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post #181 of 294 Old 03-29-2012, 04:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cat-222ASR View Post

Nice arrangement of the LCR and what more can you tell me about them is the centre driver middle to high range as I can't see a tweeter?

Is the timber balance smooth do they sound harsh or muffled I just haven't seen anything like those before.

Cheers.

Thanks.
Those are JTR Triple8 LP (Low Profile). You can find more info on their specs here

The middle driver is a Midrange driver. Mounted behind the dust cap of the midrange driver is a compression driver (tweeter). See Pic below from JTR Website:



Here's some more info taken from the JTR website that goes along with the image above.
"Our Triple loudspeakers are designed to provide uniform coverage using acoustic, physical and electrical properties. Drivers and crossover components have group delay which is often over looked. Our Triple loudspeakers optimally position the drivers for minimum group delay differences.

The typical horn suffers from pattern flip and lobing because of varying lengths, corners and asymmetrical design. The symmetrical, conical high frequency wave guide of our Triple loudspeakers provides an identical path in all directions to solve the problems of typical horns.

The interaction of drivers is critical to the off axis response because of the destruction caused by physical dimensions. Our Triple loudspeaker uses specific crossover points appropriate to driver size and location. The meticulous engineering of our Triple loudspeaker yields great results for a variety of applications.
"


You can learn more about JTR speakers on this forum on the JTR Thread.

They can handle a ton of power, are very clean/clear sounding and extremely dynamic.

Here's a link to my review I did on them a while back.
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post #182 of 294 Old 03-29-2012, 04:25 PM
 
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They look good for high sensitivity 98db and bass mid kick I would imagine? The look of them sure fooled me. Cheers for the information on them. Are you listening to them right now and with what? Do you use them all the time, and keep the TV muted?
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post #183 of 294 Old 03-29-2012, 04:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cat-222ASR View Post

They look good for high sensitivity 98db and bass mid kick I would imagine? The look of them sure fooled me. Cheers for the information on them. Are you listening to them right now and with what? Do you use them all the time, and keep the TV muted?

They are actually pretty neutral sounding. I read that the Triple 12 model has more mid bass. I use them mainly for watching movies but they do very well with music too. I've been using them more and more with music lately and really enjoy them. I listen to pretty much everything (Rock, R&B, Reggae, Pop, Soft rock, Hard rock, Hip Hop, etc) everything except classical and jazz. I think they sound great with the music I listen to.

Here's an incredible clip of an older vented version (I have the new sealed low profile version).

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post #184 of 294 Old 04-10-2012, 07:38 PM
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post #185 of 294 Old 05-01-2012, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Bunga99 View Post

As promised....Here's the review:

After living with the SubMersive HP for a month, I feel its time I provide some feedback to other potential SubMersive owners.

Warning this is going to be long -REALLY LONG!!!

First, I am going to state that this is not going to be technical but purely subjective review as I don't own or (right now) care to use certain tools as such REW as my technical skills are lacking and my placement is VERY limited. I am by no means an audiophile but I do know what I like.
Second, for part of this review I am going to put on a flame suit as I know what I was doing with my old set up was wrong and still not perfect with my current set up but who cares, its my room, my system and I am the one listening to it but still flame on.

My previous sub was a HSU VTF3.2 (now sold). I really liked this sub and I can only compare the SubMersive to what I own so this review should not be considered as a HSU or VTF3.2 bashing as I would still recommend it if you can find one or its less powerful sibling the VTF 2.3 or its more capable big brother the VTF3.3. I still think the VTF3.2 was an exceptional value. I still think HSU customer support is fantastic more so Pete is one of the most helpful people I've talked to 5 years ago and talked to him early this year and nothing has changed - he's still an awesome individual.

Here's a little background. My room is approximately 1150 cu feet, which is not sealed and is opened to the rest of the house for the most part. You can see some of the pics in the link or sig below. My system is nothing special compared to most here but I am happy with it. In 2005, I own a Pioneer 1014 receiver and purchased an Onkyo 805 receiver in 2007. I never cared for how either made my speakers sound with their EQ (MCACC or Audyssey). I always thought they made my speakers sound thin and or bright at louder levels and could get fatiguing to me. I do however love what Audyssey does for EQing the sub but still chose to leave Audyssey EQ off because it's either all or nothing with Audyssey on the Onkyo 805. With Audyssey off, but with the some distance settings and crossover settings at 80Hz, I think my system sounds better but there was a 20Hz peak (with the Submersive HP and the 3.2 in Max Ext Mode) and other peak 50Hz. Tests were done with HSU test disc and Radio Shack 33-4050 SPL meter.

Flame suit on:
I always ran my VTF3.2 hot -Hot-HOT! I owned it for 5 years. For the first 4 years, I had it in the Max Extension or 18Hz mode about 10dbs hot. I never took it to reference levels so I felt comfortable with running it that hot. The sub volume dial was at 9 o'clock position or a smidge over and receiver at -1 on sub volume. As stated above, it had a peak at 20Hz and another at 50Hz. Always had my VTF3.2 crossed at 80Hz on the LFE channel as it gave away its location very easily in either Max Ext or Max Out above 80Hz. I felt the 3.2 did a very good job with movies but sometimes the port noise would get to me. On certain movies such as Cloverfield, Dark Knight and a few others, if I turned up the volume a little (not reference) on the entire system it would sometimes sound weird - like the bass was all jumbled together and not clear anymore. I think the term here might be dynamic compression but again I am not technical so I could be wrong. I then read online that some 3.2 owners were finding great results switching to Max Output mode so I made the switch in the last year and enjoyed the more mid bass slam and it seems less distorted or compressed at louder levels (it was still there at times but not as bad as the Max Ext mode but I also lost some umpf below 20hz). The 50Hz peak was there as well. What everyone should take away from this is that the VTF3.2 is not a bad sub by any means but I like a lot of bass hence the higher than normal levels. Things probably would have been much better with an EQ but after 5 years of ownership and so many good things being said about Mark Seaton and his SubMersive, I leaped off the fence. Folks like ssteel01, Kain, Mike Duke, RossandWendy and a BUNCH of others really left quite the impression on me with some post, comments and private messages they provided. Before I go any further, I am going to single out Mike Duke and say you need to be on the Seaton payroll I'm sure I'm not the only one that feels that way as I am sure you helped many of us make the switch and we are much happier for it.
A quick call to Mark in early April, made me realize that this guy Lives, Breathes and Poops audio! He was smart enough to make your head spin when listening to him but also kind enough to dumb down the language so even I can understand. You can really tell he's been doing this for quite some time and still extremely passionate about what his company does. After all the private messages and comments I read from other SubMersive owners, my conversation with Mark started off like this I can't take it anymore, I want one! After a few minutes on the phone, Mark told me I can either get the SubMersive now or wait a few weeks, possible months, and get my hands on an upgrade that's been in the works and he's been testing for many months. Now ~2 grand is not cake for me (far from it) so I decide to wait for a more powerful amp but I was sworn to secrecy until he was ready to make this news public when further tests were completed and shipments/supplies were available.

Fast forward a few months to early July and enter the SubMersive HP. That's a 3 month wait. This wait is understandable as the HP was still in its final testing and production stages. I could be wrong but I think the normal wait now is like 3-4 weeks.

I received an email from Seaton Sound stated that my SubMersive shipped and 3 days later the FedEx truck was at my doorstep. I thought the SubMersive was packaged really well with fairly thick cardboard box it came in was sealed well with 2 inch Styrofoam all the way around with real thick cardboard edge type protectors and each corner of the Stryofoam inside the box. After opening the top of the box and slowly pushing it upside down, I was able to slide the SubMersive out with ease by just lifting the box upwards. I then found the SubMersive wrapped in a thick plastic, inside the plastic was some stryofoam type wrap around the top and between the grille and speakers.
See link for packaging:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...2&postcount=38

The wife was kind enough to buy furniture moving sliders and help me put them under the SubMersive feet while I lifted it up. I moved the VTF3.2 out and put the SubMersive in its place and proceeded to plug everything in. The SubMersive was positioned just like the VTF3.2 is below with the one driver facing the back wall (about 3.5 inches away from that back wall).

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attac...6&d=1269123023

I'll have more pics later as I don't have my camera now. The pics in this are a few weeks or months old in some cases.

I pulled out my SPL meter and began to set everything up using the old HSU test disc. The SubMersive obviously has more headroom than the VTF 3.2 but the numbers/graph looked very similar to the VTF 3.2 in Max Ext mode in my room. As previously mentioned the VTF3.2 about 10db hot uncorrected so I decided to set the SubMersive was set up about 7-8db hot uncorrected and tried a few test scenes with WOTW and Finding Nemo. Even though the graphs on paper looked very similar to the VTF from 80Hz to 16Hz, that's pretty much where the similarities ended. The bass seemed tighter and cleaner with much more authority. Authority might not be the right word but I think others refer to this as more weighted. There was definitely more impact as well but zero overhang. My receiver sub volume was at -5 and I think the SubMersive was on -7 on the dial. I then played some music and noticed some of the same characteristics/qualities I mentioned above. Thinking this was good enough for now, we (the wife and I) decide to watch the entire movie of WOTW (War of the Worlds) to see get the full impact rather than just doing demo after demo. I sometimes think that playing demo after demo gets tiring as you just look at the Max SPL and may lose a lot of how things actually sound and feel (at least for me). WOTW was great - there was a new presence in the room (more weight and more impact but no distortion and the bass seemed smoother - if that makes sense) that really made the movie seem like some new version we never heard or experience before. Later, we watched Finding Nemo and Terminator Salvation in there entirety and again there were some scenes in these movies that really woke up in terms of authority of bass/weight and impact. It's more than just more weight or impact but it's hard to put into words. I can't place my hand or mind around it to express it verbally. Now as much as I would like to say everything sounded so much better than the VTF3.2 that was not the case (Kinda). Going from a ported sub to a seal sub does take some getting used to. Regardless of the hot settings of each, there was some scenes that **sounded louder** with the VTF3.2 (Not cleaner, Not had more impact, Not had more weight, Not more true bass but just **sounded louder**). I now believe some of these scenes were never meant to sound like it did with the VTF3.2. I think this is the over hang mixed with some port ringing along with cabinet vibration that some have talked about with some ported subs. I tried some other scenes in other movies and noticed the same thing in scenes like the plane crash in Flight of the Phoenix and the Iron Hide flip in Transformers. Both of Subs were hitting similar SPL but the VTF3.2 (Max Out mode) sounded louder again this was not cleaner just more audible, almost distorted like you could hear the cabinet/port noise along with the bass of the movie. The SPL meter may have been picking up this noise and providing the same readings as the SubMersive in terms of max SPL. One thing is for certain; the SubMersive clearly had more umpf and woke up every Bass scene to another level or 2 or 3. After 5 years with the Vtf3.2, this volume thing took some getting use to. I am only stating this to be honest and so if there are any other folks going from a good ported design running hot, it may take some getting used to but you are not missing anything other than noise that should not be there. May be sitting so close to the VTF3.2 or the SubMersive amplified these effects for me but it was noticeable but not on every bass scene. I don't mean this in a bad way as I soon started to realize how much CLEANER the SubMersive sounded. After like 3-4 days I was use loving the cleaner sound of the HP so much that I decided not to even hook up the VTF3.2 anymore and box it up for sale (it's sold now). What should also be noted is that in these same scenes with the SubMersive felt like a completely new experience in terms of impact/weight and just down right awesomeness! With the VTF3.2 the plane crash scene in Flight of the Phoenix scene felt good and sounded loud - it added so much to the movie experience. The SubMersive takes out that distorted noise and just adds so much more impact and feel that your pulse starts to race and you actually feel like you are in that plane about to crash. I don't think that movie goes very low in terms on Hz but I had a weird slightly uneasy scared feeling watching/feeling it that I never experience with the VTF3.2 in either mode.

The next few days that came was followed with some more movies and a few more demos. One in particular was Tim Burton's 9. We watched this a few months ago and I thought it sounded good but did not know what all the hype was about with this movie and its claim to fame in the AVS subwoofer forum. I thought a lot of other flicks sounded better than it on my previous sub. I decided to re-rent it and watch it again. OMG!!! The difference was measureable in the butt-o-meter I could clearly feel and hear the difference. I forget now what scene it was but my wife screamed at one point It felt like someone threw a grenade under my recliner!
With music, the difference was even more apparent. The SubMersive sounded so much smoother and life like compared to the VTF3.2. Before the SubMersive, I thought the VTF3.2 sounded pretty good with music. After the SubMersive, the VTF3.2 does not hold a candle. The SubMersive just seem to blend with all the other speakers and sometimes would just disappear. The 3.2 always sounded the same. Whether it was a kick drum or whatever type of instrument, the 3.2 made them all sound more similar than different. With the SubMersive, there was a lot more distinction between instruments and bass itself.

There were still a few things I did not like and it was all with placement and EQ and not an issue with the SubMersive HP. The HP sounded so good and so smooth most of the time then when it hit that peak around 50Hz, it would really start to bug me. At least I am guessing it was this 50Hz peak that was bugging me. Not that it sounded bad but once you get a taste for this smooth yet powerful bass, you crave it like a junkie and want it like that all the time not just on certain songs or certain scenes of a movie. I believe in my set-up/room having the SubMersive 3.5 to 4inches from the wall did not help things for me. When I sat in my recliner I could sometimes clearly hear that the bass was coming from behind me and towards my right. It sometimes sounded like I could hear the bass coming directly from that back wall (not all the time but it was noticeable). I then decided to run Audyssey again and again to see if it would help. I had to keep turning down the volume of the SubMersive and re-running as it was too hot. When Audyssey was engaged it did smooth out the bass a lot and I decided to take my system to reference levels. I did verify everything with my SPL meter and it did pull out the peaks and what not for the bass and calibrated flat or 1-3dbs hot (corrected). I decided to demo the 2008 Hulk movie (sound cannon) and Transformers (Iron Hide flip) at reference. To say I was impressed and is a gross understatement. I was literally scared! Not this is so cool, I could do this all day long but more like holy $h&T turn it off before we break something in the room or the room explodes. It sounded very powerful, very impressive but down right scary. It did not feel or sound like the SubMersive was breaking a sweat but it gave the impression that the room may be the weakest link. Keep in mind my house is all concrete block. Here's the funny part - during that cannon scene at reference, I thought I was finding the electrical limits of my room because everything in that room and the SubMersive HP is hooked up to a 15amp breaker. I thought I noticed the light on the ceiling was flickering during the Hulk cannon scene. While I was doing this test my wife ran in the room and started telling me how great that sounded all the way in the kitchen. I replayed the scene again and told her to keep an eye on the light and see if it's flickering as I was now seeing spots trying to stare at the light bulb. I replayed the scene and looked at my wife who was laughing hysterically. She finally composed herself and told me to replay it again and look at the light at the angle she was looking at it. Yeah - the power was fine! There was so much bass energy, pressurization or what have you that the light bulb socket may not have been bolted down securely because it was shaking along with the light bulb during that whole scene. This is something we never noticed with the VTF3.2. We watched a movie or two with the Audyssey engaged and normal listening levels and again I didn't care for what it did with my regular speakers. Even though the bass was smoother and blended better with the rest of the speakers, the others speakers now sounded thin and bright with very little warmth to them. I verified this same thing with some music CDs. My favorite CD to test is Bob Marley - Legend (no particular reason I just love that CD and think that album has a lot of great sounding instruments). All prior tests on the VTF3.2 and the SubMersive were performed with this Legend CD and a few others CDs as well. I ran Audyssey one more time using the same exact methods and now it made my center channel sound all muddy like someone stuck a wool blanket over it. It was at this moment that I decided to get the Anti-Mode 8033. I mean if I love how Audyssey sounded for my bass but love how my speakers sound without Audyssey, then Anti-Mode and its easy set-up would be my best choice.

I ordered Anti-Mode and had it within 3 days. I ran the Anti-Mode setup and noticed, more often than not, the bass was a lot smoother now. I know Anti-Mode does other things as well with decay and what not but I have no way to verify what it did other than listening to it and using my SPL to verify if the peaks were gone. The HSU test CD revealed that some of that 20Hz peak was taken care of but most if not all of that 50Hz peak was gone. I tested this with the SPL meter and it was calibrated flat again 1-3db hot (corrected) with the rest of the speakers. I ran a few more tests and watched a few more movies but I still was not 100% happy with it as I could sometimes still hear the bass coming from behind me - towards my right. I decided to give Mark a call. He was very helpful again and advised to play with the distance setting in the receiver to see if that helps minimize localization and also use the Tool DVD kit he supplied along with some other recommendations. I did try the distance setting and it helped a little but I started to realize this screamed placement issue. Since there is no place for the SubMersive HP in the front of my room, I tried turning it sideways. It barely fit sideways. With both recliners reclined in the back position, there were ~2.5 inches of clearance on each side of the SubMersive and the tall back of each recliner. The SubMersive was now firing not into the recliner but behind them. I decided to re-run Anti-Mode again and use the HSU test CD again. I also adjusted the distance setting to what sounds best and gave a smoother response to the 80Hz crossover. The test CD SPL numbers looked exactly the same as it did prior to the move but after listening to some more demos, it was blending far better than it did before. I can sometimes still tell where the bass is coming from but this far less frequent as it was before - it's more like the exception now rather than a common thing. I decided to try Mark's DVD Tool kit and calibrate the entire system. I found that kit to be a very useful tool and easy to use. All speakers were still crossed at 80Hz even the LFE channel. Everything sounded wonderful. The bass was smooth, powerfully weighted yet detailed. The clarity of my speakers was still intact and the warmth was still there too. We watch more movies on it and the subtleties of car doors and trunks closing to heavy explosions all sounded and felt more real, had more umpf - everything just went up a few notches yet was very balanced, bass had more layers and textures to it and oh so smooth. I had it like this for a day or two and it was much harder to tell where the bass was coming from so I got curious decided to change the LFE channel crossover from 80Hz to 120Hz. End result everything is still balance and in a few movies there seems to be more LFE content there. I double checked everything again and I am still calibrated flat according to the SPL meter so corrected is probably 1-3db hot. The receiver sub level is at -5 and the sub volume dial is between -24 and -16. It's been like this for over a week now. We recently watched the Dark Knight again the difference in bass to me and the wife was very apparent. It's unreal how clean it is but now feels like nice chair messages with a lot more rippling type feel added. I am not the only one noticing some of this as the wife has been commenting a lot on how much more her recliner has been shaking as well. I have been watching more movies listening to music and grinning like a clown over here. It's hard to get this smile off my face when I am using the system.

Here's some weird stuff I noticed that I did not expect but was a very pleasant surprise. Whenever I listened to music pre-SubMersive, I did not like to listen to anything but 2 channel music. 5 channel just did not sound right. I would sometimes listen to music with the VTF3.2 off and sometimes with it on but always in 2 channel (Stereo, Direct or Pure mode). Now with the HP, I can listen to 5 channel music and it does not suck or muck things up. It actually sounds pretty good. I still think 2 channel sounds better with SubMersive on but 5 channel sound much better now that I don't feel compelled to switch it to 2 channel mode when enjoying some of my favorite CDs. There were a few times that it was hard to tell that the SubMersive was even on so I reached over and turned the power switch off to the SubMersive and all of the soul and foundation of whatever I was listening do was gone. Hit the power switch again and there goes that stupid - stupid grin again There were a few times, on different occasions, I was listening to music at low listening levels and noticed goose bumps all over my arms. I'm not sure if you can put a price tag on something like that. I read in a few places that Mike Duke and a few others stated that the SubMersive elevated their entire system performance to the next level and I believe that statement pretty much nails it.

I know my placement is not ideal and only wish I had more room to move this thing around to see if there is even more potential in it (can't see how that is possible) but overall I am very VERY PLEASED with the SubMersive HP and would recommend it to anyone. If an idiot like me can appreciate its qualities such as smoothness, weight, accuracy, depth, the uncanny ability to touch you like silk during certain moments of a soundtrack and then scare you enough where you feel you pulse is racing like never before in other movie soundtracks is priceless and all this in a package that is not that much bigger than the VTF3.2. I also found a lot of folks spring for the nicer finish. I'm not sure if the picture shows it but the satin black is nicely done. I expected a more plain less shiny finish like the VTF 3.2 so again I was pleasantly surprised.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...8&postcount=36

In the end, it does exactly as the name implies -it Sub Merges you into the experience. The Seaton SubMersive HP is now my second favorite thing in my living room/HT - the first being the wife!

Before anyone ask. Hell eF'N Yes! - it's worth the price tag and moreand Hell Yes again it was worth the wait! The difference between bass and the entire sonic experience now is improved so much that if I had to quantify it, I would say that the audio improved more so than how video would improve from switching from DVD to Blu-Ray on a 50inch or bigger HDTV.

I wanted to do this somewhat long write up of my full thoughts as I thought if I read more posts like this on the SubMersive, I would have jumped on it sooner than later. I thought something like this would have helped me in the past and might help someone else in the future.

One last note - the biggest thanks for getting this thing goes to my wife. Not only was she the one that originally told me stop thinking about it and get it already, you know it will be great from all the research you did but a few weeks after I ordered the HP we were hit with some unexpected expenses - all in one day! The AC system in the wife's car broke, the central air in the house stopped working and my riding lawn mower took a dump. Again, all this in one day and we live in Florida on a ¼ of an acre so AC is a must down here and that riding mower is nice to have in the summer heat. While eating dinner with my wife that night, I looked at her and said. I think maybe I should cancel that order for that sub with all these.. I could not finish the sentence as she interrupted me and said There is no way in hell you are canceling that order, that sub sounds like one hell of a deal! If it was not for her, I probably would be SubMersive-Less right now Yes, I know my wife is Awesome!

PS AC in the car and home has been fixed as well as the mower

I know this review is way old, but I loved reading it. I can't imagine what a Submersive does in that room nearfield!! Love it. I betting you have never felt the need for bass shakers?
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post #186 of 294 Old 05-01-2012, 09:10 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Carp! I actually moved it twice in the past 2 years. Now it's in the front of the room and I like the overall sound and response the best in that location.

I specifically remember watching the animated movie "9" and How to Train Your Dragon when it was nearfield and sitting in my recliner in the reclined position. There was a few bass moments of those movies that gave me the feeling that I was laying on a donut tube in a swimming pool and some fat kid jumped in on the other end of the pool (((((Ripples))))). So, Yes, no need for bass shakers with this beast nearfield
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post #187 of 294 Old 05-02-2012, 06:09 AM
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Yep, that is a great review. And yep, I can concur that having a SubMersive HP in a small room is quite the experience . HTTYD and TRON are just sick with this sub in a small place.

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post #188 of 294 Old 05-02-2012, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

Yep, that is a great review. And yep, I can concur that having a SubMersive HP in a small room is quite the experience . HTTYD and TRON are just sick with this sub in a small place.

how big is your room ?

All this noise about noise.
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post #189 of 294 Old 05-02-2012, 11:41 AM
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how big is your room ?

12.5Lx9.5Wx8H. So, yea, it's pretty small.

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post #190 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 06:41 AM
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Claude, I read in the Triad forum that you bought Gold L\\C\\R's? Did you change from the JTR speakers? I hope you post some of your feelings here if that's true.

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post #191 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 08:46 AM - Thread Starter
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You are correct Mike!

I am gonna “blame” this upgrade on 3 people. Craig John, MKtheater and Mankite….There was other research behind this but these are the 3 main “culprits”.

I can’t complain about the JTRs but reading Craig John’s comments about the Platinum Triads and looking at certain pics in his thread literally gives me goose bumps! The Platinum are way too big for my little room and quite frankly, I cant afford them. I also considered Triads before purchasing the JTRs but, new - retail, they were out of my budget. I’ve also read where Craig and few others refer to the Gold LCR Triads as the Baby Platinums or Platinum Jr. Then I read another poster MKtheater was doing a shootout where he had the old Gold LCRs. The old ones are not as efficient as the the new ones cant play as loud as the new LCR ones either. MKtheater stated he loves how the Triads sound and he thinks the Platinum could win his shootout if he could get his hands on it but he was more budget conscious as well. All this made me REAL CURIOUS and I noticed that another AVS member, Mankite, (who previously had JTRs also had different version of Triads). I contacted him and we talked on the phone. Awesome guy!! Long Story Short…he loved the JTRs but Loved the Triads even more. Turns out he was in the middle of auditioning Triad Gold Monitors and Gold LCR. He said he could sell me whichever one he decided not to keep. Next thing I know I’m seriously considering trying out the Triads – a week later, they are at my door step

I will have a review up on them in a few days…. I think everyone knows how much I loved the JTR Sealed T8’s but to give you an idea of how much I love the Triads Gold LCR, the JTRs are listed for sale already.
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post #192 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 09:32 AM
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WOW, That's pretty cool. I guess I am an anomaly. I really don't change speakers as much as other people here. Not that I don't think about it, but I am still quite happy with my Focal's and I know that they can sound even better then they do know. For me, they really are a great speaker that can cover all the bases for me. I will be interested in your thoughts though when you listen to them more.

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I hear yah...I had my old pair of Sapphires for over 6 years so I hardly change speakers too. Talking to Mankite just pushed me over the edge and his price made it a no brainer. Even my wife told me "You'll never know if you like the Triads better unless you hear them - so I think you should get them". I know I already stated how cool my wife is with our HT stuff but when she's telling me I should do it, I'd be a fool for not trying out the Triads
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post #194 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 10:42 AM
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I have to agree that if you have a wife that says go for it, it would be silly not to. Congrats again and I look forward to your thoughts. BTW next month will be six years for me as well with the 1027's.

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post #195 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 11:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

I have to agree that if you have a wife that says go for it, it would be silly not to. Congrats again and I look forward to your thoughts. BTW next month will be six years for me as well with the 1027's.

I dont blame you for keeping em....The 1027, along some Salks speakers and a few others (IMHO) are some of the sexiest looking speakers I've ever seen. From what you, Craig and other's have said, they sound fantastic too!
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post #196 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 12:20 PM
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I dont blame you for keeping em....The 1027, along some Salks speakers and a few others (IMHO) are some of the sexiest looking speakers I've ever seen. From what you, Craig and other's have said, they sound fantastic too!

Thanks. Yep I like their look and sound. There are plenty of great sounding speakers out there. I hope to hear some Triad speakers soon. As Craig said, in my room, these give me all the output I need. We need pics as well so don't forget about that either.

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post #197 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 03:52 PM
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You are correct Mike!

I am gonna blame this upgrade on 3 people. Craig John, MKtheater and Mankite.There was other research behind this but these are the 3 main culprits.

I can't complain about the JTRs but reading Craig John's comments about the Platinum Triads and looking at certain pics in his thread literally gives me goose bumps!

I'm' happy to be a "culprit"!

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The Platinum are way too big for my little room and quite frankly, I cant afford them. I also considered Triads before purchasing the JTRs but, new - retail, they were out of my budget. I've also read where Craig and few others refer to the Gold LCR Triads as the Baby Platinums or Platinum Jr.

Yes, they do sound like the Plats little brothers. I heard the pair you bought from Mankite, so I know exactly how they sound.

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Then I read another poster MKtheater was doing a shootout where he had the old Gold LCRs. The old ones are not as efficient as the the new ones cant play as loud as the new LCR ones either. MKtheater stated he loves how the Triads sound and he thinks the Platinum could win his shootout if he could get his hands on it but he was more budget conscious as well.

With all the stuff he's bought and sold over he years, he should just stop and buy the Platinums and be done with it.

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All this made me REAL CURIOUS and I noticed that another AVS member, Mankite, (who previously had JTRs also had different version of Triads). I contacted him and we talked on the phone. Awesome guy!! Long Story Shorthe loved the JTRs but Loved the Triads even more. Turns out he was in the middle of auditioning Triad Gold Monitors and Gold LCR. He said he could sell me whichever one he decided not to keep. Next thing I know I'm seriously considering trying out the Triads - a week later, they are at my door step

Not sure if you know this, but Mankite is who I bought my Plats from. I'll let him tell you story of how he came to be in possession of all these Triad speakers.

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I will have a review up on them in a few days. I think everyone knows how much I loved the JTR Sealed T8's but to give you an idea of how much I love the Triads Gold LCR, the JTRs are listed for sale already.

Looking forward to the review... with the pics, of course.

Craig

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post #198 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 05:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Craig! Yep, Mankite did tell me you got the Plats from him. He said, and I am Understating this, your room sounds AMAZING!

I will definitely have a review up in a few days or a week or so. I can say, for someone who uses his room for 99% HT, the Triads have me looking all over the place for my scattered cds. I've been spending my lunches and after work listening to music. We've watched 2 movies so far on them and I've also demo'd some movies scenes as well. So far, to say I'm impressed is a gross understatement!!
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post #199 of 294 Old 05-03-2012, 06:42 PM
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Thanks Craig! Yep, Mankite did tell me you got the Plats from him. He said, and I am Understating this, your room sounds AMAZING!

It sounds so amazing that sometimes I get goosebumps! The other night, when the Devils were handing the Flyers their A$$e$, I shut the game off and put on Steely Dan, Gaucho, DVD-A. My face went from this to this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunga99 View Post

I will definitely have a review up in a few days or a week or so. I can say, for someone who uses his room for 99% HT, the Triads have me looking all over the place for my scattered cds. I've been spending my lunches and after work listening to music. We've watched 2 movies so far on them and I've also demo'd some movies scenes as well. So far, to say I'm impressed is a gross understatement!!

One of the amazing qualities of Triad speakers is that they are excellent for *both* movies and music. I'm at least 50/50 music/movies. I really love the sound of hi-rez music, SACD & DVD-A. If you have any of those formats, the Triads really bring out the increased resolution and dynamic range of the formats.

Enjoy!!!

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post #200 of 294 Old 05-04-2012, 07:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Craig! I completely forgot that the Oppo 93 does DVD-Audio and SACD. If I continue this music listening trend, I'll have to look at purchasing some of those formats as well.
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post #201 of 294 Old 05-05-2012, 06:15 PM - Thread Starter
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I was able to borrow a camera to take some more pics of the Triple 8s that are for sale.

I figured I would take some pics of the Triads as well. The TV is mounted as high as possible on the TV stand and there's only a 1/4 of an inch between the center channel and the TV.

My in-laws are staying with us for a few weeks so there's limited time for testing/tweaking but I am jotting down notes when we watch movies or if I listen to music. I will post my full thoughts/review in a week or so but so far, the Triads are great!





I measured the Triad Center channel tweeter and its ~31inches from the floor to the tweeter. I sat in my recliner and reclined a little, marked a spot near my ear and my ear is about ~33inch from the floor when semi reclined (my normal seating position). The Left and Right tweeter is ~42inches off the floor. I sit about 8 to 8.5 feet away from the Triad Gold LCRs. Not perfect but not too shabby either Even with my limited placement options, you wont find me complaining.
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post #202 of 294 Old 05-08-2012, 11:20 AM
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Looks good to me Claude. I am sure they sound great as well. I am looking forward to hearing more detailed thoughts on them when you get the time. Congrats again.

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post #203 of 294 Old 05-09-2012, 09:09 AM
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I'm sure they sound thrilling...

..but the visual distraction of all those big speaker drivers surrounding the TV would drive me insane. I know, lots of guys are happier the more technology and hardware they can see in front of them. I go for a disappearing equipment aesthetic leaving only the image, at least for movie watching. (And even in my audiophile 2 channel listening, I'm not a fan of seeing speaker drivers either). It looks like you normally have the speaker grills on, which would be my choice as well.
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post #204 of 294 Old 05-09-2012, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for comments.
This room is light controlled so when I watch a movie its really dark in there. The look of the speakers dont bother me one bit, I actually like the look of them a lot but it does pretty much disappears in the dark.

I really like the look of the drivers but you are correct, I do leave the grills on. I have 2 nieces that visit us often. One is 8 the other is 2 and I fear that, without the grills, one of them may push on the dust caps of the speaker or worse push the tweeters. My nieces are great about not touching anything in that room as we talked to them about it but I remember how bad some of my little cousins where about sticking things into VCRs and damaging speakers back in the day when they were at that age
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post #205 of 294 Old 05-12-2012, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
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After living with the Triads Gold LCR for over a week and a half, watching over dozen movies and listening to a dozen or so cds, I think I have a good enough time with them where I am comfortable enough to provide some feedback. These are just my subjective opinions – YMMV.

Before anyone read my thoughts on the Triads, I think it may be a good idea for you to read my review/thoughts on the JTRs Sealed T8s I did almost a year ago as I feel it somewhat ties into this review.

If you read or did not read the review you should know that I loved the JTRs.

Disclosures: All these listening tests were done without the aid of alcohol or any other substances. It was just me and my two ears. I have not owned that many speakers in my lifetime, not as many as some here, but I have heard some friends and family members speakers, speakers at different events, various IMAX movie theaters, various aftermarket car audio system (not just woofers on wheels but good car audio systems), specialty stores with dedicated rooms and even some decent headphones.

OK so let’s start…

Both the JTRs and Triads look and feel to be solid build quality. My JTRs have a more rugged pro look while my Triads have more of a finished smoother, more refined, look. I prefer the Triads when the lights are on but usually we have the lights off when watching movies so maybe it a moot point for me. If your thing is to have a nicer finish the Triads look better but JTRs do make custom finishes as well for an additional cost.

After I hooked up the Triads, I disengage the previous Audyssey setting as it was set to work with the JTRs. I made sure all the crossovers were set to 80hz and level matched everything with an SPL meter and listened to music and some movies scenes for 1.5 hour and really loved what I heard.

I would have left things well enough alone but the bass coming out of the SubMersive was just a tad bit boomy (room related). So I decided to try Audyssey which did smooth out the bass more and I like what Audyssey does to my surrounds too.

Audyssey XT set my Gold LCRs to full range and I changed it to 80hz.

Audyssey had previously set the JTRs at -12 and it set the Triads at L/C/R -7.5, 8.0 and 7.0 respectively. Cleary the JTRs are more efficient/sensitive at 98db. The Triads Gold LCRs are 92db sensitive. With the Audyssey setting the JTRs at -12, the center channel (via SPL meter) measured 2db more than the left and right. I thought this might have given the JTRs an advantage as I thought dialog intelligibility was a little better on the JTRs. Triads were not bad at all (was actually great) but the JTRS were slightly better. While JTRs center was 2db more than the left and right speaker, the Triad left, center, and right measured the same via the SPL meter. I raised the level of the Triad center (1db) from -8.0 to -7.0 and the dialog improved further where I now feel they are about the same. Both are excellent at dialog intelligibility.

JTRs can definitely play louder but my room is only 1150cu. ft and I’m only sitting 8 to 8.5ft from the front 3 speakers. The Triads can go loud enough to put a grin on your face or damage hearing in this little room with the Onkyo 805 receiver. It’s one of the few receivers that actually meet and exceeds its published specs (bench tests). I also feel that while the Triads are very dynamic, the JTRs seemed even more dynamic but in a small room like mine with the just 805 receiver, the Triads are way more than dynamic enough for me. In a much larger room, say ~2500cu ft or more, I believe the JTRs should have a bigger benefit in dynamics over the Triads when using the same wattage.

Let’s just cut to the chase – In my room, even with the JTRs having a slight edge in dynamics and being more efficient, the Triads Gold LCRs are the best speakers I’ve ever owned. Triads are smoother, voices sound even more natural and it seems more delicate with certain material while resolving more detail. I’ll go as far as to say, the Triads are the best speaker I’ve ever heard in my life time! (Again, this is just my personal preference and it should be noted that the JTRs new is still about half the price of the Triads new). To be even clearer, I am not saying there are not any other better speakers out there. I’m just saying that I personally have not heard anything better.

In 2 channel mode, the sealed Triple 8s gives a great wall of sound. The Gold LCRs seem to cast an even bigger, more engulfing, wall of sound. There were times when I could swear, not only was sound coming from center, the right, far right and left and far left of me but it almost sounded like there was sound wrapped around me (WTF?!) How is this possible? It was like wearing some of the best set of headphones but music had more air and or ambience/presence to it. Imaging was superb in two channel mode! While I was going through some of my favorite music cd’s my, 68 year old, mother in law walks in the room a few times and starts dancing. I could not believe how great these speakers sound and how the lead singer’s voice was anchored at, what seemed like, the center channel even though this was in stereo (2 channel mode). The T8-lps did this quite well too but the Triads were revealing more details while remaining smoother to my ear. I was in such disbelief that I sat my mother-in-law in chair (sweet spot) and asked her “Can you tell me which speaker you can hear the voices while the music plays?” My mother-in-law begins to pick up back ground singers on the right speaker, tells me she hears certain instruments on the left side and then explain the lead singers voice is coming from that speaker (as she points towards the center channel – which was not even on). It’s one thing for me to understand some of this stuff and pay attention or look out for it but it’s amazing that it’s so apparent to someone who knows nothing of this hobby and could care less but yet she can still pick up on this stuff so easily. On movies, this trait makes the Gold LCR seems more fluid – meaning stuff just pans across the front stage so smoothly. There are no drop outs, holes or gaps, if you will, in the front stage. The Triple 8s were exceptional at this, the Golds are slightly better.

Since I’ve had the JTR T8-lp’s for almost a year, I had a lot of opportunities to try different sources on them. On some poor sources, the JTRs can really point out the flaws in the source. Sometimes if the source is bad enough, it’s not pleasurable listening experience. I don’t think this is a flaw in the JTR as they excel when the source is good/great. Less than stellar sources on the Triads don’t sound great but it does not sound as bad as it does on the JTRs. This may not seem like such a bad thing but if I’m watching a movie with a somewhat poor recording/source, I am more focused on how distracting it sounds versus actually watching the movie. This is probably just a mental flaw in me as it does not bother the wife or others who has watched these movies with me. Since the Triads don’t sound as bad with the same source, I am more focused on the movie and can enjoy it that much more.

IMHO the JTRs are great at live acoustic type music. It’s an incredible goose bump inducing experience. They are good with most music as well (source dependent of course). The Triads are a goose bump inducing experience regardless of the genre of music, not just live acoustic stuff. While I have experienced goose bumps on previous speakers, the Triads do it way more often. There was one point where the Triads induced tears That has never happened with any other speaker regardless of source, material, location, price, venue and etc! The Triad Golds are silky smooth, detailed and a pleasure to listen to at any volume. It does not have to be turned to near reference to enjoy them. For a guy who was always 99% HT, the Triads have me listening to more music in 1½ week than what I have listened to in the past 2 years or 2 previous systems. I feel they are fantastic with movies and yet even better with music. I never felt the need to pull out CDs with my last 2 systems as I do now – not that the JTRs or my Sapphires sounded bad with music but that’s how phenomenal I think the Gold LCRs are with music.

It seems I can turn the volume up more on the Triads and they seem to sound fuller, smoother, may be warmer than the JTRs yet remain very detailed. I don’t know why this is – I thought with the JTRs being more efficient it would sound more composed (if you will) at reference. JTR sound composed at reference but the Triads sound composed yet fuller at reference. (Again this is in my small treated room with an Onkyo 805 receiver).

Midbass seems slightly improved and smoother on the Triads. I’m also noticing more subtle details in movies and music. I can hear more instruments on music and heard a few background singers I never heard before on certain songs. On movies, if someone is walking outside, I hear more of the details like the wind, leaves/trees ruffling, birds chirping and background noises. On other movie scenes where someone might be talking in a big room a little louder than normal; I can clearly hear their voice in the center speaker and a subtle echo on either the right or left speaker. It’s not only that I can hear these details clearer now vs previous speakers but it’s how life like they sound that is equally impressive. These subtle details, mixed with big dynamic swings, superb clarity, engulfing wall of sound and the smooth/natural sound of the Gold LCR makes for an amazing music and movies experience -the best I’ve ever heard in my home or previous homes/set up. It really boggles my mind how a speaker can be this detailed, have this kind of clarity, sound so natural and tight yet remains so silky smooth.

I’ve had my in-laws staying with us for a few weeks. They have been watching movies with us almost every night. My mother-in law was always quick to tell me to turn down the volume on previous systems (except the JTRs). She never once mentioned that with the Triads either. Can’t remember what movie it was, but I had it around -6 from reference for most of the movie but for the last 40mins, I let it ride at reference and no one said anything. I thought it sounded great but at the end of the movie, I asked them if it was too loud and they said no.

In the End, I feel it was a huge gamble for me to buy the JTRs without ever listening to them and the gamble paid off very nicely. It was an even bigger gamble for me to buy the Triads (used), which, I also never heard; from someone I never met. I’ve been very lucky as the bigger risk is reaping bigger/sweeter gains. I know we all say this at one point or another in this hobby but in my current room, there is no need or desire to upgrade from the Triads Gold LCR. The only desire is to spend more time in said room!

While sound quality preferences/opinions will differ from person to person, I still feel the JTRs are a tremendous value. If one likes a speaker with excellent dynamics, dialog intelligibility, ability to play very loud and great overall clarity then Triple 8s are probably for you, but FOR ME and if someone wants the same clarity and great dynamics but with more a little more refinement, smoother sound, and greater low level detail, then the Triads would make almost anyone ridiculously happy.

There you have it…The Triad Gold LCRs are my favorite speaker...ever!
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post #206 of 294 Old 05-13-2012, 04:14 AM
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Congrats man!! When reading your post, you can certainly feel your enthusiasm. Now I want speakers that makes me cry.

Were the JTRs 4ohm as well? I'd love to look at something like your setup, but that would mean I'd had to get a new receiver as well that can handle a lower impedance speaker properly.
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post #207 of 294 Old 05-13-2012, 07:24 AM
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Thanks for the detailed, lengthy review of the Gold LCR. Having spent lots of time with this speaker (and many other Triad speakers), I agree with your observations entirely. Mankite also had similar observations in his comparison of the Gold LCR to the almost-double-the-price Gold Monitor. We both prefer the added detail of the Gold Monitor, but the Gold LCR is the best bang for the buck in the Triad line. I've heard Gold LCRs at trade shows being driven by a $10,000 amplifier and $10,000 processor (Crestron) and they could have chosen much more expensive speakers. The Gold LCR was also chosen for a proprietary CEDIA demonstration of new technologies, and they were driven by huge, expensive ADA electronics. David Nelson deserves credit for a solid design. Seas custom designed the drivers to our spec, and the enclosure is built like a bank vault.

I hope you enjoy your speakers for many, many years. I've had the same Gold Monitors for almost ten years now, and I have no intention of replacing them. As a friend used to say, "Another satisficated customer!"

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post #208 of 294 Old 05-13-2012, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Congrats man!! When reading your post, you can certainly feel your enthusiasm. Now I want speakers that makes me cry.

Were the JTRs 4ohm as well? I'd love to look at something like your setup, but that would mean I'd had to get a new receiver as well that can handle a lower impedance speaker properly.

Thanks! The JTRs were also rated at 4ohms.

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Thanks for the detailed, lengthy review of the Gold LCR. Having spent lots of time with this speaker (and many other Triad speakers), I agree with your observations entirely. Mankite also had similar observations in his comparison of the Gold LCR to the almost-double-the-price Gold Monitor. We both prefer the added detail of the Gold Monitor, but the Gold LCR is the best bang for the buck in the Triad line. I've heard Gold LCRs at trade shows being driven by a $10,000 amplifier and $10,000 processor (Crestron) and they could have chosen much more expensive speakers. The Gold LCR was also chosen for a proprietary CEDIA demonstration of new technologies, and they were driven by huge, expensive ADA electronics. David Nelson deserves credit for a solid design. Seas custom designed the drivers to our spec, and the enclosure is built like a bank vault.

I hope you enjoy your speakers for many, many years. I've had the same Gold Monitors for almost ten years now, and I have no intention of replacing them. As a friend used to say, "Another satisficated customer!"

Thanks Paul! I can say with 99% certainty these Triad Gold LCRS have permanent home in my current room. I'll leave a 1% open as I've read many terrific things about the Gold Monitors too but also believe I read that the Gold LCRs may have a bigger sound to them. I love that big sound! The only other way I can see me upgrading from these things is if I had a MUCH bigger room and came into some extra cash, then it would be the Platinums.
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post #209 of 294 Old 05-14-2012, 06:17 AM
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Great detailed review Claude. I am glad they really sound great to you. I can relate to your 2ch experience. There are times, with my 1027's, that I swear the center is on when I know it's not. Also, I know the feeling that it sounds like music is "surrounding" you with 2 speakers. Again, I have never heard Triad speakers but from what I read about them, they sure do sound like a great speaker. Have fun and enjoy. When you listened to 2ch, was it just the two Triads or was that with your SubMersive also in the mix.

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post #210 of 294 Old 05-14-2012, 07:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Mike!
The two channel mode I use is usually Stereo mode which includes the Sub. I previously had the SubMersive about 2-3db hot on my previous set ups. So far, I'm really enjoying the system with the Sub measuring flat with the mains and running the SubMersive in PGM/DSP1 again. The SubMersive just melts with the Triads like this. They both sound incredibly tight and smooth.
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