Hard-wiring ir emitter to components... - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 03-01-2012, 08:45 AM - Thread Starter
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When installing IR emitters on clients equipment, I always like to keep the emitter/wire as invisible as possible. For Crestron (or similar) systems, this means unscrewing the bezel of the TV, and hiding an emitter near the TV's IR receiver.

I have always hated emitters and the ugly wiring associated with them.

I do this all the time for iPod docks, BD/DVD players, etc... Basically anything that the client will touch or jostle. Because I'm sure you're all frustrated with emitters that have fallen off and don't relay the signal to the intended device!


Normally when using a Xantech or Russound IR routing kit, you have on the IR receiver : +12vdc, ground, and a signal lead. By splicing the emitter's gound lead to the receivers ground, and then splicing the emitters +vdc lead to the IR receivers signal lead, it works and transmits the IR.

I absolutely LOVE equipment with a 3.5mm mono IR input on the rear panel so as an experiment I wanted to see if I could create my own hardwired 3.5mm IR input onto ANY piece.

Here's where i'm at:

I have always noticed that IR receivers on devices have three "legs" soldered to the equipments PCB.

One for +5 VDC, one for -5 VDC and lastly the signal out.

I experimented with trying all sorts of splicing combinations and I was able to get one to work on my Samsung BD player.

I soldered the shield of the 3.5mm plug to the signal out, and the tip to the ground. It seems to be working 100% with my SpeakerCraft IR Routing kit.

Can anyone share a little insight?

Thanks in advance, Michael.
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Old 03-01-2012, 11:47 AM
 
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One for +5 VDC, one for -5 VDC and lastly the signal out.

It's ground, not -5V.
Signal out is active low, open collector with a weak pullup and is the demodulated signal received.
IR emitters(LEDs) are driven by a modulated signal.

I modify equipment with a optocoupler. Connect the collector and emitter of the opto to the signal out and ground of the IR receiver in the equipment, connect the input LED to a 3.5mm connector mounted on the back. Drive this with the demodulated signal from an external IR receiver.
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Old 04-05-2012, 08:37 AM
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So you're violating the warranty on customer gear by hacking into the hardware. And they're aware of this? And now you're talking about adding an electrical connection to the hardware, which was never designed to share a ground or signal voltages with anything outside of it. And you're carrying what sort of fire/liability insurance against these hacks leading to a fire in what's probably a very expensive residence?

Not that I don't sympathize with the desire to eliminate IR emitter problems, just question whether I'd ever use an integrator that made those kinds of hacks. I'd rather go with gear better designed for the purpose. Might be more expensive but it doesn't seem like that target demographic would care much about it. They WOULD care about stuff like this burning down their house though...

Using an optocoupler is a lot less likely to cause problems with the existing circuits in the equipment. Wiring direct seems like a bad idea from several perspectives. It would just seem smarter to put an IR emitter in there and leave the existing circuits out of the connection entirely. Bearing in mind the warranty issues though...
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Old 04-05-2012, 11:38 AM
 
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And now you're talking about adding an electrical connection to the hardware, which was never designed to share a ground or signal voltages with anything outside of it.

That's why an optocoupler is suggested.

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And you're carrying what sort of fire/liability insurance against these hacks leading to a fire in what's probably a very expensive residence?

5V at 20mA isn't going to start a fire, no matter how hard you try.
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Old 04-05-2012, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post

5V at 20mA isn't going to start a fire, no matter how hard you try.

Tampering inside an AC powered device does nothing to decrease the likelihood of risk from fire. Yes, low voltage isn't really the issue. It's the hacking up the inside of an AC powered device that's the issue. The risk being the aftermath of a possible fire and assigning blame. The safe side of the situation isn't the one that hacked up the boxes. I don't see disliking the look or possible maintenance issues with external emitters as a good enough reason to start hacking up the hardware.

I post this perspective as this is the DIY tweaks section.

But then it's also hard to see why a licensed professional would put that at risk either. Yet far worse things get done too, so go figure.
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Old 04-05-2012, 12:04 PM
 
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Tampering inside an AC powered device does nothing to decrease the likelihood of risk from fire.

nor does it increase it.

Quote:


It's the hacking up the inside of an AC powered device that's the issue

Speak for yourself, you may be a hack, but others aren't.

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I don't see disliking the look or possible maintenance issues with external emitters as a good enough reason to start hacking up the hardware.

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it.

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I post this perspective as this is the DIY tweaks section.

Likewise, this is a DIY section...some people aren't as scared to open equipment up.
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Old 04-06-2012, 10:44 PM
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After reading this thread got the same idea so I when and open my audio receiver, my dish receiver and my popcorn hour box, definetly everything looks nicer and dont think it will cause my hiuse to burn, evrything was done on a profesional way
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:46 PM
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Can anyone diagram this for me? (I have old equipment that I want to send my Xantech IR distribution signal to, without the emitters on the front panels. (Also will hardwiring the jack into the IR reciever stop the receiver from working?)

I'm subscribing cause I think most of the information I need is here, I just have to figure out how to read it. Thanks

My "Route 66 Basement Theater" Build Thread
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Old 10-19-2013, 02:26 PM
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I work in professional AV industry and there are people not qualified to open equipment.  No training in electronics.  I've seen new projectors not work after taking the case apart and putting it back together.  Things aren't built for just anyone to work on.  They can be a challenge for those with training.  If it's new and under warranty you can void that as well as causing fire or electric shock hazards.  You had better get the customer to release you from any liability.  Hack at your own risk regardless of your expertise.  

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Old 10-19-2013, 03:09 PM
 
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If you don't have the skill to modify an electronic device, don't attempt to....but don't tell others, who you know nothing about, what to do in a DIY forum.
ScAndal and zombied601 like this.
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Old 10-04-2015, 08:10 AM
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Not just fire danger; RF/noise changes as well...

Something else not mentioned in this discussion: today's electronic equipment often has subtle design elements that protect the nearby environment (and the equipment itself) from RF noise and interference.

If you're hacking the case in ANY way, you may be modifying that carefully designed noise shield "skin."

I'm not saying "don't touch"... I'm saying you should be aware of the implications of what you are doing, including things that are not visible to the naked eye, particularly if the modification is on behalf of a customer.

Something as simple as slipping a thin wire through the edge of a case can create a basically invisible gap in the shielding... a gap that allows RF noise in and out.
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Old 11-24-2015, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAM64 View Post
Quote:

One for +5 VDC, one for -5 VDC and lastly the signal out.


It's ground, not -5V.
Signal out is active low, open collector with a weak pullup and is the demodulated signal received.
IR emitters(LEDs) are driven by a modulated signal.

I modify equipment with a optocoupler. Connect the collector and emitter of the opto to the signal out and ground of the IR receiver in the equipment, connect the input LED to a 3.5mm connector mounted on the back. Drive this with the demodulated signal from an external IR receiver.
Hi there - tried sending you a PM to get more details on this, but I think you've chosen to disable PMs. Can you respond and provide more details on how exactly you hooked this up? I am looking to integrate a 3.5mm female plug to one piece of equipment that currently has an IR receiver soldered onto the circuit board (to allow easy connection to my IR block). Can you please tell me where I am supposed to solder the signal and tip wires from the 3.5mm cable? Thank you!
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Old 11-25-2015, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
(to allow easy connection to my IR block)
Does the "IR block" output a demodulated (baseband) signal?
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Old 11-25-2015, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by scruff67 View Post
Does the "IR block" output a demodulated (baseband) signal?
It's a Xantech IR repeater system. I plan to connect a 3.5mm mono male plug directly from the IR repeating block (Xantech 791-44) to the female 3.5mm plug that is connected to the device that I would like to control.
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Old 11-25-2015, 01:36 PM
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That doesn't answer my question, but I'm going to guess that the 3.5mm plug usually connects to an IR LED, therefore the block is outputting a modulated signal, not a baseband signal, which would be required if you want to connect directly to some equipment, bypassing the IR receiver.
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Old 11-25-2015, 01:43 PM
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Thank you. I'm not an electronics guy, but I assume this is the job of the optocoupler as referenced in an earlier post.
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Old 11-26-2015, 07:16 AM
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No, the optocoupler just provides isolation.
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Old 11-26-2015, 07:17 AM
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The easiest solution for you would be to mount an IR emitter inside the device, near the devices existing IR receiver.
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