FOX HD live sports - Stutter or 24p effect - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 405 Old 09-13-2009, 10:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LL3HD View Post

I don't understand. AVS is an influential, renowned science forum with many heavy hitting professionals as members. Where's their analysis? Aren't there any insiders with some juice to get this resolved, or at least give us some concrete answers? I can't believe this thread has been kicking around all this time and we're still at square one with our stuttering heads in a FOX hole.

I worked with Motorola on the SE-3000 encoder. Has anyone captured a bitstream when this problem was apparent?

Ron

HD MPEG-2 Test Patterns http://www.w6rz.net
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post #272 of 405 Old 09-13-2009, 10:37 PM
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I have seen this problem on the Vizio sets. It would begin to stutter whenever you went from a 1080i channel to 720p. To clear it you had to switch to a 480i channel and back to 720p without going through 1080i. Clearly a bug with the Vizio.
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post #273 of 405 Old 09-14-2009, 06:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spwace View Post

I have seen this problem on the Vizio sets. It would begin to stutter whenever you went from a 1080i channel to 720p. To clear it you had to switch to a 480i channel and back to 720p without going through 1080i. Clearly a bug with the Vizio.

Thanks, I'll give that a try next time. Clearly switching between games was 1080i to 720p and the channels directly above and below my Fox channel are both 1080i.

At no point in your rambling, incoherent post were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having read it.

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post #274 of 405 Old 09-14-2009, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spwace View Post

Are those of you seeing this problem letting the cable box do the conversion to 1080i? If you are, try switching it to 720p and let the display do the conversion and let us know if that stopped the stuttering.

I have both of my SA 8300 set to Auto DVI/HDMI, so it passes either 720p or 1080i depending on the channel.
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post #275 of 405 Old 09-14-2009, 10:14 AM
 
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It seems many of you are using the 'auto' feature...I would think it would be worth a try to 'lock' the output to either 720p OR 1080i and see if the issue persists...If the issue persists in one mode then try the other...

And as an aside I will set my OTA tuner to 'auto' and see if I get the problem of stuttering...Right now I have it locked to 1080i so the tuner converts any 720p to 1080i itself...When it is set to 'auto' my TV will take whatever signal it is being fed (720p or 1080i) and convert it to 1080i...

Past this I am very limited as to any testing I can do...It would be a real PITA but I guess if needed I could connect the cable up to my tuner and check the QAM channel and see if anything happens...But I will only go thru the trouble IF it is deemed neccessary...
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post #276 of 405 Old 09-14-2009, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splicer010 View Post

It seems many of you are using the 'auto' feature...I would think it would be worth a try to 'lock' the output to either 720p OR 1080i and see if the issue persists...If the issue persists in one mode then try the other...

And as an aside I will set my OTA tuner to 'auto' and see if I get the problem of stuttering...Right now I have it locked to 1080i so the tuner converts any 720p to 1080i itself...When it is set to 'auto' my TV will take whatever signal it is being fed (720p or 1080i) and convert it to 1080i...

Past this I am very limited as to any testing I can do...It would be a real PITA but I guess if needed I could connect the cable up to my tuner and check the QAM channel and see if anything happens...But I will only go thru the trouble IF it is deemed neccessary...

Tried all settings for resolutions, doesn't change the situation at all.
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post #277 of 405 Old 09-14-2009, 10:32 AM
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Forgive me if I'm wrong, but how could this possibly be a user issue? We can't ignore the key fact that it only happens on one of their cameras. The rest look just fine, therefore the issue resides with FOX. They're processing that particular signal in a way they weren't before. Maybe they have a reason to capture that one angle in 24p?
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post #278 of 405 Old 09-14-2009, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shammes View Post

The rest look just fine, therefore the issue resides with FOX. They're processing that particular signal in a way they weren't before. Maybe they have a reason to capture that one angle in 24p?

No, the problem is in the distribution chain, not with production.
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post #279 of 405 Old 09-15-2009, 10:48 AM
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Definitely see the same thing in Austin TWC, 8300HD set top. Contacted TW but doubt will produce any meaningful response. Seems the issues is quite complex and I'm not optimistic about this getting resolved any time soon.
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post #280 of 405 Old 09-15-2009, 04:37 PM
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My reply from the local Fox affiliate in Rochester, NY:

"If it is your HD cable service it is the responsibility of Time Warner Cable. We
feed them a fibre optic signal and have no influence what they do with it. "

Though it's poor grammar, it appears he's passing the buck onto the cable company. I wrote him back and said this was unacceptable.
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post #281 of 405 Old 09-16-2009, 08:16 AM
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Just heard from the Chief Engineer of my local Fox affiliate:
Quote:


The “stuttering” problem that you are experiencing is occurring in Scientific-Atlanta HD set top boxes in use by many cable systems. There is something in the Fox live sports data stream that these boxes can’t handle, as the over the air broadcasts and cable ready TV sets do not experience these issues.

The issue is being worked by Fox and cable engineering people and we hope a solution will be available soon.

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post #282 of 405 Old 09-16-2009, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjbanks View Post

Just heard from the Chief Engineer of my local Fox affiliate:

That's pretty close, but as already noted at least some Vizio sets with internal QAM tuners have the same issue, so there is some lag between what we know and what FOX is telling local stations.

Bottom line: It's great they are working on a solution.

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post #283 of 405 Old 09-16-2009, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

That's pretty close, but as already noted at least some Vizio sets with internal QAM tuners have the same issue, so there is some lag between what we know and what FOX is telling local stations.

Bottom line: It's great they are working on a solution.

My guess is the same tuner used in SA boxes is what Vizio is using, but I could be completely wrong.

I worry that they've been working on this for a while, considering it's been happening with baseball games for almost 2 months.
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post #284 of 405 Old 09-16-2009, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

That's pretty close, but as already noted at least some Vizio sets with internal QAM tuners have the same issue, so there is some lag between what we know and what FOX is telling local stations.

Bottom line: It's great they are working on a solution.

I don't know about my Vizio's QAM tuner, but I do know it has the issue with the ATSC tuner. I emailed Vizio and they told me to do this (haven't tried it yet as there have been no live sporting events yet):
Quote:


1- Power off TV
2- Unplug TV from outlet
3- Press and hold in the power button on the TV for 30 seconds (while it is unplugged from the wall)
4- Release the power button
5- Plug in the TV into a different outlet
6- Power the TV back on


At no point in your rambling, incoherent post were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having read it.

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post #285 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 01:29 AM
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Add me as one of the people seeing this. Actually started noticing it back at the beginning of summer but this now makes football pretty much unwatchable.

KSWB Fox5 San Diego through Cox Cable, using a SA 8300HD
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post #286 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 06:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rlshky View Post

Add me as one of the people seeing this. Actually started noticing it back at the beginning of summer but this now makes football pretty much unwatchable.

KSWB Fox5 San Diego through Cox Cable, using a SA 8300HD

Me too in San Diego, (only with FOX Sports). Have the problem on one SA8300HD and two SA4240HDC boxes.
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post #287 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 06:43 AM
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I never turn my SA8300HD STB off. This morning I found that it was off and when I turned it on it was on channel 02 standard def instead of being on the last channel I was watching which is what I have it set to do. I think this means that the box was reset somehow. Is it possible that Cablevision, my provider, sent a firmware update to correct this problem? Anyone know how to check the firmware level and when it was installed?
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post #288 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 07:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithjw View Post

I never turn my SA8300HD STB off. This morning I found that it was off and when I turned it on it was on channel 02 standard def instead of being on the last channel I was watching which is what I have it set to do. I think this means that the box was reset somehow. Is it possible that Cablevision, my provider, sent a firmware update to correct this problem? Anyone know how to check the firmware level and when it was installed?

They most likely sent a software update, but I wouldn't count on it being one to solve this problem. Time Warner pushes them out all the time.
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post #289 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithjw View Post

Is it possible that Cablevision, my provider, sent a firmware update to correct this problem? Anyone know how to check the firmware level and when it was installed?

Cablevision did send a software update for the DVR last night but it was to solve a recording issue caused by the last software update. It wasn't for the FOX issue.
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post #290 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 08:08 AM
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OK. Thanks for the info. This is the first time in the year that I have had Cablevision that I can remember the box being reset. Where did you find out that there was an update for the DVR?
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post #291 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithjw View Post

I never turn my SA8300HD STB off. This morning I found that it was off and when I turned it on it was on channel 02 standard def instead of being on the last channel I was watching which is what I have it set to do. I think this means that the box was reset somehow. Is it possible that Cablevision, my provider, sent a firmware update to correct this problem? Anyone know how to check the firmware level and when it was installed?

Probably not related. Theres been box updates going on in Cablevision territory due to remote DVR scheduling. Its also possible the box just glitched and reset(happens to me sometimes)
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post #292 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 11:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithjw View Post

OK. Thanks for the info. This is the first time in the year that I have had Cablevision that I can remember the box being reset. Where did you find out that there was an update for the DVR?

Wilt told us http://tv.groups.yahoo.com/group/cab.../message/67759
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post #293 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by themistocles View Post

Me too in San Diego, (only with FOX Sports). Have the problem on one SA8300HD and two SA4240HDC boxes.

Hi, I'm in San Diego too and have this problem. I contacted an engineer at KSWB and he was not aware of it and I sense that he thinks it's something wrong with me and/or my specific setup. Please write John Weigand at JWeigand@tribune.com and let him know you're having problems too.
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post #294 of 405 Old 09-17-2009, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dopper View Post

Hi, I'm in San Diego too and have this problem. I contacted an engineer at KSWB and he was not aware of it and I sense that he thinks it's something wrong with me and/or my specific setup. Please write John Weigand at JWeigand@tribune.com and let him know you're having problems too.

Direct him to this topic.

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post #295 of 405 Old 09-18-2009, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

Direct him to this topic.


When I contacted SD TWC I included this topic - same for when I reported the issue to the main FOX feedback site.
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post #296 of 405 Old 09-18-2009, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

Direct him to this topic.

I directed him and a rep from Time Warner Cable to this thread as well as to another forum discussing this same issue.
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post #297 of 405 Old 09-18-2009, 05:54 PM
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Can you supply a link to the other forum that is discussing this problem please?
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post #298 of 405 Old 09-18-2009, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smithjw View Post

Can you supply a link to the other forum that is discussing this problem please?


http://hdtv.forsandiego.com/messages...tml?1253138665
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post #299 of 405 Old 09-18-2009, 06:19 PM
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I emailed Cox San Diego about this problem and directed him to this thread and this is his reply.

Quote:


Hello Gary,

Thank you for your email. There are currently no reported issues with Fox Sports. I'm sorry to hear that there is a problem with our cable service. This is usually caused by a weak signal to the cable box or a poor connection.

What we need you to do to try and resolve this issue, is to unscrew and then re-screw back on the connectors on the cable line where they attach to the cable box.

Unplug the cable box from the electrical supply, and turn off the TV.

One at a time, starting with the cable coming out of the wall, unscrew and re-screw on the connectors. Ensure that the cable is free of any hardware, and has no kinks or worn places on the cable itself. After you have done this, please plug back in the cable box and turn on the TV.

On the cable box display, you should see a small line chasing itself around in a circle for one or two seconds, and then the area where the time/channel normally is will go blank for 3-5 minutes. Once the time/channel comes back on, please turn the Cox receiver back on and check the reception.

If you are still having problems after doing this, we may need to send a technician out to your residence. Please reply to this email or call our 24 hour technical support line at (800) 234-3993.


We hope that we have been able to provide you with the information you requested. If we have not, or if we can be of any additional service to you, please do not hesitate to contact us again.


Sincerely,

Kenneth
Cox Communications - Video/Telephony Tech Support
Online Support Team

EDIT: BTW here's the email I sent in:

I have the SA 4240 HDC STB and am noticing a stuttering effect on the football game (Vikings/Browns) on Fox5HD (705). I've also noticed this effect on Fox's Saturday baseball games. I have bypass the STB and used my QAM tuner in my HDTV and I have no problem with the stuttering. There is a whole thread on this forum you can look at. It seems the common problem is the SA STB's.
Stutter or 24p effect http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1163878
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post #300 of 405 Old 09-18-2009, 06:44 PM
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Funny. You can bet he didn't read the link that you gave him unless he thinks that people all over the country on multiple cable providers all have loose connections!
Oh, and that the loose connection only affects live Fox sporting events in HD!
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