'Game of Thrones' on HBO HD - NO SPOILERS or Book Discussion - Page 310 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #9271 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 12:19 AM
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Originally Posted by RobertR View Post
That's why I put "legitimate" in quotes. All I'm saying is that simply being a Lannister isn't what enabled her to seize the throne. It was an important factor in having Robert marry her, but without that marriage, she simply would have had no basis for being at KL in the first place, and certainly no basis for anyone there to say "ok, we recognize you as queen".
Nobody cares who says OK or not, since they have nothing to oppose her.
It is only you who keep arguing about the fact that she married Robert and that's why she's in court in the first place. We all have moved beyond that obvious fact that includes the show creators and Cersei, why can't you?

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post #9272 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 07:58 AM
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Nobody cares who says OK or not, since they have nothing to oppose her.
A person needs more than lack of opposition to ascend to a throne. He or she needs the support of other people for the claim to have any meaning. Without that support, he's just another person.

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It is only you who keep arguing about the fact that she married Robert and that's why she's in court in the first place.
I don't argue it as a "fact". I say it's a crucial reason why she has support for her claim to the throne. You seem eager to dismiss it as having no importance.
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post #9273 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 10:22 AM
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I'm sure there are a few people left, besides Qyburn, that don't want to give their head to the mountain.

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post #9274 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 11:16 AM
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I'm still wondering who is going to be there for Danaryes to fight? The Lanister Army? (aren't they broke?). Dorne won't help Cersei, King of the North won't help her, Sir Tarly fought for the Targaryans in the Rebelion, so I doubt he's going to switch. Highgarden won't fight for Cersei.

House Bolton, Baratheon, and Frey are now pretty much gone. Not sure who is on the Lanister side anymore.


I must post and say that mourn the passing of the High Sparrow. The only just man in the kingdom, done in by Cersei's evil ways. Funny how there is no 'outrage' at the rape punishment of the Septa. shame! shame! Shame!
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post #9275 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 12:18 PM
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Right now I would say the Lannister Army, Kingsguard and possibly the Iron Islands when they find out who Danny has in her army.

"Just" is from a certain point of view. His actions were not black and white. As far as the Septa that is only speculation.


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post #9276 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 12:33 PM
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oh please, that's typical TV talk...they film in mostly warm climates- Spain, Morocco, etc...no matter what time of year they film it's not going to be freezing cold there...they used to film in Iceland but stopped a season ago...they're just looking for excuses to delay the show to fit into the shortened 13 episodes remaining...I'm hoping they film both seasons back-to-back and either air them straight or break them up into shorter seasons but with less of a wait until the final season
Not true. They film with different crews simultaneously in multiple locations. One of them being Northern Ireland. It makes sense to do it later in the year now.
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post #9277 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 12:51 PM
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Not true. They film with different crews simultaneously in multiple locations. One of them being Northern Ireland. It makes sense to do it later in the year now.

Northern Ireland is mainly for the indoor sets...Spain is their main hub of operations for the past year...and into Season 7 from what I'm hearing...even if it was Ireland they normally start shooting in July, so waiting a few weeks or a month wouldn't really cause a major change in the weather (or season)...they would need to wait 3+ months for that...
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post #9278 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by RobertR View Post
A person needs more than lack of opposition to ascend to a throne. He or she needs the support of other people for the claim to have any meaning. Without that support, he's just another person.
She has plenty of support, she's part of the most powerful family in Westeros. Haven't you heard?


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I don't argue it as a "fact". I say it's a crucial reason why she has support for her claim to the throne. You seem eager to dismiss it as having no importance.
Not a whole lot, not from her POV.

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post #9279 of 9355 Old 07-07-2016, 04:22 PM
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She has plenty of support, she's part of the most powerful family in Westeros.
You keep trying to omit the other half of the equation. She's a Lannister AND her marriage to Robert gave her an "in" to the throne. As I said, if she had been hanging out at Casterly Rock all this time, and showed up with no army and said "crown me queen", she'd be laughed at.

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Not a whole lot, not from her POV.
Again, you cling to this notion that nothing anyone else thinks matters. In the scene where Jon was proclaimed King of the North, it was because those present agreed that he is. If they hadn't, his viewpoint would have meant nothing.
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post #9280 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 04:16 AM
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I'm still wondering who is going to be there for Danaryes to fight? The Lanister Army? (aren't they broke?). Dorne won't help Cersei, King of the North won't help her, Sir Tarly fought for the Targaryans in the Rebelion, so I doubt he's going to switch. Highgarden won't fight for Cersei.

House Bolton, Baratheon, and Frey are now pretty much gone. Not sure who is on the Lanister side anymore.


I must post and say that mourn the passing of the High Sparrow. The only just man in the kingdom, done in by Cersei's evil ways. Funny how there is no 'outrage' at the rape punishment of the Septa. shame! shame! Shame!
Since the size of Dany's army is massive and looks unstoppable something must happen. She probably is convinced to go to the Iron Islands first so they can reclaim and then while there something happens with the white walkers and she goes there, etc. If she went right to kings landing, she is going to win and take the throne in one episode so she has to get side tracked somehow.

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post #9281 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 05:43 AM
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Since the size of Dany's army is massive and looks unstoppable something must happen. She probably is convinced to go to the Iron Islands first so they can reclaim and then while there something happens with the white walkers and she goes there, etc. If she went right to kings landing, she is going to win and take the throne in one episode so she has to get side tracked somehow.

I think Dany will go to Dorne first...hang out a bit...then somehow find and marry Jon...then in the final 2 episodes of Season 7 she will attack King's Landing...Cersei will attempt to use the remaining wildfire caches around the city (same thing Mad King Aerys tried to do), forcing Jamie to kill her...Dany will then fulfill her destiny of reclaiming the Iron Throne...she's won the game of thrones!...but...the ending of Season 7 will see the Night's King destroying The Wall and the same way Season 6 ended with a wide shot of Dany and her massive army headed to Westeros, the final shot of Season 7 will be a wide shot of the Night's King, white walkers and his massive army of the undead ready to unleash hell on everybody in their path
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post #9282 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 07:01 AM
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Originally Posted by TitusTroy View Post
I think Dany will go to Dorne first...hang out a bit...then somehow find and marry Jon...then in the final 2 episodes of Season 7 she will attack King's Landing...Cersei will attempt to use the remaining wildfire caches around the city (same thing Mad King Aerys tried to do), forcing Jamie to kill her...Dany will then fulfill her destiny of reclaiming the Iron Throne...she's won the game of thrones!...but...the ending of Season 7 will see the Night's King destroying The Wall and the same way Season 6 ended with a wide shot of Dany and her massive army headed to Westeros, the final shot of Season 7 will be a wide shot of the Night's King, white walkers and his massive army of the undead ready to unleash hell on everybody in their path
Good synopsis, but I'd still like to see Cersei try to use wildfire on Dany to no effect. :-) The final season would have the apocalyptic showdown with Dany and Jon and the dragons vs. the WW. The Song of Ice and Fire.
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post #9283 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by TitusTroy View Post
I think Dany will go to Dorne first...hang out a bit...then somehow find and marry Jon...then in the final 2 episodes of Season 7 she will attack King's Landing...Cersei will attempt to use the remaining wildfire caches around the city (same thing Mad King Aerys tried to do), forcing Jamie to kill her...Dany will then fulfill her destiny of reclaiming the Iron Throne...she's won the game of thrones!...but...the ending of Season 7 will see the Night's King destroying The Wall and the same way Season 6 ended with a wide shot of Dany and her massive army headed to Westeros, the final shot of Season 7 will be a wide shot of the Night's King, white walkers and his massive army of the undead ready to unleash hell on everybody in their path
From a logistical standpoint, in my mind, Dany's fleet has already reached the Westeros Coast at the end of the show. There were ships from House Tyrell and Martel in that final shot if you look at the banners. It wouldn't make sense for them to sail all the way from Westeros (where they already are) to Slaver's Bay in Essos, meet Dany's fleet, then sail back to Westeros. What would be the point?

It makes much more sense for Dany's fleet to head West to meet the Tyrell and Martel ships close to Westeros.
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post #9284 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 08:21 AM
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Maybe Dany isn't immune to wildfire. That stuff looks nasty.
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post #9285 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 08:44 AM
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I think Dany will go to Dorne first...hang out a bit...then somehow find and marry Jon...then in the final 2 episodes of Season 7 she will attack King's Landing...Cersei will attempt to use the remaining wildfire caches around the city (same thing Mad King Aerys tried to do), forcing Jamie to kill her...Dany will then fulfill her destiny of reclaiming the Iron Throne...she's won the game of thrones!...but...the ending of Season 7 will see the Night's King destroying The Wall and the same way Season 6 ended with a wide shot of Dany and her massive army headed to Westeros, the final shot of Season 7 will be a wide shot of the Night's King, white walkers and his massive army of the undead ready to unleash hell on everybody in their path
I like this one a lot. Makes sense to. Not sure if it is "bittersweet" enough though. Martin has said he loves the Lord of the Rings because of its bittersweet ending and he was going to do the same thing. No idea what that can be but it leaves a LOT of possibilities.
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post #9286 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 09:20 AM
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Yes, but instead of sending all the magic creatures seaworthy, they will all die horrible deaths.

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post #9287 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 11:51 AM
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I like this one a lot. Makes sense to. Not sure if it is "bittersweet" enough though. Martin has said he loves the Lord of the Rings because of its bittersweet ending and he was going to do the same thing. No idea what that can be but it leaves a LOT of possibilities.

there's still 1 more season left after Season 7 so the bittersweet ending will be in the final season...I don't think the series will end as neatly as everyone seems to think with Dany and Jon defeating the White Walkers...the showrunners mentioned that there is 1 final surprising twist that GRRM outlined to them but that is at the very end
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post #9288 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:17 PM
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there's still 1 more season left after Season 7 so the bittersweet ending will be in the final season...I don't think the series will end as neatly as everyone seems to think with Dany and Jon defeating the White Walkers...the showrunners mentioned that there is 1 final surprising twist that GRRM outlined to them but that is at the very end
I don't consider a split season of 13 episodes two seasons .. to me, it smells like a ploy by HBO to milk it for all it's worth .. and spend the least money to do it .. the "weather delay" plays right into that ..


Film the 13 Episodes .. which I am sure will film concurrently .. then, air the 13 episodes and be done with it ..
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post #9289 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:22 PM
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I don't consider a split season of 13 episodes two seasons .. to me, it smells like a ploy by HBO to milk it for all it's worth .. and spend the least money to do it .. the "weather delay" plays right into that ..


Film the 13 Episodes .. which I am sure will film concurrently .. then, air the 13 episodes and be done with it ..
That would most likely lead to lesser quality episodes.

I'd rather they split the seasons, spend more money per episode, and make a higher quality show. I have to think that budget is about 99.9995% of the reason to split it into 2 seasons.
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post #9290 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:23 PM
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I don't consider a split season of 13 episodes two seasons .. to me, it smells like a ploy by HBO to milk it for all it's worth .. and spend the least money to do it .. the "weather delay" plays right into that ..

Film the 13 Episodes .. which I am sure will film concurrently .. then, air the 13 episodes and be done with it ..

this is HBO's biggest hit ever so it's understandable that they want to delay the end for as long as possible...I hate shortened split seasons as well...I hated it when Breaking Bad and The Sopranos did it but I guess it's now the popular thing to do...with movies also ever since Harry Potter split the final film into 2 parts...now everyone is doing it- Divergent, Hunger Games etc
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post #9291 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:24 PM
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there's still 1 more season left after Season 7 so the bittersweet ending will be in the final season...I don't think the series will end as neatly as everyone seems to think with Dany and Jon defeating the White Walkers...the showrunners mentioned that there is 1 final surprising twist that GRRM outlined to them but that is at the very end
I think Jon will kill Dany, and not because he wants to, but because he needs to. And she will willingly sacrifice herself.

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post #9292 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:34 PM
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That would most likely lead to lesser quality episodes.

I'd rather they split the seasons, spend more money per episode, and make a higher quality show. I have to think that budget is about 99.9995% of the reason to split it into 2 seasons.
B&W are going to film the 13 episodes concurrently .. I'd lay money on that .. it's not even a season and a half .. and, they know what the budget is .. I just feel it's BS to call it two seasons .. it was originally seven seasons .. add three episodes and call it eight ..
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post #9293 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:43 PM
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B&W are going to film the 13 episodes concurrently .. I'd lay money on that .. it's not even a season and a half .. and, they know what the budget is .. I just feel it's BS to call it two seasons .. it was originally seven seasons .. add three episodes and call it eight ..

I don't think they're going to call it 8 seasons...I think it'll be 7 seasons split up into 2 parts...same way Breaking Bad was 5 seasons even though the show ran for 6 years...the showrunners have long talked about how perfect it would be to end the show after 7 seasons- Seven Kingdoms, Seven Gods, Seven Books...7 is the number that fits perfectly with the overall theme of the show (and books)
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B&W are going to film the 13 episodes concurrently .. I'd lay money on that .. it's not even a season and a half .. and, they know what the budget is .. I just feel it's BS to call it two seasons .. it was originally seven seasons .. add three episodes and call it eight ..
They know what the budget is...but it is almost assuredly higher based on being for 2 seasons and not one. Two seasons = Two Seasons worth of budget.

That means a greater allocation of $ per episode.

If they did it all as one season, they'd have less budget and would have to cut more corners.
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post #9295 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 12:53 PM
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They know what the budget is...but it is almost assuredly higher based on being for 2 seasons and not one. Two seasons = Two Seasons worth of budget.

That means a greater allocation of $ per episode.

If they did it all as one season, they'd have less budget and would have to cut more corners.
Or, the budget is a per episode allocation, thus explaining why more resources get devoted to some episodes .. the numbers I saw were $10 million per episode ..


http://www.forbes.com/sites/hayleycu.../#6dd171d14b22
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post #9296 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 01:18 PM
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Or, the budget is a per episode allocation, thus explaining why more resources get devoted to some episodes .. the numbers I saw were $10 million per episode ..


http://www.forbes.com/sites/hayleycu.../#6dd171d14b22
Obviously each episode is going to have it's own budget, but they all have to fit into an overall budget for the entire season.

The battle of the bastards clearly cost more than other episodes. If every episode called for everything that episode did, their season budget would be much higher...or they'd have to have fewer episodes.
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post #9297 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 01:33 PM
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Obviously each episode is going to have it's own budget, but they all have to fit into an overall budget for the entire season.

The battle of the bastards clearly cost more than other episodes. If every episode called for everything that episode did, their season budget would be much higher...or they'd have to have fewer episodes.
Which is why I used the word "allocation" .. showrunners generally have discretionary choice ..

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post #9298 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 01:45 PM
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I don't believe for a second that HBO or the showrunners are trying to go cheap and lower the budget in any way...the budget for the show has gone up every season and they know that the final '2' seasons are going to be crazy expensive so any way they split up the final episodes will just be a way of maximizing the resources while also trying to keep the show somewhat within a certain budget...they're probably also going to need longer to render the visual effects as this is close to feature film quality...I can't even imagine how they're going to pull off the final White Walker battle...it'll probably span multiple episodes and look insane on TV
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post #9299 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by TitusTroy View Post
I don't believe for a second that HBO or the showrunners are trying to go cheap and lower the budget in any way...the budget for the show has gone up every season
Who said anything about lowering the budget .. ??

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post #9300 of 9355 Old 07-08-2016, 02:17 PM
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I don't believe for a second that HBO or the showrunners are trying to go cheap and lower the budget in any way...the budget for the show has gone up every season and they know that the final '2' seasons are going to be crazy expensive so any way they split up the final episodes will just be a way of maximizing the resources while also trying to keep the show somewhat within a certain budget...they're probably also going to need longer to render the visual effects as this is close to feature film quality...I can't even imagine how they're going to pull off the final White Walker battle...it'll probably span multiple episodes and look insane on TV
Yeah, physically shooting all 13 episodes back to back is one thing, but then they have to go into post production and edit, score, add VFX etc. etc.

If - based on what we expect to happen - the final episodes have more complex production timelines because of all the onscreen dragon zombie carnage, then they will probably still be working on season 8 in post as season 7 is airing. Sure, they could film all the episodes and wait for post to complete but then it would probably be 2018 before the show hits the screen.

If the choice is a fully finished "season 7" with less episodes airing next year, or a longer single season airing in 2018, I'll take the former.
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