Sony Blames Blu-ray for "Bag of Hurt" - Page 45 - AVS Forum
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post #1321 of 1354 Old 07-03-2014, 01:07 PM
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Here's an idea that might financially help Blu-ray a little bit for a little longer. As soon as a title formerly only available on DVD gets a Blu-ray release, immediately discontinue the DVD edition. Then if true 4K Blu-ray goes mainstream, as soon as a title formerly only available on 1080p Blu-ray gets a 4k Blu-ray release, immediately discontinue the 1080p Blu-ray edition. It would require more people to upgrade their players, and people would only be able to buy the most current edition of a title. Also, they'd cut even more costs if they'd quit bundling all previous editions with it!
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post #1322 of 1354 Old 07-03-2014, 01:34 PM
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Unfortunately the cost is minimal to add the DVD version with the BD. The amount extra they charge should morethan cover a tidy profit. Although I hate having these DVDs included since I will never use them

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post #1323 of 1354 Old 07-03-2014, 01:35 PM
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I agree, I don't understand why they even make DVD's any more. But I don't think companies will do this, they probably make more money selling all different versions, otherwise they wouldn't sell DVD's.
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post #1324 of 1354 Old 07-03-2014, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
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Unfortunately the cost is minimal to add the DVD version with the BD. The amount extra they charge should morethan cover a tidy profit. Although I hate having these DVDs included since I will never use them
I think he means the individual DVD's.

But that brings up another idea, discontinue the individual DVD's, but keep including them in the Blu-rays as they are released, and then with 4K, discontinue the individual blu-rays, and sell the 4k blu-ray and the 1080p blu-ray. They will probably maximize profit that way too.
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post #1325 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 05:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
I think he means the individual DVD's.

But that brings up another idea, discontinue the individual DVD's, but keep including them in the Blu-rays as they are released, and then with 4K, discontinue the individual blu-rays, and sell the 4k blu-ray and the 1080p blu-ray. They will probably maximize profit that way too.
On one hand, backward compatibility might be a selling point regarding bundles, but on the other hand, bundles are more expensive for the consumer and less people would buy them. I just thought of something. What if they make single, hybrid multi-layer discs--in addition to the BD50 layer, the manufacture discs with a 4K layer and an SD DVD layer. Would hybrid discs be as expensive to manufacture, as well as to purchase, as bundles? If so, then they should just quit bundling, sell the most current version, and make us upgrade our equipment for the better. If hybrid discs wouldn't be too expensive to manufacture or to purchase, then they should discontinue all single-disc-type editions and bundles, start bringing on the hybrids, and everyone might benifit from discs compatible with everything from DVD players to 1080p Blu-ray players to 4K Blu-ray players!
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post #1326 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 06:06 AM
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I think a hybrid disk would be very expensive compared to what they do now. The thing with bundles is it's virtually free for them to include extra discs. The bulk of the cost is licensing the movie, distribution, the package, etc. I read somewhere that the case and shipping is more expensive than the blu-ray itself. So adding a blu-ray into a 4k blu-ray package is virtually free, or extremely cheap to do. They just mark it combo packages because they can. After a year or two, combo packages fall into 5 dollar bins.
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post #1327 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
I think a hybrid disk would be very expensive compared to what they do now. The thing with bundles is it's virtually free for them to include extra discs. The bulk of the cost is licensing the movie, distribution, the package, etc. I read somewhere that the case and shipping is more expensive than the blu-ray itself. So adding a blu-ray into a 4k blu-ray package is virtually free, or extremely cheap to do. They just mark it combo packages because they can. After a year or two, combo packages fall into 5 dollar bins.
Then I guess they should stick with multi-disc-type bundles, but stop selling different disc types individually. At least it would ensure backward compatibility and might help to keep physical media alive a little longer.
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post #1328 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big C View Post
On one hand, backward compatibility might be a selling point regarding bundles, but on the other hand, bundles are more expensive for the consumer and less people would buy them. I just thought of something. What if they make single, hybrid multi-layer discs--in addition to the BD50 layer, the manufacture discs with a 4K layer and an SD DVD layer. Would hybrid discs be as expensive to manufacture, as well as to purchase, as bundles? If so, then they should just quit bundling, sell the most current version, and make us upgrade our equipment for the better. If hybrid discs wouldn't be too expensive to manufacture or to purchase, then they should discontinue all single-disc-type editions and bundles, start bringing on the hybrids, and everyone might benifit from discs compatible with everything from DVD players to 1080p Blu-ray players to 4K Blu-ray players!
I would rather have separate discs than a Hybrid one. At least with separate discs I can just trash the ones I don't want. The Hybrid discs would have too much going on with multiple layers for each version.

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post #1329 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 11:20 AM
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Post 1326 suggests that hybrids are more expensive to produce and that bundles would cost less. Post 1327 suggests that doing away with separate editins and sticking with bundles might help be a good way to go.
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post #1330 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassment View Post
I agree, I don't understand why they even make DVD's any more. But I don't think companies will do this, they probably make more money selling all different versions, otherwise they wouldn't sell DVD's.
Unfortunately they were not able to get everyone on board with Blu-ray. In many cases devices still use/come with DVD drives - think computers, car rear seat entertainment, portable players etc. (and now instead of DVD drives being replaced by Blu-ray drives in many cases the drives are being dropped altogether). So many people want both copies the Blu-ray for the big screen TV in the living room and the DVD for everywhere else.
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post #1331 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
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I agree, I don't understand why they even make DVD's any more. But I don't think companies will do this, they probably make more money selling all different versions, otherwise they wouldn't sell DVD's.
Uh, because DVDs *still* make a ton of money.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dadehaye...-anytime-soon/

While everyone at AVS is aware of PQ with Blu-Ray the mass consumers don't buy into the Blu-Ray "hype" when you need a new TV to enjoy it. 480p is "good enough" for the majority of movies, especially when titles aren't even available on Blu-Ray /*glares at "The Fabulous Baker Boys", "Titan A.E.", etc.

http://www.the-numbers.com/weekly-dvd-sales-chart
http://www.the-numbers.com/weekly-bluray-sales-chart

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post #1332 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 04:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Big C View Post
Here's an idea that might financially help Blu-ray a little bit for a little longer. As soon as a title formerly only available on DVD gets a Blu-ray release, immediately discontinue the DVD edition.
/Sarcasm Yeah, that's a "good" idea -- like consumers "love" forced obsolescence.
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post #1333 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 07:27 PM
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It's a shame Apple decided not to support Blu-ray. Imagine playing a Blu-ray on a Macbook Pro laptop with a 15" 2560x1600 IPS Retina display and good built-in speakers. This would have further shown the potential of this great hardware, as well as opened the door for in-car Blu-ray solutions and portable Blu-ray solutions continuing beyond 2012 or 2013. While Apple is right to have pride in their hardware and do well selling it, they should have allowed it to perform at its full potential and support Blu-ray, as opposed to having pride in their compressed video format which didn't allow maximum performance. As a company, how can you make good hardware, yet not allow consumers to use it to its maximum potential! As a result, I'm sticking with HP laptops, and if I get financially lucky, I might get an Alienware or something.
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post #1334 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 08:03 PM
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Blu-Ray=Lie Ray.
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post #1335 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Big C View Post
It's a shame Apple decided not to support Blu-ray. Imagine playing a Blu-ray on a Macbook Pro laptop with a 15" 2560x1600 IPS Retina display and good built-in speakers. This would have further shown the potential of this great hardware, as well as opened the door for in-car Blu-ray solutions and portable Blu-ray solutions continuing beyond 2012 or 2013. While Apple is right to have pride in their hardware and do well selling it, they should have allowed it to perform at its full potential and support Blu-ray, as opposed to having pride in their compressed video format which didn't allow maximum performance. As a company, how can you make good hardware, yet not allow consumers to use it to its maximum potential! As a result, I'm sticking with HP laptops, and if I get financially lucky, I might get an Alienware or something.
Itunes offers high quality movies above Blu-Ray quality. Apple is to much like Sony. Neither of them is going to pay anyone royalties to use there products. Hence, why Sony does not have a DLP projector and why Apple and Microsoft do not offer Blu_ray support out of the box. Audiovox makes a in car Blu-Ray player. http://www.amazon.com/Audiovox-AVDBR.../dp/B009CW6YZC
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post #1336 of 1354 Old 07-04-2014, 08:30 PM
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In a press release late last year the BDA hinted that any players capable of handling UHD discs would not be backwards-compatible with DVDs, though full compatibility with current BDs would be assured. This is predicated on triple-layer discs being selected as the standard for UHD BDs. Despite all their moaning about how unprofitable Blu-Ray has been for them, you can rest assured that Sony will be among the very first manufacturers to debut consumer UHD Blu-Ray players.
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post #1337 of 1354 Old 07-05-2014, 07:36 AM
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Itunes offers high quality movies above Blu-Ray quality. ...
Are you talking about demo movies or actual higher quality versions of all/most of the movies they sell? If you are talking about normal movies I could buy on Blu-ray how exactly do they do offer a "high quality" verison? Where do they get them from?

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post #1338 of 1354 Old 07-05-2014, 07:46 AM
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I like having the DVD so that I can create small files to be played on my kids Ipads. Kids don't care about quality and honestly DVD looks good on an Ipad.
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post #1339 of 1354 Old 07-05-2014, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Itunes offers high quality movies above Blu-Ray quality. Apple is to much like Sony. Neither of them is going to pay anyone royalties to use there products. Hence, why Sony does not have a DLP projector and why Apple and Microsoft do not offer Blu_ray support out of the box. Audiovox makes a in car Blu-Ray player. http://www.amazon.com/Audiovox-AVDBR.../dp/B009CW6YZC
Itunes offers high quality movies above Blu-Ray quality.

I don't think so. Maybe on a 2" screen but not on a large front projection set up for sure. Not sure where that one is coming from
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post #1340 of 1354 Old 07-05-2014, 01:44 PM
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Uh, because DVDs *still* make a ton of money.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dadehaye...-anytime-soon/

While everyone at AVS is aware of PQ with Blu-Ray the mass consumers don't buy into the Blu-Ray "hype" when you need a new TV to enjoy it. 480p is "good enough" for the majority of movies, especially when titles aren't even available on Blu-Ray /*glares at "The Fabulous Baker Boys", "Titan A.E.", etc.

http://www.the-numbers.com/weekly-dvd-sales-chart
http://www.the-numbers.com/weekly-bluray-sales-chart
That article actually considers blu-ray as "dvds".
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post #1341 of 1354 Old 07-05-2014, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Itunes offers high quality movies above Blu-Ray quality. Apple is to much like Sony. Neither of them is going to pay anyone royalties to use there products. Hence, why Sony does not have a DLP projector and why Apple and Microsoft do not offer Blu_ray support out of the box. Audiovox makes a in car Blu-Ray player. http://www.amazon.com/Audiovox-AVDBR.../dp/B009CW6YZC
Not even close. Itunes movies are way worse than blu-ray quality. I'd say the main reason is that apple doesn't use any optical drive on many of their laptops, as the laptops are thinner than the disc drives.
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post #1342 of 1354 Old 07-05-2014, 06:10 PM
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15" IPS 2560x1600 Retina screen with high-quality built-in speakers without Blu-ray? What a waste!
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post #1343 of 1354 Old 07-06-2014, 07:07 PM
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15" IPS 2560x1600 Retina screen with high-quality built-in speakers without Blu-ray? What a waste!
Apple dropped any CD/DVD drive from their laptops since way back actually.

USB 3.0 bluray players still available and useful on Mac atm.


Btw, not buying in the "laptop with good speakers" thing. It may be good for a laptop, but it still sucks on an absolute scale.
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post #1344 of 1354 Old 07-06-2014, 07:09 PM
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It seems the MBP is aimed at creative pros more than anyone else. But I'm sure BDs can be "ported" over with an external drive if absolutely necessary to have.

edit: beat me to it

"I knew you'd say that"...*BLAM!*
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post #1345 of 1354 Old 07-07-2014, 04:49 AM
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That article actually considers blu-ray as "dvds".
Man, that's annoying. I see people in Amazon reviews referring to "Blu-ray DVDs" quite frequently. Apparently, to many people, a disc is a disc is a disc.

Now, when I play my Blu-ray on my turntable, which side gets the needle?
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post #1346 of 1354 Old 07-07-2014, 05:07 AM
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Apple dropped any CD/DVD drive from their laptops since way back actually.
Apple is generally quicker than other computer makers to ditch legacy components when they detect declining customer use. They were also the first major computer maker to ditch floppy disks. They are now aggressively ditching hard disks in favor of SSDs.

Personally, I don't think laptops make for a good movie viewing experience anyhow.
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post #1347 of 1354 Old 07-07-2014, 05:31 AM
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I think China plays a big role in marketing these physical media. A bootleg copy of DVD is 1/10 the price of a BD variant. This means the manufacturing cost of DVD is low. DVD writer is a lot cheaper than BD writer.
The only way BD can be cheaper is if China ditches the DVD market.
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post #1348 of 1354 Old 07-07-2014, 06:12 AM
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Apple is generally quicker than other computer makers to ditch legacy components when they detect declining customer use. They were also the first major computer maker to ditch floppy disks. They are now aggressively ditching hard disks in favor of SSDs.

Personally, I don't think laptops make for a good movie viewing experience anyhow.
They sure dropped USB fast on their tablets... :P
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post #1349 of 1354 Old 07-07-2014, 11:19 AM
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DRM killed Blu-ray for me. When building my second media PC, the Blu-ray players were finally down in price, so I figured why not install one instead of just the DVD variety. Then I bought Blu-ray "Sound Of Music" for my wife as a present - but we couldn't play it. The DRM was requiring special software purchase to play the disk. To hell with that. I had to waste time breaking the DRM, just to play my legally purchased copy, which now resides conveniently on a hard drive. I made the mistake later of also buying the "Lord OfThe Rings" trilogy on Blu-ray, and those wouldn't play either without hacking. At this point, I have little interest in buying Blu-ray disks which won't play in my player without spending more on software or messing around hacking DRM, are inconvenient compared to hard drive stored media, and more prone to misplacement/damage from my kids. IMHO Sony is behind the times with Blu-ray and not meeting enough customer needs.
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post #1350 of 1354 Old 07-07-2014, 03:59 PM
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DRM killed Blu-ray for me. When building my second media PC, the Blu-ray players were finally down in price, so I figured why not install one instead of just the DVD variety. Then I bought Blu-ray "Sound Of Music" for my wife as a present - but we couldn't play it. The DRM was requiring special software purchase to play the disk. To hell with that. I had to waste time breaking the DRM, just to play my legally purchased copy, which now resides conveniently on a hard drive. I made the mistake later of also buying the "Lord OfThe Rings" trilogy on Blu-ray, and those wouldn't play either without hacking. At this point, I have little interest in buying Blu-ray disks which won't play in my player without spending more on software or messing around hacking DRM, are inconvenient compared to hard drive stored media, and more prone to misplacement/damage from my kids. IMHO Sony is behind the times with Blu-ray and not meeting enough customer needs.
I never had any issues playing my BD of The Sound of Music. Whether I played the disc or the BD ISO rip it played fine.

I also had no issues with my LotR Triolgy BDs. I have no idea why you had those issues but that is not the norm. What kind of player were you using? Maybe that was the issue?

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