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post #61 of 88 Old 12-15-2014, 05:53 AM
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I'd say because of Joe Buck, but that's just why is sounds bad
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post #62 of 88 Old 12-15-2014, 09:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by primetimeguy View Post
Both the Green Bay game and the Vikings game today on FOX were the usual garbage PQ. OTA watching KMSP in Minneapolis.

Wow. I haven't watched much NFL this season, especially on Fox. I was shocked at how bad the picture quality was for the GB/Buffalo game. It looked like SD. What's the deal?
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post #63 of 88 Old 12-15-2014, 10:28 AM
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Seattle-49ers game was just terrible PQ. This was ota . Very close to sd in my opinion.
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post #64 of 88 Old 12-15-2014, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by reds75 View Post
Seattle-49ers game was just terrible PQ. This was ota . Very close to sd in my opinion.
Agree on the PQ, I was also watching OTA. Fox or not Fox, the Seahawks synthetic also adversely impacts the PQ, the black rubber pellets showing through the green give the the field a dull, dirty look.

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post #65 of 88 Old 12-15-2014, 02:05 PM
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We had the "Johnny Football" game on FOX, horrible PQ (OTA KFOX TV), it also didn't help both teams wearing a lot of orange sometimes you lost who had the ball!

The feeds from Fox to the Mexican Channel that does its own version of Redzone is also bad, you can tell when the games are on FOX w/o the logo, way less clear, darker, fuzzier, etc.

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post #66 of 88 Old 12-16-2014, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hooked01 View Post
Wow. I haven't watched much NFL this season, especially on Fox. I was shocked at how bad the picture quality was for the GB/Buffalo game. It looked like SD. What's the deal?
I am not sure what was going on, but I had access to two different OTA feeds (WPB and Miami). Miami looked like stair stepping SD crap. The WPB feed was actually pretty good. The SF/Sea game was pretty good on both feeds. Of course, Fox is way sub par to NBC and CBS.

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post #67 of 88 Old 12-17-2014, 01:26 PM
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720P sucks. Fox football has always looked like crap. The wacky idea that 720P is better for sports was circa 2004 lunacy. The NFL in 1080i is spectacular as is car racing, tennis, golf and every other sport.

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post #68 of 88 Old 12-17-2014, 02:37 PM
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Are they still using the splicer?
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post #69 of 88 Old 12-18-2014, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Star56 View Post
720P sucks. Fox football has always looked like crap. The wacky idea that 720P is better for sports was circa 2004 lunacy. The NFL in 1080i is spectacular as is car racing, tennis, golf and every other sport.
If you want to see it even worse watch college football on ABC - for some reason they have the worst PQ even though ESPN usually looks decent.
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post #70 of 88 Old 12-18-2014, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post
If you want to see it even worse watch college football on ABC - for some reason they have the worst PQ even though ESPN usually looks decent.
Very true. In fact, watch anything on ABC. It indeed sucks worse than FOX.
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post #71 of 88 Old 12-18-2014, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by humdinger70 View Post
Are they still using the splicer?
Yes.
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post #72 of 88 Old 12-19-2014, 10:25 AM
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I remember when Mark Cubans HD.Net did college football. Excellent picture quality.You could see the mesh of the players uniform clearly,and individual blades of grass.I believe he had a contract with satellite company too have HD.net shown with very little compression . Back then this was possible.
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post #73 of 88 Old 12-19-2014, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post
If you want to see it even worse watch college football on ABC - for some reason they have the worst PQ even though ESPN usually looks decent.
Because the local affiliate does whatever they want to the signal. My ABC affiliate now converts it to 1080i for some bizzaro reason, and gives it around 12 Mbps MPEG-2. It looks terrible. FOX is far superior, although their college games are usually really noisy (and I don't just mean Gus Johnson).
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post #74 of 88 Old 12-19-2014, 12:00 PM
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HD Net, and CBS OTA, [with 0 Subs] we're the clear quality standard. That's when most HD channels popped when you clicked them on.
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post #75 of 88 Old 12-28-2014, 01:35 PM
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Don't know what their doing but my FOX NFL HD (PackersLions) via Comcast HD Digital and looks like SD Turdvision with stair stepping galore. Haven't seen anything this bad for about five years as I view ZERO SD.

What goes? Just through watching CBS Miami/Jets wth crystal clear HD and then this crap. BlurVision - even the bottom runner is blurry/fuzzy was a stinkin SD bear.

Anyone know if this is Comcast or the Network? Haven't seen anything this bad since I owned a Magnavomit Tube TV pre-HD era.

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post #76 of 88 Old 12-28-2014, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post
Don't know what their doing but my FOX NFL HD (PackersLions) via Comcast HD Digital and looks like SD Turdvision with stair stepping galore. Haven't seen anything this bad for about five years as I view ZERO SD.

What goes? Just through watching CBS Miami/Jets wth crystal clear HD and then this crap. BlurVision - even the bottom runner is blurry/fuzzy was a stinkin SD bear.

Anyone know if this is Comcast or the Network? Haven't seen anything this bad since I owned a Magnavomit Tube TV pre-HD era.
Must not be your provider. Dallas/Washington looked like hammered dog crap (Dallas KDFW channel 4)...OTA with no sub-channels. Had to be a bad feed from the stadium...commercials, etc. looked ok.
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post #77 of 88 Old 12-29-2014, 06:51 AM
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A lot of artifacts around even slow moving players walking back to the huddle during the Giants/Philly game via Cablevision on L.I., really sub-par even for Fox.
I watched the full Jets/Miami game on CBS-HD and it was gorgeous- then switched to the Giants/Philly game on Fox and the contrast between the two was startling.

One quick observation/question not specific to Fox- when showing the coach on the far side of the field across from the booth- it seems that in very cold or hot situations the auto focus has a very difficult time locking in on that long zoom shot. In that case- when you see the auto focus "hunting" why doesn't the camera operator switch to manual focus to lock it in? Do the broadcast cams not allow manual focus?

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post #78 of 88 Old 12-29-2014, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reds75 View Post
I remember when Mark Cubans HD.Net did college football. Excellent picture quality.You could see the mesh of the players uniform clearly,and individual blades of grass.I believe he had a contract with satellite company too have HD.net shown with very little compression . Back then this was possible.
Oh yeah, the best broadcast football I ever saw was on hdnet. Great PQ, and the camera shots were tighter.

Now hdnet looks pretty much like any other channel, with content that holds little interest for me

Instead of trying to make independent films of middling quality, Cuban could have gone the AMC route and tried to produce great TV shows to make hdnet a real destination and valuable property.
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post #79 of 88 Old 12-31-2014, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by videojanitor View Post
Yes.
I know one Fox affiliate that doesn't use the splicer. They decode and recompress the feed, with the usual problems with audio and video. I'll bet other stations do it, too, and don't tell Fox...
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post #80 of 88 Old 01-01-2015, 01:21 AM
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I know one Fox affiliate that doesn't use the splicer. They decode and recompress the feed, with the usual problems with audio and video. I'll bet other stations do it, too, and don't tell Fox...
Market #1 perhaps? I don't see a splicer bug on it, and the audio sounds HORRIBLY compressed. Unlistenable.
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post #81 of 88 Old 01-01-2015, 01:34 AM
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with this deplorable broadcast quality
why bother with a 4k display?

nfl network crap actually being delivered is neither full 1080i
nor 720p

some bastardized signal that fails to attain either of the standards we were promised for pro football.

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post #82 of 88 Old 01-01-2015, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by replayrob View Post
One quick observation/question not specific to Fox- when showing the coach on the far side of the field across from the booth- it seems that in very cold or hot situations the auto focus has a very difficult time locking in on that long zoom shot. In that case- when you see the auto focus "hunting" why doesn't the camera operator switch to manual focus to lock it in? Do the broadcast cams not allow manual focus?
I don't know any pro video camera op who uses autofocus - especially for a game broadcast. I actually cringe when I get stuff from "wanna-be's" that shoot in full auto (focus, iris, audio gain control) during locker room pressers, arrival footage or practice footage.

Heck, I wouldn't even use autofocus during a perp walk and no professional I know would either.

Because you bring up weather, I'm betting what you're seeing is haze due to the extreme amount of telephoto zoom. Often, those tight shots not only require the entire length of the zoom, but the 2x converter to be added. That means any moisture in the atmosphere from humidity or even breath in the cold will cause the image to appear to waiver in and out of focus.
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post #83 of 88 Old 01-01-2015, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by mr. wally View Post
with this deplorable broadcast quality
why bother with a 4k display?

nfl network crap actually being delivered is neither full 1080i
nor 720p

some bastardized signal that fails to attain either of the standards we were promised for pro football.
Agree, the NFL must not care when their own channel looks like YouTube.

4k is just the next thing to market and fits the cycle of watering down the current technology to one again make it look superior. And it will, for a couple of years before it is reduced to YouTube garbage as well.
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post #84 of 88 Old 01-01-2015, 08:40 AM
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My 2 cents are that a lot of football looks 'bad'...except the more high profile games where they use extra cameras. I mean, I turn into the regular Sunday broadcasts...does not look good. I check out a Monday night or Sunday night game (granted, they are not on FOX...but what I am saying applies to CBS as well) and those look SO much better.
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post #85 of 88 Old 01-02-2015, 11:13 PM
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neither does football look good on ESPN, the leader in edge enhancement.
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post #86 of 88 Old 01-05-2015, 08:21 AM
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I thought the Cowboys-Lions game was wildly inconsistent. There was one camera that would zoom in on the QB and it looked like it was fogged up. The camera on the zip line gave me vertigo. FIOS VHO8.

I think it also affected the refs. What a terrible officiating crew.
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post #87 of 88 Old 01-05-2015, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lionsfan54 View Post
Time and time again I notice that NFL on Fox looks like crap. It's so bad that sometimes the only way you can tell it's HD is that it's wide screen.

Compared to ABC/ESPN or CBS (the best NFL signal IMHO) it looks soft and crappy.

My wife took one look at the screen and stated, matter-of-factually, "That is not Hi-Def." I agree. FOX deserves to be savaged because of the terrible picture.

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post #88 of 88 Old 01-05-2015, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by replayrob View Post
One quick observation/question not specific to Fox- when showing the coach on the far side of the field across from the booth- it seems that in very cold or hot situations the auto focus has a very difficult time locking in on that long zoom shot. In that case- when you see the auto focus "hunting" why doesn't the camera operator switch to manual focus to lock it in? Do the broadcast cams not allow manual focus?
I don't know of any broadcast camera operators who use AutoFocus on-shot, and it is only relatively recently that broadcast lenses have had AF facilities at all, and it is still an optional extra, so many facilities won't buy the AF version of a lens. I do know that in some circumstances some ops will use it on SOME gigs in part-time mode, where it will only engage when you press a button to enable it. This can be quite useful in some situations, but for most stuff decent operators "know" where something is and how far to alter their settings to reach it.

However BCUs (Big Close Ups) over long distance will mean the operator is at the end of their lens (often with a x2 range-extender) in as well which cuts the light, which means the aperture is wide open, which means shallower depth of field and more critical focus. And any tiny movement at the camera end will be hugely amplified on-shot.
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