Logitech Debuts Two Harmony Remotes - Ultimate and Smart Control - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 261 Old 04-18-2013, 10:02 PM
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ill admit, the harmony one was groundbreaking. but apparently it was such a leap that logitech cant even compete with itself anymore on this product. this is basically the harmony one with new design and a few additional features the harmony one didnt have that people complained about. i'd be interested to hear more about build quality, as the harmony one clearly was not designed to be a product to last for more than two years (if not dropped). the buttons wear and become wobbly far too fast and the bottom material was a giant magnet for all kinds of crusty stuff. while it had an lcd touch screen, it wasnt anything special, just basic macros behind a cheap 8 bit logo. this really looks like more of the same with the new remote. same cheap touch screen os and a different body and buttons.

when you dont put out a product for two to three years, we'd like to think you've actually done something with your time. i dont see a single reason to shell out 350 for a rehashed product. I'd buy another harmony one before i pay an additional 100 bones for basically the same remote.i really wish some of these other manufacturers would have caught on a little earlier becaues it seems logitech has all but monopolized this market and it clearly shows with this product and its pricing.

on another note, if logitech is going to flatline with product creativity, why not flourish from a marketing standpoint. why not solicit yourselves to tv manufacturers to be the out of the box remote manufacturer with every flatscreen sold? this tech that was introduced a few years ago should now be a standard.
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post #32 of 261 Old 04-18-2013, 11:50 PM
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Not enough hard buttons on this one for me. I'll stick with the Harmony One if they keep making it. Best remote I've found so far.

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post #33 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 01:52 AM
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Logitech seems to get deeper and deeper into trouble with re-arranging buttons and adding bells and whistles rather than going a more logical route.

Just fix the 900 and Harmony One etc so the buttons all make sense.

If you want to fiddle with touch screens make a remote with physical buttons on part of it and the rest is where a phone slides in for the touch portion and be done with it. Some items are better as physical buttons and the rest can be "programmed" in on the phone part.
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post #34 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 04:23 AM
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At least Harmony was kind enough to grace us with Yellow, Blue, Red, and Green hard buttons. The less touch screen on a remote the better. Not sure I'm sold on the scrolling rows of channel icons vs direct access number hard buttons.
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post #35 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 05:07 AM
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I think this thread would have great value if everyone let everyone else know whether they are all set about remotes, about all set, almost all set, or wholly fecal instead of using each remote that comes with each piece of the HT fecal I own, I am gonna buy one of these and replace the use of all those. Also please let us know, those who use their cell phones as a remote, whether and why they would use one of these instead. But most importantly, whether you are already set. That is so valuable. Thank you for sharing. smile.gif

Seriously, the Ultimate looks very nice but does it merit spending money on it to replace some earlier all in one remote?. Is it a break through or game changer?..
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post #36 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I think this thread would have great value if everyone let everyone else know whether they are all set about remotes, about all set, almost all set, or wholly fecal instead of using each remote that comes with each piece of the HT fecal I own, I am gonna buy one of these and replace the use of all those. Also please let us know, those who use their cell phones as a remote, whether and why they would use one of these instead. But most importantly, whether you are already set. That is so valuable. Thank you for sharing. smile.gif

Seriously, the Ultimate looks very nice but does it merit spending money on it to replace some earlier all in one remote?. Is it a break through or game changer?..

The ultimate is too expensive to be a game changer, but it's a very nice combination of the harmony touch, RF capabilities and phone/tablet integration. At $100 less, it would be very tempting.

I've had very good results with my $25 Sony RMZ620, and had enough issues with the Harmony 650 that I went back to the Sony. The Harmony 650 was great when it worked, but between the poor build quality (dropping it would cause it to reboot) and lack of customizable sequences made it a no go. I would love to pick up a harmony touch or the ultimate, but they're still too expensive. My ideal device would be the Smart Control, but with a Harmony 650-style LCD (non-touchscreen) for under $150. The Sony can do so much for $25 that $200 is just too much to spend on any remote, no matter what it can do.
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post #37 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 08:01 AM
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Another vote for harmony one. Mines 6? Years old, original battery, been dropped many times, attacked by puppy, and the only prob I had was a unresponsive info button. Took it apart and cleaned buttons all is good. Lag does kinda suck sometimes.

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post #38 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 08:03 AM
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I still love my 900. I wil consider this as a replacement. Not sure I will like not having dedicated number hard buttons though. The less I have to look at the remote the better. Bluetooth is a welcome addition, some Samsung displays are using it now too.
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post #39 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 08:54 AM
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I see they've rearranged buttons once again. I've finally adapted to the Harmony Touch, but the button layout (similar to the ultimate) is not very convenient with FF/REW/Play etc. at the very top. The remote doesn't balance well when holding to access these buttons, and as frequently as I skip past commercials this isn't one of the highlights.

Both packages are way overpriced IMO. I'm interested in the Smart Control setup, being a smartphone and tablet freak, but it ain't worth more than $50 to me.

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post #40 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 09:29 AM - Thread Starter
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According to the diagram below, the Hub is a giant IR Emitter. There are two additional ports behind the unit that you can plug in IR Emitters. I don't know what the impedance is, I wonder if you can simply stick a dual head IR emitter to allow 4 additional source controls.

The Harmony solution is great for smaller application and where the user doesn't have time or is not proficient enough to program more complex remotes. Other solutions available in the custom market offer more discreet IR porting capabilities as well as a higher amount of devices and custom macro programming.

The Harmony Ultimate is great in my opinion as it can control many devices on the market. I have too much gear at home and require more in-depth programming. Although this product is great, it may not be for everyone.



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post #41 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 01:26 PM
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The Ultimate looks just like the Harmony Touch - but with one feature the Touch did not have - a dedicated chapter skip/back button. The Touch only has a FF and reverse dedicated button. Sigh - I wish I knew this redesign was coming when I purchased the Touch a couple of months ago.
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post #42 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey ra View Post

The Ultimate looks just like the Harmony Touch - but with one feature the Touch did not have - a dedicated chapter skip/back button. The Touch only has a FF and reverse dedicated button. Sigh - I wish I knew this redesign was coming when I purchased the Touch a couple of months ago.

Mikey, I'm sure the touch is still under warranty... would be ashamed if it "stopped working" and they gave you a credit towards a new remote...

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post #43 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 01:56 PM
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The Ultimate looks nice! But yeah not enough hard buttons..

I'm happy with my One also, hasn't even been a year yet that I've had it

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post #44 of 261 Old 04-19-2013, 04:30 PM
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I guess I am in the other camp. I have been using a nearly completely touch screen Onkyo CHAD with the only hard buttons for volume control and channel up and down for the past 10 years. Since I mainly use the system it controls for movies, I rarely use the hard buttons on the remote. I set the volume and then leave it for the rest of the movie. It has served me well and I have not found a good reason to trash it, but it is dying on me since my kids have dropped it so much. I read that the hub alone will be available for $100. I will buy that or the smart control since I use my iPhone to control my music anyway and would love to use my phone as my remote assuming the macros work as well as on my CHAD. I am also looking forward to controlling since PS3 with Bluetooth rather than IR to an IR USB dongle.

Since all of my equipment is in a closet except my projector, I will have to put one additional emitter through the wall to control that, but I will finally be able to ditch the remote and use the device that I use for nearly every other part of my life to control my system.
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post #45 of 261 Old 04-20-2013, 01:50 AM
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I hate the design of the Ultimate, just like the Touch. I decided a long time ago, when I put my last Phillips Pronto remote in a drawer, that hard buttons are the way to go. I use and am OK with the Harmony One, but would much prefer to go back to the Harmony 670 whose button layout was, in my opinion, the best of the bunch. Having the transport controls laid around the d-pad works great. Why Logitech insists on putting transport buttons at the top of these new remotes so you have to use two hands or reach over the touch screen to use them is beyond me. And why do the new remotes have to be so stubby and ugly as sin? They look like they were made for a 3-year old to use.

I can't wait to see someone else get their hands on the Harmony line. Logitech should stick to making keyboards, mice, PC speakers and headphones. They do that pretty well. As for everything else they make, blech.

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post #46 of 261 Old 04-20-2013, 11:29 AM
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Nice timing, Just broke my harmony one and pre ordered the smart control for my living room.
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post #47 of 261 Old 04-20-2013, 09:06 PM
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Amazing how the price has gone up on the ONE!! Selling for $300 at Amazon! I got a new one six months ago for $99 at Radio Shack but they don't have any now. I just ordered another at Meritline.com for $124 (says they have them in stock) since I have four at home and I worry about one breaking. There is nothing out there on the market for around a hundred bucks that I think is reasonably useful (and that I can use with my eyes closed).

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post #48 of 261 Old 04-21-2013, 11:13 AM
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these are not new other then the addition of RF on the "link" the ultimate is just the Touch remote included with the RF capable link so yeah...

I have the Harmony One and the Link, whats sad is they locked down the link so much that it honestly is useless compared to the Harmony one probably because of the price difference they want people to buy the more expensive remotes but sheesh you cant even create button sequences on the Link ~_~

And they seem to not give a damn about the android app, it took them years upon years upon years just to add tablet support for the android app and its not even landscape capable lol nor is there a TV guide yet, all they seem to be is Apple lovers over their ~_~

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post #49 of 261 Old 04-21-2013, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLeerUK View Post

"Because the Harmony Ultimate uses Bluetooth technology, it provides a much more accurate and reliable mode of transmission to the hub."

As compared to what?

In my experience, Bluetooth has a maximum effective transmission radius of about 15ft (5m) and even then is super flaky about maintaining pairing of devices. This might be sufficient for the typical home setup with the user on the couch and the receiver end sitting inside a closed hot-boxing cabinet full of equipment at the front of the living room, but if the equipment is more remotely located (as in my case, a dedicated media closet off a home office) the only option is a wired IR receiver.

Sorry, I'll take a wired IR receiver anytime, or if necessary RF dedicated; using Bluetooth for this is going to cause a lot of hurled remotes - maybe if the remote is able to transmit while being airborne and you throw it in the general direction of the receiver...

My Plantronics Bluetooth headset has a range of 35 feet and that's plenty for the Harmony remotes. I can walk around 40 feet away from my phone with my Voyager Pro HD headset and still listen to music or calls.

Also the same with using the same phone with my mom's 2012 Honda Civic's system. I can walk around 40 feet from it with my phone and still stream music to the system.
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post #50 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 06:59 AM
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This looks like a really nice remote. The build quality will probably not be the best, but there is nothing that offers close to this much functionality at the price point. RTI, procontrol etc have a lot more features but you are easily looking at over $1000 with programming. I hope that they have increase the RF range so that I can use it future setup where the AV equipment is going to be moved to the basement, My harmony 900 barely works in the next room so I doubt it will reliably work with the equipment in the basement.
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post #51 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpatel1080 View Post

This looks like a really nice remote. The build quality will probably not be the best, but there is nothing that offers close to this much functionality at the price point. RTI, procontrol etc have a lot more features but you are easily looking at over $1000 with programming. I hope that they have increase the RF range so that I can use it future setup where the AV equipment is going to be moved to the basement, My harmony 900 barely works in the next room so I doubt it will reliably work with the equipment in the basement.

THIS.

100% agree. A lot of people criticize the harmony line, comparing it to remotes that cost over twice the price and require the consumer to have a masters in computer programming (if they can even get the software) OR pay someone else to program the remote every time you upgrade equipment or change your set up. For the money, these remotes are difficult to beat. With the functions they've now added, they offer MOST consumers everything they'd ever ask for in a remote. Yes the software can be frustrating, but they have to compromise somewhat to make it simple enough for the average consumer. I really hope the harmony line continues either with them or with someone that will support past remotes and improve future ones.

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post #52 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 10:40 AM
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As many have noted here, this looks like a jump-off from the Harmony Link... however my perspective is that it's worse technology.

The strength of the harmony link was in its use of wifi protocol. The app required for it was poor, but having access to it over your home network was excellent.

Now they have reverted back to bluetooth (which is how the Harmony 900 worked, also discontinued).

I am having trouble following Logitechs.... logic. First they make a BT remote (the 900) with a sleek design and specialized hardware unlike any other items in their catalog. They then appear to abandon bluetooth technology in favor of wifi.

As I said above, the use of wifi was a great stride forward at the cost of Harmony 900 users and for those willing to use the *terrible* Harmony Link app as early adopters.

Now they want to use the same Harmony Link hardware approach with an app, but they eschew the wifi... the only thing that really made the Harmony Link a good offering.
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post #53 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 11:41 AM
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A RF communication between the remote and the base station is probably better than Wifi because there will be less lag than if the signal has to be transmitted over the home network through a router. I do not think the remote communicates to the base via bluetooth...bluetooth is used by the base to turn on devices such as the PS3. I hope they have made the RF range longer though. Also as a bonus CNET is reporting that the Harmony touch actually does have RF and that Touch users will be able to purchase the base station!
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post #54 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpatel1080 View Post

A RF communication between the remote and the base station is probably better than Wifi because there will be less lag than if the signal has to be transmitted over the home network through a router. I do not think the remote communicates to the base via bluetooth...bluetooth is used by the base to turn on devices such as the PS3. I hope they have made the RF range longer though. Also as a bonus CNET is reporting that the Harmony touch actually does have RF and that Touch users will be able to purchase the base station!

In my experience, bluetooth introduces lag. On an "activity-based" approach like the Harmony, I think a little lag is preferable to a problem with range.
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post #55 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 02:22 PM
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I wish they would update the 890/1100 line of remotes with the very reliable z-wave rf tech. I have two of the 890's one for me one for my wife. The range is excellent all over the house. They have a terrible button layout and the Z-wave lighting controlls are clunky but all could be fixed with a firmware change. Give me a remote like the Harmony one with z-wave RF and it would be better than anything they have come out with since.

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post #56 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 04:02 PM
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Is it me or does Logitech make fewer and fewer buttons conveniently available with every new model? I still have my 880 because of the 8 programmable buttons. I have a lot of stuff to control - lighting, shaker level, ... -- and it drives me nuts to scroll through pages. I hate the 880 buttons, but I stick with it because of the 8 controls. Not sure why their newer models seem less and less convenient.
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post #57 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 04:51 PM
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Harmony Remotes are #1 in market share and position but unfortunately the business unit is not profitable to Logitech..
In January, 2013 they announced that they would sell off the Harmony division due to dismal Logitech earnings..

http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/23/logitech-q3-earnings-selling-harmony-remotes/

Just my $0.02... 👍😉
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post #58 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 06:43 PM
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I still love my Harmony One.

Right On!
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post #59 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 07:12 PM
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I'm hooked on my three Harmony 880's. Dependable, great hard-buttons for controlling in the dark, customizable to run my IR-controlled light dimmers. And, I've gotten pretty good with the web-interface (which could be better)...but now that I've got the remotes the way I like them, I don't touch them unless I get a new piece of gear.
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post #60 of 261 Old 04-22-2013, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post

Harmony Remotes are #1 in market share and position but unfortunately the business unit is not profitable to Logitech..
In January, 2013 they announced that they would sell off the Harmony division due to dismal Logitech earnings..

http://www.engadget.com/2013/01/23/logitech-q3-earnings-selling-harmony-remotes/

Just my $0.02... 👍😉

yeah that never happened, they just streamlined production instead.

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