Sony PlayStation 4 in U.S. Stores November 15 for $399 - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 153 Old 08-29-2013, 06:55 AM
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My local Best Buy says they have been ordered to open at midnight the 15th for a big release party/sale. I may swing by just for the swag. It's a "sleepy" Best Buy, quiet and lame, mostly doing mobile phone biz, and I can fantasize them not selling any, getting frustrated, and using some "manager's discretion" to move a few.
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post #92 of 153 Old 08-29-2013, 10:24 AM
 
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Originally Posted by bigceebin4 View Post

I have my PS4 pre ordered and paid for already as do a lot of Gamers already. To me the choice was easy. As I own a 360, Wii and a PS3, my 360 is basically a dvd player for my 2 year old if he happens to be in the loft, that is all it gets used for. the PS3 on the other hand gets used for a plethora of things including steaming, gaming, blu-ray, etc. (and still will in another room of our house once the PS4 is brought in). My only problem is that my wife bought a Wii U the day it came out. I wasn't too thrilled about the idea of having 4 gaming systems, soon to be 5, she said she 'Had to Have it'... Im not going to lie, I love the Wii U. It has def taken the spot of the PS3 for gaming in the house. It has amazing graphics and awesome media options via online. The PS3 is still used, but the U is by far a superior system. I doubt it will hold a light to the 4, but it is still amazing. I have to laugh to myself when all of these 'experts' have been bashing the U, mostly because the are on Microsoft's n**$. the 360 is crap compared to the Wii U. I never touch my 360. havent in forever. Dont plan on touching a Xbox1 either. (I dont know if this was relevant to any topic or issue being discussed, but whatever)
You're right, irrelevant. A lot of it sounded more like a fanboy rant. The Wii U's success (or lack thereof) is reflected in its anemic sales.
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post #93 of 153 Old 08-30-2013, 02:18 PM
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FYI I just picked up the new Splinter Cell, After some reviews, the Wii U version is superior in graphics to the PS3 and X360. It only falls short of the PC version.

It's only doing true 720p graphics, but it's doing it with vsync on at 30fps. The X360 and PS3 are upscaling it from something like 530p resolution, and no vsync which means screen tearing, in order to push 30 fps.

On the downside, I'm having a hard time adjusting from a 360 controller to the wii u.
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post #94 of 153 Old 08-30-2013, 02:35 PM
 
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Let's hope the Wii U is graphically superior to the 360, since the Wii U technology is at least 7 years newer. tongue.gif
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post #95 of 153 Old 08-30-2013, 05:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by jonathanc View Post

FYI I just picked up the new Splinter Cell, After some reviews, the Wii U version is superior in graphics to the PS3 and X360. It only falls short of the PC version.

It's only doing true 720p graphics, but it's doing it with vsync on at 30fps. The X360 and PS3 are upscaling it from something like 530p resolution, and no vsync which means screen tearing, in order to push 30 fps.

On the downside, I'm having a hard time adjusting from a 360 controller to the wii u.

Seriously? Bragging that your new console has better graphics than the 8 year PS3 is like bragging that your car only broke down twice today.
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post #96 of 153 Old 08-31-2013, 09:13 PM
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Seriously? Bragging that your new console has better graphics than the 8 year PS3 is like bragging that your car only broke down twice today.

Bragging ? It's not even my console. The spouse returned the fancy wine cooler I bought her and bought a launch day Wii U instead. I'm simply stating some technical facts regarding the progression of graphics. My point being, not even the Wii U is doing native 1080p graphics. It's barely doing 720p at 30fps. The PS3 and X360 can't even manage 530p at 30fps without vsync. I'm wondering if this "next gen" will even handle 1080p at 60fps.

Basically, you're trying to play console fanboy with someone who hasn't even played a videogame in 8 months until the other day.
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post #97 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 03:45 PM
 
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If the new MS and Sony consoles can't process 1080p at 60fps, they should be boycotted. wink.gif
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post #98 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 03:46 PM
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I agree. Mgs iv 1080p at 30fps is horrible. Cod in 60fps is ok.
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post #99 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 05:25 PM
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If anyone's using the PS4 thinking it will be a great UHD media playback machine... I think you need to be prepared for disappointment. Unlike with Blu-ray, the PS4 is being released before the UHD specs are fully ratified. Unless every bit of video processing is software based and upgradeable and the HDMI chipset is able to be set to the 2.0 standards, it's severely gimped right out of the gate.

Sony used the PS3 as a stealth Blu-ray player in order to get its fledgling HD disc medium into as many households as possible... with no such UHD medium locked down at time of manufacturing... the PS4 seems to be caught in home theater format limbo until the PS5 is released.

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post #100 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 05:27 PM
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When ps4 comes out sales of ps3s will be great.
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post #101 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 08:37 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

If anyone's using the PS4 thinking it will be a great UHD media playback machine... I think you need to be prepared for disappointment. Unlike with Blu-ray, the PS4 is being released before the UHD specs are fully ratified. Unless every bit of video processing is software based and upgradeable and the HDMI chipset is able to be set to the 2.0 standards, it's severely gimped right out of the gate.

Sony used the PS3 as a stealth Blu-ray player in order to get its fledgling HD disc medium into as many households as possible... with no such UHD medium locked down at time of manufacturing... the PS4 seems to be caught in home theater format limbo until the PS5 is released.

I really don't think this will be an issue. First of all 4K is a good 6-8 years away from being mainstream, by that time the PS5 will be out. Second, Sony is at the forefront of 4K tech, as they were with BluRay. So, I expect the PS4 will have the necessary hardware to do some 4K video processing for the few people that will demand it. What a lot of people (on this forum especially) don't realize is that a ton of people still have their PS3's hooked up to SDTV's.

4K's are just hitting the market, aside from an extremely small percentage of early adopters ( guinea pigs), things like this take a long time to catch on. Relatively speaking there will be no demand for 4K content this generation of consoles.

This upcoming Gen of consoles should be focused solely on running games at 1080p @60fps. They haven't even gotten this down yet and we're like 8 or 9 years into 1080p ! Forget 4K ! Max out my current TV's potential first, then we can talk 4K.
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post #102 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

If anyone's using the PS4 thinking it will be a great UHD media playback machine... I think you need to be prepared for disappointment. Unlike with Blu-ray, the PS4 is being released before the UHD specs are fully ratified. Unless every bit of video processing is software based and upgradeable and the HDMI chipset is able to be set to the 2.0 standards, it's severely gimped right out of the gate.

Sony used the PS3 as a stealth Blu-ray player in order to get its fledgling HD disc medium into as many households as possible... with no such UHD medium locked down at time of manufacturing... the PS4 seems to be caught in home theater format limbo until the PS5 is released.

Even though it only has a hardware h.264 decoder, the CPU/GPU in there shouldn't have any issue decoding h.265 at any bit depth or bitrate. HDMI 1.4 is going to limit 4K to 24fps, but that'll still cover 99.9% of movies. I'm sure in 2-3 years there will be a PS4 slim with HDMI 2.0 anyway.

I bet it'll probably be the best UHD player on the market for a while.

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post #103 of 153 Old 09-01-2013, 08:45 PM
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Ahh, but they're adding higher frame rates to 4k. And the Sony UHD downloads are currently only 8 bit. The final UHD specs being bandied about talk of 10 bit (or even 12 bit) and a wider color gamut too. HDMI 1.4 is not designed for this.

Like I and others stated, the PS5 may be ready for the final UHD specs, but not the PS4 if anyone's buying it for more than just gaming. The PS4 is more like a PS3 with a little added bonus till the real deal, not the second coming as Sony has trumpeted it as being.

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post #104 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 01:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

Ahh, but they're adding higher frame rates to 4k. And the Sony UHD downloads are currently only 8 bit. The final UHD specs being bandied about talk of 10 bit (or even 12 bit) and a wider color gamut too. HDMI 1.4 is not designed for this.

Like I and others stated, the PS5 may be ready for the final UHD specs, but not the PS4 if anyone's buying it for more than just gaming. The PS4 is more like a PS3 with a little added bonus till the real deal, not the second coming as Sony has trumpeted it as being.

I haven't really seen Sony play up the PS4 as much of a video player at all actually. The fact that it can do anything beyond gaming is almost incidental. This time around it's very much a games console first, and HDMI 1.4 is sufficient for any game the GPU is capable of rendering.

HDMI 2.0 would be nice, but the PS4 is already long overdue. I think it's a little premature to bring the PS5 into this conversation though.

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post #105 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 02:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

Ahh, but they're adding higher frame rates to 4k. And the Sony UHD downloads are currently only 8 bit. The final UHD specs being bandied about talk of 10 bit (or even 12 bit) and a wider color gamut too. HDMI 1.4 is not designed for this.

Like I and others stated, the PS5 may be ready for the final UHD specs, but not the PS4 if anyone's buying it for more than just gaming. The PS4 is more like a PS3 with a little added bonus till the real deal, not the second coming as Sony has trumpeted it as being.

I haven't really seen Sony play up the PS4 as much of a video player at all actually. The fact that it can do anything beyond gaming is almost incidental. This time around it's very much a games console first, and HDMI 1.4 is sufficient for any game the GPU is capable of rendering.

HDMI 2.0 would be nice, but the PS4 is already long overdue. I think it's a little premature to bring the PS5 into this conversation though.

agree 100%. if hdmi 2.0 support becomes an absolute necessity sony will likely release a ps4 version that supports it. probably 12-18 months away at the earliest. MS would likely do the same.

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post #106 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by bd2003 View Post

I haven't really seen Sony play up the PS4 as much of a video player at all actually. The fact that it can do anything beyond gaming is almost incidental. This time around it's very much a games console first, and HDMI 1.4 is sufficient for any game the GPU is capable of rendering.

HDMI 2.0 would be nice, but the PS4 is already long overdue. I think it's a little premature to bring the PS5 into this conversation though.

Agreed. There was a presentation online that was conducted by PS4 lead architect, Mark Cerny, I think it was in May but memory is failing me at the moment. It was about an hour long and somewhat technical but what can really be taken from it was how much emphasis this time around Sony's putting in to bring back the PlayStation to its roots, which is first and foremost a gaming machine. As someone who's buying it mainly for gaming, the track Sony's taking with the PS4 is very reassuring.
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post #107 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 10:21 AM
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And adding the ability to share stuff on ps4 and add voice recognition makes this the hottest playstation since ps2.
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post #108 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 11:18 AM
 
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If you really think about it 4K makes no sense right now. Americans haven't even maxed out our 1080p sets yet. We still only broadcast in a heavily compressed1080i signal. Quite a few BluRay releases aren't given proper transfers to show off 1080p's potential. Next gen consoles should finally start doing 1080p @60fps more often than not. Although BF4 will run at 720p@ 60fps and I'm sure many others will until at least a few years into the ps4's life cycle. Video streaming services aren't even capable of streaming 1080p BluRay quality.

So what's the point of moving forward at this point ? It's sounds like people are going to buy into 4K before there's any content and even before 1080p has become the standard.
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post #109 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 11:25 AM
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Just as 1080p improves dvd movies, 4k will improve 1080p. The audio quality also matters. The ps3 was one of two consoles to offer lossless surround sound via hdmi, the other being xbox 360. The audio quality is much clearer. More channels means more space on the disc.
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post #110 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 11:56 AM
 
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Just as 1080p improves dvd movies, 4k will improve 1080p. The audio quality also matters. The ps3 was one of two consoles to offer lossless surround sound via hdmi, the other being xbox 360. The audio quality is much clearer. More channels means more space on the disc.

I don't think you get it. I'm saying 1080p sets having even been allowed to reach their full potential yet from today's media. Why would I need a new 4K TV to upconvert heavily compressed 1080i cable broadcasts, half assed BluRay transfers, 720p and 1080i streaming services, and 720p console games ???? Why up-convert media that isn't even coming close to maxing out today's HD sets ?
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post #111 of 153 Old 09-02-2013, 11:57 AM
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Crt sets are still good quality even though its obsolete.
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Crt sets are still good quality even though its obsolete.

CRT sets had reached their full potential for quite some time before HDtv was introduced. CRT sets were bulky, extremely heavy, and really limited people's living rooms. The introduction of widescreen, lightweight, flat panel TV's was a game changer in its self. HD ( an unknown at the time) was just icing on the cake.

4K brings nothing to the table right now. Besides up-converting media that isn't even reaching current 1080p TV's potential, they bring nothing new at this point. They're still using flawed LED edgelit LCD technology. The panels are the same size and weight as HD sets.

All I'm saying is, I want PS4 to focus on maxing out our 1080p sets. 1080p @60fps is all I want from this gen of consoles.
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post #113 of 153 Old 09-03-2013, 01:20 PM
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Same here....
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post #114 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 09:25 AM
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http://3dvision-blog.com/9043-hdmi-forum-has-announced-version-2-0-of-the-hdmi-specification/

HDMI 2.0 is finally official, and it uses the same connectors and cables. That significantly increases the chance that the early PS4s can support it with a firmware upgrade, just like the original PS3. Time will tell if it really happens.

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post #115 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 11:13 AM
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http://3dvision-blog.com/9043-hdmi-forum-has-announced-version-2-0-of-the-hdmi-specification/

HDMI 2.0 is finally official, and it uses the same connectors and cables. That significantly increases the chance that the early PS4s can support it with a firmware upgrade, just like the original PS3. Time will tell if it really happens.

Normally HDMI circuitry cannot be upgraded via a Firmware update. It's pretty much set in stone... that's why the slim PS3 had new HDMI architecture to allow bitstreamed audio. The fat version could never be upgraded due to the outdated HDMI chip set.

That's why HDMI is still around... so the manufacturers can easily out date equipment that still works fine otherwise.

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post #116 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 11:15 AM
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Has it been announced that the PS4 is HDMI 1.4 in the first place? I haven't read such. You can bet chip sets 99% up to spec (if not 100%) could have been being produced months ago by now. Just because 2.0 hadn't been publicly announced doesn't mean it hasn't been finished or all but finished for "x" number of weeks or months. Think about it.

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post #117 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 11:26 AM
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I just texted some of my buddies (~35 yrs old) who were video game whores like me and said: "just imagine how insanely jacked we'd be for the ps4 just 10 years ago" and they pretty much universally agreed.

I understand there are plenty of 30 somethings still huge into video games but it passed me (and these guys, apparently) by so unexpectedly (and quickly) out of the blue around 27-28 that I fear it will never rebound. No Madden. No golf. No nuttin.

Now, just give me/us the other "junk" it will do, lmao. tongue.gifbiggrin.gif

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post #118 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 11:35 AM
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Normally HDMI circuitry cannot be upgraded via a Firmware update. It's pretty much set in stone... that's why the slim PS3 had new HDMI architecture to allow bitstreamed audio. The fat version could never be upgraded due to the outdated HDMI chip set.

That's why HDMI is still around... so the manufacturers can easily out date equipment that still works fine otherwise.

How'd they manage to get them working with frame packed 3D then?

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post #119 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 01:18 PM
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How'd they manage to get them working with frame packed 3D then?

This was an update to the MPEG-4 software decoder. The chipset still reads MVC encoded data as an MPEG-4 AVC video file. It's a subset that was around since the beginning of H.264, they just happened to use MVC for 3D purposes.

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post #120 of 153 Old 09-04-2013, 02:06 PM
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This was an update to the MPEG-4 software decoder. The chipset still reads MVC encoded data as an MPEG-4 AVC video file. It's a subset that was around since the beginning of H.264, they just happened to use MVC for 3D purposes.

But isn't the bandwidth still an issue? Or did the PS3 ship with 1.3?

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