2012 F1 in HDTV - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:21 AM
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I guess to put it more succinctly, why would someone who ran the fastest in qualifying (which indicates he is the fastest at a particular event), become a tank on the track?
After all, the qualifying proved who had the fastest combination of driver/car.confused.gif

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Old 07-24-2012, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by oink View Post

I guess to put it more succinctly, why would someone who ran the fastest in qualifying (which indicates he is the fastest at a particular event), become a tank on the track?
After all, the qualifying proved who had the fastest combination of driver/car.confused.gif

I don't remember the qualifying rules, they change a lot, but it's more controlled now than ever pretty much. Used to be special tires, setup etc. They'd turn the turbo motors up a few hundred hp as well. They used to say guys got sickish from the exhaust fumes from the turbo cars - everyone had their own special blend of fuel, with some very nasty stuff in there smile.gif Not much relationship to the race setup - that's why they have that rule now, where you run what you brung. Also, he was involved in a lot of first lap, first turn incidents.

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Old 07-24-2012, 02:54 PM
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No Senna won a lot of poles at Mclaren as well beginning with 13 in '88.

Yeah cars were more dangerous in the '50s and '60s, but there was also a lot less competition.

Interesting story about Long Beach.

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Old 07-24-2012, 08:33 PM
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I got interested in F1 at a young age, and the local paper covered it, so I followed Clark in his last few years. To do what he did with the equipment and danger of the day means something to me. I saw Fangio drive the Mercedes at the inaugural Long Beach race. Anyone who can drive that well at that age must have been pretty good I figure smile.gif I was sitting on the front straight for the "race," about a third of the way down from the entry corner. He messed up his shifts the first lap, got a little better the next few, and by the third or fourth he was perfect from then on. I was 20, and just thrilled to be at my first (and still only) F1 race. I started to tear up as the laps wore on, it was so amazing to me to see these guys on a track in their original cars. Being a kid I was embarrassed to be crying in public like that, so I kind of sneaked a peak at the older guy, late 50s, Ferrari jacket, next to me and he was crying too smile.gif Pretty cool, little life lesson.
If the above wasn't clear, the inaugural Long Beach Grand Prix was a big deal obviously, and they had a "race" with a bunch of older F1 drivers, mostly in their original cars. It's where Gurney famously apologized to Fangio for passing him.
A lot of his poles (I'm assuming, haven't looked it up) were in the Lotus,
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Yeah cars were more dangerous in the '50s and '60s, but there was also a lot less competition.
Interesting story about Long Beach.
I first got interested in F1 in the '50s too and Fangio was my hero. Despite my regard for his skill, though, I agree that he could never have been as dominant as he was if the level of competition then had even approached what it is today. Ecriglio makes a good point that F1 racing was more dangerous in the '50s and '60s than it it today. It's still dangerous, of course, but these days it's unlikely that a shunt will kill a driver. Open wheel racing in the '50s was blood sport.. I had to take a law school final examination on Memorial Day 1955. As I was driving to the law school I listened to the Indianapolis 500 race, which was a huge deal back then, and Bill Vukovich was leading. When I came back from my final and tuned to the race again, I learned that Vukovich had been killed on Lap 57 while leading by 17 seconds. Brrrr!. I think the high probability that a driver won't be killed in a crash these days is a major factor contributing to the crazy chances many F1 drivers take almost routinely.
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Old 07-24-2012, 08:58 PM
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I I think the high probability that a driver won't be killed in a crash these days is a major factor contributing to the crazy chances many F1 drivers take almost routinely.
If it is, that's a shame.

It is totaly disrespecting the efforts of the team; the hundreds of engineers and workers etc. who build and design the cars and fix and/or replace equipment after a crash.
Think of the $$$ that must be spent...the all-nighters to get a car back on track the next day.

If I was an owner and one of my drivers did something very stupid, he would hear about it....LOUDLY.wink.gif

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Old 07-28-2012, 01:29 AM
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I don't know if anyone has been following the 20(?) Greatest Drivers Countdown on F1 Debrief.
We are down to about 8 drivers, to be revealed on later shows.
Some big names haven't come up yet: Senna, Clark, Schumacher, Alonso, Prost, Fangio.....
Anyone care to do some ranking?
Sorry, I don't have a link to the previous drivers named.
F1 Debrief named Rows 3&4 tonite, leaving (by process of elimination;)) the foursome of Senna, Clark, Schumacher, Fangio for the last 2 Rows.
OK, now that we know WHO is left to work with....please rank, in order....

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Old 07-28-2012, 06:24 PM
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After qualifying in the dry today, rain is forecast for the race tomorrow.biggrin.gif

Looking at the list of 4, my rankings:

4. Clark
3. Fangio
2. Senna
1. Schumacher

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Old 07-28-2012, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by oink View Post

After qualifying in the dry today, rain is forecast for the race tomorrow.biggrin.gif
Looking at the list of 4, my rankings:
4. Clark
3. Fangio
2. Senna
1. Schumacher

That's the order I'd have if you reversed the middle two then turned it upside down smile.gif

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Old 07-29-2012, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by fjames View Post

That's the order I'd have if you reversed the middle two then turned it upside down smile.gif
Ha!tongue.gif

For me, Schumacher's 91 wins are hard to overlook.
Senna's amazing % of poles (in the modern era) is also difficult to ignore.
OTOH, Fangio winning % is stunning....
However, Clark's % is also terrific.

Rankings are, ultimately, subjective.....I think....biggrin.gif

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Old 07-29-2012, 09:01 AM
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Clark had the best car at the time. I guess you could say Schumacher had the same advantage most years but still his domination was so great its hard to argue he's #1. I'd move Fangio up to #2 though...And then there's...

When I was at the age when cars were all a boy could think about and all my friends were getting excited about the guys driving in circles real fast I somehow heard about this british driver who'd been retired for about 10 years.Reading his exploits made him my childhood hero so that road racing was the only thing for me and I had no interest in Indy or Nascar...


Match race in equal cars, I'll take Sterling Moss.

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Old 07-29-2012, 03:18 PM
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Clark had the best car at the time. I guess you could say Schumacher had the same advantage most years but still his domination was so great its hard to argue he's #1. I'd move Fangio up to #2 though...And then there's...
It's tough to rank these guys.
MS gets my vote because the numbers are just too overwhelming, everyone below him just can't match this (in spite of everything else).

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When I was at the age when cars were all a boy could think about and all my friends were getting excited about the guys driving in circles real fast I somehow heard about this british driver who'd been retired for about 10 years.Reading his exploits made him my childhood hero so that road racing was the only thing for me and I had no interest in Indy or Nascar...
I have never have had any interest in watching "cars drive around the inside of a soup bowl (per David Hobbs wink.gif)."

F1 and ALMS (in spite of the crappy job ESPN has been doing) is all I really need.

If you get a chance to see an ALMS race, I strongly recommend it....it's great fun to watch the various classes of cars going at it.
All the cars look and sound different....a car guy's wet dream.

Many cars look like street cars the public can buy from their local dealers.
It's a kick to root for a Corvette or Porsche or whatever when a guy has one or hopes to.

I will be going to the NJ race next year.
Would love to do Austin this year, but I don't have much confidence in the event's organizers regarding logistics.
There is a good chance it could become a < enjoyable experience for fans.

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Old 07-29-2012, 08:46 PM
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I am curious why Kimi was so fast reaching Hamilotn and then couldn't get around. This is becoming a trend.

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Old 07-29-2012, 09:52 PM
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Definitely a trend, if you're near the front, near the end, do you nurse the tires home or pit late. Vettel pitted late and was making ~2 seconds a lap up.

Hamilton said he let Kimi get close mid lap, but made sure to do the last few corners well to pull ahead onto the straight. I'd guess Kimi used up his tires pretty well catching him, and Hamilton was running a pace, so was happy to see Kimi coming (knowing he'd be using up his tires.)

Sometimes tire strategy makes it interesting, but this is getting annoying to me - several times now it's just a tire maintenance race the last several laps.

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Old 07-30-2012, 12:40 AM
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Definitely a trend, if you're near the front, near the end, do you nurse the tires home or pit late. Vettel pitted late and was making ~2 seconds a lap up.
True, but he STILL couldn't pass Grosjean.

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Hamilton said he let Kimi get close mid lap, but made sure to do the last few corners well to pull ahead onto the straight. I'd guess Kimi used up his tires pretty well catching him, and Hamilton was running a pace, so was happy to see Kimi coming (knowing he'd be using up his tires.)
The track is notorious for not offering a lot of passing opportunities.

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Sometimes tire strategy makes it interesting, but this is getting annoying to me - several times now it's just a tire maintenance race the last several laps.
It's all part of the race and this year's topsy-turvy race results have been great for the fans (IMO).wink.gif

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Old 07-30-2012, 04:48 AM
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I have never have had any interest in watching "cars drive around the inside of a soup bowl (per David Hobbs wink.gif)."
F1 and ALMS (in spite of the crappy job ESPN has been doing) is all I really need.
If you get a chance to see an ALMS race, I strongly recommend it....it's great fun to watch the various classes of cars going at it.
All the cars look and sound different....a car guy's wet dream.
Many cars look like street cars the public can buy from their local dealers.
It's a kick to root for a Corvette or Porsche or whatever when a guy has one or hopes to.
I will be going to the NJ race next year.
Would love to do Austin this year, but I don't have much confidence in the event's organizers regarding logistics.
There is a good chance it could become a < enjoyable experience for fans.
Agree with you on all these points. My wife and I are regulars for ALMS at Sebring, Petit Le Mans, and Road America (13 races since 2006).

We were booked in a hotel for Austin and cancelled because we think the logistics will be a nightmare. No parking at the track for regular folks. I'll bet the waits for shuttles for the track to/from downtown are going to be long. We'll reconsider for next year. We went to the F1 race at IMS for 5 years. That was great: we were in the BMW car corral two blocks away from the track.

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Old 07-30-2012, 07:40 AM
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Agree with you on all these points. My wife and I are regulars for ALMS at Sebring, Petit Le Mans, and Road America (13 races since 2006).
We were booked in a hotel for Austin and cancelled because we think the logistics will be a nightmare. No parking at the track for regular folks. I'll bet the waits for shuttles for the track to/from downtown are going to be long. We'll reconsider for next year. We went to the F1 race at IMS for 5 years. That was great: we were in the BMW car corral two blocks away from the track.

Check out Montreal F1 race. No parking at track, but the metro gets you to and from the track in anywhere from 10 to 30 minutes, depending on your hotel location. Been going there since 1990 and this system seems to work well. We have had the same seats for several years and there are no crazy fees to buy the rights to your seats. Just request your seats "early on" after the previous race and you are set. City has great restaurants and party atmosphere.

We will also attend the New Jersey event.
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Old 07-30-2012, 07:56 AM
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Check out Montreal F1 race. No parking at track, but the metro gets you to and from the track in anywhere from 10 to 30 minutes, depending on your hotel location. Been going there since 1990 and this system seems to work well. We have had the same seats for several years and there are no crazy fees to buy the rights to your seats. Just request your seats "early on" after the previous race and you are set. City has great restaurants and party atmosphere.
We will also attend the New Jersey event.
We have considered going to Montreal, but haven't made it yet. As for driving to Canada, a higher priority is to attend Mosport for ALMS.

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Old 07-30-2012, 10:49 AM
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We were booked in a hotel for Austin and cancelled because we think the logistics will be a nightmare. No parking at the track for regular folks. I'll bet the waits for shuttles for the track to/from downtown are going to be long. We'll reconsider for next year.
I'll be watching closely as to how it all shakes out.
If they do a good job, I'll consider going next year.

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Old 08-15-2012, 01:53 PM
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For those of us who fancy themselves as having serious driving skills:
http://news.discovery.com/autos/stunt-driving-in-san-francisco-gotta-see-videos-120710.html

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Old 08-15-2012, 03:47 PM
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For those of us who fancy themselves as having serious driving skills:
http://news.discovery.com/autos/stunt-driving-in-san-francisco-gotta-see-videos-120710.html

Ken Block is an alien. All of his videos are amazing.

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Old 08-15-2012, 04:47 PM
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Must have been a Sunday morning.

BTW, is there any crazy sh^t that Travis Pastrana won't do?
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Old 08-15-2012, 05:03 PM
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Must have been a Sunday morning.
BTW, is there any crazy sh^t that Travis Pastrana won't do?
I wondered that too.

Anyway, I am HATING our annual F1 summer break.....frown.gif

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Old 08-16-2012, 02:43 AM
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Something to ease the boredom while waiting for Spa:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=60e_1345072990

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Old 08-21-2012, 08:03 AM
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Has anyone seen this video of the Red Bull Car in the Lincoln Tunnel? Cool!! I guess this is a promo for the NJ F-1 race for next year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4VPB7D54lk
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Old 08-21-2012, 11:22 AM
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Cool on board shot, I could see that being used in a movie!
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Old 08-21-2012, 01:26 PM
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Cool on board shot, I could see that being used in a movie!
+1 smile.gif

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Old 08-23-2012, 04:56 PM
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They must have recently paved the tunnel. The last time I went through it I felt like I was riding on Seabiscuit!
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Old 09-01-2012, 03:57 PM
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Front row of Jenson and Kamui.eek.gifsmile.gif

Is Kimi gonna come thru tomorrow?

Massa is done....Ferrari needs to bring in Perez or Kubica this week.

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Old 09-01-2012, 09:24 PM
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Excited for the race tomorrow. Lets go Kimi!
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Old 09-03-2012, 02:05 PM
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Another great race...too bad about all those guys becoming DNF on the first corner, but that's racing.

BTW, the instigator of the crash (Grosjean) has been banned from the next race and the 3rd driver will be brought in.

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