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post #1171 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by scowl View Post

Get ready to start laughing.
Jonathan Pollard was sentenced to life in prison after being convicted for passing classified information he collected as a civilian analyst to Israel.
Defense Department analyst Lawrence A. Franklin was sentenced to twelve years in jail for passing classified military information onto an Israeli diplomat and pro-Israeli lobbyists.

ok you have a point wink.gif

But in the context of the series, I still see no reason for Saul to be a traitor.
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post #1172 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 11:36 AM
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ok you have a point wink.gif
But in the context of the series, I still see no reason for Saul to be a traitor.

Wouldnt taht be the perfect cover though? We havent been given a reason, which is why hes able to operate so well.....Im not saying he is, just thinking "tv land" style for now......while people may not WANT him to be one, I can see it causing a large stir if he turns out to be one.....
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post #1173 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 11:58 AM
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All I know is if Saul get's killed off in the show like Estes, the show is cooked imo. His character and Mandy Patinkin's acting saves the poor episodes and is the cherry on top of the great ones.

 

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post #1174 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

But in the context of the series, I still see no reason for Saul to be a traitor.

Why are you trying to reason with this series? Patinkin has a habit of quitting series. People are surprised he's coming back next season. The writers probably wrote his final episode last season and are working the plot around it for when he leaves the show. Saul being an agent for Mossad would be a dramatic exit for him, as good as anything on 24.

Remember, this is a series in which the Director of the CIA plotted to have a U.S. Congressman assassinated, and a terrorist assassinated the Vice President by remote control leaving no evidence. The outlandish nature of the writing has convinced me that anything is possible next season. Maybe Saul will pull off a Mission Impossible mask and we'll discover he had been an Arabic terrorist the whole time.

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post #1175 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scowl View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

Remember, this is a series in which the Director of the CIA plotted to have a U.S. Congressman assassinated, and a terrorist assassinated the Vice President by remote control leaving no evidence. The outlandish nature of the writing has convinced me that anything is possible next season. Maybe Saul will pull off a Mission Impossible mask and we'll discover he had been an Arabic terrorist the whole time.

If you are referring to Estes he was the director of the Counterterrorist Center at the CIA, not the DCI. Walden was a former DCI but he would not have been involved in an assassination of his VP running mate.
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post #1176 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 06:48 PM
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Despite how much more than its fair share of preposterousness Homeland contains, I still can't see the writers making Saul, who has been the moral compass of his organization and the show, into a traitor. We all realize this is television so anything can happen but come on.smile.gif
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post #1177 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by HD Hockey Guy View Post

All I know is if Saul get's killed off in the show like Estes, the show is cooked imo. His character and Mandy Patinkin's acting saves the poor episodes and is the cherry on top of the great ones.


Very well put, and I agree.

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post #1178 of 1775 Old 12-20-2012, 10:29 PM
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One thing that caught my attention in the finale's final scene was when Carrie called Saul's name as he was saying prayers for the dead. The first time she calls his name, it appeared to me as if Saul instantly recognized her voice, paused for a split second but then continued to recite the prayers. Then Carrie calls his name again, and now Saul shows a wry smile and turns around to see Carrie.

One possibility was that Saul considered Brody and Carrie died in the attack, with suspicions of Brody's role as the would be assassin raised when the CIA official says that explosion was caused by Brody's car. Saul might have considered Brody was guilty, while Carrie might have been an unfortunate collateral damage in the blast. When he heard Carrie's voice calling him, it appears as if Saul's mind was racing through analyzing the possibilities of Brody triggering the blast and Carrie helping him escape, out of her love and "misguided trust" in Brody.

When these thoughts raced through Saul's mind, he might have continued to say prayers, presumably implying "now you are dead for me, Carrie". When she called out his name again, he turned around to look at her with that sympathetic look of a paternal figure looking down upon a mischievous, troubled child, as if he was saying "you silly girl !! I warned you about Brody, and now have you helped him escape from the scene of the blast?? You've left me no option but to take you down!"

Next season could see Saul throwing Carrie in the brig for aiding Brody carry out and/or escape after a terrorist attack. He could go after finding Brody and the new terrorist leader who turned up on TV, allegedly claiming responsibility for the attack. We could see Carrie bare her soul to Saul in interrogation scenes, explaining to him how Brody couldn't have caused the attack. We could see a couple of sessions like this, and finally Saul comes around to agree with her, and launches efforts to get in touch with Brody in hiding, potentially to once again work together to take down the new terrorist leader."

How about that for a theory based on the split second pause (that I perceived) in Saul's prayers, and in turning around to face Carrie in the final scene of this season!! smile.gif
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post #1179 of 1775 Old 12-21-2012, 06:02 AM
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Originally Posted by raaj View Post

One thing that caught my attention in the finale's final scene was when Carrie called Saul's name as he was saying prayers for the dead. The first time she calls his name, it appeared to me as if Saul instantly recognized her voice, paused for a split second but then continued to recite the prayers. Then Carrie calls his name again, and now Saul shows a wry smile and turns around to see Carrie.
 

I had the impression that Saul thought it was in his head and he didn't believe that he actually heard her until the second time Carrie calls out to him.  

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post #1180 of 1775 Old 12-21-2012, 07:06 AM
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'Homeland' star Claire Danes gives birth to first child

Wow, they sure filmed around this very well. Congrats to her!
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post #1181 of 1775 Old 12-21-2012, 10:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raaj View Post

One thing that caught my attention in the finale's final scene was when Carrie called Saul's name as he was saying prayers for the dead. The first time she calls his name, it appeared to me as if Saul instantly recognized her voice, paused for a split second but then continued to recite the prayers. Then Carrie calls his name again, and now Saul shows a wry smile and turns around to see Carrie.
One possibility was that Saul considered Brody and Carrie died in the attack, with suspicions of Brody's role as the would be assassin raised when the CIA official says that explosion was caused by Brody's car. Saul might have considered Brody was guilty, while Carrie might have been an unfortunate collateral damage in the blast. When he heard Carrie's voice calling him, it appears as if Saul's mind was racing through analyzing the possibilities of Brody triggering the blast and Carrie helping him escape, out of her love and "misguided trust" in Brody.
When these thoughts raced through Saul's mind, he might have continued to say prayers, presumably implying "now you are dead for me, Carrie". When she called out his name again, he turned around to look at her with that sympathetic look of a paternal figure looking down upon a mischievous, troubled child, as if he was saying "you silly girl !! I warned you about Brody, and now have you helped him escape from the scene of the blast?? You've left me no option but to take you down!"
Next season could see Saul throwing Carrie in the brig for aiding Brody carry out and/or escape after a terrorist attack. He could go after finding Brody and the new terrorist leader who turned up on TV, allegedly claiming responsibility for the attack. We could see Carrie bare her soul to Saul in interrogation scenes, explaining to him how Brody couldn't have caused the attack. We could see a couple of sessions like this, and finally Saul comes around to agree with her, and launches efforts to get in touch with Brody in hiding, potentially to once again work together to take down the new terrorist leader."
How about that for a theory based on the split second pause (that I perceived) in Saul's prayers, and in turning around to face Carrie in the final scene of this season!! smile.gif


I don't know-I thought Saul at least suspected she had run off with Brody.He had earlier told her she had to choose between the CIA or Brody. Since he had chosen his carreer over his own wife he thought she would do the same. He had begun to think he was wrong about that until she reappeared. The smirk was because her reappearance proved him right, showing he knows Carrie pretty well.

"There is no truth. There's just what you believe."
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post #1182 of 1775 Old 12-21-2012, 02:35 PM
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I had the impression that Saul thought it was in his head and he didn't believe that he actually heard her until the second time Carrie calls out to him.  

That's exactly what I had assumed.
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post #1183 of 1775 Old 12-21-2012, 02:39 PM
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I don't know-I thought Saul at least suspected she had run off with Brody.He had earlier told her she had to choose between the CIA or Brody. Since he had chosen his carreer over his own wife he thought she would do the same. He had begun to think he was wrong about that until she reappeared. The smirk was because her reappearance proved him right, showing he knows Carrie pretty well.

I'm not sure if you mean he suspected she ran off with Brody, and missed the funeral, or they were there for the bombing and left. Because I think it was established by the CIA that they were there.

I took his reaction as one of disbelief and overwhelming joy. I wonder what his reaction will be when he realizes she left the scene to help Brody. I don't think Carrie will even try and pretend there was some other reason she disappeared for a couple of day.
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post #1184 of 1775 Old 12-21-2012, 04:28 PM
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I wonder what his reaction will be when he realizes she left the scene to help Brody.

Well he'll probably be pissed for a little while wink.gif but I'm also sure he will find out pretty soon that Carrie was right and Brody didn't do it. For now I see season 3 centered on Carrie and Saul, investigating the attack and trying to find the people behind it, and the mole(s)... Brody might have a more restraint role though I would prefer not to to be honest. I like Damian Lewis and his character.
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post #1185 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 08:11 AM
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I don't know-I thought Saul at least suspected she had run off with Brody.He had earlier told her she had to choose between the CIA or Brody. Since he had chosen his carreer over his own wife he thought she would do the same. He had begun to think he was wrong about that until she reappeared. The smirk was because her reappearance proved him right, showing he knows Carrie pretty well.

I'm not sure if you mean he suspected she ran off with Brody, and missed the funeral, or they were there for the bombing and left. Because I think it was established by the CIA that they were there.

I took his reaction as one of disbelief and overwhelming joy. I wonder what his reaction will be when he realizes she left the scene to help Brody. I don't think Carrie will even try and pretend there was some other reason she disappeared for a couple of day.

RE: Saul's reaction. I thought so too, but because he assumed she (and Brody) had been killed in the blast.
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post #1186 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 09:54 AM
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I thought Saul's reaction to seeing Carrie was first shock, and then delight, that she had not been killed in the CIA bombing as Saul had originally thought.
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post #1187 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 10:38 AM
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Biggest plot hole of the finale IMO ...

How did Carrie and Brody get away in her car from the CIA headquarters without anyone seeing? It has to be assumed that her car was parked either in the lot with all of the rest of the funeral attendees or in whatever lot she would normally park in as an employee. Either way, once the explosion occurred, the whole place would have gone on immediate lockdown (which it already is on anyway with security managing in/out).

So we are just supposed to accept that somehow in all the confusion both Carrie and Brody left in HER car, either without being seen at all, or being seen and no one later recalling that the supposed-terrorist Brody (as seen on TV) was with her in her car.
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post #1188 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 11:49 AM
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What about Saul's inability to take a lie detector test regarding the suicide by razor blade from the first season? He created a nervousness bordering on phobia to taking the test. What better way of not having a lie detector test trip you up. I would not be surprised if Saul turns out to be bad. Things really no longer have to make logical sense in the show.
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post #1189 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 02:09 PM
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What about Saul's inability to take a lie detector test regarding the suicide by razor blade from the first season? He created a nervousness bordering on phobia to taking the test. What better way of not having a lie detector test trip you up. I would not be surprised if Saul turns out to be bad. Things really no longer have to make logical sense in the show.

Or he could be nervous about the test, knowing that it hasn't been scientifically proven to work. Thus, they could get any type of result from testing him, and he'd be considered guilty.
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post #1190 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 02:19 PM
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The CIA in lock down is like Jack Bauer's CTU lock down. Secure the perimeter means someone always gets out ..smile.gif

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post #1191 of 1775 Old 12-22-2012, 09:27 PM
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Biggest plot hole of the finale IMO ...
How did Carrie and Brody get away in her car from the CIA headquarters without anyone seeing? It has to be assumed that her car was parked either in the lot with all of the rest of the funeral attendees or in whatever lot she would normally park in as an employee. Either way, once the explosion occurred, the whole place would have gone on immediate lockdown (which it already is on anyway with security managing in/out).
So we are just supposed to accept that somehow in all the confusion both Carrie and Brody left in HER car, either without being seen at all, or being seen and no one later recalling that the supposed-terrorist Brody (as seen on TV) was with her in her car.

The prodicers mentioned this in thier interview, the 1st response unit took a little while to get there, while thier exit was almost immediate...I am sure there is tape of them leaving, but at the time they are a Congressman and a CIA agent, there are a few ways they could spin that for TV world sake..Basically yes thats what it came down to, they left in the lapse between the attack and 1st responders getting to the scene to lock everything down......Take a look at the interview that was posted a page or two back, it may give you some of the answers you are looking for (you may not like them, but there are answers).
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post #1192 of 1775 Old 12-27-2012, 06:23 AM
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'Homeland' star Claire Danes gives birth to first child
Wow, they sure filmed around this very well. Congrats to her!

We know that baby has the gene for some dramatic crying... good luck to her. tongue.gif
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post #1193 of 1775 Old 02-02-2013, 08:13 PM
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I finally caught up.

I think Brody did not know anything about the bombing. Saul is not a mole. Everything we've seen shows Saul is a stand-up guy. It'd be a total and arbitrary betrayal of his character to make him responsible for the bombing.

I can't believe that Carrie would help Brody run RIGHT THEN. Really? Seems the sensible thing to do was stay and try to explain, eg, why would he use his own car, etc. Of course the video coming out made it look like the smart decision retroactively, but at the time, it did not make sense. Now she has to explain where she's been.

A small detail, but why did Saul decide to investigate Quinn? What tipped him off?
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post #1194 of 1775 Old 02-03-2013, 01:11 PM
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I finally caught up.

I think Brody did not know anything about the bombing. Saul is not a mole. Everything we've seen shows Saul is a stand-up guy. It'd be a total and arbitrary betrayal of his character to make him responsible for the bombing.

I can't believe that Carrie would help Brody run RIGHT THEN. Really? Seems the sensible thing to do was stay and try to explain, eg, why would he use his own car, etc. Of course the video coming out made it look like the smart decision retroactively, but at the time, it did not make sense. Now she has to explain where she's been.

A small detail, but why did Saul decide to investigate Quinn? What tipped him off?

He was curious about Quinn since he was introduced as "Este's" man.....They were not given any information on him and saul wanted to know who he was and what he was doing as part of "thier" team.....The more he looked the more things he found.....
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post #1195 of 1775 Old 02-04-2013, 05:13 PM
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post #1196 of 1775 Old 02-04-2013, 05:47 PM - Thread Starter
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wow, that's hot eek.gif

Thanks for the posting.
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post #1197 of 1775 Old 02-04-2013, 07:38 PM
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Mrs. Brody wants to be a "Bond Girl". eek.gif

http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/morena-baccarin-life-homeland-article-1.1255007

I would have thought Morena Baccarin a good choice to be a Bond girl even before I saw the luscious photos of her included in the link. The pictures though sealed the deal for me.smile.gif
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I would have thought Morena Baccarin a good choice to be a Bond girl even before I saw the luscious photos of her included in the link. The pictures though sealed the deal for me.smile.gif


And a good choice for my future ex-wife!

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post #1199 of 1775 Old 03-22-2013, 05:44 AM - Thread Starter
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From the HOTP thread at the top of the HDTV Programming forum page

Obituary
'Homeland' Writer-Producer Henry Bromell Dies of Heart Attack
By Lacey Rose, The Hollywood Reporter - Mar. 19, 2013

Homeland executive producer Henry Bromell has died of a heart of attack.

The acclaimed writer/producer had been part of the Emmy-winning drama’s six-member writing staff since its first season. In addition to a rich resume, which includes Northern Exposure, Homicide: Life on a Street, Chicago Hope, Rubicon and Showtime’s Brotherhood, Bromell, 66, brought with him personal experience as his father had worked for the CIA.

"We were lucky to work with Henry on and off for the past 18 years. He was a supremely talented writer and as kind and warm a person as you could ever meet. He will be deeply missed at the studio and on Homeland. Our hearts and prayers go out to his wife and children," studio Twentieth Century Fox TV and Fox 21 said in a statement Tuesday morning.
In recent months, Bromell had been particularly involved in luring new staff members to the Homeland’s writers room ahead of the show’s third season. Among the hires: James Yoshimura, who had worked with Bromell years earlier on Homicide.

Like much of the Showtime drama’s pedigreed staff, he had been blown away with the show’s breakout success, which included a string of award show acclaim for the series as well as its cast.

“When we were writing the first season, we had no idea this would hit the zeitgeist. We were trying to write a really good television show. The last time this happened to me was on Northern Exposure. First it was the reviews, and then it was President Obama is watching. It’s cool, but then it’s, ‘Oh god, now we’re going to let everyone down,’” he told The Hollywood Reporter during a 2012 set visit for the fifth episode of the Emmy-winning drama’s second season, which Bromell had written.

He noted at the time that his “secret fantasy” was that the episode would win star Damian Lewis an Emmy.

Bromell is survived by his wife, Sarah, and two sons.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/homeland-writer-producer-henry-bromell-429701
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post #1200 of 1775 Old 03-22-2013, 07:52 AM
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From the HOTP thread at the top of the HDTV Programming forum page

Obituary
'Homeland' Writer-Producer Henry Bromell Dies of Heart Attack
By Lacey Rose, The Hollywood Reporter
What a shame- he was 65!
Condolences to his family....

"I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure...."

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