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post #1 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 04:13 PM - Thread Starter
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My stuff:

Pioneer Elite vsx-53 AVR
Panasonic DMP-BD80 Blu-Ray Player
Mini-dsp
Kinivo HD 1080p switchbox
Cerwin Vega CV 5000 amp to power subwoofers (placed in the laundry room next to my room)
Epson 8350 projector
158 inch screen (2:35:1) 124 inch with masking panels in (16:9)
inuke 3000 dsp to power left and right main speakers
inuke 3000 dsp to power Crowson Transducer (plan on buying more Crowsons)
4 Elemental Designs Cinema 6 surround speakers
8 Stereo Integrity 18" Subwoofers
LCR JTR Noesis 215's



UPDATE July 16th 2014

























My subs are all now hidden behind velvet covered frames in the front corners behind the speakers, but here was what they looked like before I covered them and bought the new speakers:











Older Pictures












View from sitting on a subwoofer:






Equipment rack:






Ceiling Acoustic Panels:







It ain't pretty, but it's nice to have this room next door to keep the sub amp since it's so loud and to be able to get behind the components.







It may look messy but this is about as neat as I can get it. I have so much crap going through here especially since I moved the computer back here.





darthray and Mr. Hatcher like this.

Last edited by carp; 07-31-2014 at 12:41 PM.
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post #2 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 04:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I just finished a pretty big project - at least by my standards. With the help of a friends I built a riser for the second row. I was inspired by both Gorilla83 and MrSmithers. Gorilla had just built a riser which got me thinking about it and I also recently went to MrSmithers new house to check out his room and we were experimenting with distances from the screen and I found I didn't mind at all being 9 or 10 feet from the screen on a size similar to what I have in my own room. So, when I got home I moved my chair up 3 feet so that my head is 11 feet from the screen. I could go a little closer but I don't want to mess up the stereo image when I'm listening to music (which is most of the time when I'm in here).

So I enlisted a friend to "help" me out with the project (which means he does most of it since I'm one step from worthless).

I bought 2 2x10's 12 feet long, and 3 2x10's 10 feet long. I already had some MDF that I knew I could use. I figured that 5x7 would be a good size for the riser. For one my couch that length but also I checked Walmart and they sell 5x7 area rugs for very cheap.

So, yesterday we built the riser in the garage. Right before moving it downstairs I had a horrible flash of realization that it may not fit down the stairs. Unfortunately that turned out to be right and we had to take some of it apart, move it to the basement, and re-assemble.

Here is the final stages of screwing the mdf top to the frame.

024-4_zps519c1fff.jpg


Good job Dave. smile.gif




029-4_zps4fbaae96.jpg



We went with 14" spans between 2x10's. This thing is sturdy and heavy as hell especially with the 3/4 MDF top. I didn't take a picture of it, but I also put speaker/subwoofer feet under the frame. I had 20 of them so I placed them under it, hoping that maybe I'll get a better tactile effect from bass.


Dave had the great idea to use replacement carpet and adhesive spray for the sides of the frame. I did this part alone, so it took me awhile to realize the only way to get the carpet on straight was to get it off the ground. Did I mention this thing is heavy?


028-4_zpsaa820850.jpg


Ok, here it is with the walmart rug on top. I think the rug was 35 bucks or close to it. I was going to use black but the black one they had was a lot thinner and wouldn't have been an exact match to the black on the sides anyway. I'm glad I didn't go with the black rug, this one looks really good IMO.


033-2_zps730a0054.jpg


034-1_zps222a8103.jpg

033-2_zps730a0054.jpg

036-1_zps7d974d07.jpg




Couch is on!! That was fun by myself too. smile.gif


037-2_zpsb0de79c3.jpg

039-1_zpscabe8bd7.jpg

041-1_zps5000460e.jpg



Back row reclined:

042_zpse999700c.jpg




Both rows reclined:

045_zpsb2855276.jpg

Don't know why but this view made me laugh; makes me feel like taking a nap. biggrin.gif

046-2_zpsbbfb32fc.jpg



Hey, look at that, the MBM-12 is back in the mix!! smile.gif I wanted to make sure I had just enough room for it in between. I like it better this way, it's a bit more hidden than before I had the 2nd row.

047_zpsba6248f6.jpg

048_zps81ef7306.jpg

050-4_zps4ba48f9f.jpg




Here is what the view is like for me in the back row not reclined.

052-1_zps6ea83785.jpg


Here is fully reclined with the front row upright.

053-1_zps2a2729ca.jpg

Fully reclined with front row fully reclined. Better not have stinky feet!!!

055-1_zpsebf56f75.jpg




I like this. This is sitting up with the front row seats reclined. This way the center channel speaker gets to me with no blockage.

056-1_zps701531a6.jpg



This is laying down watching golf. I'll still be able to do it as long as the front row is reclined.

057-2_zpsf06554f9.jpg
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post #3 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 05:01 PM
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How you going to open up your thread with an apology...lol

Riser looks great broseph!!!!
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post #4 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 05:26 PM
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Nice, Carp! Glad you're having fun with the riser and the seating. It's fun getting to choose which row you get to sit in, right? biggrin.gif
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post #5 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 06:10 PM
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nice job on your riser.
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post #6 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 08:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post

How you going to open up your thread with an apology...lol

Riser looks great broseph!!!!


Haha, yeah I know. I just didn't want the thread police to get ticked that I was basically doing the same thread all over again.

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Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

Nice, Carp! Glad you're having fun with the riser and the seating. It's fun getting to choose which row you get to sit in, right? biggrin.gif


Exactly! I have to say, I like being up high too for some reason. The couch seems more inviting now, I hardly sat on it when it was against the wall. You're going to think I'm crazy but I think the acoustics are noticeably different up there. My daughters came down to check it out and I was talking to them and noticed that my voice sounded different. It seemed like there was more of an echo, not sure. Could be because I'm closer to the ceiling? At any rate if that's the case then that's not a good thing... may have to get some more treatments. Ehhhh... basically just thinking aloud right now, probably won't be a big deal.


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nice job on your riser.

Thanks man! Most of the credit goes to my friend.
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post #7 of 133 Old 06-19-2013, 08:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Here's a question for you guys. I now have a open area of unused space to the right of my main LP. I have 7 feet between the edge of my chair and the wall and at least 8 feet along the wall itself.

MrSmithers is going to do a bar in his room so that got me thinking. I wonder if I could fit a small/skinny bar along the wall with barstools in between the bar and the wall. Room for 3 stools would be great. Obviously I wouldn't have room to have stools on both sides of it, but it would be nice to have something like that in here. I eat down here when it's not family dinner time, and it would be very nice to have something like that where I could eat. Also the added seating room for guests would be great too.

So, I went online looking for a skinny bar or even a high pub table that would be long and thin. It seems like what i am looking for doesn't exist. My guess is the liability of making something that could tip over is why nobody makes them?? I don't know, but I was really surprised tonight when walking through Nebraska Furniture Mart and NOTHING even close to what I am thinking of...

That's my question. Does anyone know where I could find something like this? What I'm afraid of is the only way is to build it yourself..... I really don't want to do that.
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post #8 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 02:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

Here's a question for you guys. I now have a open area of unused space...

I only got this far in your post and guess what the first thought that popped into my head was?

Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post

MrSmithers is going to do a bar in his room so that got me thinking. I wonder if I could fit a small/skinny bar along the wall with barstools in between the bar and the wall....

That's my question. Does anyone know where I could find something like this? What I'm afraid of is the only way is to build it yourself..... I really don't want to do that.

You want something like this...
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1421716/bigmouthindc-summer-fun-just-10-minutes-down-the-parkway/200_100#post_23422664

Not going to happen unless you DIY it. I actually helped BIG build this. It's anchored directly to the riser to ensure stability. Something tall and skinny would pose a tipping liability for sure.
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post #9 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 10:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post

I only got this far in your post and guess what the first thought that popped into my head was?
You want something like this...
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1421716/bigmouthindc-summer-fun-just-10-minutes-down-the-parkway/200_100#post_23422664

Not going to happen unless you DIY it. I actually helped BIG build this. It's anchored directly to the riser to ensure stability. Something tall and skinny would pose a tipping liability for sure.


Wow, yeah that's exactly the type of size I'm looking for. I'm thinking 6 feet long, and could probably do 20-24 inches wide. I just tried out a folding table that is 6 feet long and 30 inches wide in that spot. The length is fine but the width is too much, which is fine since I don't want something that wide anyway. Looks like I could easily do 3 bar stools behind it. Not a ton of space between the table and the wall, but enough to get around someone if they were bellied up to the bar.

Is there a way I could bolt it to the concrete floor? I think that's the only way I could keep it stable since it will be out in space, not behind a row like Big's.
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post #10 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 10:30 AM - Thread Starter
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It's interesting, Big's room is the exact same length as mine, 23 feet and his front front row is the same distance from the screen. If I didn't have the bathroom in the back of the room I could do the same kind of bar he has behind the back row. I would probably scoot everything forward a foot or so, but it could work.... still that open space is begging for something to fill it and I don't want anymore recliners.
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post #11 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 10:59 AM
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Haha, yeah I know. I just didn't want the thread police to get ticked that I was basically doing the same thread all over again.
Exactly! I have to say, I like being up high too for some reason. The couch seems more inviting now, I hardly sat on it when it was against the wall. You're going to think I'm crazy but I think the acoustics are noticeably different up there. My daughters came down to check it out and I was talking to them and noticed that my voice sounded different. It seemed like there was more of an echo, not sure. Could be because I'm closer to the ceiling? At any rate if that's the case then that's not a good thing... may have to get some more treatments. Ehhhh... basically just thinking aloud right now, probably won't be a big deal.
Thanks man! Most of the credit goes to my friend.

I did sweeps of all 6 seats last weekend and found some of them can vary drastically in response! On the low end they were all pretty solid but at least two of the seats had huge dips from 1-2k hz. I'll be dealing with that as much as possible but I can tell you it's going to be hard to fix one area without compromising another. I've got a bunch more panels/boards on the way to experiment so we'll see what happens.
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post #12 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 12:23 PM
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Remember the MRS CARP license plate I saw? I happened to go by the same parking spot this morning. She must have driven her husband's Suburban today because the license plate said CARPS! biggrin.gif

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post #13 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 12:45 PM
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With those 18" subs, is there a need for that MBM12? Do you set proper crossover so that the MBM12 only handles the upper bass? Aren't the Noesis good enough for the upper bass?
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post #14 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 05:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorilla83 View Post

I did sweeps of all 6 seats last weekend and found some of them can vary drastically in response! On the low end they were all pretty solid but at least two of the seats had huge dips from 1-2k hz. I'll be dealing with that as much as possible but I can tell you it's going to be hard to fix one area without compromising another. I've got a bunch more panels/boards on the way to experiment so we'll see what happens.

How do they sound by ear? Can you tell some seats aren't very good just by listening?
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post #15 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 05:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Remember the MRS CARP license plate I saw? I happened to go by the same parking spot this morning. She must have driven her husband's Suburban today because the license plate said CARPS! biggrin.gif



Haha, what's up with all the Carp plates? Maybe they aren't taken in Kansas and I should get one. Althought I still have my heart set on "assman". smile.gif One in a million shot doc... one in a million.
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post #16 of 133 Old 06-20-2013, 05:40 PM - Thread Starter
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With those 18" subs, is there a need for that MBM12? Do you set proper crossover so that the MBM12 only handles the upper bass? Aren't the Noesis good enough for the upper bass?

Well yes and no. The system sounds awesome without the mbm. However, you turn it on and it's just that much better as far as tactile feel for music.

It's a little crazy looking to have 8 frickin subs and a mbm on top of all that but it works great.


I only use it for music. For movies the mbm doesn't work as well... or maybe it's more that I just don't need it for movies since the subs crush me all by themselves. For music it's just a subtle added tactile feel that is so nice.

What's interesting is that the way I have it dialed in the frequency response looks exactly like it does without it. However, it's easy to tell the difference when it's on - for music that is. Ha, I think you get the fact that I only use it for music. biggrin.gif

Yes, I have it dialed in using the minidsp for distance settings. You can't tell at all that it's on or where the bass is coming from.

The Noesis measure flat to mid 50hz, and sound nice and tight in the midbass but on a concrete floor they don't give you that tactile feel like the mbm does right behind your seat. Plus I use a 80 hz crossover anyway and the mbm plays flat to 50hz.
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post #17 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 02:37 AM
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Quote:
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Well yes and no. The system sounds awesome without the mbm. However, you turn it on and it's just that much better as far as tactile feel for music.

It's a little crazy looking to have 8 frickin subs and a mbm on top of all that but it works great.


I only use it for music. For movies the mbm doesn't work as well... or maybe it's more that I just don't need it for movies since the subs crush me all by themselves. For music it's just a subtle added tactile feel that is so nice.

What's interesting is that the way I have it dialed in the frequency response looks exactly like it does without it. However, it's easy to tell the difference when it's on - for music that is. Ha, I think you get the fact that I only use it for music. biggrin.gif

Yes, I have it dialed in using the minidsp for distance settings. You can't tell at all that it's on or where the bass is coming from.

The Noesis measure flat to mid 50hz, and sound nice and tight in the midbass but on a concrete floor they don't give you that tactile feel like the mbm does right behind your seat. Plus I use a 80 hz crossover anyway and the mbm plays flat to 50hz.
Your 18 inchers play <50Hz, your MBM12 plays 50Hz-80Hz, and your Noesis play >80Hz...am I correct?

I also have concrete flooring in my house. I have dual Rythmik FV15HPs in my setup. Due to the flooring, the shake/vibration on my 3-seater couch is very minimal. In WOTW, when the pod strikes its laser (centered around 30Hz bass) or when Kate Beckinsale fires her uzi guns in U:A , that's when my couch shakes a bit. I would like to increase the tactile sensation. I'm not sure if I want Buttkicker as some say it's very artificial. Do you think adding rubber feet to my couch will improve the tactile feeling (allowing the couch to shake easier)? Or adding Buttkicker is the only way to go in my situation (more wiring that WAF may get more angry)?
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post #18 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 04:47 AM
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How do they sound by ear? Can you tell some seats aren't very good just by listening?

Now that I know I'm listening for it, I can tell a difference - I think. But it's not as drastic/bad as I would have thought by looking at a -25DB null between 1-2K. eek.gif The other seats in the back row are fantastic (FR wise), and 2/3 of the fronts are close to ideal with only small variations.
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post #19 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 08:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Skylinestar View Post

Your 18 inchers play <50Hz, your MBM12 plays 50Hz-80Hz, and your Noesis play >80Hz...am I correct?

I also have concrete flooring in my house. I have dual Rythmik FV15HPs in my setup. Due to the flooring, the shake/vibration on my 3-seater couch is very minimal. In WOTW, when the pod strikes its laser (centered around 30Hz bass) or when Kate Beckinsale fires her uzi guns in U:A , that's when my couch shakes a bit. I would like to increase the tactile sensation. I'm not sure if I want Buttkicker as some say it's very artificial. Do you think adding rubber feet to my couch will improve the tactile feeling (allowing the couch to shake easier)? Or adding Buttkicker is the only way to go in my situation (more wiring that WAF may get more angry)?


No. The Noesis play > 80hz, and both the mbm and subs play below 80hz and the mbm drops off below 50hz. I could set up my minidsp how you describe it with the big subs not taking over until 50hz and below but I don't feel the need to since the frequency response is good (measured with omnimic) with both mbm and subs playing at the same time. There are times when I'm listening to music that I'm not in the mood for the mbm and I shut it off. The tactile sensation is decreased but the sound quality is the same. It's nice because I still get good punchy tactile bass without the mbm, but it just adds to it when turned on.

I've tried adding rubber feet to my couch and that didn't do much. However, I did add them to the riser just in case, I had a bunch of extra feet that I didn't use on my subs so I put them on the riser. Before adding the feet we turned on some bass heavy clips to see if the riser made any vibration noise and fortunately it did not. However when I stood on it (this was before the couch was on it) there was a noticeable difference in feeling between standing on the riser and standing on the floor. That was without the feet, so I'm hoping for even more feel but I haven't had a chance to try it out yet.

Ok, back to your question. It sounds like you want the lower end frequency feel which means the mbm wouldn't do it for you. It's more for punchy, tactile feel not shake the couch feel. I never got much shake the couch feel until I went from an SVS sub to a Captivator and then dual Captivators. I would suggest near field but for me that didn't work as well for the low end frequency couch shaking - in your room this may not be the case though. With the Caps up front in the corners the scene from Die Hard 4 with the apartment uzi the couch shook like crazy. With nearfield not so much. The nearfield Caps placement did help with music tactile feel though.

I'm not a fan of bass shakers. Some people love them though, so if you have experienced them and like them then that is the way to go for sure.
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post #20 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 09:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Ugh. Man the sound from the center channel is not good from the back row. It sounds like the voice of the person speaking is coming from everywhere up front, not from a specific point. Fortunately I can recline the front seats a bit and then the center sounds good again since you get the direct line of sight. I know this screams AT screen...
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post #21 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
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I wanted to get a rough (very rough smile.gif) idea if a bar would fit/work in here.

I would think you would get a better rough idea with beer. biggrin.gif
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post #22 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 02:03 PM - Thread Starter
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post #23 of 133 Old 06-21-2013, 02:48 PM - Thread Starter
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And then I run across something like this and I'm tempted to say screw it and just go with a simple table and 2 stools. Is it me or is this a really good price? It seems a lot of places want this money just for a table this size with no stools. Free shipping too, hmmm.


http://www.barstools.com/pub-tables-&-sets/pub-sets/boraamaugustapubtablesetlightcherry.cfm
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post #24 of 133 Old 06-30-2013, 03:43 PM
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Wife dragged me to Macy's earlier and we came across this and I though about your room.







The kicker... Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
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post #25 of 133 Old 06-30-2013, 10:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Wow, that would have worked really well - nice find!

I was starting to regret my recent purchase until I saw the price - ouch!!! That and the knee room looks small.

I went ahead and got a bar table and stools from hayneedle. I think it's a great deal, they look really nice and total price after the 10 percent discount they were offering was 400 shipped for 3 stools and the table. One of the stools had a 1 inch tear on the back of the seat which isn't visible. I called hayneedle and they gave me 85 bucks back!! So 3 stools and a table for 315, not bad.

The stools are comfortable and swivel, which is a must.












You can see below I took the recliner upstairs. I can still get into the front row walking next to the bar table but I like having a nice wide aisle coming into the room. For a movie night I will just temporarily move the recliner back into the room.




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post #26 of 133 Old 06-30-2013, 10:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post

Wife dragged me to Macy's earlier and we came across this and I though about your room.







The kicker... Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)


Just looked at this again. Man, none of the local furniture stores had ANYTHING like this and I couldn't find anything like it online either. I don't get the price tag at all though, that's crazy.
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post #27 of 133 Old 06-30-2013, 11:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Oh, I also finally got around to putting up some more signs to keep my JTR sign company. I have had these forever now, I can't even remember where I got them. I know it was through a link here on avs forum and they were pretty cheap. I can tell it was a long time ago because I had a Seaton Sound sign and a Elemental Designs sign. I finally got some cheap frames at wal mart (6 frames for 18 bucks).





I also took the glass out of the JTR sign, looks much better - too much reflection before.

Wow, I really need to clean out that closet and paint the back of it black.
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post #28 of 133 Old 07-01-2013, 01:44 PM
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I can no longer come to your house Carp....SQUIRREL.....

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post #29 of 133 Old 07-02-2013, 11:02 PM - Thread Starter
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I can no longer come to your house Carp....SQUIRREL.....

Hey, come on now, you weren't quite as bored this last time right? wink.gif
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post #30 of 133 Old 07-02-2013, 11:05 PM - Thread Starter
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I have a speaker delay question.

So, my center channel is 1' 9" from the screen. Do I change the CC speaker distance so that it is the same as the screen (add 1'9" to the speaker distance)? If I do that it throws off the other speakers though, right? Do I simply add that same 1'9" to all my speaker and sub distances?

It probably doesn't make that much difference but I'm curious.
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