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post #1891 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 05:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Man...those 601s sure are purty! I'm Goimg to go demo a pair!
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post #1892 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 07:19 AM
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Sounds like you are gettin close to lift off with those legacies man looking forward to those great videos!!!.

McIntosh are my all time favorite amps got me thinking back in the day when my uncle has some 240's how great they looked and sounded. If my current and future space were large enough to support large high end towers these would be my end game amps even the Mrs likes them.I have seen and heard the 601's in a showroom but could not really make a good sound comparison to the other speaker/amp combo they were using.

Do you plan in the future to bring the equipment out in the open for viewing or do you prefer not seen but heard???
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post #1893 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 07:24 AM
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Brolic if your main focus was just home theater & gaming would you have kept the klipsch's & the integra?
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post #1894 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 07:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Why the three taps? I believe most amps automatically handle the Ohms. Is it a fundamental engineering/design choice? I've noticed other Mac amps output the same wattage regardless of Ohms....how is that? I'm quite curious.

The three taps are to best match the amp's output impedance with the load of the speaker. The Autoformer ensures that power output is constant and consistent regardless of the load a speaker presents. Usually as load varies, the amp has to work harder and output more juice. That's how I understand it. You use the tap appropriate for your speaker; if it falls in between, you use the next lowest tap. My Mirages are 6 ohm nominal impedance, so I'd use the 4-ohm tap. But I also bi-wire, so I use the 2-ohm tap for the woofers and 4 for mids and highs. I was told not to use the 8-ohm tap by McIntosh, given my speakers' impedance.

Aha, here's something from the 501 manual:

All solid state power amplifier output circuits work best
into what is called an optimum load. This optimum load
may vary considerably from what a loudspeaker requires.
In the case of more than one loudspeaker connected in parallel,
the load to the power amplifier may drop to two ohms
or even less. A power amplifier connected to a load that is
lower than optimum, causes more output current to flow,
which results in extra heat being generated in the power
output stage. This increase in temperature will result in a
reduced life expectancy for the amplifier. The special
Balanced Winding Autoformer creates an ideal match between
the power amplifier output stage and the loudspeaker.
A McIntosh amplifier with an Autoformer can be used to
safely drive multiple speakers without reducing the life
expectancy of the power amplifier. There is absolutely no
performance limitation with an Autoformer. Its frequency
response exceeds that of the output circuit itself, and extends
well beyond the audible range. Its distortion level is so low
it is virtually impossible to measure.


These Autoformers also give DC protection to the speakers. And as mentioned, the 501s are absolutely cool to the touch. They've never been even warm around here. I don't blast my music, but I'm sure the Autoformers help.
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post #1895 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 07:40 AM
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Brolic if your main focus was just home theater & gaming would you have kept the klipsch's & the integra?
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post #1896 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 07:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Star Trek: Into Darkness is an absolutely superb film. These days, it takes a lot to impress me in a movie theater; however, yesterday--I was truly impressed. We saw it at the IMAX theater in Silver Spring, MD in 3D and this film has everything any of us could want. Picture quality? YES! Audio? HECK YES!!! Story? YOU BETCHA!!! We may go see it again. Benedict Cumberbatch plays what may quite possibly be the best villain of the last decade and that includes Ledger's Joker. Anyone who appreciates audio, video, and story done right simultaneously should go see Star Trek: Into Darkness.

I agree with everything you wrote here. I just came back from watching Star Trek and absolutely loved it. I saw it in 2D and the pq and aq was sensational. The story was fantastic, I did not want the movie to end. It will be a definite buy on blu ray for me. smile.gif

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post #1897 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 04:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wkingincharge View Post

Sounds like you are gettin close to lift off with those legacies man looking forward to those great videos!!!.

McIntosh are my all time favorite amps got me thinking back in the day when my uncle has some 240's how great they looked and sounded. If my current and future space were large enough to support large high end towers these would be my end game amps even the Mrs likes them.I have seen and heard the 601's in a showroom but could not really make a good sound comparison to the other speaker/amp combo they were using.

Do you plan in the future to bring the equipment out in the open for viewing or do you prefer not seen but heard???

Yeah man!!! Lift off is next week with the Legacies--the speakers are already en route to my abode!! If I end up going with Monoblocks, I'll run the XLR cables to the front corners of the room and will place them on amp stands for all to see!!

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Originally Posted by mech27 View Post

Brolic if your main focus was just home theater & gaming would you have kept the klipsch's & the integra?

hey ther mech[warrior?] lol...My main focus actually is Home Theater and Gaming....there is generally a fluctuation at some level, but movies and gaming together out-portion music use (although neither one does so individually). The truth is, I was ready to go high end with the upgrade. I got the Klipsch from Best Buy when I was in grad school, but things are very different financially now, and I wanted to splurge on my passion of Home Theater, so after much deliberation, I decided to take the jump into high-end.
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Originally Posted by prepress View Post

The three taps are to best match the amp's output impedance with the load of the speaker. The Autoformer ensures that power output is constant and consistent regardless of the load a speaker presents. Usually as load varies, the amp has to work harder and output more juice. That's how I understand it. You use the tap appropriate for your speaker; if it falls in between, you use the next lowest tap. My Mirages are 6 ohm nominal impedance, so I'd use the 4-ohm tap. But I also bi-wire, so I use the 2-ohm tap for the woofers and 4 for mids and highs. I was told not to use the 8-ohm tap by McIntosh, given my speakers' impedance.

Aha, here's something from the 501 manual:

All solid state power amplifier output circuits work best
into what is called an optimum load. This optimum load
may vary considerably from what a loudspeaker requires.
In the case of more than one loudspeaker connected in parallel,
the load to the power amplifier may drop to two ohms
or even less. A power amplifier connected to a load that is
lower than optimum, causes more output current to flow,
which results in extra heat being generated in the power
output stage. This increase in temperature will result in a
reduced life expectancy for the amplifier. The special
Balanced Winding Autoformer creates an ideal match between
the power amplifier output stage and the loudspeaker.
A McIntosh amplifier with an Autoformer can be used to
safely drive multiple speakers without reducing the life
expectancy of the power amplifier. There is absolutely no
performance limitation with an Autoformer. Its frequency
response exceeds that of the output circuit itself, and extends
well beyond the audible range. Its distortion level is so low
it is virtually impossible to measure.


These Autoformers also give DC protection to the speakers. And as mentioned, the 501s are absolutely cool to the touch. They've never been even warm around here. I don't blast my music, but I'm sure the Autoformers help.

Thanks a bunch for the information--I now understand. That makes total sense......McIntosh and their technical-design superiority!!
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Originally Posted by Franin View Post

I agree with everything you wrote here. I just came back from watching Star Trek and absolutely loved it. I saw it in 2D and the pq and aq was sensational. The story was fantastic, I did not want the movie to end. It will be a definite buy on blu ray for me. smile.gif

It was indeed sensational! I cannot wait for the Blu Ray release!!! I'm glad you enjoyed it!
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post #1898 of 3333 Old 05-25-2013, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Yeah man!!! Lift off is next week with the Legacies--the speakers are already en route to my abode!! If I end up going with Monoblocks, I'll run the XLR cables to the front corners of the room and will place them on amp stands for all to see!!

Congrats, Matt!! Can't wait to see some pics or videos of those beauties. My upgrade path continues as well. I just scored a brand new, in box set of KEF iQ70 towers. They ship on Tuesday. They will be put to use as my side surrounds and complete my setup. I now own the full iQ series of speakers. Like you, I eagerly await delivery.
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post #1899 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 07:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Congrats, Matt!! Can't wait to see some pics or videos of those beauties. My upgrade path continues as well. I just scored a brand new, in box set of KEF iQ70 towers. They ship on Tuesday. They will be put to use as my side surrounds and complete my setup. I now own the full iQ series of speakers. Like you, I eagerly await delivery.

Thanks man and congrats on your upgrade! I also am a firm believer in the use of towers for Surround Duty and the timbre matching will make the new surrounds that-much more of a contribution to the overall system. What amp are you rocking those bad-boys with?
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post #1900 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 07:49 AM
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What amp are you rocking those bad-boys with?

I haven't ventured into the world of separates yet, so I'm powering my speakers with a new Pioneer SC-1522-K receiver. I was previously using a Denon 3311, but jumped on the Costco $599 deal for the Pioneer. I was considering a 3 channel Emotiva amp to power my fronts and center when I had the Denon. I will have to reevaluate once the new iQ70s arrive, and I really begin to push the levels of the D3 amps in the Pioneer. This receiver runs so cool, I feel like I can really push it without coming close to its limits. I do know, however, that at some point separates will start calling my name!!!
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post #1901 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 08:52 AM
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Hey Matt, looking forward to your thoughts and a video on the Legacies. I am sure they will be fantastic, I heard Mac amps years ago and I was very impressed. If you go with them, I am know you won't be disappointed. I would love to go that route but they are just too large for where I have to place them. But again, I am looking forward to your upgrade.

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post #1902 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 09:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dharel View Post

I haven't ventured into the world of separates yet, so I'm powering my speakers with a new Pioneer SC-1522-K receiver. I was previously using a Denon 3311, but jumped on the Costco $599 deal for the Pioneer. I was considering a 3 channel Emotiva amp to power my fronts and center when I had the Denon. I will have to reevaluate once the new iQ70s arrive, and I really begin to push the levels of the D3 amps in the Pioneer. This receiver runs so cool, I feel like I can really push it without coming close to its limits. I do know, however, that at some point separates will start calling my name!!!

Ah yes, the separates shall indeed be calling thy name quite soon!!! But that Pioneer AVR is definitely no slouch!
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Originally Posted by MIkeDuke View Post

Hey Matt, looking forward to your thoughts and a video on the Legacies. I am sure they will be fantastic, I heard Mac amps years ago and I was very impressed. If you go with them, I am know you won't be disappointed. I would love to go that route but they are just too large for where I have to place them. But again, I am looking forward to your upgrade.

Whats up Mike! I'm probably going to go with Parasound.....when I consider that I plan to add heights and wides, Parasound has a broader range of amps I can use after getting a pair of JC-1 jeavyweights.
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post #1903 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Greetings! Yup...I plan to replace them with identical sub models (Submersive F2 HPs), albeit in black maple finish instead of the gorgeous--but soon to be out of place--rosenut finish I currently enjoy....but I may sit tight on Mark's new F4 before pulling any sub triggers. One way or another, I'm never leaving the Seaton family. One cannot ask for more out of a sub setup than what Seaton Sound subwoofers offer.

Invite is still open if you are interested in hearing what DIY has to offer.

smile.gif
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post #1904 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Ah yes, the separates shall indeed be calling thy name quite soon!!! But that Pioneer AVR is definitely no slouch!
Whats up Mike! I'm probably going to go with Parasound.....when I consider that I plan to add heights and wides, Parasound has a broader range of amps I can use after getting a pair of JC-1 jeavyweights.
Those are supposed to be very good amps. Just know that I am pretty sure they bias class A pretty high so they are going to get very hot so cooling the room will have to be addressed maybe more then it already is. My room gets hot with my two Brystons so if I need to, I can turn on two fans to combat that issue. But the Parasounds are supposedly really good. I had a Halo C2 preamp for a number of years and I loved it. I am kind of upset that Parasound stopped making HT pre-amps because I really like the C2 and I never had any issues with it. The JC-1's are going make those Legacies sound so good.

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post #1905 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Whats up Mike! I'm probably going to go with Parasound.....when I consider that I plan to add heights and wides, Parasound has a broader range of amps I can use after getting a pair of JC-1 jeavyweights.

As I recall, the high bias on the JC-1s is 25w of Class A; low is 10w. And yes, they do generate a lot of heat in high bias. Ten watts of Class A probably isn't exactly cool either. But they will sound good. As I said, both the Parasounds and the Macs will grip your speakers nicely.

Try this.
http://www.hometheater.com/content/parasound-halo-p-7-multichannel-preamplifier-51-multichannel-amplifier-amp-jc-1-single-chann
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post #1906 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by prepress View Post

As I recall, the high bias on the JC-1s is 25w of Class A; low is 10w. And yes, they do generate a lot of heat in high bias. Ten watts of Class A probably isn't exactly cool either. But they will sound good. As I said, both the Parasounds and the Macs will grip your speakers nicely.

Try this.
http://www.hometheater.com/content/parasound-halo-p-7-multichannel-preamplifier-51-multichannel-amplifier-amp-jc-1-single-chann
You are right on the wattage for the high and low bias. In a big, well vented room, away from the main listening position, it would probably be fine. But in a room, especially a small one like mine, it would be insanity to do that. But if you are still keeping all the amps in that equipment room, it may not matter for you, but just watch the heat in the room itself. I have read about those JC-1's though. The Parasound and the Mac's would be a great choice for your speakers Matt.

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post #1907 of 3333 Old 05-26-2013, 10:51 PM
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Ah so you are gonna stay with Seaton F2's. I'm looking into a pair and seen yours for sale a couple different places. I was gonna ask you why would you get rid of them until I saw your above post. smile.gif
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post #1908 of 3333 Old 05-27-2013, 05:59 AM
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hi brolic very nice theater ,just watched the video ,may i suggest using a tripod to shoot so the shaking video is prevented, just set the shots and angles you want and narrate along , no need to handhold and walk around
you will make better videos that way
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post #1909 of 3333 Old 05-27-2013, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post

Invite is still open if you are interested in hearing what DIY has to offer.

smile.gif

Greetings! I would indeed love to come check out the DIY prowess. I'm a DIY kind of guy around the house, but building speakers/subs entails a level of effort that I can't really provide at the moment. Are you the gentleman with the one massive black DIY enclosure w/ mulllltiple massive drivers across the front of the theater?
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Those are supposed to be very good amps. Just know that I am pretty sure they bias class A pretty high so they are going to get very hot so cooling the room will have to be addressed maybe more then it already is. My room gets hot with my two Brystons so if I need to, I can turn on two fans to combat that issue. But the Parasounds are supposedly really good. I had a Halo C2 preamp for a number of years and I loved it. I am kind of upset that Parasound stopped making HT pre-amps because I really like the C2 and I never had any issues with it. The JC-1's are going make those Legacies sound so good.

Oh yeah--being a PC builder for years, I am actually toying with utilizing some CPU water cooling techniques [on a much larger scale] to dissipate some heat from the massive heat-sinks. It would take a lot of time to design and I'd have to be very very careful to tap ONLY the heat-sink fins, but If I got it right....it would be revolutionary. My room doesn't generally hold temperatures [warm or cold] well on its own since it opens up into a kitchen to the left, but if I do find the room getting hot, then I'll need to kick my water-cooling idea into full gear.
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Originally Posted by prepress View Post

As I recall, the high bias on the JC-1s is 25w of Class A; low is 10w. And yes, they do generate a lot of heat in high bias. Ten watts of Class A probably isn't exactly cool either. But they will sound good. As I said, both the Parasounds and the Macs will grip your speakers nicely.

Try this.
http://www.hometheater.com/content/parasound-halo-p-7-multichannel-preamplifier-51-multichannel-amplifier-amp-jc-1-single-chann

I saw some Krell monoblocks on Audiogon a few weeks ago that were pure class A to 250w.....those things must need their own HVAC systems. lol...Oh yeah, I'm familiar with that review of the Parasound Halo line. I remember it's the same issue of HT Mag with the article "Dreaming the Not-Impossible Dream." That's one of my favorite issues of all time!! :-)
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You are right on the wattage for the high and low bias. In a big, well vented room, away from the main listening position, it would probably be fine. But in a room, especially a small one like mine, it would be insanity to do that. But if you are still keeping all the amps in that equipment room, it may not matter for you, but just watch the heat in the room itself. I have read about those JC-1's though. The Parasound and the Mac's would be a great choice for your speakers Matt.

The monoblocks would go in the front-corners of the room. Coincidentally, I have a thermostat in the room so I can keep tabs on the temperature.
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Ah so you are gonna stay with Seaton F2's. I'm looking into a pair and seen yours for sale a couple different places. I was gonna ask you why would you get rid of them until I saw your above post. smile.gif

Greetings! Yeah, I sold my Submersive F2 HP's because their finish no longer works with my current setup (and wouldn't work with the future setup as well) and it looks like the buyer has put them up for sale. I'm actually going to run my new speakers full-range for a while, until some new products from Seaton Sound are released.
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Originally Posted by jjoboh View Post

hi brolic very nice theater ,just watched the video ,may i suggest using a tripod to shoot so the shaking video is prevented, just set the shots and angles you want and narrate along , no need to handhold and walk around
you will make better videos that way

Thanks for the kind words! It's funny you mention the use of a tri-pod because I used a tri-pod for the first time with my most recent video--the J-River overview. Before that, it was 100% hand-held. I used the same tri-pod I use to run Audyssey and just attached my camera to it to record.
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post #1910 of 3333 Old 05-27-2013, 11:18 AM
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Greetings! I would indeed love to come check out the DIY prowess. I'm a DIY kind of guy around the house, but building speakers/subs entails a level of effort that I can't really provide at the moment. Are you the gentleman with the one massive black DIY enclosure w/ mulllltiple massive drivers across the front of the theater?

biggrin.gif

Yessir... Well, at the current moment I have 8 18's in the front and 8 in the rear nearfield to my seats. We can play around a bit when you come by. I'd like to get your impressions on how one of my boxes (4 x 18's) fares against dual F2's. Obviously different spaces are going to yield dramatically different results, but I enjoy getting different perspectives.

I'm out here in Chantilly and the invite is open anytime. Shoot me a PM when you want to set something up.
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post #1911 of 3333 Old 05-27-2013, 03:07 PM
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That cooling idea sounds interesting. I would like to see a video on that if you ever get something like that going. If they they are in the front of the room, then you should be OK. Although, I do think they will still give off some heat. Regarding the Krell amps, way back when, they had some huge amps that were all class A. They may be the ones you saw. I am sure you could cook a meal on them if you wanted too. Looking forward to the video for your speakers and then whatever amps you go with.

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post #1912 of 3333 Old 05-28-2013, 07:17 AM
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Believe it or not, I have a Gantt chart on my expected life-direction, and these plans, according to the project schedule, also align with the introduction of fatherhood (the predecessor of which is, of course, marriage--which is, itself, fast approaching).

Very PMO-ish of you, LOL. Does your CPM go all the way to having the baby delivered? tongue.gif
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post #1913 of 3333 Old 05-28-2013, 03:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Very PMO-ish of you, LOL. Does your CPM go all the way to having the baby delivered? tongue.gif

LOL--Marriage is referred to as IOC and Birth of first child is referred to as FOC. :-) biggrin.gif
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post #1914 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 07:38 AM
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LOL--Marriage is referred to as IOC and Birth of first child is referred to as FOC. :-) biggrin.gif

LOL, nice. Speaking of project management, did you ever get a PMP?
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post #1915 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 08:56 AM - Thread Starter
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LOL, nice. Speaking of project management, did you ever get a PMP?

Nah, I never pursued the PMP. As a Program Manager, I actually am going to be pursuing a PgMP later this year. Some of my colleagues who are great at their jobs have failed this test; thus, by their results, I have been warned of its difficulty. I'm going to take about 3 weeks off from work and will study about 6 hours a day for this exam when the time comes.
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post #1916 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by BrolicBeast View Post

Nah, I never pursued the PMP. As a Program Manager, I actually am going to be pursuing a PgMP later this year. Some of my colleagues who are great at their jobs have failed this test; thus, by their results, I have been warned of its difficulty. I'm going to take about 3 weeks off from work and will study about 6 hours a day for this exam when the time comes.

Yeah, I heard the PMP was very hard as well too. I believe I read a statistic of only a 40% passing rate somewhere on the PMI website. My company tends to hire a lot of PMPs, and within my team alone my manager and a couple colleagues have their PMP, so I'm feeling left out of the crowd. I'm actually waiting for approval to take the boot camp course and exam later this year. I can't say that I know many people that went for a PgMP as well...is the exam vastly different than the PMP?
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post #1917 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 03:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Yeah the PMP is itself a difficult exam. The PgMP is very rare, but I love a challenge!!! I have a few PMPs operating under my authority--In all honesty, I often rely on them first when assigning high-cost or long-term projects. I feel that people who go the extra mile to get these professional certifications deserve the chance to shine.

BTW--when are we going to see your system here in WYSC???
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post #1918 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I'm in a bit of a predicament that will work out in the long run, but will leave me in s strange place for a few weeks. I sold the XPA-5 to put towards the amp upgrade and an upgrade plan is indeed in place; however, the timing of the Focus/Marquis arrival tomorrow or Friday (waiting on the shipping company to contact me) will leave me without amplification for a few weeks. Sure, I've moved the placeholder infinities back upstairs and have my media-room fully functioning again, so it's not like I"m without A/V happiness--but it will be difficult to look at the legacies without being able to hear them. But--it will all be worth it. A couple of VTI amp stands are now on the way to hold the (new black finish) Parasound Halo JC-1 monoblocks and an a third stand will hold the A31 when they arrive [Amp Timeframe: June]. After this, I'm done with HT upgrades for a longggg time.....unless I hear good things about the Krell Evolution pre-pro.
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post #1919 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 08:15 PM
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After this, I'm done with HT upgrades for a longggg time.....unless I ............

Surely you jest. Surely!!

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post #1920 of 3333 Old 05-29-2013, 08:20 PM
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Say it ain't so !!!

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