Is Samsung Giving Up On OLED TV? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:26 AM
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I am wondering if Samsung will continue making Plasma's after June, considering their departure from OLED
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post #92 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:27 AM
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Let's hope so...

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post #93 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:36 AM
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As Nikkei article says for Samsung it was a matter of better ROI for OLED business. It's just a common sense from Samsung to do this pause. They can sell thousands large screen OLED TV sets worldwide or millions of small and midsize OLED displays for mobile or portable devices. If I was faced with that choice and had only a discrete, fixed amount of money to spend on OLED factory I'd do the same in a heart beat. Granted it is not music to the ears of A/V enthusiasts but OLED is essentially following the same growth and maturity patterns as plasma and LCD. First LCD displays were small and expensive. It took quite a few years to work all of the issues with production, quality and proper manufacturing yields. 

 

I would look at this development as a wise decision since this pause will allow Samsung to work out methods to develop technologies to make large, high quality OLED panels at lower costs and better yields.

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post #94 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

.
but for now, I'm gonna use my plasmas until they stop working or OLED replaces LED

Same here. I still enjoy my Runco 50" plasma.
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post #95 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:45 AM
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Maybe Sony,Toshiba and even Panasonic and others will buy OLED panels from LGD? You never know many including Sony and Toshiba are buying plenty of LCD panels from them right now! Sammie might build a OLED TV panel plant in future if they can make a business case for it down the road.

It might be a stretch for Samsung to do likewise but not at all unprecedented as they currently buy Sharp , AUO, etc. panels ☺

I bought a '13 Sammie plasma , '13 Sony LED/LCD along with a '13 LG LED/LCD so I'm set until and if OLED prices ever come down substantially ☺

EDIT: Actually ,
Quote:
JAPANESE TV MAKERS IN TALKS WITH LG to buy OLED TV panels

Sony and Panasonic entered into a partnership with a plan to develop OLED TVs, but nothing concrete ever materialized, and the partnership has ended.

Now they are looking to Korea for help, according to ET News, who says that the companies are negotiating for supply of OLED TV panels from LG.Display.Sony and Panasonic hope to source OLED TV panels from LG - just like the Chinese TV makers
read more: http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1398328440

Sony and Panasonic will be making their own picture circuits so that's likely a winning proposition there!
I want one!.............someday.

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post #96 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sibuna View Post

a 10000$ TV not selling well

YOU DON'T SAY!

maybe tgey will bring back plasma biggrin.gif

I hope so. I love my plasma tvs and without something else getting produced I shudder as the LCD option as my "next" tv if my plasma's crap out.
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post #97 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 10:55 AM
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Samsung had the best laser LED DLP set on the market and was all too ready to dump it too! I think the chairman of the board of that corporation is just too timid, and they also do a poor job of marketing. I love my Samsung LED DLP, and I wouldn't trade it for anything, but I guess I can't blame them for jumping ship during the 2008 market crash.
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post #98 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 11:30 AM
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OLED without 4K is a non-starter for me, and the curved screen really sinks the boat. The top LED TV's are darned good and a fraction of the price. I'll check back again in 2 years.
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post #99 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 11:32 AM
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I will laugh "if" Apple builds an oled tv/apple tv and sells them in direct competition to LG, samsung, and Sony.

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post #100 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 11:39 AM
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Pioneer still makes high-end Plasma sets.

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post #101 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 12:27 PM
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Man what a shame! Will OLED never arrive??? Man, THIS is the tech people actually HAVE been waiting for. Will shuttering the plant really help get the prices down?? Bah.
Especially since all the new Samsugn LCD and their LCD factories produce messed up panels that have striping defects, almost all of them, where every other scanline when fed the same level of green does not put out the same level of green! Especiall on certain parts of each screen! And the black levels seem to be getting worse with LCD again instead of better.
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post #102 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BizarroTerl View Post

70" or larger check
OLED check
4K/UHD check
curved screen PASS
My thoughts exactly
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post #103 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 01:07 PM
 
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Curved screen isn't a deal-breaker...speaking as an owner of one of these newfangled OLEDs, it's a back of the mind issue that I could do with or without.
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post #104 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmatheny View Post

Pioneer still makes high-end Plasma sets.

Pioneer doesn't make TV displays of any type. They have licensed their name, and check the designs, but they don't actually design or produce anything.
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post #105 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 01:56 PM
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OK - you can BUY Pioneer branded plasma sets - better? BTW - who makes their panels?

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post #106 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmatheny View Post

The bigger crime here is uneducated consumers preferred the blindingly bright, over-saturated look of LCD over Plasma, and plasma has gone by the wayside - not because it's inferior to LCD - it is MUCH superior - but because of idiotic purchasers. I just got a PN64F5500, probably one of the last Plasma strains Samsung will produce, because I can't STAND looking at an unnatural LCD screen. Pasty flesh tones, terrible blacks and contrast.


I have to agree with the 'general version' of your statement. It is my personal opinion that 99% of the TV watching population have no idea WHAT a good TV picture should look like, nor bother or know how to set up their TV to get the best out of their TV. When I was shopping for my new flat screen TV, I had to request the remote so that I could set up the color, contrast, brightness and lighting temp., as EVERY TV on display was way off optimum. After I had set up every TV I was interested in, there was always one that stood out. The funny thing was that other people shopping for TVs always came back to the TV I had selected as best and commented about it. You'd think that every TV section would have someone who knew how to set up TVs on the floor to show off their lines to their best performance. But even then I can guarantee that when the customers get their new TV home, they will not know or bother to set it up correctly.

My personal final selection ended up being the Visio M3D470KD, a 47" 3D 240 hz. properly adjusted set that has absolutely the best color picture of any TV in my price range, and believe it or not, the passive 3D has absolutely NO artifacts and a perceived sharper image than the same image in 2D! This TV will happily be around for many years before replacement as I can not expect a better picture to be available at my price range ($1,000 - $1,500) for many years.
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post #107 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 02:02 PM
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First, I'd like to say that I hope OLED technology becomes prevalent and less expensive. It is the logical next step to plasma. Curved screens, in my opinion, are a mistake for consumer electronics. They seem to be only another marketing gimmick to show how OLED can be curved and/or flexible. Flexible OLED displays might make sense in some applications, but not in a consumer home theater.

Next, I want to say something about 1080p vs 4K. Personally, I think the whole UHD/4K thing (for the consumer market) is just a marketing gimmick. A person with 20/20 vision can only perceive detail at a resolution of one arcminute. That's one sixtieth (1/60) of one degree, or 0.01666667 degrees. Of course, some people have vision that is better than 20/20. When I was 20 years old, my vision was 20/15 in my right eye, and 20/17 in my left eye. I now wear progressive bifocals that correct my vision to a little better than 20/20.

Let's take my 64 inch 1080p TV for example. In order for a person with 20/20 vision to see every detail that the TV is capable of displaying, he/she would need to sit less than 8 feet from the screen. That same person with 20/20 vision would need to sit less than 4 feet from a 4K display of the same size.

Would you want to sit less than 4 feet from a 64 inch TV? I didn't think so. If you are like me, then 4K displays are unnecessary.

I've actually tested this. First, make sure that your TV (and the playback device) is set to display 1:1 pixel mapping (no overscan). Search online or make your own bitmap which is exactly 1080x1920 (for a 1080p TV). The columns of pixels in the image should alternate between black and white. Basically, the image should be alternating black/white vertical stripes that are one pixel wide. Put on your glasses/contacts if you wear them. Move toward the screen until you can see the individual columns of black and white. Now, move back just before they turn gray. This is the distance at which your eyes can see the full detail of your display.

How far are you from the screen? If you had a 4K display, you would need to sit half that distance.

In my living room, I sit 12 feet from my 64 inch 1080p TV. In order to see the individual pixels on my TV, I need to sit between 7 and 8 feet from the TV. In order to take full advantage of a 4K display at 7-8 feet, I would need a 128 inch TV. At 10.5-12 feet, that grows to 192 inches. Do YOU want to sit 12 feet from a 192 inch screen? I wouldn't.

Personally, I think that's too big. Prior to my divorce (back when I still had money), I built my home theater to fit the room. In that room, I sat 17 feet from a 120 inch (diagonal) screen, and it gave me the same experience as I got when I sat exactly in the center of the stadium cinema near my home. I don't think I'd want to sit 7.5 feet from that same screen.

Just my opinion, of course.
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post #108 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barnabas1969 View Post

First, I'd like to say that I hope OLED technology becomes prevalent and less expensive. It is the logical next step to plasma. Curved screens, in my opinion, are a mistake for consumer electronics. They seem to be only another marketing gimmick to show how OLED can be curved and/or flexible. Flexible OLED displays might make sense in some applications, but not in a consumer home theater.

Next, I want to say something about 1080p vs 4K. Personally, I think the whole UHD/4K thing (for the consumer market) is just a marketing gimmick. A person with 20/20 vision can only perceive detail at a resolution of one arcminute. That's one sixtieth (1/60) of one degree, or 0.01666667 degrees. Of course, some people have vision that is better than 20/20. When I was 20 years old, my vision was 20/15 in my right eye, and 20/17 in my left eye. I now wear progressive bifocals that correct my vision to a little better than 20/20.

Let's take my 64 inch 1080p TV for example. In order for a person with 20/20 vision to see every detail that the TV is capable of displaying, he/she would need to sit less than 8 feet from the screen. That same person with 20/20 vision would need to sit less than 4 feet from a 4K display of the same size.

Would you want to sit less than 4 feet from a 64 inch TV? I didn't think so. If you are like me, then 4K displays are unnecessary.

I've actually tested this. First, make sure that your TV (and the playback device) is set to display 1:1 pixel mapping (no overscan). Search online or make your own bitmap which is exactly 1080x1920 (for a 1080p TV). The columns of pixels in the image should alternate between black and white. Basically, the image should be alternating black/white vertical stripes that are one pixel wide. Put on your glasses/contacts if you wear them. Move toward the screen until you can see the individual columns of black and white. Now, move back just before they turn gray. This is the distance at which your eyes can see the full detail of your display.

How far are you from the screen? If you had a 4K display, you would need to sit half that distance.

In my living room, I sit 12 feet from my 64 inch 1080p TV. In order to see the individual pixels on my TV, I need to sit between 7 and 8 feet from the TV. In order to take full advantage of a 4K display at 7-8 feet, I would need a 128 inch TV. At 10.5-12 feet, that grows to 192 inches. Do YOU want to sit 12 feet from a 192 inch screen? I wouldn't.

Personally, I think that's too big. Prior to my divorce (back when I still had money), I built my home theater to fit the room. In that room, I sat 17 feet from a 120 inch (diagonal) screen, and it gave me the same experience as I got when I sat exactly in the center of the stadium cinema near my home. I don't think I'd want to sit 7.5 feet from that same screen.

Just my opinion, of course.

Closer, the better experience:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimum_HDTV_viewing_distance

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/4k-resolution-201312153517.htm

8-9 ft at 55"- 65". Perfect sitting distances for 4K wink.gif
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post #109 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBlow74 View Post

I will laugh "if" Apple builds an oled tv/apple tv and sells them in direct competition to LG, samsung, and Sony.

Why? Apple buying into OLED will be the quickest way to get these prices down, Apples ability to market, hype and sell would put a big demand on OLED. Aluminum use to be very expensive but with Apple pumping it out its price has dropped a lot and made it more affordable. Apple getting onto the OLED train will be a great thing for consumers who hope to afford one one day.

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post #110 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 02:52 PM
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Samsung used to think in an innovative, independent manner but has given into the worship of the bottom line. They also used to stand behind their products but have of late been abandoning their customer service that once stood above the fray.

ie I own a barely two year old plasma with the well documented "purple hue" flaw. I have been completely ignored by their service/tech department with not even a phone call back after emails and three phone calls. They used to replace these defective panels even if out of warranty.

I'm not holding my breath that they will do anything of note until forced to by the money god!
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post #111 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 02:58 PM
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I see a lot of talk about playback quality and how great 4k is and sure I get the fuss. For the average user though with the average sized lounge area there is no visible difference on a 65 inch or smaller set between good quality 1080p and 4k. Most can't even tell the difference between 1080i and 1080p.
That combined with limited 4k content in the mass market just makes it a ridiculously easy choice to go with standard edge or full led back lit LED LCD panels.
Remember that full led back lit LCD is available as well with local dimming that actually increases the contrast ratio to an acceptable level for the average user.
Samsung is a mass market producer.
They made the right choice for the mass market.
Hit on the specialist companies with ultra high end devices to do oled. Don't really see any of the others doing it though.
Samsung and LG seem to be the only companies putting any sort of push on development.
I think LG will end up pulling out of the big screen market. Samsung are ironing out the bugs on the small screens first where the mass market has already accepted OLED and AMOLED technology.
Makes sense.
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post #112 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellenback View Post

Samsung used to think in an innovative, independent manner but has given into the worship of the bottom line.

Can you cite a publicly traded company that HASN'T given-in to the worship of the bottom line?
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post #113 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:14 PM
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This "anti-lcd religion" is ridiculous, some lcd are better than your plasma, and not only the 2014 models.
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post #114 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmatheny View Post

OK - you can BUY Pioneer branded plasma sets - better? BTW - who makes their panels?

The fact that a TV has the Pioneer brand on it is only of marketing significance as there is no Pioneer technology in them, so this is not just a question of grammar.

In any case, the sets are not available in North America and they are LCD, not plasma.
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post #115 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:20 PM
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It's funny, I was going to say that you are all wrong smile.gif
As I figured who buys a TV that wants watch good quality anyways. I didn't think there were many people left.
I thought Anyone wanting a good picture would buy a projector with great contrast. But judging by the amount of people here posting in this thread there is still a lot of people looking for a good quality picture.
BUT...

I'm not one of them.
and I guess quite a few people who would spend a considerable amount on HT also do NOT spend a ton of money on televisions.
My angle is this:
I am spending all of my extra monies on my dedicated HT build. Spending most of the money on a great LCOS based projector, dedicated, large screen, dark, acoustically treated room.

I could care less of the quality of my TV in the living room. I want my evening viewing to be special. an Event.
I'll go down to my basement mancave to watch movies and sports, and watch the news and PBS upstairs on my crappy 46 inch LCD TV.

so no OLEd for me....
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Originally Posted by Sona Kakoo View Post

This "anti-lcd religion" is ridiculous, some lcd are better than your plasma, and not only the 2014 models.
G'wan then, name some decidedly superior models in all aspects to plasma.
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post #117 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:23 PM
 
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Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

I am loyal to Sony due to their customer service which I consider excellent and no matter what electronics I have bought Sony has always been the most reliable and lasted the longest. On top of that I think their W900A which I own is one of their best HDTV's made in some time.
A funny thing about that is one of our illustrious forum sponsors said that Sony is the one manufacturer who doesn't necessarily care about making the more irate customer happy, lol (when referring to manufacturers that hand out full refunds for defective panels...they're apparently the most reluctant to do so in his experience).
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post #118 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

G'wan then, name some decidedly superior models in all aspects to plasma.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonoman View Post




easy, the new Samsung HU9000 UHD curved screen.
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post #119 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:32 PM
 
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^LOL. eek.gif Wow, having a bad flashback to 2007 when I owned one of their edge-lits. Samdung, what a joke you are!
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post #120 of 196 Old 05-08-2014, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubby497 View Post

Closer, the better experience:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optimum_HDTV_viewing_distance

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/4k-resolution-201312153517.htm

8-9 ft at 55"- 65". Perfect sitting distances for 4K wink.gif
Honestly, I would like a larger TV for my 12 foot viewing distance, but cost and functional reasons prohibit this in my current viewing area. If I had what I would prefer, my TV would be approximately 84" diagonal. If I had better control over the ambient light in my viewing area, I would go with a fixed matte screen and a projector. Unfortunately, I don't have enough control over the ambient light.

Obviously, everyone has their own preference when it comes to distance from the screen. I chose the size of the screen in the home theater at my previous place of residence based on my preferred seating position in the stadium cinema near my home. I went to the cinema and arrived early for the movie. I found the seat which was my personal ideal position. I then used the ceiling tiles to measure the width of the screen and my distance from the screen. I scaled these measurements to fit my room.

As for the two links you provided, all I can tell you is this: I've measured it with my own two eyes using the method I described above. The human eye cannot perceive the difference between 1080p and 4K at 8-9 feet on a 64 inch plasma display (a Samsung PN64D8000). Try it for yourself.
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