Emotiva Pro 'Stealth 8' - 400W Bi-Amped Reference Monitor with Airmotiv™Tweeter - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 45 Old 01-31-2013, 07:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Emotiva Pro largest and most powerful speaker is the new Stealth 8 monitor. Designated as a near field monitor, the Stealth 8 is packed with audiophile-friendly features and plenty of power. The highlight of this 400-watt bi-amplified speaker is the airmotiv™ tweeter, powered by its own 200 watt amp. The use of folded diaphragm tweeters is gaining in popularity, chosen for their near-perfect transient response. The Stealth 8 pairs such a tweeter with an 8" woofer to provide 115db of output at 1 watt/meter. Both drivers are mounted to a 2" thick extruded baffle, helping to minimize diffraction and giving the monitor a very serious industrial look.
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"Our amps are not simply monsters of power. Each is a true audiophile reference, with fully discrete design, extensive use of surface-mount parts, precision resistors and film capacitors. The transformer is a custom toroid for exceptional efficiency. Take a look inside the Stealth series monitors, and you'd swear you're looking inside a megabuck audiophile amp."

http://emotivapro.com/products/powered_monitors/stealth8.php

At $750 a piece the Stealths are not exactly bargain speakers, however with so much power for each unit and a design that emphasizes performance above other factors, I am left wondering what happens if you hook a pair of these directly to a high-quality audio source with balanced outputs? Do you need anything more to appreciate music at an audiophile level? Could you use five, or seven of these speakers to put together a brutally minimalist home theater? I would argue that such a combination brings one close to replicating a studio mixing environment at home, while satisfying the requirement of discerning audiophiles in terms of build quality and design. This is especially true in the case of the folded diaphragm tweeter - Emotiva states they will play near-flat from 30hz to 23,000 hz within +/- 1.75 - with specs like that, the only kind of subwoofer one would need is the sort that really brings an LFE track to life and can play down to 20hz or lower.
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The Stealth 8 is a precision, bi-amplified active studio monitor that features a high frequency driver very similar to those found in speakers from GoldenEar and MartinLogan’s Motion line.

http://www.technologytell.com/hometech/92432/emotiva-pro-announces-stealth-8-precision-bi-amplified-active-studio-monitor/

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post #2 of 45 Old 01-31-2013, 09:14 AM
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My Klipsch XF-48 are self powered along with a number of other speakers out there. I always wondered if that was a true benefit as the manufacturer could match the tweeter and woofer(s) with the appropriate amp or is it better to just buy a quality amp and pair it to the speaker?

It’s how most subs are sold so it seems like a good idea to me.

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post #3 of 45 Old 02-01-2013, 10:26 AM - Thread Starter
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In the case of this speaker I think the built-in amp is a plus because of the generous power specs and the bi-amping. Achieving the same thing with outboard amps and buying speakers of this quality to go with it would likely cost the same or more. If you hook a pair of these up to a good source with balanced XLR cables, you'd be good to go. Such a tempting speaker.smile.gif
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My Klipsch XF-48 are self powered along with a number of other speakers out there. I always wondered if that was a true benefit as the manufacturer could match the tweeter and woofer(s) with the appropriate amp or is it better to just buy a quality amp and pair it to the speaker?

It’s how most subs are sold so it seems like a good idea to me.

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post #4 of 45 Old 02-01-2013, 12:11 PM
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Studio monitors are usually designed for nearfield work.
i would like to see the response and sound levels attainable at HT type distances before thinking of using them in that kind of setup.

Example:

Maximum Acoustic Output (pair, short term)
115 dB SPL (sine wave, @ 1 meter, on axis, radiating into half space)
121 dB SPL (sine wave, @ 0.5 meter, on axis, radiating into half space)

What would be the output at say 4 meters?
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post #5 of 45 Old 02-01-2013, 01:59 PM
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Anechoically (that is, sound directly from the speaker as it is likely quoted above, and not including room reflections), SPL from a point source drops 6 dB every time you double the distance. So if it is 115 dB at 1 meter, it would be 103 dB at 4 meters.

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post #6 of 45 Old 02-01-2013, 11:02 PM
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This looks like a great speaker! Wonder how they'd perform behind a AT screen?

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post #7 of 45 Old 02-01-2013, 11:14 PM
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200 watts for a tweeter?

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #8 of 45 Old 02-01-2013, 11:38 PM
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If you want the output levels and added headroom to play clean at or near reference level, with a 4 m or greater seating distance in a treated room,your going to need more capability than what a near-field monitor can produce.You would need at least a mid-field monitor for those requirements. The Emotiva Pro Stealth 8 will not be able to put out enough output at it's rated low limit of 30hz to meet reference level requirements by itself.Most of those size monitors have there highest output in the 80-2000 hz range.That's usually the range were those max output numbers come from.

I use THX approved near-field reference monitors with 8 inch woofers( that output 111dB max per pair on axis at acoustic half space at 1m), at a 2m seating distance, in a partially treated room and they are just shy of meeting the 105dB peak output requirements for reference level playback at that distance.You would still want at least another 3dB or preferable 6dB of added headroom to play cleanly with low distortion.I don't listen at are very close to reference,so it's not that big of a deal,but It would be nice to have that added headroom just for peace of mind.wink.gif
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post #9 of 45 Old 02-02-2013, 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

200 watts for a tweeter?

You need to look at the speaker design before making a comment like that.
It isn't like 200W feeding a car tweeter full range.rolleyes.gif
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post #10 of 45 Old 02-02-2013, 07:52 AM
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I have the Airmotiv 5's, but I'm looking at these for my main computer room. I bought the 5's before the 8's were released. I've heard the Stealth 8's before but they were too big for my desk. I have decided to pull my desk forward about 18" and use stands, like the Ultimate Support ones Emotiva used in their demo, and put them behind the desk. I'm just waiting for another Emotiva sale along with the DC-1 DAC they were supposed to release with these. I guess I'm shooting for summer maybe.

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post #11 of 45 Old 02-02-2013, 09:12 AM - Thread Starter
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I don't run my speakers full range, I use stereo subwoofers (four subs total). That's how I would field these speakers, with stereo subs that can play flat to 20 hz and up to 115db at 1m - that's going to sound tight. A pair of these speakers should play 6db louder than one speaker at they are already rated at 115db at 1meter, AFAIK that should make them THX-Ultra certification-capable already so long as you use a sub that's up to the task you're good to go.

I would never suggest using these speakers in an inappropriate manner, like trying to achieve reference in a large treated room with just two of these speakers, no sub. One look at my own system should tell you I'm not that guy... at 2.5 meters, I have over 2,400 watts running my L/R mains. What I do suggest is that they will perform like a similar 8" 2-way bi-amped bookshelf speaker from a reputable manufacturer - a popular choice for critical listening. If you are looking for a folded-diaphragm tweeter, there are not so many options - look at Martin Logan's offering, the Motion 15 for $800/pair. No way that's going to achieve any decent SPL, it's a puny speaker and you still need an amp. That's what I find interesting about these, plus the baffle design which is both cool looking and totally logical.
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If you want the output levels and added headroom to play clean at or near reference level, with a 4 m or greater seating distance in a treated room,your going to need more capability than what a near-field monitor can produce.You would need at least a mid-field monitor for those requirements. The Emotiva Pro Stealth 8 will not be able to put out enough output at it's rated low limit of 30hz to meet reference level requirements by itself.Most of those size monitors have there highest output in the 80-2000 hz range.That's usually the range were those max output numbers come from.

I use THX approved near-field reference monitors with 8 inch woofers( that output 111dB max per pair on axis at acoustic half space at 1m), at a 2m seating distance, in a partially treated room and they are just shy of meeting the 105dB peak output requirements for reference level playback at that distance.You would still want at least another 3dB or preferable 6dB of added headroom to play cleanly with low distortion.I don't listen at are very close to reference,so it's not that big of a deal,but It would be nice to have that added headroom just for peace of mind.wink.gif

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post #12 of 45 Old 02-02-2013, 10:13 AM
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"Our amps are not simply monsters of power. Each is a true audiophile reference, with fully discrete design, extensive use of surface-mount parts, precision resistors and film capacitors. The transformer is a custom toroid for exceptional efficiency. Take a look inside the Stealth series monitors, and you'd swear you're looking inside a megabuck audiophile amp."

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post #13 of 45 Old 02-02-2013, 07:45 PM
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Still not getting it lol frown.gif. Why would you need that much power for a tweeter? Don't think anyone would ever use 1/8 of that power! Can this airmotive tweeter really play down to 30hz with authority? If so I can understand the 200watts but it also has a woofer?
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Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

You need to look at the speaker design before making a comment like that.
It isn't like 200W feeding a car tweeter full range.rolleyes.gif

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #14 of 45 Old 02-03-2013, 01:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Still not getting it lol frown.gif. Why would you need that much power for a tweeter? Don't think anyone would ever use 1/8 of that power! Can this airmotive tweeter really play down to 30hz with authority? If so I can understand the 200watts but it also has a woofer?
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Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

You need to look at the speaker design before making a comment like that.
It isn't like 200W feeding a car tweeter full range.rolleyes.gif

I was curious, here's one explanation http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=stupid&action=print&thread=22938

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post #15 of 45 Old 02-03-2013, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Still not getting it lol frown.gif. Why would you need that much power for a tweeter? Don't think anyone would ever use 1/8 of that power! Can this airmotive tweeter really play down to 30hz with authority? If so I can understand the 200watts but it also has a woofer?

I agree 200 Watts is a lot for a tweeter. Maybe Emotiva just wants to make sure the power is "adequate" at all times.. Maybe they use a stereo amp and both channels are therefore of equal power... BTW, all Emotiva Pro speakers have identical power for tweeter and midwoofer (25+25 for Airmotiv 4, 50+50 for the 5, 100+100 for the 6). There will also be a Stealth 6, about the same size as the Airmotiv 6. I don't know the specs or the price of that one.

Anyway, the real forte of this design is not that the amps are built in, but that there's an active crossover BEFORE the amps, hence avoiding all the bad things happening in passive crossovers. Passive crossovers are inherently flawed. Simple as that.

To all those doubting the SPL capacity, how loud can "normal" passive loudspeakers play? Not many can reach THX ultra level IMO. You can feed many Watts to them, but you risk heating damage or mechanical failure.
Here's an interesting article:
http://www.audioholics.com/education/loudspeaker-basics/loudspeaker-sensitivity
A quote from p2:
We’ve all heard the -6dB inverse square law of SPL reduction for every doubling of distance but in reality that pertains to free space, or an anechoic chamber – which is a room without echoes. Real world listening rooms will see more along the lines of 3-4dB of loss for every doubling of distance. But for arguments sake, we stick to the common -6dB figure for all of our calculations in this article. Just recognize the real world losses should be much less, unless of course you live in an anechoic chamber or are listening to your speakers outdoor in free space.

I have a pair of airmotiv 5 (50+50 Watt each) that I really like in a bedroom sized space at 2 meter listening distance. The only thing is that they quickly loose high frequency response once at 30° off axis. But the stealth 8 seems to have solved that (at least that's the claim of the cabinet design, have to listen myself first).

I fail to see why the stealth 8 would not work in my HT at 3.6 meter, especially with the crossover to the sub at 80 Hz, as per THX recommendation. The room is four times bigger than the one with the airmotiv 5, but so is the power of the stealth 8.
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post #16 of 45 Old 02-04-2013, 05:49 PM
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I did have the opportunity to listen to the Stealth 8s at the Emotiva complex in Franklin Tn. Here is my two cents.


Attached – my wife with the Emotiva mascot – unfortunately I had to tell her Jackson was not for sale!

First and foremost, visiting Emotiva was a very pleasant and informative experience. Emotiva sales and engineering folks are world class – knowledgeable, extremely professional and courteous. Both my wife and I felt relaxed and were treated like VIPs. They took their time to demonstrate all the various products and answered the many questions I had. This was actually no surprise given the experience I’ve had with them on the phone.

My original intention was to audition their amps and preamps – not monitors. I was interested in the UMC-200 and XMC-1 (got to see but not hear) preamps along with the XPA-3 and XPA-2 amps for my HT overhaul. My curiosity had the best of me after reading so many positive Emotiva reviews. I just had to hear them myself. So I jumped at the chance to actually listen to them at the Emotiva HQ in Tennessee. All it took was a phone call and we were given the OK to stop by.

I am writing about the Stealth 8 monitors so I won’t say much about the amps, although I am very impressed – audio craftsmanship at its finest, period!

Again, I had absolutely no intentions of listening to Near/Mid Field monitors. But it happened, I was given the chance to listen to the Stealth 8 monitors and they were quite a surprise. Before I actually listened to them I had to touch, partially lift, fully examine, etc., and came to the immediate conclusion these had a solid high quality build. OK, fire them up!

Wow, simply amazing! The soundstage gave the feeling the drum kit I was listening to was hovering in mid air, right in front of me. The lows were impeccable and powerful – wonderfully palpable. Something I’ve missed from my current HT setup using Mackie 824s and 628s. The Mackie combination worked in a smaller room, but I have since moved and now have a larger HT room where the SPL from the Mackie monitors gets swallowed up. I even took the surrounds (624s) and paired with the 824s to get more SPL – did not help much. I did not have time to audition vocals on the Stealth 8s, but what music I did hear blew me away.

Bottom line – after listening to these I’m now considering ditching my pre/pro and amp separates with new tower speakers and matching center channel design to replacing the Mackies with the Stealth 8 monitors. New preamp and Stealth 8s – done! This eliminates the need for new cables and separate amps. Just my thoughts.

Mackie 824 has a woofer size of 8.75”, 100dB SPL @ 1meter and freq. response of 39Hz to 20K Hz +/- 1.5 dB. Low –frequency amp is 150 watts and the high is 100 watts with THD < .035%. Weight: 32 lbs. S/N > 102 dB, reference to 100 watts into 6 ohms. The 624s are similar and smaller.

Emotiva Stealth 8 has a woofer size of 8”, 115dB SPL @ 1meter and freq. response of 30Hz to 23K Hz +/- 1.75 dB. Low –frequency amp is 200 watts and the high is 200 watts with THD not specified. Weight: 41.5 lbs. S/N not specified.
(specs summarized for convenience only – ref actual specs at corresponding web sites)


Attached – current setup with Anthem AV-2 pre driving Mackie 824s and 624s for fronts – consider replacing with Emotiva Stealth 8.
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post #17 of 45 Old 02-04-2013, 06:35 PM
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Saril,

Thank you for sharing your experience! btw, have you considered ditching the Pre-Pro idea and adding an OPPO BDP-105? It does feature two HDMI inputs. The purer the signal, the better.

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post #18 of 45 Old 02-04-2013, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perpendicular View Post

Saril,

Thank you for sharing your experience! btw, have you considered ditching the Pre-Pro idea and adding an OPPO BDP-105? It does feature two HDMI inputs. The purer the signal, the better.

That is a very interesting concept indeed. Thanks for the suggestion. I wish the 105 also included balanced XLR out for the center chan and surrounds - as I may be entertaining powered monitors all around for a simple 5.1 HT setup. Also, my audio and HT are the same system - I may actually benefit from room correction software for movies. I could go with a small amp and regular speakers for the surrounds and keep the fronts and CC on powered monitors. Perhaps a small pre/pro like the Outlaw 975 or the Emotiva UMC-200 for more flexibility – lots of options.
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post #19 of 45 Old 02-05-2013, 08:17 AM
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Saril, Also thanks for sharing! I own an emotiva amp and find it very capable of driving quality speakers. I would guess that Emotiva had those speakers set up in a room that was perfect for acoustics, giving that awinspiring performance. something that my living room could never bring out of a quality set of speakers. Congrats to Emotiva on these!!

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saril View Post

That is a very interesting concept indeed. Thanks for the suggestion. I wish the 105 also included balanced XLR out for the center chan and surrounds - as I may be entertaining powered monitors all around for a simple 5.1 HT setup. Also, my audio and HT are the same system - I may actually benefit from room correction software for movies. I could go with a small amp and regular speakers for the surrounds and keep the fronts and CC on powered monitors. Perhaps a small pre/pro like the Outlaw 975 or the Emotiva UMC-200 for more flexibility – lots of options.
Saril,

The stealth 8 is one of the options I am also considering for our HT build as you will have read above, so I hope you report once you decided and installed them.

Keep in mind the stealth 8 only accepts balanced interconnects.
Input:
One balanced combination connector (accepts a balanced XLR, balanced 1/4", or unbalanced 1/4" connector)

So you might want to wait for the UMC-500 which is a UMC-200 with balanced outputs (and extra HDMI inputs and a volume turn-knob). It will sell for $999. Or else you can use RCA to XLR interconnects.

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post #21 of 45 Old 02-05-2013, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saril View Post


Mackie 824 has a woofer size of 8.75”, 100dB SPL @ 1meter and freq. response of 39Hz to 20K Hz +/- 1.5 dB. Low –frequency amp is 150 amps and the high is 100 amps with THD < .035%. Weight: 32 lbs. S/N > 102 dB, reference to 100 watts into 6 ohms. The 624s are similar and smaller.

Emotiva Stealth 8 has a woofer size of 8”, 115dB SPL @ 1meter and freq. response of 30Hz to 23K Hz +/- 1.75 dB. Low –frequency amp is 200 amps and the high is 200 amps with THD not specified. Weight: 41.5 lbs. S/N not specified.
(specs summarized for convenience only – ref actual specs at corresponding web sites)

The Mackie HR824's are spec'd at +/- 111dB SPL at 1m max short term on axis half space and that's per pair.That's the measurement that better matches how the Stealth 8's are measured for a comparison.
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post #22 of 45 Old 02-05-2013, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZOOM ZOOM View Post

Saril, Also thanks for sharing! I own an emotiva amp and find it very capable of driving quality speakers. I would guess that Emotiva had those speakers set up in a room that was perfect for acoustics, giving that awinspiring performance. something that my living room could never bring out of a quality set of speakers. Congrats to Emotiva on these!!

You're right about the room, lots of treatments. However, it was the amount of bass that really impressed me - at a distance of about 9 feet! I too am also concerned how they will sound in my living room. With a 30 day return policy, you're provide with a great opportunity to audition with no risk.
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post #23 of 45 Old 02-05-2013, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erwinfrombelgium View Post

Saril,

The stealth 8 is one of the options I am also considering for our HT build as you will have read above, so I hope you report once you decided and installed them.

Keep in mind the stealth 8 only accepts balanced interconnects.
Input:
One balanced combination connector (accepts a balanced XLR, balanced 1/4", or unbalanced 1/4" connector)

So you might want to wait for the UMC-500 which is a UMC-200 with balanced outputs (and extra HDMI inputs and a volume turn-knob). It will sell for $999. Or else you can use RCA to XLR interconnects.

Still toying with my options. I will certainly update if I do get them. I did not know about the UMC-500, interesting. Thanks for your post.
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The Mackie HR824's are spec'd at +/- 111dB SPL at 1m max short term on axis half space and that's per pair.That's the measurement that better matches how the Stealth 8's are measured for a comparison.

Thanks - sorry about that.
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post #25 of 45 Old 02-05-2013, 11:48 PM
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Thanks - sorry about that.

No need to be sorry.I just realized you were looking at the wrong spec and I happen to own the same monitors.smile.gif
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post #26 of 45 Old 02-07-2013, 10:35 AM
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Hi Saril. Thanks for the report on your Emotiva visit and impression on the Stealth 8. I am researching to get a pair of active monitors for a dedicated 2ch music system and very interested in the Emotiva studio monitor line. Just curious, what electronics and cables did Emotiva use to drive the Stealth 8? Also, could you expand your thought on the speakers' transparency, imaging and tonal balance of instrument? Lastly, how do they compare to other active monitors in your experience? $1400/pair is a lot of money but perhaps the sonic performance compellingly justifies it. Thanks.
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post #27 of 45 Old 02-11-2013, 07:44 PM
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Hi Saril. Thanks for the report on your Emotiva visit and impression on the Stealth 8. I am researching to get a pair of active monitors for a dedicated 2ch music system and very interested in the Emotiva studio monitor line. Just curious, what electronics and cables did Emotiva use to drive the Stealth 8? Also, could you expand your thought on the speakers' transparency, imaging and tonal balance of instrument? Lastly, how do they compare to other active monitors in your experience? $1400/pair is a lot of money but perhaps the sonic performance compellingly justifies it. Thanks.

I don't know if I can give you a good answer - sorry. As you know, I wasn't there to listen to any speakers. Moreover, I had never even heard of a Stealth 8 monitor until that day. I paid little attention to their speakers because what I did hear just didn’t do it for me - plain and simple. Near the end of the visit, when I mentioned my Mackies, that’s when the invite came to hear the Stealth 8s. From the perspective of someone who has been using Mackie monitors for the last 10 years in a 5.1 HT setup, the Stealth 8s absolutely blew me away! I did not expect that much sound to come from a bookshelf monitor. The chair I sat in was definitely in the “sweet” spot. However, I got up and backed away such that I was around 9’ away and was still amazed by the deep bass and overall levels of sound. I did not critically listen for a change in the sound field as I felt that a purchase would only happen after I auditioned them in my own room. I was simply in the mode of determining, “do I want to try these at home”. I will say the speakers did seem to completely disappear at the sweet spot. Summarizing, the Stealth 8s made me reconsider my over all 5.1 HT setup, i.e., pre/pro with amp and towers vs. Pre/pro and Stealth 8s. As far as the electronics and cables, I would contact Nick at Emotiva. I would recommend auditioning in your own home.
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post #28 of 45 Old 02-12-2013, 11:03 AM
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^^
And those Mackie's are the speakers Ethan Winer uses at home (624) and he is always repeating how good they are... That is saying something about the stealth 8.

Saril, how large is your room now and what's the listening distance?

Building a HT with 7.2.4 layout and SEOS-24 LCR.
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post #29 of 45 Old 02-13-2013, 03:05 PM
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^^
And those Mackie's are the speakers Ethan Winer uses at home (624) and he is always repeating how good they are... That is saying something about the stealth 8.

Saril, how large is your room now and what's the listening distance?

My room is 24 x 17 x 9 (width x depth x height) with an open area behind it. My listening distance from the front edge of speaker to my ear is around 9.5 feet.

The Mackie’s are great speakers and have served me well for 10 years in a 5.1 HT setup. I think part of my problem is that the rubber on the bass drivers has hardened a bit. That coupled with a larger room with wood floors doesn't help much either I'm sure. I’m also wondering about the Mackie’s or Emotiva being placed in the cabinet you see in the picture of my original post – even though it’s open front and back.

I'm still undecided on what I'm going to do as some of the tower speakers I've heard are still an option. The great thing about Emotiva is that I can try them in my home and return if I don't like.
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post #30 of 45 Old 03-03-2013, 03:28 PM
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Besides just matching the amp to the driver, the crossover can be adjusted to work perfectly with the specific drivers used EVen the best external "general purpose" active crossover is limited in this regard, whereas a crossover custom designed for the driver can be perfectly matched to both the driver and the amplifier.
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My Klipsch XF-48 are self powered along with a number of other speakers out there. I always wondered if that was a true benefit as the manufacturer could match the tweeter and woofer(s) with the appropriate amp or is it better to just buy a quality amp and pair it to the speaker?

It’s how most subs are sold so it seems like a good idea to me.

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