'Whale Wars' on Animal Planet HD - Page 39 - AVS Forum
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post #1141 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Hanky View Post

AVS "consensus" is definitely more accurate out of pure circumstance that the interests that bring us here together (AV) makes us a typically disinterested party from the matter of whaling vs. anti-whaling. There will be some who have no problem with it, others that don't like it, and still others that don't care either way. That leaves the viewing and criticism to be less emotionally charged where it comes to judging character and integrity demonstrated by various participants in the footage. Overall, they don't really pass the sniff test, regardless of how you feel about the Jpn and what they do on the high seas.

Well said.
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post #1142 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 03:04 PM
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Wow!


The Japanese were the violent party not the Sea Shepard ...
which escalated the Ady Gil Mate after their outrageous and dangerous actions.
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post #1143 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 03:37 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gadianton View Post

I have no doubt that many people think differently that watch Whale Wars.

But I think that in a scientific study across a representative sample of US citizens would show more people sympathize with the whalers after watching Whale Wars than prior. I also suspect that you would find stronger sentiments on both sides. (Someone who was mildly anti-whaling will be strongly anti-whaling... someone who was mildly pro-whaling would be strongly pro-whaling.) I also suspect that most people who were neutral would be turned off by the SS.

I suspect that the same study using a Japanese sample will show an even stronger Anti-SS sentiment.

Now of course, I haven't done a scientific study. If you are willing to pay for one, I'd be interested in the results. I could be wrong. There is no way to tell without testing the hypothesis.

However, using Animal Planet (or any online poll) is not strong evidence for your argument. Firstly, people that go to animalplanet.com are likely self selected pro-animals anti-whalers. Additionally, any online poll is so open to manipulation that it says more about the visitors of the website than it does about the public. A strongly anti-whaling poll on animalplanet.com indicates that most of its visitors are anti-whaling, supporting my self selection hypothesis. It says nothing at all about the general public.

Since you asked, I believe my view is more consistent with the general public consensus because:

1) at avsforums - a website that has nothing to do with animal rights and thus probably includes a fairer representative of the public than animalplanet.com seems to agree with me.

2) at reddit.com - a website that has nothing to do with animal rights and thus probably includes a fairer representative of the public than animalplanet.com seems to agree with me.

3) my gaming clan - that has nothing to do with animal rights and thus probably includes a fairer representative of the public than animalplanet.com seems to agree with me.

Like I said, this isn't a scientific sampling. There may be biases involved in these 3 that I am not aware of. If so, please point them out.

But seeing as I have set forth my reasoning pretty clearly, and instead of addressing the merits of those points or setting forth your own points, you resort to changing the subject, name calling and attacking my credibility with unfounded claims. I doubt you will be able to rationally respond.

Hogwash, It certainly doesn't support yours! You suspect this, you suspect that. Let me know when you have some facts. I'll just sit back while you try and talk out of both sides of your mouth. Your not fooling anybody.
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post #1144 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

I'm pretty sure some of the whales species they hunt are on the extinction list now.

The Japanese hunting extinct whales is something I could fully support. Whales on the endangered list is however another matter.
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post #1145 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 04:09 PM
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Lets get back to the facts:
The goal of the Sea Shepard group is to end whaling in Antarctica. The two methods used are:
1) Make it unprofitable by blocking the fisherman from doing their job in a timely manner. This is why their whole focus is the factory ship. Each additional day that 6 Japanese boats have to spend at sea costs tens of thousands of dollars, that are taken off the profit from the whale meat.
2) Document what is going on down there for the general public from around the world to comment on. "What goes on in Antarctica, stays in Antarctica", until someone catches it on video and broadcasts it around the world.
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Originally Posted by gadianton View Post

...at avsforums - a website that has nothing to do with animal rights ...seems to agree with me.

From what I can tell, AVSforum posters regard this show more as a comedy of hapless floating idiots, than a pro OR anti-whaling platform.
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post #1146 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 04:15 PM
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IMHO, a person that wants to see NO whales killed ever is going to be more bias then ones who are not.

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post #1147 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 04:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett Adams View Post

The Japanese hunting extinct whales is something I could fully support. Whales on the endangered list is however another matter.

They really could do without hunting endangered ones honestly. I know the quota is suppose to help, but really there are others with a higher population.

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post #1148 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by WaTaGuMp View Post

They really could do without hunting endangered ones honestly. I know the quota is suppose to help, but really there are others with a higher population.

They predominately hunt minke whales which are not endangered. They usually reserve a quota on some of the endangered species, but usually one kill a few, if any.
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post #1149 of 1464 Old 08-17-2010, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by gadianton View Post

They predominately hunt minke whales which are not endangered. They usually reserve a quota on some of the endangered species, but usually one kill a few, if any.

I know Minke's are their main source, they also kill humpbacks which are listed as endangered.

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post #1150 of 1464 Old 08-18-2010, 05:17 AM
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Originally Posted by hall View Post

You asked for it.... Next season, "Whale Wars: North Sea".

Is this for real? I hope so. Guess that means Watson will become Commander in Chief? I just wish they'd use Marvin the Martian's voice for that sound blaster they have.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hall View Post

By the way, from the SS website, they say this: They say this is what allows them to do what they do. Will be interesting to see how "regulations" passed by a committee then fall under UN rules.

It will be interesting to see how motivated the UN is to enforce this:

(from wiki):New regulations from the United Nations International Maritime Organization due to take effect in July 2011 will make it illegal for the Nisshin Maru to operate below 60 degrees south but all of the Japanese pelagic whaling is done inside the area. The new rules prohibit ships using heavy oil in the Antarctic Treaty System area because of the harm a spill would cause. Furthermore, the IMO's Guidelines For Ships Operating In Ice-Covered Waters put requirements on safety and hull-strength which the Nisshin Maru does not fulfill.
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post #1151 of 1464 Old 08-18-2010, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

Is this for real? I hope so. Guess that means Watson will become Commander in Chief? I just wish they'd use Marvin the Martian's voice for that sound blaster they have.




It will be interesting to see how motivated the UN is to enforce this:

(from wiki):New regulations from the United Nations International Maritime Organization due to take effect in July 2011 will make it illegal for the Nisshin Maru to operate below 60 degrees south but all of the Japanese pelagic whaling is done inside the area. The new rules prohibit ships using heavy oil in the Antarctic Treaty System area because of the harm a spill would cause. Furthermore, the IMO's Guidelines For Ships Operating In Ice-Covered Waters put requirements on safety and hull-strength which the Nisshin Maru does not fulfill.

Correct me if I am wrong. Isn't that new regulation after the 2011 season will be over, so they wont be affected till the year after that?

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post #1152 of 1464 Old 08-18-2010, 12:07 PM
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Correct. July 2011 would be after the 2011 whaling season (1 more).
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post #1153 of 1464 Old 08-19-2010, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

Hogwash, It certainly doesn't support yours! You suspect this, you suspect that. Let me know when you have some facts. I'll just sit back while you try and talk out of both sides of your mouth. Your not fooling anybody.

You're opinion has become an AVS/Whale Wars monotonous droning. Give it a rest already.
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post #1154 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 12:37 AM
 
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Originally Posted by kabin View Post

You're opinion has become an AVS/Whale Wars monotonous droning. Give it a rest already.

You can always ignore my posts. And just because You don't agree with my view you think I should be silenced. What a joke, you must be new to discussion forums.
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post #1155 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 06:55 AM
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No, your whole argument was defeated ( see Gary's post ) so I will standby my original statement.

Not an argument, an 'observation'.
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post #1156 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

You can always ignore my posts. And just because You don't agree with my view you think I should be silenced. What a joke, you must be new to discussion forums.

I've enjoyed our discussion. I still think that SS hurt the cause more than help it. But I like opposing viewpoints as it helps inform mine.
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post #1157 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 10:09 AM
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I don't know if they help or hurt whaling...but it is FUNNY.

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post #1158 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by McDonoughDawg View Post

I don't know if they help or hurt whaling...but it is FUNNY.

Agreed. From an entertainment standpoint, it is comedy gold. As far as the "cause", who knows? They have turned a bunch of people that were against whaling into supporters of the Japanese whaling fleet - but they certainly must have added some supporters that were previously apathetic, so it could go either way. Although I suspect that among the population that is uninvolved in the "fight", the percentage of people that are pro "law and order" far exceeds those that are anti-whaling. If that's the case, they are creating more opponents than supporters.

Of course Paul Watson doesn't care as long as his wallet is getting fatter, and that certainly is happening.
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post #1159 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 10:23 AM
 
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Not an argument, an 'observation'.

And the wrong one at that!
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post #1160 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 10:25 AM
 
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I've enjoyed our discussion. I still think that SS hurt the cause more than help it. But I like opposing viewpoints as it helps inform mine.

Yes, the whole point of my counter argument!. Thank You
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post #1161 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 10:27 AM
 
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Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

Agreed. From an entertainment standpoint, it is comedy gold. As far as the "cause", who knows? They have turned a bunch of people that were against whaling into supporters of the Japanese whaling fleet - but they certainly must have added some supporters that were previously apathetic, so it could go either way. Although I suspect that among the population that is uninvolved in the "fight", the percentage of people that are pro "law and order" far exceeds those that are anti-whaling. If that's the case, they are creating more opponents than supporters.

Of course Paul Watson doesn't care as long as his wallet is getting fatter, and that certainly is happening.

Again, all speculation on your part. I just know many people that feel differently.
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post #1162 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 11:06 AM
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It's not speculation, from this board's point of view, when you can look back at hundreds of post in this thread and see many people cheering for the Japanese (I'm one of them). I just wish the Japanese would put a harpoon through the SS bow. They could say they were firing at a whale and the SS got in the way.

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post #1163 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

Again, all speculation on your part.

Did I say anything to indicate that it wasn't speculation?


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Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

I just know many people that feel differently.

I disagree, I don't think you do.

Based on the feedback from this thread with a random sample of viewers, it's easy to extrapolate a more accurate consensus than just "the people you know".

Unless you are just speculating that you know many people that feel differently.
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post #1164 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 01:46 PM
 
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Did I say anything to indicate that it wasn't speculation?




I disagree, I don't think you do.

Based on the feedback from this thread with a random sample of viewers, it's easy to extrapolate a more accurate consensus than just "the people you know".

Unless you are just speculating that you know many people that feel differently.

And if you go to the Animal Planet web site, you get the opposite. Whats more representative of the viewers of Whale wars? The thoughts you get here at AVS or the web site that actually airs the channel the show is on. I rest my case.
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post #1165 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

And if you go to the Animal Planet web site, you get the opposite. Whats more representative of the viewers of Whale wars? The thoughts you get here at AVS or the web site that actually airs the channel the show is on. I rest my case.

They've closed the forum for Whale Wars on the Animal Planet website. If it were all sunshine and rainbows for the SS'ers on that forum, why the need to close it?

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post #1166 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 02:14 PM
 
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They've closed the forum for Whale Wars on the Animal Planet website. If it were all sunshine and rainbows for the SS'ers on that forum, why the need to close it?

Because people couldn't be civilized, it only takes one or two. However the poll speaks for itself!
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post #1167 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

And if you go to the Animal Planet web site, you get the opposite. Whats more representative of the viewers of Whale wars? The thoughts you get here at AVS or the web site that actually airs the channel the show is on. I rest my case.

I hope you aren't a lawyer.

The opinions here are easily more representative of the public at large than those at Animal Planet - or the Sea Shepherd's website.
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post #1168 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 05:57 PM
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Being outside of his native echo chamber is evidently a very unusual experience for Lodef. He really does not have a good reference for what the "world" is really like beyond that chamber.

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post #1169 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 06:58 PM
 
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Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

I hope you aren't a lawyer.

The opinions here are easily more representative of the public at large than those at Animal Planet - or the Sea Shepherd's website.

One of the arguments here is that the show has hurt their cause more than helped it. I strongly disagreed and pointed to the AP website where you would get a better representation of those that actually watch the show and their views. Sure you can point out other forums of the general public that might be against them, but that opinion might be solely based on news reports or 2nd hand information and my guess is many of those folks have never even watched the show unlike most of the posters on the AP website who I'm sure have. There is the difference.
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post #1170 of 1464 Old 08-20-2010, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodef View Post

One of the arguments here is that the show has hurt their cause more than helped it. I strongly disagreed and pointed to the AP website where you would get a better representation of those that actually watch the show and their views. Sure you can point out other forums of the general public that might be against them, but that opinion might be solely based on news reports or 2nd hand information and my guess is many of those folks have never even watched the show unlike most of the posters on the AP website who I'm sure have. There is the difference.

Isn't ALL information 2nd hand since NONE of us are really there?

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