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Scott Greczkowski's Avatar Scott Greczkowski 09:37 AM 10-30-2013
Thats why I said earlier I would love to see Joe chime in and give his opinion.

To me it does sound better then we thought it was although probably not quite as good as a Jok Kane calibration / review. smile.gif

dabotsonline's Avatar dabotsonline 02:38 PM 10-27-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Part of the CR testing process includes confirming that the video-processing features—which are normally on by default—can be disabled by the user. This is not always the case with all TVs, especially when it comes to budget brands. Turning a feature off does not always completely disable processing.
This is extremely useful to know!
Mrorange303's Avatar Mrorange303 06:58 PM 11-05-2014
In the 4k quandary to buy or not to buy imagic himself uses CR against me. He says they are not reliable and the article about 4k and distances for benefit was not valid.

Then he writes this?

Months later now CR is variable?

How many people read that thread and bought a 1080p set over 4k because of his comments against CR?

I bring this up because it was a very very heated discussion.

He chose the side against consumer reports and says they are wrong about the benefits of 4k and eye sight.

So hypocritical. So very damn hypocritical.
imagic's Avatar imagic 07:27 PM 11-05-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post
In the 4k quandary to buy or not to buy imagic himself uses CR against me. He says they are not reliable and the article about 4k and distances for benefit was not valid.

Then he writes this?

Months later now CR is variable?

How many people read that thread and bought a 1080p set over 4k because of his comments against CR?

I bring this up because it was a very very heated discussion.

He chose the side against consumer reports and says they are wrong about the benefits of 4k and eye sight.

So hypocritical. So very damn hypocritical.
Call it what you will. I never addressed UHD/4K visibility in this piece, there were no UHD/4K TVs at Consumer Reports when I visited. And, just because I'm impressed with Consumer Report's TV testing does not mean I'll agree with everything Claudio Ciacci or Jim Willcox writes. Plus, my views evolve as I get more and more exposure to new technologies. ANyone expecting me to remain utterly consistent in my views is in for some disappointment. I learn, I make mistakes, I change my mind, I debate. It's all good, there's no need to be so critical and call me hypocritical.

Would it be possible for you to provide a link to the crux of the previous discussion? I would not mind refreshing my memory.
Mrorange303's Avatar Mrorange303 08:46 PM 11-05-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrorange303 View Post
In the 4k quandary to buy or not to buy imagic himself uses CR against me. He says they are not reliable and the article about 4k and distances for benefit was not valid.

Then he writes this?

Months later now CR is variable?

How many people read that thread and bought a 1080p set over 4k because of his comments against CR?

I bring this up because it was a very very heated discussion.

He chose the side against consumer reports and says they are wrong about the benefits of 4k and eye sight.

So hypocritical. So very damn hypocritical.
Call it what you will. I never addressed UHD/4K visibility in this piece, there were no UHD/4K TVs at Consumer Reports when I visited. And, just because I'm impressed with Consumer Report's TV testing does not mean I'll agree with everything Claudio Ciacci or Jim Willcox writes. Plus, my views evolve as I get more and more exposure to new technologies. ANyone expecting me to remain utterly consistent in my views is in for some disappointment. I learn, I make mistakes, I change my mind, I debate. It's all good, there's no need to be so critical and call me hypocritical.

Would it be possible for you to provide a link to the crux of the previous discussion? I would not mind refreshing my memory.
Combing quotes from multiple users for one post is just not my idea of fun sorry man. However just saying less bias would of helped that particular thread and helped a lot of folks out.
GregLee's Avatar GregLee 09:16 AM 11-11-2014
Since the intended purpose of a TV set is to be watched by a human, you would expect the testing of TVs to involve prominently human perception of the TV images. That doesn't seem to be the case for the CR testing, so far as I can tell. Anyone who doubts that human perception of reproduction quality can be tested scientifically can look for a model at the work of Sean Olive, who posts here on audio matters, from time to time. His blog is http://seanolive.blogspot.com/2014/1...-of-audio.html. It's not easy to do relevant tests, but it's possible.
imagic's Avatar imagic 10:24 AM 11-11-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregLee View Post
Since the intended purpose of a TV set is to be watched by a human, you would expect the testing of TVs to involve prominently human perception of the TV images. That doesn't seem to be the case for the CR testing, so far as I can tell. Anyone who doubts that human perception of reproduction quality can be tested scientifically can look for a model at the work of Sean Olive, who posts here on audio matters, from time to time. His blog is http://seanolive.blogspot.com/2014/1...-of-audio.html. It's not easy to do relevant tests, but it's possible.
The science behind the testing is based entirely on well-understood science of human perception. And yes, there is a human element to the way CR tests, as well as a measurements-based element. You need both to perform a proper review. Calibration is the first step, and that requires instruments/measurements.
Dave Moritz's Avatar Dave Moritz 02:58 PM 11-14-2014
I do not believe Consumer Reports and to not rely on anything they say to be honest! Not after reports years ago about them accepting money from companies and after there attempt to compare an LG HDTV to a Pioneer Elite Kuro. Sorry CR no one has matched that tv yet although they are getting closer. I do not trust what they say and I would not pay for there magazine to find out.
Chere's Avatar Chere 02:12 AM 11-27-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Moritz View Post
I do not believe Consumer Reports and to not rely on anything they say to be honest! Not after reports years ago about them accepting money from companies and after there attempt to compare an LG HDTV to a Pioneer Elite Kuro. Sorry CR no one has matched that tv yet although they are getting closer. I do not trust what they say and I would not pay for there magazine to find out.

This is absolutely baseless. Maybe you can corroborate your accusation with some kind of proof?
Dave Moritz's Avatar Dave Moritz 11:29 PM 12-05-2014
Quote:
I do not believe Consumer Reports and to not rely on anything they say to be honest!
What I should have said is that they are not a source I use for electronics and the things I generally buy are things I do not believe they cover well. I wish I could remember the source of who they took a bribe from but it has been many years and to be honest there are a lot more important things I try to remember details on and this is not one of them. As far as the LG vs Kuro thing it was one of Consumer Reports I vaguely remember but I do remember them comparing the two and them saying it was just as good. Just about every high end tv is still compared to the Pioneer Elite Kuro. Some day it will happen but it seems that the Kuro is still the holy grail that tv manufacturers strive to reach. I personally am not a big fan of them and maybe that might change it is hard to say.
BobSalita's Avatar BobSalita 09:07 AM 12-19-2014
Thanks imagic. Nice piece of writing. Really great that CR people post on avsforum. Couple comments. CR evaluates usually just one item but they never really know if they got pop-parts, average, or a lemon. Think about the times you got a lemon device. It's got to happen to CR sometimes. Also, how rigorous is the oversight? CR can't be the only organization that never makes a mistake, follows every procedure exactly and is able to duplicate every result. I respect CR, actually been a subscriber for 50 years. I agree with others who say CR is one important voice out of many that should be weighed before buying. I'm wondering how often CR results deviate significantly from user reviews on Amazon and others. I can't imagine making purchasing decisions without CR or Amazon.
CaliRaftDude's Avatar CaliRaftDude 04:20 PM 01-04-2015
Stellar article!

Thanks for taking the time to discuss what CR does and provides. I have always liked CR and its nice to hear about their process and dedication.
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