Panasonic Announces "Plasma-level" LED TVs at CES 2014 - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

^^ that would be the first time i've ever heard of any edgelit led having zero uniformity issues. you either got a great panel(lucky) or aren't as sensitive to it as some ppl.

i actually looked at some hx850's when i was shopping because sony used to have a full array led that got great reviews, and i could clearly see flashlighting in the corners on the display set.

 

When talking about observations of TVs, you always have to talk about aggregates.  The likelyhood of getting uniformity, etc.

 

In the case of the one 65HX950 I saw (note the 9), I saw no uniformity issues, noblooming, unparalleled motion handling etc.  I've been told (by Chron) that the 900 (909?) & 929's were better PQ overall because of them being Sharp panels, but IMO that would only increase the liklihood of a good panel.  Because I couldn't find a thing wrong with that 2012 65HX950.  Of course I'm not a reviewer dissecting it for a few days either.


Well vinnie97, one of the kindest and most helpful and respected members here, was banned for silly reasons. And now vinnie_RIP is banned as well. The mark of an inexperienced moderator is to forget that their role is one of resource, not one of petulant authority and further that the members are doing the forum organization a favor by being here, not the other way around. They know darn well they screwed up here.
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post #62 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

When talking about observations of TVs, you always have to talk about aggregates.  The likelyhood of getting uniformity, etc.

In the case of the one 65HX950 I saw (note the 9), I saw no uniformity issues, noblooming, unparalleled motion handling etc.  I've been told (by Chron) that the 900 (909?) & 929's were better PQ overall because of them being Sharp panels, but IMO that would only increase the liklihood of a good panel.  Because I couldn't find a thing wrong with that 2012 65HX950.  Of course I'm not a reviewer dissecting it for a few days either.

you're absolutely right. i tried a few samsung LED's and each one was bad in a different way. i actually edited my last post as well, as now i'm not positive it was the 850 i actually looked at.

it's still one of those things though. if i'm spending that kind of money, and going through the hassles of borrowing a friends truck to bring it home, carry it downstairs and set it all up etc, i want to know there's a GOOD chance of getting what i want. i seem to be extra sensitive to clouding/flashlighting because of my viewing habits(always lights off) so now for me, any HINT of flashlighting in a store setting is a deal breaker for me. i don't want to try 2 or 3 or 10 panels until i find one that's not noticeable. i'd much rather spend more money for a full array and be sure. or spend less somehow for a plasma

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post #63 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 10:56 AM
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Radio81 not every Edge Lit tv is bad and has Flashlighting or clouding. Case in point my Sony HX850. I have zero flashlighting or clouding so I am a pretty happy camper there.

OK, just as every Sony HX850 is not the same. Your point? Do you honestly think there are no HX850 TVs that show clouding or flashlighting? Do you even read owner's threads?

Regardless, my remark about Panasonic was sarcastic. Let’s all hope they can magically surpass full-array (which even FALD has minimal clouding) with this new edge-lit tech, that supposedly only Panasonic is capable of in 2014.
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post #64 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Radio81 not every Edge Lit tv is bad and has Flashlighting or clouding. Case in point my Sony HX850. I have zero flashlighting or clouding so I am a pretty happy camper there.

OK, just as every Sony HX850 is not the same. Your point? Do you honestly think there are no HX850 TVs that show clouding or flashlighting? Do you even read owner's threads?

Regardless, my remark about Panasonic was sarcastic. Let’s all hope they can magically surpass full-array (which even FALD has minimal clouding) with this new edge-lit tech, that supposedly only Panasonic is capable of in 2014.


First I NEVER said there were no HX850's that didn't have clouding/flashlighting issues and YES I read the owners threads which I am apart of the HX850 thread so I have read about those issues. All I said was mine didn't have those problems. That being said Panasonic should have stayed with Plasma because that's what they are good at but they decided not to. Who knows maybe Panasonic's LED tv will be good and maybe not. We shall see.
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post #65 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 04:02 PM
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Fair enough, steve. I wasn’t sure what you were getting at with your comment about the HX850. Any series of edge-lit panels can have good and bad panels, and it can be very hit or miss. Whether good or bad, they all have some sort of clouding. It’s just the limits of what edge lighting can do. Except for yours…yours is the first I’ve heard of without any sort of clouding. Are you sure the backlight isn’t set at zero? biggrin.gif Kidding...

It’s a very bold statement for Panasonic to make, and then mention the panel is edge-lit, as PQ and edge-lit usually don’t usually go hand-in-hand in comparison to full array and plasma displays.
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post #66 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 06:03 PM
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You can't get around the peeves of LCD technology. The sharp elite was a good display but it still had plenty of the usual LCD shortcomings. I expect no different from Panasonic's LCD's. Plasmas overall will still be better.
Well said. Panasonic thought auto parts and microwaves were more profitable and are still making LCD technology look overrated. Their first LCDs were very wide screen, and had accurate color. And where can you go from there with 4K LCDs? rolleyes.gifwink.gif
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post #67 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 07:01 PM
 
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No, they think the business world is more profitable (i.e. their lucrative battery business with Tesla). They are increasingly shunning consumer electronics.
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post #68 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 07:49 PM
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Fair enough, steve. I wasn’t sure what you were getting at with your comment about the HX850. Any series of edge-lit panels can have good and bad panels, and it can be very hit or miss. Whether good or bad, they all have some sort of clouding. It’s just the limits of what edge lighting can do. Except for yours…yours is the first I’ve heard of without any sort of clouding. Are you sure the backlight isn’t set at zero? biggrin.gif Kidding...

It’s a very bold statement for Panasonic to make, and then mention the panel is edge-lit, as PQ and edge-lit usually don’t usually go hand-in-hand in comparison to full array and plasma displays.


Well Radio it may be that I have the 46inch version of the HX850 and not the 55inch. The bigger the screen the harder it is to make it uniform across the board hence the flash lighting and clouding. I have read and heard that the bigger the screen the more chances of clouding/flashlighting and banding. Oh and yes the backlight setting is set a zero per the pro calibration I had done a month ago. But even at its highest setting there was no hint of clouding or flashlighting.
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post #69 of 77 Old 01-15-2014, 09:29 PM
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Just curious, I know its not a consumer model and is definitely way too pricey but what makes the Dolby PRM so good? Glimme?

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #70 of 77 Old 01-16-2014, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

Well Radio it may be that I have the 46inch version of the HX850 and not the 55inch. The bigger the screen the harder it is to make it uniform across the board hence the flash lighting and clouding. I have read and heard that the bigger the screen the more chances of clouding/flashlighting and banding. Oh and yes the backlight setting is set a zero per the pro calibration I had done a month ago. But even at its highest setting there was no hint of clouding or flashlighting.

this is absolutely true.

although...
i've got a 23" in the bathroom with a THICK bezel and it's still got terrible clouding. you can actually see the flashlighting THROUGH the bezel, haha. but it is cheap
i went through 3 samsung's at 40" (d6300) for my bedroom and none of them were close to watchable for me. bar none, the WORST tv's i've had at home. my friend bought one at the same time because we rangled up a crazy deal on them, he's been absolutely thrilled with his and still loves it. he has his in a living room next to a window. i went to his house to 'check' and i still saw flashlighting.

secondly, going smaller can be as much of a compromise as lower picture quality. given the choice between a great looking 32" tv's and a good looking 65" tv, wouldn't be easy. so while 46 isn't tiny, it's still something potential buyers would have to weigh in on. i find it funny that one of the things LED supports mock plasma for is their 'limited' sizing, yet as you mentioned, as the sizes get up there, the picture gets much much worse.

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post #71 of 77 Old 02-05-2014, 12:40 PM
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Panasonic should be ashamed. They have disgraced themselves. They went from buying the Kuro patents to the LED sewer!

Seriously?

those same patents that Pioneer couldn't make a profit on either

Is a patent from a losing business...that you obtain and also lose money on the business...really that big of a deal?

I am not sure why people on here really dont like to preface that its really all about making a profit....

ANYTHING else is really a moot point..if there is no profit


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post #72 of 77 Old 02-05-2014, 12:44 PM
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No, they think the business world is more profitable (i.e. their lucrative battery business with Tesla). They are increasingly shunning consumer electronics.

they think its more profitable?

or is it indeed more profitable

If it is ...there are the drivers of them changing their business model

If they are not doing well on consumer electronics them why would they continue to make them?

They have to satisfy shareholders.....and investors like to see a lot of activity to the left of the decimal point



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post #73 of 77 Old 02-05-2014, 12:47 PM
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the HX950 is a very good TV

off angle and a small amount of blooming are the only issues I have seen

great black and great shadow detail....2nd best LED I have ever seen behind the Sharp Elite

too expensive though...as was the Sharp


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post #74 of 77 Old 02-05-2014, 03:04 PM
 
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they think its more profitable?

or is it indeed more profitable

If it is ...there are the drivers of them changing their business model

If they are not doing well on consumer electronics them why would they continue to make them?

They have to satisfy shareholders.....and investors like to see a lot of activity to the left of the decimal point
It probably is more profitable for them for the most part, but I'm sure they have some projections and research to indicate that as well. Hooray for nitpicking.
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post #75 of 77 Old 02-06-2014, 08:21 AM
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Well Radio it may be that I have the 46inch version of the HX850 and not the 55inch. The bigger the screen the harder it is to make it uniform across the board hence the flash lighting and clouding. I have read and heard that the bigger the screen the more chances of clouding/flashlighting and banding. Oh and yes the backlight setting is set a zero per the pro calibration I had done a month ago. But even at its highest setting there was no hint of clouding or flashlighting.

this is absolutely true.

although...
i've got a 23" in the bathroom with a THICK bezel and it's still got terrible clouding. you can actually see the flashlighting THROUGH the bezel

 

Take it out of the shower.


Well vinnie97, one of the kindest and most helpful and respected members here, was banned for silly reasons. And now vinnie_RIP is banned as well. The mark of an inexperienced moderator is to forget that their role is one of resource, not one of petulant authority and further that the members are doing the forum organization a favor by being here, not the other way around. They know darn well they screwed up here.
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post #76 of 77 Old 02-06-2014, 08:23 AM
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the HX950 is a very good TV

 

The XBR-65HX950 I saw was jaw dropping.  I saw none of the (relatively rare) complaints.  And that motion handling was superb.  MAN!  If it had been passive-3D I would have bought the used one I found.


Well vinnie97, one of the kindest and most helpful and respected members here, was banned for silly reasons. And now vinnie_RIP is banned as well. The mark of an inexperienced moderator is to forget that their role is one of resource, not one of petulant authority and further that the members are doing the forum organization a favor by being here, not the other way around. They know darn well they screwed up here.
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post #77 of 77 Old 02-06-2014, 11:07 PM
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How much better was the XBR-65H950 versus a Sharp Elite? In what ways did it surpass it? Do you think it would beat out a Sharp Elite in a shootout?
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