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post #361 of 527 Old 11-06-2009, 02:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Audyssey Pro kit EQ Calibration
Try #1 - 11-06-09
Try #2 - 11-08-09 w/80Hz crossovers (no measurement changes)

(I'll add more detail later...)


For full information see post #1 in my HT Thread

Fixed Features
Room:
-- Dedicated HT room - designed by Rives Audio (Level 1+) with some modficiations (eg front partial wall added after design)
–- Room dimensions - 22' 4" x 17' 6" x 7'7” height (ceiling diffusers hang down 3”)
AVR: Denon 5308CI
Front: Rocket RS1000Sig
Center: Rocket RSC200Sig "Bigfoot"
Sides: Rocket RSS300
Back: Rocket RS250MkII

Variables:
Audyssey version: v3.2.628.465
Measures: 8 (at each seat) -- back extreme L/R seats are off axis from L/R tweeters!
RS1000Sig
-- toe in: aimed at center
-- woofers aimed (in or out): in
-- woofers gain: approx 40% max (left), 60% max (right) -- hmm, no reason that should be assymetric!
-- woofers phase: 12 o'clock (on L & R) - next time will change to 0
-- woofers frequency (crossover/cutoff): midway -- so 150-30 = 120/2 = 60 + 30 base position = ~90 Hz cuttoff - change to 80 next time
RSC200Sig Center: tilted up toward ear height
Sub position: front left corner
Target Sound Options:
-- Mid range compensation (MRC): off
-- High frequency roll off: #1
Mic: ~1.5 ft from back of leather chair
Measure #1: front, mid (right)
Chairs:
-- Front - measured as fully reclined
-- Back - measured not reclined


Mike


ADDENDUM:
Audyssey Thread troubleshooting - link

I'm sure I'll be making a few changes:
- no cell phone/blackberyy in room (may interfere)
- quiet as possible background noise
- mic away from seat
- 2 height positions at each seat (?)
- less "wide" at rear seating postion based on L/R toe in
- L/R to "small" or 40/60/80 Hz crossover [did on 11-08-09]
- more measurements
- decrease "vol/gain" on sub -- given -12 dB gain via Audyssey measurement (correct?)
- RS1K woofers: increase gain ~10-20% to left and right woofers in RS1KSig (and be symmetric in gain) [noted 11-08-09], phase = 0, Freq to ~80 (10 o'clock position)
- etc.


Audyssey Question (link):

I was considering getting two subs in the future.
If my current Audyssey gain on sub is -12 and the on sub vol/gain is only at 1/3-1/2 (I'll have to check to confirm).
Then I should likely turn the gain down a little for measures, and ??? may not have that much improvement in getting additional subs (at least vis-a-vis gain)?

Auddysey graph

 

Audyssey Customer Certificate 11-06-09.pdf 147.1689453125k . file

 

Audyssey Customer Certificate 11-08-09 - 80 Hz cuttoffs.pdf 147.494140625k . file
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post #362 of 527 Old 11-18-2009, 10:54 AM - Thread Starter
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I ordered the Emotiva USP-1 pre-amp ($349) and ERC-1 CD player ($319) today.
Apparently they are on the way already.
This will be matched with my Emotiva UPA-2 amp and TCA WAF-1 speakers.

Should be fun to play with in my office setup.
Great prices.

Mike







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post #363 of 527 Old 11-21-2009, 09:40 AM
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I know this is not an Emotiva Thread but I am quite impressed with their stuff (and service). I recently replaced an Adcom and Bryston that were pulling duties driving my center and surrounds with the Emotiva 200wpc 3 channel amp. Looks rugged and sounds wonderful .... all for about $600.

I have Audyssey Pro as well. How did you get the graph with the before and after plots on it?

Great looking theater by the way. Very attractive. Rives Audio also did my room but I took the more "utilitarian" approach when it comes to appearance.
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post #364 of 527 Old 11-21-2009, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

I know this is not an Emotiva Thread but I am quite impressed with their stuff (and service). I recently replaced an Adcom and Bryston that were pulling duties driving my center and surrounds with the Emotiva 200wpc 3 channel amp. Looks rugged and sounds wonderful .... all for about $600.

I have Audyssey Pro as well. How did you get the graph with the before and after plots on it?

Great looking theater by the way. Very attractive. Rives Audio also did my room but I took the more "utilitarian" approach when it comes to appearance.

Thanks.

Do you have the Audyssey Pro kit?
You need to log in online (make an account) to use it and download the "certificates"/graphs.

Per Chris/Audyssey a new software version will include X and Y axis labels and measures in the future.

Mike
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post #365 of 527 Old 11-21-2009, 10:26 AM
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I do have a log in to Audyssey but the Certificates I get show the before and after on separate graphs. Somehow you show them on the same graph. What am I doing wrong?
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post #366 of 527 Old 11-21-2009, 10:44 AM
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Nice!
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post #367 of 527 Old 11-21-2009, 07:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

I do have a log in to Audyssey but the Certificates I get show the before and after on separate graphs. Somehow you show them on the same graph. What am I doing wrong?

Which software are you using?
I'm using v3.2.

If you have v3.2 you should contact Audyssey tech support and/or post on the Audyssey thread to get the gurus to help.

Mike

PS - I'm doing some new measurements now...
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post #368 of 527 Old 11-21-2009, 08:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Audyssey Try #3 - Date: 11-21-09


Fixed Features
Room:
-- Dedicated HT room - designed by Rives Audio (Level 1+) with some modifications (eg front partial wall added after design)
- Room dimensions - 22' 4" x 17' 6" x 7'7 height (ceiling diffusers hang down 3)
AVR: Denon 5308CI
Front: Rocket RS1000Sig
Center: Rocket RSC200Sig "Bigfoot"
Sides: Rocket RSS300
Back: Rocket RS250MkII

Variables:
Audyssey version: v3.2.628.465
Measures: 12
RS1000Sig
-- toe in: aimed at center
-- woofers aimed (in or out): in
-- woofers gain: ~ 2 oclock position [increased from last time --approx 40% max (left), 60% max (right)]
-- woofers phase: 0
-- woofers frequency (crossover/cutoff): Freq to ~80 (10 o'clock position)
RSC200Sig Center: tilted up toward ear height
Sub position: front left corner
Target Sound Options:
-- Mid range compensation (MRC): off
-- High frequency roll off: #1
Mic: ~1.5 ft from back of leather chair
Measures
-- #1: front, mid (right)
-- #2: front, mid (right) 3 ft in front of prior position
-- #3-8: remaining front seats & 3 ft in front
-- #9, 10 mid back seats (excluding most lateral back seats as off tweeter axis)
-- #11, 12 3 ft in front of first position
Chairs:
-- Front - measured as fully reclined
-- Back - measured as fully reclined

Other comments:
- no cell phones or Blackberry in room (may interfere)
- decreased subwoofer gain to = 10 oclock position -- given -12 dB gain via Audyssey measurement on 11-06 and 11-08-09 calculations
- mic away from seat
- less "wide" at rear seating position based on L/R toe in
- more measurements

Next time:
- different height measures
- include two lateral back seats as not extreme off axis (???)
- ??? change RS1000Sig woofer gain and/or crossover ???
- Consider playing with MRC and flat custom curve
- further decr sub gain

Questions:
- why is subwoofer level flat but below 0
- what is source of sawtooth pattern from back surrounds (RS250MkIIs)?

 

Audyssey Customer Certificate 11-06-09.pdf 147.1689453125k . file

 

Audyssey Customer Certificate 11-08-09 - 80 Hz cuttoffs.pdf 147.494140625k . file

 

Audyssey Customer Certificate 11-21-09 - 12 meas - 80Hz cutoff.pdf 147.958984375k . file
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post #369 of 527 Old 11-23-2009, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

I ordered the Emotiva USP-1 pre-amp ($349) and ERC-1 CD player ($319) today.
Apparently they are on the way already.
This will be matched with my Emotiva UPA-2 amp and TCA WAF-1 speakers.

Should be fun to play with in my office setup.
Great prices.

Mike


*EDIT*
Wow, after more listening, it really sounds good.
I don't atrribute this to pre-amp as it could only introduce noise in signal path, but to increasing the volume out from computer.
Now I need a DAC to play with...








Emotiva gear arrived Friday at work but I was at home.

Just got this set up.
So far I have just listened to Pandora -> USP-1 -> UPA-2 -> TCA WAF-1
Sounds great.
Could be:
1) placebo effect / new gear happiness
2) Pandora One music selection (so far: David Gilmour, Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin...)
3) increased computer volume to max*

*I'm told this increases the S/N ratio for computer based audio.
I'll now have to adjust volume with the Emotiva remote or manually.

ERC-1 tomorrow...

Mike


LL
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post #370 of 527 Old 11-25-2009, 11:28 AM
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Hello Mike.

Congrats on the Emotiva Audio ensemble. Looks great. You mentioned possibly adding a DAC to the mix. What about the ONIX DAC25 Upsampling DAC Decoder you showed interest in? Would that be an applicable solution or is the Onix for a different scenario such as the whole home audio?

Regards

"Chance favors only the prepared mind. "Louis Pasteur"

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post #371 of 527 Old 11-25-2009, 11:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ldgibson76 View Post

Hello Mike.

Congrats on the Emotiva Audio ensemble. Looks great. You mentioned possibly adding a DAC to the mix. What about the ONIX DAC25 Upsampling DAC Decoder you showed interest in? Would that be an applicable solution or is the Onix for a different scenario such as the whole home audio?

Regards

Thanks.
I'm listening to it now.
Sounds great.
The UPA-2 is way overkill.
I have to turn the gain down on the amp just to get in a useful range for the pre-amp volume control (with computer volume at max -- I think that optimizes S/N?).
Now I need to find an appropriate screwdriver size to open up the ERC-1 tank-like remote to put in batteries.

RE: DAC
I think I'll wait to see what Emotiva comes out with -- tentatively (???) before 2010. It would fit well with the other gear.

Other DAC options are interesting including Onix.
I lurk (and post) alot in the TCA forum where there is a conglomeration of Onix dealers!

If I recommended someone doing this from scratch I would likely go with:

Speakers: TCA WAF-1 (I'm awaiting the release Skiing Ninja WAF-1's sometime in the future)
Amp: TCA Gizmo or Peachtree (combo DAC/integrated amp -- very elegant solution)

Luckily I have space under my desk to put this huge stack.

Now, gotta get a 10" sub!


Mike
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post #372 of 527 Old 12-06-2009, 06:48 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm researching small (10" driver or smaller) office subwoofers.

Here are some notes (PDF)...
The new TCA sub CS-10.1 (yet to be released) is high on the list.

MIke

 

SMALL Subwoofer comparison - 2009 - 2010 TCA etc - 12-5-09.pdf 91.359375k . file
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post #373 of 527 Old 12-24-2009, 07:04 AM
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Hey mike wishing you and your family a merry Christmas

_________________________

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post #374 of 527 Old 12-24-2009, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Hey mike wishing you and your family a merry Christmas

Same here Mike, except im wishing you a happy holidays from sunny Florida, oh did I mention was almost 80 degrees and sunny today? will be back on Jan 1.
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post #375 of 527 Old 12-28-2009, 12:51 PM
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Hello Mike.

I really apologize for missing your thread before Christmas Day and wishing you a joyous holiday.

Happy Holidays to you and your family, and a properous New Year.

Regards,

"Chance favors only the prepared mind. "Louis Pasteur"

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post #376 of 527 Old 12-29-2009, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Hey mike wishing you and your family a merry Christmas

Quote:
Originally Posted by funlvr1965 View Post

Same here Mike, except im wishing you a happy holidays from sunny Florida, oh did I mention was almost 80 degrees and sunny today? will be back on Jan 1.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ldgibson76 View Post

Hello Mike.

I really apologize for missing your thread before Christmas Day and wishing you a joyous holiday.

Happy Holidays to you and your family, and a properous New Year.

Regards,

Thanks everyone.
I was out of town on vacation -- near Louisville, KY, so not as warm as some of you. (But, planning a spring FL trip with the family).

Merry (belated) Christmas to you and Happy New Years.


I got back and did another Lumagen RadianceXE firmware update.
Good piece of hardware.
Debating on a Carada CIH masking system.
Lot's of stuff to spend money on (non-HT related) in 2010 or not.

Wayne - I may actually see your wife at work in Jan. More on that later.

Ho ho ho...

Mike
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post #377 of 527 Old 12-29-2009, 08:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

Thanks everyone.
I was out of town on vacation -- near Louisville, KY, so not as warm as some of you. (But, planning a spring FL trip with the family).

Merry (belated) Christmas to you and Happy New Years.


I got back and did another Lumagen RadianceXE firmware update.
Good piece of hardware.
Debating on a Carada CIH masking system.
Lot's of stuff to spend money on (non-HT related) in 2010 or not.

Wayne - I may actually see your wife at work in Jan. More on that later.

Ho ho ho...

Mike



Sure thing Mike I will let her know. I contemplated the carada CIH also however for the moment I put a freeze on all major upgrades to the theater room especially after the last room renovation. The industry is shifting again, hdmi 1.4, led projectors not to mention 3D. etc.. This year should be an interesting year to see what comes to market........will the new led front projectors make 2009 high end projectors obsolete?
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post #378 of 527 Old 12-30-2009, 03:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funlvr1965 View Post

Sure thing Mike I will let her know. I contemplated the carada CIH also however for the moment I put a freeze on all major upgrades to the theater room especially after the last room renovation. The industry is shifting again, hdmi 1.4, led projectors not to mention 3D. etc.. This year should be an interesting year to see what comes to market........will the new led front projectors make 2009 high end projectors obsolete?

Not obsolete, just better.
Our great looking images will remain great.

I wouldn't worry about HDMI 1.4 or 3D for now.
I saw 3D at CES last year (likely skipping this year) and it was cool to see but fatiguing.
I will hold out until (at least) the second gen of (widely available) LED projectors.

The CIH masking is interesting with some upcoming fun 16:9 content -- namely the Superbowl and the Olympics!

Mike
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post #379 of 527 Old 12-30-2009, 04:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

Not obsolete, just better.
Our great looking images will remain great.

I wouldn't worry about HDMI 1.4 or 3D for now.
I saw 3D at CES last year (likely skipping this year) and it was cool to see but fatiguing.
I will hold out until (at least) the second gen of (widely available) LED projectors.

The CIH masking is interesting with some upcoming fun 16:9 content -- namely the Superbowl and the Olympics!

Mike

Mike what's your thoughts on 3D?

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post #380 of 527 Old 12-30-2009, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

Not obsolete, just better.
Our great looking images will remain great.

I wouldn't worry about HDMI 1.4 or 3D for now.
I saw 3D at CES last year (likely skipping this year) and it was cool to see but fatiguing.
I will hold out until (at least) the second gen of (widely available) LED projectors.

The CIH masking is interesting with some upcoming fun 16:9 content -- namely the Superbowl and the Olympics!

Mike


With led it would be nice to have more consistant lumens throughout the life of the projector compared with what we have now with bulbs however after going through several projectors I have found myself right back where I started which is appreciating good ansi and a sharp image, any led projector will have to measure up to the lens and ansi of the Marantz even if it means on/off isnt that great.

The 3d thing is really still in its infancy and chasing that at least for now to me doesn't seem worth it since I'm sure that will go through several versions, there aren't any official protocols for the supporting equipment for 3D now anyway.

I'm still struggling with the masking system Mike, even you and I agree that it's still a lot of money for what it really does, granted its the cheapest option from a manufacturer that we have. With me putting the kabash on any major theater spending at least for the near future it looks like this one is definately on the back burner but I can still enjoy yours!
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post #381 of 527 Old 12-30-2009, 08:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Mike what's your thoughts on 3D?

I think 3D is interesting but immature.
3D ready TV are out and coming out, but they are a small percentage of the market.
3D blu rays are out (eg, Coraline, etc), but I don't think 3D will be a major force (if ever) for several years.
3D is being used to try to get people to the theaters again and will likely be successful at some point in the future. I just wouldn't make a lot of decisions based on it now.

Mike
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post #382 of 527 Old 12-30-2009, 08:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funlvr1965 View Post

With led it would be nice to have more consistant lumens throughout the life of the projector compared with what we have now with bulbs however after going through several projectors I have found myself right back where I started which is appreciating good ansi and a sharp image, any led projector will have to measure up to the lens and ansi of the Marantz even if it means on/off isnt that great.

The 3d thing is really still in its infancy and chasing that at least for now to me doesn't seem worth it since I'm sure that will go through several versions, there aren't any official protocols for the supporting equipment for 3D now anyway.

I'm still struggling with the masking system Mike, even you and I agree that it's still a lot of money for what it really does, granted its the cheapest option from a manufacturer that we have. With me putting the kabash on any major theater spending at least for the near future it looks like this one is definately on the back burner but I can still enjoy yours!

Roger, roger.
You will obviously hear if I get a CIH masking system.


Mike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike_WI View Post

Roger, roger.
You will obviously hear if I get a CIH masking system.


Mike

I'll bring the drill ....
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post #384 of 527 Old 12-31-2009, 10:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by funlvr1965 View Post

I'll bring the drill ....

Wayne -

Thanks.
You are very helpful.
Hopefully I get to the point where I install something.
The Superbowl and Olympics are getting closer...

Mike
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post #385 of 527 Old 12-31-2009, 11:42 AM
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For what it's worth, I have ordered a motorized add-on masking system from HTIQ for my existing 2.35 screen. To date, it has not been a pleasant experience, as all I originally (over 1 year ago) received was a pile of parts and no instructions (all of which I sent back to him). We have been in contact for the entire year and the most recent ESTIMATED ship date of a completed product with detailed install instructions is the week of Jan 7 (now that I think about it, he did not specify a year!). Supossedly it will have programmable multiple stops, etc --- but given my experiences of the past, I'm not holding my breath ---

And by the way, GREAT looking room

If it works, it will be FAR cheaper than buying a system from Carada or anyone else. If this turns out to be a big pile of parts, then I will end up doing something else.

I will keep you posted.
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post #386 of 527 Old 12-31-2009, 11:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioguy View Post

For what it's worth, I have ordered a motorized add-on masking system from HTIQ for my existing 2.35 screen. To date, it has not been a pleasant experience, as all I originally (over 1 year ago) received was a pile of parts and no instructions (all of which I sent back to him). We have been in contact for the entire year and the most recent ESTIMATED ship date of a completed product with detailed install instructions is the week of Jan 7 (now that I think about it, he did not specify a year!). Supossedly it will have programmable multiple stops, etc --- but given my experiences of the past, I'm not holding my breath ---

And by the way, GREAT looking room

If it works, it will be FAR cheaper than buying a system from Carada or anyone else. If this turns out to be a big pile of parts, then I will end up doing something else.

I will keep you posted.

Thanks.
Do you have links to the HTIQ info.
I will add it to the Carada CIH thread under "Competitors".
I don't have the patience for a DIY solution.
But funlvr1965 might .

Share some links and pics.

Happy NYE,

Mike
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post #387 of 527 Old 12-31-2009, 12:02 PM - Thread Starter
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I found this...

http://htiq.com/cihmasking.php



2-Way CIH Masking System

Dual-Motor System
  • Vertical rollers on each side of screen
  • Each mask independently controlled
  • IR remote
  • Up to 10 presets
  • Space requirements: 3.0 inches on all sides of screen
  • Fits screens 108 - 144 inches wide
  • Easy to install
Pricing Details
MM2 $1499.00
Optional trim kit$199.00 (MM2-T)
Optional AT masks$99.00 (MM2-AT)
Optional RS232$199.00 (MM2-RS232)



One-Way CIH Masking
  • Top roller design with drop-down masks for 1.78 viewing
  • IR remote control
  • Space requirements: 2.5 inches above the screen, 2 inches on each side
  • Fits screen sizes 108 inch to 144 inch wide
  • Easy to install
Pricing Details
MM1-10 for screen sizes 9-10 feet wide$999.00
MM1-12 for 12 foot wide screen$1099.00
Optional trim kit$199.00 (MM1-T)
Optional AT masks$99.00 (MM1-AT)




Integrated CIH Screen Frame & Masking System
  • Aluminum screen frame
  • Integrated single-motor masking system
  • IR or optional RS232 control
  • Curved or flat screens
  • AT or non-AT screen material available (sold separately)
Prices starting at $2999.00 USD (100 inch screen width)
Screen Material

Phifer SheerWeave 4400 1.16 gain, 63 inches wide
$20.00/lin. ft.
Phifer SheerWeave 4500 1.16 gain AT, 63 inches wide
$21.00/lin. ft.
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post #388 of 527 Old 12-31-2009, 07:13 PM
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Happy new year Mike

_________________________

Frank

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post #389 of 527 Old 01-03-2010, 11:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I found this online hearing test posted on the Seaton Sound forum (link) and thought it was interesting/fun:

http://audiocheck.net/audiotests_frequencycheckhigh.php

I heard ~17 kHz with in ceiling room speakers.
I may want to test on some other speakers as well...


Mike

PS - Note comments about sound card, etc. in link
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post #390 of 527 Old 01-03-2010, 11:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franin View Post

Happy new year Mike

Thanks.
Happy NY to you as well.

Mike
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