Netflix Ushers In Era of UHD/4K Streaming - Page 4 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 8Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 124 Old 04-13-2014, 03:05 PM
Advanced Member
 
SMHarman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 570
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 139 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chise View Post

I give you thumbs down for that one, the disc is still the best.
until they go rotten.
SMHarman is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 124 Old 04-14-2014, 11:04 AM
Member
 
dschlic1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampabay, FL
Posts: 113
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 18
In the past I have had trouble maintaining 1080p resolution streaming from Netflix. However within the past week or two, I have had no problems maintain 1080p. Perhaps Netflix put on equipment online to help with the streaming load?

Sony KDL-42V4100 LCD TV, Yamaha RX-V665 AV receiver, Sony PS3 slim, Klipsch F-30 speaker system
dschlic1 is offline  
post #93 of 124 Old 04-14-2014, 11:14 AM
Advanced Member
 
HockeyoAJB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 748
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 216 Post(s)
Liked: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by dschlic1 View Post

In the past I have had trouble maintaining 1080p resolution streaming from Netflix. However within the past week or two, I have had no problems maintain 1080p. Perhaps Netflix put on equipment online to help with the streaming load?

 

More likely that the issues you were having were due to your ISP, particularly if you use Comcast.

steve1971 likes this.
HockeyoAJB is online now  
post #94 of 124 Old 04-17-2014, 12:26 AM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 312 Post(s)
Liked: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexanderDelarg View Post

I thought this season of House of Cards looked fantastic. Great show and the picture quality for a streaming show was very good. It may not be Blu ray but it was still very good, IMO. 
I agree. Besides some banding in the opening credits the quality was excellent.
StinDaWg is offline  
post #95 of 124 Old 04-17-2014, 09:26 AM
Advanced Member
 
SMHarman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 570
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 139 Post(s)
Liked: 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post


I agree. Besides some banding in the opening credits the quality was excellent.

That banding seems to be more of a problem of adaptive streaming and clearing the cache of lower bitrate data is netflix realizes they can send you HD data.

SMHarman is online now  
post #96 of 124 Old 04-19-2014, 06:21 PM
AVS Special Member
 
TVOD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 4,881
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 74 Post(s)
Liked: 70
While 4K from Netflix and others are another step forward, let's not forget the true barometer of video technical advancement: 4K adult entertainment is now available for streaming eek.gif No word on whether the the audio is in 5.1, and if it is whether it supplies a good lower end - with the Lfe channel of course.
SMHarman likes this.
TVOD is offline  
post #97 of 124 Old 04-21-2014, 04:13 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dan Hitchman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Northern Colorado
Posts: 9,201
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1016 Post(s)
Liked: 523
Quote:
Originally Posted by jogiba View Post

The UHD 4K videos I have seen on youtube taken with the new UHD 4K Sony AX100 camcorder are much better than any 1080p camcorder that I have seen. I have the new Panasonic GH4 camera on pre-order that has cinema 4K (4096x2160) along with UHD 4K (3840x2160) modes and the video are also much better than 1080p. The AX100 top bitrate is 60Mbps and the GH4 200Mbps.

Better check the specs. again. The GH4 records DCI 4k at 24 fps and UHD up to 30 fps @ 100 Megabits/sec using H.264 in various wrappers. Yes, still better than the Sony AX100, but the 200 Megabits/sec All-I recording is for 1080p only.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
Dan Hitchman is online now  
post #98 of 124 Old 04-21-2014, 04:29 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jogiba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,019
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 110 Post(s)
Liked: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post

Better check the specs. again. The GH4 records DCI 4k at 24 fps and UHD up to 30 fps @ 100 Megabits/sec using H.264 in various wrappers. Yes, still better than the Sony AX100, but the 200 Megabits/sec All-I recording is for 1080p only.
I said " The AX100 top bitrate is 60Mbps and the GH4 200Mbps." That is 100% correct.
jogiba is offline  
post #99 of 124 Old 04-21-2014, 08:35 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dan Hitchman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Northern Colorado
Posts: 9,201
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1016 Post(s)
Liked: 523
Quote:
Originally Posted by jogiba View Post

I said " The AX100 top bitrate is 60Mbps and the GH4 200Mbps." That is 100% correct.

Your post made it sound like the GH4 recorded 4k at 200 Mbps. I was only clarifying.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
Dan Hitchman is online now  
post #100 of 124 Old 04-23-2014, 09:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 312 Post(s)
Liked: 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by SMHarman View Post

That banding seems to be more of a problem of adaptive streaming and clearing the cache of lower bitrate data is netflix realizes they can send you HD data.
The banding is definitely in their "Super HD" 1080p encoding. I was at the highest bitrate the entire time.
StinDaWg is offline  
post #101 of 124 Old 04-24-2014, 09:51 AM
Member
 
rrobelen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 17
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfs6278 View Post

Why cant HEVC/H.265 decoder just be on the PC for you to stream on?

have you been able to stream Netflix 4K through a PC? I posted up the question in a new thread. I should have posted here. My graphics card supports H.265 and my bandwidth is 49mbs both ways (WebPass is great). My monitor is a Seiki 39" 4K HDTV uses as a monitor. I cannot get Netflix to stream 4K
rrobelen is offline  
post #102 of 124 Old 04-24-2014, 10:33 AM
Advanced Member
 
HockeyoAJB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 748
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 216 Post(s)
Liked: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by rrobelen View Post


have you been able to stream Netflix 4K through a PC? I posted up the question in a new thread. I should have posted here. My graphics card supports H.265 and my bandwidth is 49mbs both ways (WebPass is great). My monitor is a Seiki 39" 4K HDTV uses as a monitor. I cannot get Netflix to stream 4K


I'm guessing that this is a limitation of the Netflix app (including the web browser version) that PC's use.  Does it even give you the option to try and stream 4K?  If not then you will have to wait until the app/web interface is updated.  It is likely only a select few brands of 4K displays that have a Netflix app with the 4K streaming option, at present.

HockeyoAJB is online now  
post #103 of 124 Old 04-24-2014, 06:18 PM
Member
 
rrobelen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 17
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyoAJB View Post


I'm guessing that this is a limitation of the Netflix app (including the web browser version) that PC's use.  Does it even give you the option to try and stream 4K?  If not then you will have to wait until the app/web interface is updated.  It is likely only a select few brands of 4K displays that have a Netflix app with the 4K streaming option, at present.

No it does not give me the option. The few Netflix support people who were aware that the service has started tell me it is automatic. If you have the right hardware it will stream 4K without any need to do anything. They have no chat support only telephone. Have had no success with that. I think you may be right in that it will require a change in the browser software. I will just wait and hope. The Seiki is great as a monitor which was the principle reason I bought it.
rrobelen is offline  
post #104 of 124 Old 04-29-2014, 12:43 PM
Member
 
rrobelen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 17
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
One correction to my earlier post. Webpass, is giving me 95mbs both upstream and downstream. I said earlier 49mbs. That was through my wireless router. Wired I get the higher number. Webpass if you can get it is great. Still no 4K Netflix streaming through m PC.
rrobelen is offline  
post #105 of 124 Old 04-30-2014, 09:12 AM
AVS Special Member
 
steve1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota.
Posts: 1,973
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 174 Post(s)
Liked: 276
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Quote:
"We still think that reference-level 1080p Blu-ray transfers like Oblivion
 look cleaner especially during busier sequences, but Netflix has done a decent job within the shackles of manageable internet streaming bandwidth." Vincent Teoh - HDTVtest

It's nice to see Netflix take the plunge and roll out UHD/4K. Nevertheless, I'm skeptical about what it might mean for viewers. I wish Netflix had tried to beat Blu-ray quality with its new UHD/4K streaming content, instead of just matching it. What do you think, are you happy to see 4K/UHD streaming come to Netflix, or should the company work to further improve its 1080p offerings?

Like AVS Forum on Facebook
Follow AVS Forum on Twitter
+1 AVS Forum on Google+


I think the company should work to further improve on its 1080p offerings. But that's just me.

Sony Bravia KDL-55W900A LED/3D TV.
Sony BDP S6200 3D Blu ray Player.
Sony 5.2-Channel 4K A/V HD Receiver - STRDH540.
Center Channel Speaker: Tivoli Signature Series.
Tower Speakers: Sony SS-MF315's.
Surrounds: Pioneer Satellite Speakers.
steve1971 is offline  
post #106 of 124 Old 04-30-2014, 09:19 AM
AVS Special Member
 
steve1971's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Saint Paul, Minnesota.
Posts: 1,973
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 174 Post(s)
Liked: 276
Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlb View Post

I think you miss the key point. It may not look like 4k off one of the UHD hard drives; but their 1080P also doesn't look like 1080P from a Blu Ray disk and my OPPO player. Ttheir 4k streaming will look significantly better than their 1080P. That's the valid comparison.

The comparison I want to see is Netflix 4K/UHD streaming versus 1080p Vudu HDX.


If you ask me 1080p Vudu HDX is beautiful and comes so very close to Blu ray quality.

Sony Bravia KDL-55W900A LED/3D TV.
Sony BDP S6200 3D Blu ray Player.
Sony 5.2-Channel 4K A/V HD Receiver - STRDH540.
Center Channel Speaker: Tivoli Signature Series.
Tower Speakers: Sony SS-MF315's.
Surrounds: Pioneer Satellite Speakers.
steve1971 is offline  
post #107 of 124 Old 05-12-2014, 01:27 PM
Member
 
rrobelen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 17
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyoAJB View Post


I'm guessing that this is a limitation of the Netflix app (including the web browser version) that PC's use.  Does it even give you the option to try and stream 4K?  If not then you will have to wait until the app/web interface is updated.  It is likely only a select few brands of 4K displays that have a Netflix app with the 4K streaming option, at present.

I spoke with someone today that seemed to know a little about Netflix 4K streaming. Here is what he suggested. Under your user icon in the upper right - in the drop down list select 'Your Account' - in 'YOUR PROFILE' select 'Playback settings' - If 'Auto' is selected change the setting to 'High' - 'Save'.
The picture improved slightly but I am still not sure I am receiving 4K. It would be nice if there was a way to find out what your are receiving?
rrobelen is offline  
post #108 of 124 Old 05-12-2014, 04:12 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
DaveFi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Natick MA
Posts: 17,178
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 26
The Windows 8 Netflix app does not support 4k. There is no Netflix 4k playback support on the PC at all.

XBOX Live: Wagmman
PSN: Wagg
BFBC2: Wagman
Steam: Wag

My Second Life character looks and acts exactly like me except he can fly.
DaveFi is offline  
post #109 of 124 Old 05-17-2014, 09:38 AM
Senior Member
 
size14d's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 399
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyoAJB View Post

More likely that the issues you were having were due to your ISP, particularly if you use Comcast.

I have Comcast business. Never have an issue streaming NetFlix at 1080p. That includes before NetFlix started paying them. Maybe they don't degrade any of their business customer's signals. One of the selling points what business traffic in their system has priority over residential so maybe it goes along those lines.
size14d is offline  
post #110 of 124 Old 05-17-2014, 09:44 AM
Senior Member
 
size14d's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Marietta, GA
Posts: 399
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by rrobelen View Post

One correction to my earlier post. Webpass, is giving me 95mbs both upstream and downstream. I said earlier 49mbs. That was through my wireless router. Wired I get the higher number. Webpass if you can get it is great. Still no 4K Netflix streaming through m PC.


If you are using a 801.11g router you won't get those high speeds wireless. You need a 801.11n or 801.11ac router.
size14d is offline  
post #111 of 124 Old 05-22-2014, 12:15 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Rudy1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Ft. Lauderdale, FL
Posts: 3,204
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 106 Post(s)
Liked: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveFi View Post

The Windows 8 Netflix app does not support 4k. There is no Netflix 4k playback support on the PC at all.

Netflix has hinted that 4K streaming through your PC may be coming later this year in the US. Japan's 4K broadcasts are starting within the next few days, and already Sharp has announced a DVR that can record 4K HEVC at 60fps:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2157141/sharp-debuts-recorder-for-4k-tv-shows.html
Rudy1 is online now  
post #112 of 124 Old 05-22-2014, 01:04 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Dan Hitchman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Northern Colorado
Posts: 9,201
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1016 Post(s)
Liked: 523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy1 View Post

Netflix has hinted that 4K streaming through your PC may be coming later this year in the US. Japan's 4K broadcasts are starting within the next few days, and already Sharp has announced a DVR that can record 4K HEVC at 60fps:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2157141/sharp-debuts-recorder-for-4k-tv-shows.html

You will also need a video card with enough horsepower to handle hardware HEVC decoding at UHD modes and, obviously, a 4k monitor.

However, the broadcast specs for UHD are still being ironed out. It's really premature to sink a bunch of money into an unknown commodity.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
Dan Hitchman is online now  
post #113 of 124 Old 05-30-2014, 10:09 AM
AVS Special Member
 
GregLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waimanalo HI
Posts: 3,250
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 167 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Here is an interesting article on how much download speed you need for 4k: Why 4K Streaming Isn’t Really 4K. The take-away:
Quote:
Why is Netflix suggesting 15 Mbps and Sony 20 Mbps when all the math says that a minimal 4K stream requires at least 40 Mbps? It's likely because the average American home is not ready to support a 40 Mbps service.

Greg Lee
GregLee is offline  
post #114 of 124 Old 05-30-2014, 11:46 AM
Advanced Member
 
HockeyoAJB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 748
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 216 Post(s)
Liked: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregLee View Post

Here is an interesting article on how much download speed you need for 4k: Why 4K Streaming Isn’t Really 4K. The take-away:

 

Nice that the providers have already figured out an excuse to use when the 4K stream doesn't look as good as upscaled Blu-Ray content..."Blame your ISP".

 

A lot of people will probably fall for that.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again, they should be shooting for PQ that surpasses upscaled Blu-Ray w/ all forms of native 4K content delivery.  If that means streams have to be in the 40 Mbps range then so be it.  Maybe that means you will turn off some customers from the streaming option, but there are other methods that could be employed.  Downloads of similar quality may take folks hours (or even days, if they use DSL), but it beats paying all that money on equipment for a poor implementation of 4K.  For those who can't stream it (most of us) and those who don't want to wait for it to download (again, likely most of us), there has to be some form of physical media.  Whether that be a new disc format, high capacity flash memory, or even a hard disk drive with preloaded movies doesn't really matter to me.  Pick one, two, or even all three.

 

IMO, the only realistic plan for getting 4K content into the hands of consumers (in order to drive sales of 4K displays as well as the content itself) is to use a mix of streaming, downloading, broadcast, and physical media.  Based on current internet bandwidth pricing and availability, I don't think that they can realistically expect the combination of streaming and downloading to account for even 50% of sales unless they want it to be an extremely niche market.  I'd suggest a 20/30/50 (20% stream, 30% download, 50% physical) plan to start.  In the next two years, add broadcast to the mix, going to a 20/20/20/40 (20% streaming, 20% downloading, 20% broadcast, 40% physical) plan.  If, over the next 5 years, internet bandwidth pricing and availability makes streaming possible for more people then you can ween people off of physical media to an extent and perhaps go to a 30/20/30/20 plan.

HockeyoAJB is online now  
post #115 of 124 Old 05-30-2014, 12:51 PM
AVS Special Member
 
GregLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waimanalo HI
Posts: 3,250
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 167 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyoAJB View Post

Nice that the providers have already figured out an excuse to use when the 4K stream doesn't look as good as upscaled Blu-Ray content..."Blame your ISP".
If I were a provider, I'd be thinking that very few customers will be comparing the picture they get from these supposed 4k streams with upscaled blu-ray content. Instead, they will be comparing with the 2k streams they could see previously on their wee little pads or smartphones. If the streaming "4K" looks better than that, why would customers complain?

It's not a quality thing -- it's a marketing thing.

Greg Lee
GregLee is offline  
post #116 of 124 Old 05-30-2014, 01:09 PM
Advanced Member
 
HockeyoAJB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 748
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 216 Post(s)
Liked: 240
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregLee View Post


If I were a provider, I'd be thinking that very few customers will comparing the picture they get from these supposed 4k streams with upscaled blu-ray content. Instead, they will be comparing with the 2k streams they could see previously on their wee little pads or smartphones. If the streaming "4K" looks better than that, why would customers complain?

It's not a quality thing -- it's a marketing thing.

 

Perhaps in the long run.  I suspect most early adopters of 4K will be folks who actually own a Blu-Ray player and a decent number of Blu-Rays.  And they will consume whatever content they can get their hands on in addition to up-scaling 1080p content.  So, they will be swapping from one to the other routinely.  They'll invite friends over to watch and, if the friends don't like what they see in the way of native 4K content, it could cause them to delay their own purchases.  It wouldn't take long for 4K streaming to develop a bad rep.

 

2K streaming didn't really get pushed until after a large part of the population already had the equipment to do it, including those who focus more on convenience than quality.  4K streaming is being pushed from the get-go, before anyone has the equipment to do it.  A higher % of the early 4K streaming adopters are going to demand quality in addition to convenience.

 

As far as the comparison to a 2K stream on an iPad goes, an iPad is small enough that it does a decent job of hiding some of the flaws in a 2K stream (unless you hold it to your nose).  If they are comparing a 2K stream on an iPad to a 4K stream on their much larger 4K set, they might actually get the impression that the 4K stream is worse than the 2K stream.  Then they would put the 2K stream on the big screen for comparison and see how much worse that looks than it does on their iPad.  This could lead them to blame their new TV, rather than the stream quality.  And that could result in high return rates on 4K sets.

HockeyoAJB is online now  
post #117 of 124 Old 06-16-2014, 01:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
GregLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waimanalo HI
Posts: 3,250
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 167 Post(s)
Liked: 78
I got my wife a 4k set to watch DirecTV satellite channels, mostly 1080i, with the hope that the upscaled 4k would be an PQ improvement over her previous plasma set. And it is -- it looks nice. I was so pessimistic about streaming real 4k to our relatively low bandwidth house (14mbps) that until yesterday, I hadn't even tried it. But the youtube 4k demos give a very high quality picture, approximating blu-ray 1080p quality, I guess (though I can't actually compare on this TV).

Greg Lee
GregLee is offline  
post #118 of 124 Old 06-20-2014, 10:43 AM
Member
 
bass excavator's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 173
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyoAJB View Post
Quote:Originally Posted by GregLee 

Here is an interesting article on how much download speed you need for 4k: Why 4K Streaming Isn’t Really 4K. The take-away:

 
Nice that the providers have already figured out an excuse to use when the 4K stream doesn't look as good as upscaled Blu-Ray content..."Blame your ISP".
 
A lot of people will probably fall for that.
 
I've said it before and I'll say it again, they should be shooting for PQ that surpasses upscaled Blu-Ray w/ all forms of native 4K content delivery.  If that means streams have to be in the 40 Mbps range then so be it.  Maybe that means you will turn off some customers from the streaming option, but there are other methods that could be employed.  Downloads of similar quality may take folks hours (or even days, if they use DSL), but it beats paying all that money on equipment for a poor implementation of 4K.  For those who can't stream it (most of us) and those who don't want to wait for it to download (again, likely most of us), there has to be some form of physical media.  Whether that be a new disc format, high capacity flash memory, or even a hard disk drive with preloaded movies doesn't really matter to me.  Pick one, two, or even all three.
 
IMO, the only realistic plan for getting 4K content into the hands of consumers (in order to drive sales of 4K displays as well as the content itself) is to use a mix of streaming, downloading, broadcast, and physical media.  Based on current internet bandwidth pricing and availability, I don't think that they can realistically expect the combination of streaming and downloading to account for even 50% of sales unless they want it to be an extremely niche market.  I'd suggest a 20/30/50 (20% stream, 30% download, 50% physical) plan to start.  In the next two years, add broadcast to the mix, going to a 20/20/20/40 (20% streaming, 20% downloading, 20% broadcast, 40% physical) plan.  If, over the next 5 years, internet bandwidth pricing and availability makes streaming possible for more people then you can ween people off of physical media to an extent and perhaps go to a 30/20/30/20 plan.
This is the most logical answer to the 4k content issue. It must be gradual.

Enter all at the strait gate and walk the narrow way.
"I am the way the truth and the life, no one enters the Fathers' Kingdom except through me."

Jesus is the strait gate.
bass excavator is offline  
post #119 of 124 Old 06-20-2014, 12:09 PM
AVS Special Member
 
GregLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Waimanalo HI
Posts: 3,250
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 167 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by bass excavator View Post
This is the most logical answer to the 4k content issue. It must be gradual.
I didn't write the stuff that you've attributed to me.

Greg Lee
GregLee is offline  
post #120 of 124 Old 06-21-2014, 10:46 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
NetworkTV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: CT
Posts: 15,623
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 172 Post(s)
Liked: 454
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregLee View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by HockeyoAJB

Nice that the providers have already figured out an excuse to use when the 4K stream doesn't look as good as upscaled Blu-Ray content..."Blame your ISP".

If I were a provider, I'd be thinking that very few customers will be comparing the picture they get from these supposed 4k streams with upscaled blu-ray content. Instead, they will be comparing with the 2k streams they could see previously on their wee little pads or smartphones. If the streaming "4K" looks better than that, why would customers complain?

It's not a quality thing -- it's a marketing thing.
Which is why I honestly would rather see better HD with the bandwidth they're giving to 4K than trying to view 4K in a wrapper that doesn't quite fit the product.

Really good HD looks great on any screen. Bit starved 4K will have the same compression artifacts and washed out visuals regardless of screen size. I'd rather a little less detail in the master than have any improvement be lost with the amount of compression they'll squeeze it all down with. What good is creating content where you can see every freckle when it's just going to get compressed into wax by the time it reaches the viewer?

It feels like the whole SD/HD situation all over again. In professional television, I've seen some excellent broadcast quality SD that looks far better than some of the bit starved HD that is full of compression artifacts. The problem is, consumers only see the dumbing down of every format, so that 480i SD really ended up as low bit rate 320i when they saw it at home.

We're seeing the same thing in the push for 4K: HD has become so overly compressed with so called "improved codecs" that we feel the need to push for higher resolutions at bit rates that should be given to HD.

It seems like with every year we're becoming more OK with less bandwidth and more artifacts all in the name of fitting it into our technical limitations. We'll gladly accept the myth that some new codec is twice as efficient just so we can justify giving it less bandwidth. Then we'll compain later when the dye has been cast and the standard is set - only to have everything slowly settle to the bottom of the barrel over time.

Last edited by NetworkTV; 06-21-2014 at 10:54 AM.
NetworkTV is offline  
Reply Latest Industry News

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off