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post #1 of 71 Old 07-29-2010, 09:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Why am I doing this? My surround sound and watching movies is my hobby and I am continually trying to improve. I am about as far as I can go with everything in my system except, maybe, my HDMI cables. The cable I use is Monoprice's High Speed, Cat. 2, rated 1.4, six foot cable with a cost of $3.04. If there is a weak link in my system, the possibility is that link is the HDMI cable. Plus I have time on my hands and it sounded like fun.

Up front, I want to state that this is not a test backed by science. There was not one meter, scope or any other electronic measuring device in the room except for my eyes. My viewing was all I was concerned about. I didn't care whether the color saturation was one point lower on a meter gauge on one HDMI cable verses another. All I cared about was the best picture quality that is possible while sitting in my home theater watching Blu-ray movies.

Do I have an agenda against high priced or low priced HDMI cables? In away I do. I have used Monoprice cables for years and I like them BUT my real agenda was to get the best picture quality possible. So, my bias would be with the high-end cables in hopes that they will give me something better than what I have been viewing. If an expensive HDMI cable did give me a better picture, I would be happy and purchase that cable. So, yes I do have a bias towards any HDMI cable if it produced a better quality picture. If the cost of that quality cost $3.00 or $1,500.00, I would purchase. I am a strange video fanatic.

PARAMATERS:
Many high-end HDMI cables used to see how my $3.00 Monoprice cable stood up in video quality.

All cables are 6-6 ½ feet long. Plugged into a Marantz BD8002 Blu-ray player and ran directly to one of four HDMI inputs on a Samsung UN55B8000 LED/LCD TV.

The Samsung has four HDMI input connections. I used each TV HDMI input by plugging in four different HDMI cables at once so that all I had to do was change out and pop in one cable at a time into the player for an easy viewing comparison.

I sat 13 feet from my TV, all the shutters were closed, lights off, my wife playing cards at a neighbors while I tested each day. Viewing was in the afternoons so that even if all the shutters were closed that room was not totally dark.

Blu-rays and scene sections:
Knowing: because of a strange jitter/floating from the Blu movie while watching in the past. Scene selections 3, 4, 5, 6.

BARAKA: for sharpness, color and clarity. Watched fifteen minutes into the film from the beginning for each test.

Super Speedway: for speed, trailing, etc. Scene selections 5, 7, 11

After watching the selected Blu and its sections with an HDMI cable, the Blu was backed to its starting point, the HDMI cable switched and the Blu started again while taking notes on the color, clarity and sharpness for each test.

CABLES:
Visual:
All cables tested looked similar except for Wireworld Ultraviolet 6 and Monoprice.

All the cables were the typical round cable except for Wireworld which was flat. Wireworld says their exclusive flat design provides lower loss and higher precision than the conventional round HDMI.

The Monoprice cable is different in that on each end of the cable, just before the connectors, is a large knob. That knob is called a ferrite core. Monoprice stated that the purpose of the ferrite core is to filter noise and frequency interference.

Cable Specs:
All cables tested were high speed and supported the highest approved HDMI data rate of the 1.4.

HDMI Cables Tested:
Monoprice
High Speed 28AWG, $3.04
http://www.monoprice.com/products/pr...seq=1&format=2

Audioquest
Cinnamon, $89.00
Chocolate, $150.00
Carbon, $250.00
*Coffee, $700.00
*Diamond, $1,500.00
I tested a number of Audioquest's cables because of the silver content that was used from their Cinnamon cable to their Diamond.
http://www.audioquest.com/

Monster
THX Ultimate 1000, $150.00
http://www.monstercable.com/productdisplay.asp?pin=5328

Wireworld
Ultraviolet 6, $150.00
http://www.wireworldcable.com/products/119.html

*I have tried to locate Audioquest's $1,500.00 Diamond HDMI cable along with their $700.00 Coffee HDMI for testing but I was unable to find the cables anywhere. Through the Internet, I discovered the Audioquest Corporation was about 75 miles from my home. On Tuesday, July the 10th, I decided to drive to Audioquest to see if I could take a look at the cables or have them tell where one could be purchased.

I walked up the the front door of Audioquest to discover that it was locked. I pushed the red button on the intercom that was posted on the wall and a young woman answered and told me that this was not a retail store and she would not be able to help.

I told her I was trying to locate where I can pickup their Diamond HDMI cable. She asked me to please hold. Within a few minutes, a gentleman unlocked and opened the front door. He introduced himself as Dennis Miller, President of Audioquest. I told Mr. Miller what I wanted and was told the Diamond HDMI cable just had its final approved for sales and won't be on the market for 60 days.

I informed Mr. Miller that I wanted to test the Diamond and Coffee HDMIs for their video quality. Mr. Miller replied that the video section of the cables will not be any different then their Chocolate or Carbon. Where the difference lies between the Diamond and Coffee vs their other cables is in audio. The audio wires that run the length of the Diamond cable are 100% silver and Coffee are 10% silver and that is where the major leap is, in audio not video. Since I am testing HDMI cables for video and not audio, working with the Diamond or Coffee HDMIs would be a waste of time since I have already tested their Chocolate and Carbon HDMI cables.

Mr. Miller than asked me to tour the facility with him which I found extremely interesting. I was amazed watching all the VERY expensive cables and power cords being hand-put-together and what went into each high-end product.

THE DIFFERENCES:
Regarding the jittering/floating in Knowing that I have previously viewed: That phenomena maintained throughout all the cables tested leaving me to believe it was the film versus any HDMI cable.

While sitting on my couch meticulously watching a Blu-ray movie and the chosen scenes for testing, I discerened there was no way I could determine if one cable was better in video quality than another. They all looked virtually the same.

Where I discovered a very slight, minuscule difference was when I froze a frame of a scene. One such frame was section 3 of Knowing. In that scene, 2 actors are in the forefront and behind them were trees with fall colors that filled most of the screen. While frozen, I changed out each HDMI cable at the player and noticed very carefully any changes that might occur such as sharpness, color, etc. Back and fourth changing cables and observing almost every inch on the screen many, many, many times. First standing 15 feet away and then moving to within two feet of the TV trying to detect any difference from the frozen frame. I found it almost impossible to see any between the cables. Even though it was so slight to almost notice, I have to give the nod to the higher-priced cables above Audioquest's Cinnamon's price line. They all seemed a tiny, tiny bit richer in color in comparison to Monoprice and Audioquest's Cinnamon. BUT once again, it was so slight that it took me quite along time to make that observation from a frozen frame.

Another frozen frame tested was three minutes into BARAKA. In that scene the BARAKA logo came up in big bold letters across the TV. I froze the frame and once again back and fourth over and over trying to discern any differences anywhere. Even though so slight to almost be unnoticeable, I have to give the thumbs up to the higher-priced cables.

CONCLUSION:
99.99% of HD watchers that enjoy their movies, television, etc., would not see any differences between a decent HDMI cable, which makes Monoprice's $3.00 HD cable perfect, versus the more expensive cables on my test list. The other .01% are fanatics that think there could be a difference and then spend a lot of money just in case.

This testing is not definitive because I used my system and my eyes. Someone else might find a completely different result using their eyes and system but I would bet my findings are pretty accurate.

Save your money.

 

 

 

 

m


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post #2 of 71 Old 07-29-2010, 09:48 PM
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If you noticed "bolder color" you are fooling yourself...

Otherwise, everything is as expected.

There is no separate "audio" channel in an HDMI cable, unless he was referring to the audio return channel. In any case, it is digital and at a lot lower bit rate than the video going to the display. The silver won't make a difference.

Save your money...
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post #3 of 71 Old 07-29-2010, 11:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colm View Post

If you noticed "bolder color" you are fooling yourself...

Otherwise, everything is as expected.

There is no separate "audio" channel in an HDMI cable, unless he was referring to the audio return channel. In any case, it is digital and at a lot lower bit rate than the video going to the display. The silver won't make a difference.

Save your money...

Please don't take things out of context. What I said was:
They all seemed a tiny, tiny bit bolder in color

But you made me think. "Bolder" was the wrong use of words. I should have used "Richer" for there was a difference between two of the cables vs the others. Slight but there.


Save your money...
Funny, that is what I thought I said.

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post #4 of 71 Old 07-30-2010, 11:31 AM
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"Bolder" or "richer", you are fooling yourself. HDMI doesn't work that way.

I was suggesting that you follow your own advice. Save your money. Most of the rest of us already are.

BTW you didn't try what is arguably the best HDMI cable available, BJC's Series 1. It is quite reasonably priced, too.
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post #5 of 71 Old 07-30-2010, 11:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Colm View Post

"Bolder" or "richer", you are fooling yourself. HDMI doesn't work that way.

BTW you didn't try what is arguably the best HDMI cable available, BJC's Series 1. It is quite reasonably priced, too.

This was a test for "me" not for the world. I owned Monoprice not BJC.

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post #6 of 71 Old 07-30-2010, 12:02 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimShaw View Post

Up front, I want to state that this is not a test backed by science.

That needs reiterating.

This section also made me giggle:
Quote:


Mr. Miller replied that the video section of the cables will not be any different then their Chocolate or Carbon. Where the difference lies between the Diamond and Coffee vs their other cables is in audio. The audio wires that run the length of the Diamond cable are 100% silver and Coffee are 10% silver and that is where the major leap is, in audio not video. Since I am testing HDMI cables for video and not audio, working with the Diamond or Coffee HDMIs would be a waste of time since I have already tested their Chocolate and Carbon HDMI cables.

Did he actually say that in those words about the "audio wires?" Because that is amazing! There are no "audio wires" in HDMI. He should know that. Audio data in HDMI occurs during video blanking on the data pairs. Pretty stunning ignorance, but sadly not surprising coming from someone at Audioquest.

Quote:


They all seemed a tiny, tiny bit richer in color in comparison to Monoprice and Audioquest's Cinnamon. BUT once again, it was so slight that it took me quite along time to make that observation from a frozen frame.

Human perception weakness at work here. This is not something which can occur with HDMI cabling, or be affected by it, as colm points out. HDMI doesn't work that way, it's just a data feed.

Quote:


This testing is not definitive because I used my system and my eyes.

It also was not a 'blinded' test, which makes it entirely useless.

I guarantee that if you stuck a signal analyzer on the other end and compared the data feed, they would be 100% identical. The only real difference might be signal jitter, which would not have any impact on video at all anyway.

But tests like these are what you get and claims like those are what you hear from people who have no clue how HDMI works.
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post #7 of 71 Old 07-03-2012, 12:22 AM
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JimShaw, thank you for your amazing review on those HDMI cables. I, for one just bought the last Sony BRAVIS 46' XBR tv (they won't be making any more XBR's in the 46' size), and I was on a mad quest to find the best HDMI cable out there. Every store I walked into gave me different answers except for one place that told me I wouldn't be able to see the difference in video quality (I was only concerned with that aspect) between any of those HDMI cables. One pace even told me to get the MONSTER HD1000 series HDMI cable.
As I was googling I came upon the Audioquest Diamond HDMI cable and since it seemed to be their best wanted to get that one, as l'm a fanatic myself and must absolutely have the best. But your review saved me thousands of dollars as I'm now simply going to get the MONSTER HD1000 HDMI cable. Thank You
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post #8 of 71 Old 07-03-2012, 02:12 PM
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Still like the Kool Aid, huh?
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post #9 of 71 Old 07-09-2012, 03:41 AM
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Nah. First post, it's definitely a salesman from Monster (TM).

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

Give a monkey a brain and he'll swear he's the center of the universe. -Fishbone
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post #10 of 71 Old 07-09-2012, 06:59 PM
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Oh, make that handing out Kool Aid...
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post #11 of 71 Old 01-08-2013, 03:40 PM
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+ 1 for audioquest hdmi's

They're great
I went from basic hdmi to hdmi x bu audioquest
It was an improvement over first Chinese cable for sure.

Then chocalate which was my favourite until I tried carbon from aq. Best I can afford.

Sound better too

Gotta be it contains 5% silver.

I was a sceptic before
0's and 1's blah bla bla,

But I gave chocalate a shot then went from there.

I'm convinced now ,,
And I don't care what all you audio professor spew about theory ,
I'm keeping these.



http://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-Carbon-Series-percent-Silver/product-reviews/B0035OWI1W/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1
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post #12 of 71 Old 02-22-2013, 06:45 PM
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Vm844
I also got the very same results,I have over 20k in a/v equipment and have tryed many,many HDMI cables
Audioquest are by far my favorite..the picture is very sharp,detailed,and 3-d..but the sound quality is most def.where you hear the difference!
Carbon is just awesome..cinnamon and chocolate are also a notch or two above any others I have had in my system..highly recommended.. You others have no idea what your missing!
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post #13 of 71 Old 02-23-2013, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esh516 View Post

Vm844
I also got the very same results,I have over 20k in a/v equipment and have tryed many,many HDMI cables
Audioquest are by far my favorite..the picture is very sharp,detailed,and 3-d..but the sound quality is most def.where you hear the difference!
Carbon is just awesome..cinnamon and chocolate are also a notch or two above any others I have had in my system..highly recommended.. You others have no idea what your missing!
That's good because I'd hate to think you'd see a difference in the audio. BTW when one posts a post such as yours they usually end it with a 'smilie' like one of these: rolleyes.gifcool.giftongue.gifwink.gifeek.gif
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post #14 of 71 Old 03-07-2013, 07:53 AM
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Colm, Wiggles and olyteddy, just because you can't afford high end cables, please don't disparage those of us who can. I have a standard definition tv and was thinking of upgrading to hd, but when 4K was announced, I decided to wait. However, I heard about the Diamond hdmi cable. I recently hooked it up to my standard def tv and WOW! My picture quality is better than the 4K setup at Best Buy. It looks more like 8k. The audio sounds awesome too. My htib speakers sound like the Wilson Alexandria speakers I heard at an audio show. I also notice that when I'm streaming pics and home video from my htpc, I look taller and more handsome and my wife's even hotter. Lastly, I've noticed when streaming movies, my Internet speed is noticeably faster. It went from average speeds of 15-20gbs to Google fiber speeds around 300 gbs. These cables are awesome.
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post #15 of 71 Old 03-07-2013, 10:32 AM
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Well, I guess I am just going to have to ask for overtime at Walmart so I can afford some of them cables.
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post #16 of 71 Old 03-07-2013, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vm8444 View Post

+ 1 for audioquest hdmi's

They're great
I went from basic hdmi to hdmi x bu audioquest
It was an improvement over first Chinese cable for sure.

Then chocalate which was my favourite until I tried carbon from aq. Best I can afford.

Sound better too

Gotta be it contains 5% silver.

I was a sceptic before
0's and 1's blah bla bla,

But I gave chocalate a shot then went from there.

I'm convinced now ,,
And I don't care what all you audio professor spew about theory ,
I'm keeping these.

http://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-Carbon-Series-percent-Silver/product-reviews/B0035OWI1W/ref=dp_top_cm_cr_acr_txt?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1

You obviously sell Audioquest cables.

Edit - and google confirms.

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #17 of 71 Old 03-14-2013, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Neurorad View Post

You obviously sell Audioquest cables.

Edit - and google confirms.

Yes so?

Mark up not gonna make me rich but a lotta satisfied customers
From all my installs.
They're choice never forced!

I was once a sceptic till I gave aq a shot.
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post #18 of 71 Old 03-15-2013, 08:12 AM
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Some people would argue a salesman for something isn't exactly an impartial source tongue.gifwink.gif
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post #19 of 71 Old 03-15-2013, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by NickTheGreat View Post

Some people would argue a salesman for something isn't exactly an impartial source tongue.gifwink.gif

I sold "high-end" cables at a hi-fi store when I was in college, and I knew they were no better than the cheap stuff. One easy way I could tell (other than the sound) was by checking the manufacturer's cost which was marginally higher than the store brand, but the retail price was exponentially greater. Mostly marketing mumbo jumbo.
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post #20 of 71 Old 03-15-2013, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
And I don't care what all you audio professor spew about theory ,

Brilliant, willful ignorance!
Quote:
They're choice never forced!
Quote:
I sold "high-end" cables at a hi-fi store when I was in college,

you went to college?
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post #21 of 71 Old 03-15-2013, 01:31 PM
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Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post


you went to college?

Did you go to college? Do you understand the colloquial use of quotation marks to indicate when an item purports to be something it's not? Or perhaps you erroneously quoted the wrong person.
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post #22 of 71 Old 03-16-2013, 12:16 PM
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I would like to pitch in here.


I feel there has been a fashionable negative attitude towards the benefits of higher/high quality/end HDMI cabling over the last seven or so years.


Fashionable to pretend there is absolutely no difference between A&B. And for some absolutely embarrassing to even remotely hint they noticed even 0.5% of a difference for the positive/good. On the UK version of these forums there are quite a few people who could never admit that they have good cabling - for fear of ridicule from ignorant biased people (some, not all) who haven't even tried said cable - and point the finger of 'delusion'.



Personally I would be embarrassed if I hadn't noticed any difference with some cabling, as some things are glaringly obvious.


By that I mean video as well as audio. I'm not talking night and day difference but improvement nonetheless. And not necessarily just the £90 better than the £5 HDMI. I have seen a £20 cable (look) better than a £70 cable. So no one will tell me it's brain washing snake oil 100% of the time


I think you need to know your type of display, and components, and material (inside out)

Some differences are bigger but it's usually sharpness and clarity difference (however slight) for me.



But there (is) so many variables - before the cable is plugged in that in my honest opinion - unfair to call a person delusional because they may genuinely feel an improvement has been made. Good luck to them I say.



A clean as possible power supply, going through good quality components, whilst viewing quality material on correct settings are more important obviously firstly though. Then worry about the last link :-P


;-)
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post #23 of 71 Old 03-16-2013, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

I feel there has been a fashionable negative attitude towards the benefits of higher/high quality/end HDMI cabling over the last seven or so years.

Facts have always been in fashion...
Quote:
Fashionable to pretend there is absolutely no difference between A&B.

Offer any scientific proof that there's a difference.
Quote:
And for some absolutely embarrassing to even remotely hint they noticed even 0.5% of a difference for the positive/good.

Let's pretend there was a .5% difference. For whatever the cost difference is, over a $5 cable, it took to obtain that difference, that money would be better spent on speakers, amps, displays, projectors, etc. Replace a $2000 display and $1000 HDMI cable with $5 cable and a $2995 display - you'll see that difference! (an exaggeration, but you get my point)

Quote:
By that I mean video as well as audio. I'm not talking night and day difference but improvement nonetheless. And not necessarily just the £90 better than the £5 HDMI. I have seen a £20 cable (look) better than a £70 cable. So no one will tell me it's brain washing snake oil 100% of the time

A defective cable, yes, but ALL claims of subtle improvements in image quality are simply not true. It's a digital signal, operating a digital display. So even subtle effects (clock jitter) that affected DAC performance on CD's don't apply - because there's no final analog stage to be affected.
Quote:
Some differences are bigger but it's usually sharpness and clarity difference (however slight) for me.

Any difference you're seeing at that level is placebo effect. If you feel better and/or believe it makes a difference for you, so be it. But it really doesn't.


Jeff

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post #24 of 71 Old 03-18-2013, 03:05 PM
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I did mention Jeff that i saw a difference in a (more expensive cable) (not) being as good on occasion with a reference to the fashionable "snake oil" claim.


But i failed to mention that by going to the same AV store for years has enabled me to "try before i buy" Mostly demo cables but the odd one not. I have only seen two genuinely exceptional cables out of maybe 20 or so (no not the most expensive). Silver, of course the superior conducter in electronics...quality of materials... shielding, and just general build quality all (help)


Also like i mentioned though earlier - it's the last link - everything before it needs to be maxed or it genuinely is a pointless exercise to a certain degree.
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post #25 of 71 Old 03-18-2013, 04:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

But i failed to mention that by going to the same AV store for years has enabled me to "try before i buy" Mostly demo cables but the odd one not. I have only seen two genuinely exceptional cables out of maybe 20 or so (no not the most expensive). Silver, of course the superior conducter in electronics...quality of materials... shielding, and just general build quality all (help)

Also like i mentioned though earlier - it's the last link - everything before it needs to be maxed or it genuinely is a pointless exercise to a certain degree.

There could be some differences in analog signal cables due to electrical characteristics (I don't believe these are audible, but we'll leave it at that for this discussion) - not counting general shielding, wire gauge and other measurable effects as a given. But for truly digital signal paths like HDMI, Dolby Digital / DTS audio, etc. where there are NO analog transitions that could be affected by any "non-defective" cable, there will be no difference. If the bits arrive intact, and that means "close enough to be correctly called a 1 or 0", the result is identical. There can be no subtle effects like blacker-blanks or crisper pictures, or more dynamic DTS-MA bass...

So if you're talking about previous experience with speaker cables or analog interconnects, I'll have to take your word for it, but for HDMI cables, this really is science, and anything perceived was, well, perception...

And any points about build quality or aesthetics is really a separate discussion. Most of the "high end" cables are certainly well-made and lots of them look very nice. Nothing wrong with paying extra for those things. Same as chrome headers and exhaust tips. Just don't tell me the car runs faster or gets better gas mileage with them. smile.gif

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post #26 of 71 Old 03-19-2013, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by jautor View Post

There could be some differences in analog signal cables due to electrical characteristics (I don't believe these are audible, but we'll leave it at that for this discussion) - not counting general shielding, wire gauge and other measurable effects as a given. But for truly digital signal paths like HDMI, Dolby Digital / DTS audio, etc. where there are NO analog transitions that could be affected by any "non-defective" cable, there will be no difference. If the bits arrive intact, and that means "close enough to be correctly called a 1 or 0", the result is identical. There can be no subtle effects like blacker-blanks or crisper pictures, or more dynamic DTS-MA bass...

So if you're talking about previous experience with speaker cables or analog interconnects, I'll have to take your word for it, but for HDMI cables, this really is science, and anything perceived was, well, perception...

And any points about build quality or aesthetics is really a separate discussion. Most of the "high end" cables are certainly well-made and lots of them look very nice. Nothing wrong with paying extra for those things. Same as chrome headers and exhaust tips. Just don't tell me the car runs faster or gets better gas mileage with them. smile.gif

Jeff


No i wouldn't dream of saying that Jeff ;-)


But all petrol/gas gets from A2B. But there is more refined fuel that gets you there a (bit) better if you know what i am getting at.


But of course not a tremendous difference, as it can't change engine size or base performance ;-)
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post #27 of 71 Old 03-19-2013, 08:36 AM
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But all petrol/gas gets from A2B. But there is more refined fuel that gets you there a (bit) better if you know what i am getting at.

But of course not a tremendous difference, as it can't change engine size or base performance ;-)

I'm saying that's not a good analogy. Changing the chemistry of the fuel could absolutely change the performance (better or worse!) of the engine. Digital signals don't work like that. Better analogy would be putting the same gas (our digital signal, which doesn't change) into a chrome-plated gas tank and wrapping the fuel lines in carbon fiber sleeves. Might look cool, might hold up better over time, but doesn't make the engine run any differently...

It's the believe that there are subtle improvements possible with digital signals that's a fallacy. Ones and zeros. (Past issues with CD audio and DACs - where the differences are really at the analog transition, doesn't apply here)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jautor View Post

There could be some differences in analog signal cables due to electrical characteristics (I don't believe these are audible, but we'll leave it at that for this discussion) - not counting general shielding, wire gauge and other measurable effects as a given. But for truly digital signal paths like HDMI, Dolby Digital / DTS audio, etc. where there are NO analog transitions that could be affected by any "non-defective" cable, there will be no difference. If the bits arrive intact, and that means "close enough to be correctly called a 1 or 0", the result is identical. There can be no subtle effects like blacker-blanks or crisper pictures, or more dynamic DTS-MA bass...

So if you're talking about previous experience with speaker cables or analog interconnects, I'll have to take your word for it, but for HDMI cables, this really is science, and anything perceived was, well, perception...

...

+1 (and more)

Everytime someone brings up a perceived difference with more expensive HDMI cables improving the picture, not one person yet has provided a method by which that video is improved. The "best" I've read was someone who claimed to discover an analog audio signal on HDMI that was improved. Of course, the fact that there is no analog signal on HDMI didn't get in the way of this non-explanation.

What goes across the HDMI cables are bits. The bits are represented by a range of voltage levels (not just one) per bit. The start of the bits are indicated by transitions in voltages. We also know that bit errors are visible (or audible) with HDMI. High speed data and encryption with no error correction on the video and audio data make this possible. So, what mechanism allows a dumb cable to improve the picture quality consistently (for many minutes)across many bits and still allows for encryption? If someone would be kind--enough to answer with a real-world physical description, maybe I'll become a believer. Until then, this is snake oil.

Really this another great example of "golden ears" where if you spend a lot of money on an improved audio device then your audio must be improved or you wouldn't have spent the money (QED). It's just now being applied to video as well. The cable must improve the video because I spent more money than on a cheaper cable. It isn't the eyes that are most important for determining PQ in this case, it's the brain.

How come we don't have this discussion for USB or S/PDIF or SATA cables? Does a better USB cable mean that the bits going to a hard drive are better? We accept that those bits are the same (or otherwise our programs wouldn't work), so what's special about HDMI cables?
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post #29 of 71 Old 03-19-2013, 12:07 PM
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I would propose that choosing a high(er) grade HDMI cable means that it's no longer a possible problem for HDMI handshake issues. A pro installer wouldn't start with the cheapest, and continue to upgrade until he finds one that works - if it's even the problem.

If I was a pro, I would start with quality HDMI cables. It's my dime to return to troubleshoot, and including drive time, that's a pile of money. Don't blame an installer for choosing pricier cables - unless they're unreasonably priced, and marketed.

Blue Jeans makes some great cables, at a reasonable price. I'd probably stock those, if I was a pro (and didn't have access to other comparable distributors).

Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. -Buddha

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post #30 of 71 Old 03-19-2013, 06:56 PM
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