Sony Online Support.

We are sorry, but the issues you describe will require more
communication than can be effectively handled via e-mail. Please contact our
Customer Information Service Center by phone. This will allow our telephone
technicians to diagnose your issue further. They may be reached at the
following: (800) 222-7669.

Thank you for the opportunity to be of assistance.

Your Sony Email Response Team
Jacob


I post this email response for anyone who could never find the 800 support number for Sony! It's useful. I did call Sony, and they said that the DAV-X1 has a monitor out for video. So it seems that the HDMI is really useful for the DVD player. The S-video output will be handled by the Monitor S-video out feed. I already hooked the replay directly to the TV and have the TV audio out feeding to the DAV-X1. I'm not sure there would be anything to gain from moving the Replay back to the video 1 input of the DAV-X1. There might be some benefit to the sound quality...

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post #5 of 18 Old 01-04-2007, 06:43 PM
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The signal flowing through an HDMI cable is an encrypted digital stream. The audio and video signals coming out of the Replay's A/V jacks are old fashion analog signals. You will NEVER be able to send an analog audio/video signal through an HDMI connection. As Sony support indicated, in order to display the analog video signal from the Replay on your TV, you will need to connect your DAV-X1 to your TV using either the composite or S-video connections. The analog audio signal will play through the DAV-X1's speakers, as you have already discovered.

You can watch DVDs via the HDMI connection because the digital data is streamed off of the DVD, encrypted for transmission, send through the HDMI cable, then decrypted, decoded, and finally displayed on your digital TV.


RF
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post #6 of 18 Old 01-04-2007, 11:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes, that's what I've ultimately discovered. Also resolved that it would be better to rehook the Replay back to the sound system directly instead of to the TV then fed back to the sound system via the audio out jacks on the TV. There's a potential to lose dolby sound quality feeding through the TV first.

I found a helpful, interesting description of HDMI online. It's the connection wave of the future:

HDMI (High-Definition Multimedia Interface) is a connection standard that was first developed by Hitachi, Panasonic, RCA, Silicon Image, Sony, and Toshiba in 2002. HDMI is quickly emerging as the connection standard for HDTV in the consumer electronics market.

HDMI is the first and only digital interface that is able to combine uncompressed audio and video over a single cable. Possessing a bandwidth of 5 Gbps, transmissions over HDMI are currently using less than half of that. This leaves plenty of room to expand the technology in the future.

HDMI is fully backwards compatible with DVI, and will supplant it as the interface of choice over the next few years.

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post #7 of 18 Old 01-05-2007, 06:50 AM
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Notice the 'backward compatibility'. This means that the communication over HDMI does not have to be encrypted.

Just as has happened with all 'superior' technologies, eventually we'll find receivers that DO upconvert from any input to HDMI. My first receiver was capable of up-convert to S-video. The one I have now upconverts to Component. I think there is a 999.00 yamaha that upconverts to HDMI, but I've not really dug into it's specs yet.
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post #8 of 18 Old 01-05-2007, 07:05 AM
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I'm also aware of some higher-end Onkyo receivers that convert any video input to HDMI, I'm sure there are others.
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post #9 of 18 Old 01-05-2007, 04:36 PM
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I don't know how your system works. I had to return a Sony receiver because it would only "pass thru" HDMI audio.

So with a DVD connected to the receiver via HDMI it would not process the auidio for the surround system, but pass it thru to the tv. What's the point of having HDMI on the receiver? The work around was to send the audio back to the receiver via an optical cable, but I could do that with my old receiver so I returned the receiver.

Good luck.

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post #10 of 18 Old 01-05-2007, 09:32 PM
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Geez. Thats horrible. Have a look at some of the Yamaha stuff at Best Buy.
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post #11 of 18 Old 01-08-2007, 09:35 AM
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The DENON AVR-2307CI is another good mid-to-low priced receiver that does HDMI upconversions, to 1080p even! You can pick one up for around $600.
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post #12 of 18 Old 01-08-2007, 10:26 AM
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IMHO the best bang for the buck in receivers that do up conversion to HDMI is the JVC RX-D401S/RX-D402B. Here is a good thread here on the AVS Forum:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=582122

You can get one for about $300 Delivered.

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post #13 of 18 Old 01-08-2007, 06:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I should point out that one of my main objectives when I purchased the Sony DAV-X1 was to aquire a new technology unit that projected surround sound without having to set up 5 speakers. I know this technology isn't perfect. My research showed that Yamaha was likely the best for this type of unit on the market, utilizing one long box with numerous speakers and drivers inside. But the Yamaha did not come with a subwoofer. You had to purchase that separately. Next, I looked at the Bose 321, which has outstanding sound quality as well, but it is plagued with a cheap receiver unit...the DVD breaks down easily, and it cannot play HD DVD's. This Sony, however, displayed an impressive surround sound with only two speakers (and a subwoofer which came with the unit) and can play HD DVD's too, as an added benefit to my new HDTV.

Overall, I'm very happy with my choice, as it was half the price of the Yamaha and Bose system when purchased online at Curcuit City.

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post #14 of 18 Old 01-09-2007, 08:37 AM
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Interestingly I was in the market for something similar a couple of years ago, and purchased the Niro 1.1 Pro system, which has 1 speaker and 1 subwoofer. The sound quality of the thing is outstanding, but the surround field leaves something to be desired... It projects stereo sound very well, but I don't think I've ever thought sound came from behind me. All in all, a good choice if avoiding wire clutter is a concern.

Are you sure the DAV-X1 can play HD DVDs? It may be upconverting standard definition DVD to HD resolution, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't support HD-DVD. Sony is behind the blu-ray format anyway, but I think this receiver precedes it.
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post #15 of 18 Old 01-09-2007, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cutrock View Post

. . . it was half the price of the Yamaha and Bose system when purchased online at Curcuit City.

Bose and Yamaha are hardly in the same league!
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post #16 of 18 Old 01-09-2007, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RFontenot View Post

The signal flowing through an HDMI cable is an encrypted digital stream. The audio and video signals coming out of the Replay's A/V jacks are old fashion analog signals. You will NEVER be able to send an analog audio/video signal through an HDMI connection. As Sony support indicated, in order to display the analog video signal from the Replay on your TV, you will need to connect your DAV-X1 to your TV using either the composite or S-video connections. The analog audio signal will play through the DAV-X1's speakers, as you have already discovered.

You can watch DVDs via the HDMI connection because the digital data is streamed off of the DVD, encrypted for transmission, send through the HDMI cable, then decrypted, decoded, and finally displayed on your digital TV.

The data flowing through an HDMI cable is sent by TMDS.

Encryption is a red herring, it has nothing to do with the issue.

If you want to send analog over HDMI you need a device to actively convert the analog signals to TMDS. Encryption is not necessary as all HDMI sinks can receive unencrypted TMDS signals.

The problem here is most likely what everyone else pointed out that the entry-level receivers only switch HDMI sources for their HDMI output and don't bother converting the analog inputs into digital.
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post #17 of 18 Old 01-10-2007, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little_blaine View Post


Are you sure the DAV-X1 can play HD DVDs? It may be upconverting standard definition DVD to HD resolution, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't support HD-DVD. Sony is behind the blu-ray format anyway, but I think this receiver precedes it.

Yes, you're correct, the DAV-X1 upconverts standard def DVD to HD resolution (not HD-DVD). The Bose 321 has a DVD player, but it doesn't upconvert DVD to HD Res.

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post #18 of 18 Old 01-10-2007, 06:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lsarver View Post

Bose and Yamaha are hardly in the same league!

Please elaborate...same league as what?

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