2012 IndyCar Series on ABC and NBCSN - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 03-25-2012, 11:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Honda Grand Prix Of St. Petersburg
WABC-DT FiOS TV NYC

I guess ESPN can't make abc letterbox their SD feed like FOX so we are stuck with formatting for 4:3.
PQ is much better then NASCAR FOX (WNYW-DT) even with WABC having an HD and SD sub channel.
Some cameras do have some edge enhancement.
The top of the screen graphics are the same as with NASCAR but at least the bottom line is off.
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post #2 of 24 Old 03-25-2012, 01:53 PM
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Any ESPN on ABC programming is always going to be framed in 4:3 safe mode since a lot of their affiliate stations don't have theequipment to do what Fox did by presenting everything in 16:9/letterbox format.

And the FOUL!
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post #3 of 24 Old 03-26-2012, 06:52 PM
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Three car races on Sunday and no big wrecks! Never thought I would see that happening.

On much of the St. Petersburg course it's hard to keep track of the cars.

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post #4 of 24 Old 03-26-2012, 08:21 PM
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Sorry, I tried watching the race, but ended up leaving it on as background filler. The car needs a beauty makeover. Also, now I can't help but look at Indycars as no better than a AAA league to F1 and Nascar. I will watch Indy, but I won't make it a point to watch the other races.

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post #5 of 24 Old 03-27-2012, 04:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Wellman View Post

Any ESPN on ABC programming is always going to be framed in 4:3 safe mode since a lot of their affiliate stations don't have theequipment to do what Fox did by presenting everything in 16:9/letterbox format.

Well, not "always", but it is going to be some time.

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post #6 of 24 Old 03-27-2012, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

Sorry, I tried watching the race, but ended up leaving it on as background filler. The car needs a beauty makeover. Also, now I can't help but look at Indycars as no better than a AAA league to F1 and Nascar. I will watch Indy, but I won't make it a point to watch the other races.

The cars just had a makeover... for safety, not beauty. With the speeds they reach, especially on ovals, they had to do something.

Comparing IndyCars to a AAA League is sacrilegious. F1 couldn't cut it and NASCAR is great, but its crowds are down also.
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post #7 of 24 Old 03-27-2012, 11:14 AM
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I thought the new car was developed, because it had been TEN years with the last one. Also, they wanted to move to a new engine. There is no reason an elegant looking car can't be safe.

As for the second part of your reply, Indycars is probably more of 1A league. Not AAA, but definitely not on the level of F1 or Nascar. Is there any Indy driver that would be even remotely competitive in either series. Maybe Dario or Will could be bumping on the top fifteen in competitive equipment in Nascar. I can't see any of the drivers being no better than a back marker in F1.

I am guessing when you say F1 couldn't cut it you are talking about Indy. If so, then there lies the problem with this series. It is all about one race. Heck, the series is even named after the race. That is fine, if that is what you are trying to achieve. It just doesn't create interest in the rest of the races.

Look at the end of the day, you aren't going to change my mind and I am probably not going to change your mind (especially after seeing your screen name). One parting thought on the car though is that it seems like a lot of Robin Miller's readers agree with me.

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post #8 of 24 Old 03-27-2012, 11:54 AM
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In Indy's defense, if there's a car that REALLY needs a beauty makeover it's F1. Those are currently the ugliest monstrosities of all, with goofy looking wings and protuberances sticking out all over them. Even the shape of the tub is angular and blocky and very unpleasing to the eye.

For me, the only cars that still look good are IMSA GTP cars. And even some of those are looking ugly these days.
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post #9 of 24 Old 03-27-2012, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

I thought the new car was developed, because it had been TEN years with the last one. Also, they wanted to move to a new engine. There is no reason an elegant looking car can't be safe.

As for the second part of your reply, Indycars is probably more of 1A league. Not AAA, but definitely not on the level of F1 or Nascar. Is there any Indy driver that would be even remotely competitive in either series. Maybe Dario or Will could be bumping on the top fifteen in competitive equipment in Nascar. I can't see any of the drivers being no better than a back marker in F1.

I am guessing when you say F1 couldn't cut it you are talking about Indy. If so, then there lies the problem with this series. It is all about one race. Heck, the series is even named after the race. That is fine, if that is what you are trying to achieve. It just doesn't create interest in the rest of the races.

Look at the end of the day, you aren't going to change my mind and I am probably not going to change your mind (especially after seeing your screen name). One parting thought on the car though is that it seems like a lot of Robin Miller's readers agree with me.

Yes, I know we aren't going to change each other's minds, but when I talk about F1 not cutting it in the U.S., I'm not so shallow as to limit my remarks and my reasons to Indy.

First of all, I love racing in almost all forms... NASCAR, IndyCar, Formula One, Sports Cars, etc., etc. I have seen F1 races at Watkins Glen and Indianapolis. I followed the CanAm series when the greats of racing made that series super exciting and I followed them to Watkins Glen, Road Atlanta, and Road America. So please don't insinuate that I'm a one-trick (or one-track) pony. In fact, I've spent more years at IMS (IndyCars, NASCAR, and F1) than I care to remember. When the greedy idiots chose to split the Indy cars into two factions in the mid-90s, that marked the rapid decline of the glory days for IndyCar racing in general and, to a great extent, the Indy 500 itself. It's hard for those of us who truly remember how great is was to accept the fact that those days are apparently long gone.

The fact remains, however, that the Indianapolis 500 is still here and is still the greatest one-day sporting event in the world. The fact also remains that F1 has been trying to find a U.S. audience for many years. If you are unaware of the failed attempts of F1 to remain a presence here, the following link may refresh your memory:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Grand_Prix

I hope the 2012 race brings F1 back to the U.S. for a good, long time but based on past history, I have my doubts.

P.S. I admire Robin Miller also.
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post #10 of 24 Old 03-27-2012, 08:36 PM
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Mac,
I don't think this years F1 car is great, but I think it is better than the Indy car.

Jim,
I think we probably agree more than you think. I was a huge Cart fan. I absolutely loved watching Indy and all of the races. Then came the split. The first couple of years weren't to bad, but by 2000 it started to get exhausting. The funny thing is if Tony would have just used Nascar engines then his series might have been a lot better and maybe won a lot sooner. Oh well, it is what it is.

An interesting story from the late 90s about Indy cars and public opinion. My sister was a corporate insurance underwriter. She called me and asked my opinion on insuring either a team or the series. I can't remember which. I told her the problems they were having and I think Brayton had just died. I said she should probably walk away from it, which she did.

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post #11 of 24 Old 03-28-2012, 04:37 AM
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I think she made a good decision based on the state of the series at the time.
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post #12 of 24 Old 04-01-2012, 12:29 PM - Thread Starter
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NBCSN FiOS TV NYC

Honda Indy Grand Prix of Alabama.
PQ on NBC Sports Network is terrible and much worse then ESPN on ABC.
Every camera shot has motion artifacts and macroblocking.
Graphics are formatted for 4:3.
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post #13 of 24 Old 04-02-2012, 04:17 AM
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I thought it looked great, just like VS. did last few years. Great sound too. Comcast in the ATL.
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post #14 of 24 Old 04-29-2012, 09:44 AM - Thread Starter
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NBCSN FiOS TV NYC

Once again there is heavy macroblocking on all camera shots with any panning or fast movement.

The leaderboard at the top of the screen is to low.
Even with overscan on there is to much empty space at the top.
As with the SNF NFL score bar the black space above it is annoying and needs to be removed.
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post #15 of 24 Old 04-29-2012, 03:19 PM
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Actually what is most annoying and really needs to be removed are the hideously ugly and slow cars on track.
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post #16 of 24 Old 04-29-2012, 03:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gerhard911 View Post

Actually what is most annoying and really needs to be removed are the hideously ugly and slow cars on track.

Slow? As opposed to what exactly?
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post #17 of 24 Old 04-29-2012, 04:50 PM
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CART (circa 1996!), F1, ALMS.
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post #18 of 24 Old 04-30-2012, 04:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icemannyr View Post

NBCSN FiOS TV NYC

Once again there is heavy macroblocking on all camera shots with any panning or fast movement.

It was a Brazilian feed, the quality was bad. DD 5.1 was non-existent for most of the race too. They mentioned that early on, not much they could do about it.
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post #19 of 24 Old 04-30-2012, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gerhard911 View Post

Actually what is most annoying and really needs to be removed are the hideously ugly and slow cars on track.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RedOctober205 View Post

Slow? As opposed to what exactly?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gerhard911 View Post

CART (circa 1996!), F1, ALMS.

LOL

The biggest thing I got out of the race was a desire to eat a Kit Kat.


Yeah, it was a Brazil feed. F1 does it as well. Is this mandatory when you go to another country?

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post #20 of 24 Old 05-24-2012, 07:52 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gerhard911 View Post

CART (circa 1996!), F1, ALMS.

Wrong.
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post #21 of 24 Old 05-24-2012, 09:44 PM
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At least for CART/INDY cars he's correct.

From this Wiki page of Indy 500 records:


Fastest Race Lap:
Fastest Unofficial (Practice) Lap:

Those old Indy cars were so fast that when IMAX made their Super Speedway film in 2000, they took one of the old cars and bolted an enormous IMAX camera on top of it and even with that large suitcase-sized airbrake bolted on top of it, the camera car was competitive with the new cars.

One of the most interesting parts of the film is when Mario and Michael Andretti are testing the camera car to make sure it's safe and Mario says "Wow" when he hears the lap times that the camera car is turning.
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post #22 of 24 Old 06-23-2012, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
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NBCSN HD
Iowa Corn Indy 250

Macroblocking on all camera shots. The shots with the fence behind the track are the worst with heavy macroblocking.
There's also annoying motion artifacts below the running order graphic.
Next race since is on abc. I'll take abc 720p with motion artifacts over NBCSN 1080i with macrblocking.
I know some get good PQ on the races but it's not the case on FiOS.
Plus there are consistent audio clicks and dropouts on NBCSN.
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post #23 of 24 Old 06-24-2012, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac The Knife View Post

At least for CART/INDY cars he's correct.

From this Wiki page of Indy 500 records:


Fastest Race Lap: Fastest Unofficial (Practice) Lap:

Those old Indy cars were so fast that when IMAX made their Super Speedway film in 2000, they took one of the old cars and bolted an enormous IMAX camera on top of it and even with that large suitcase-sized airbrake bolted on top of it, the camera car was competitive with the new cars.


One of the most interesting parts of the film is when Mario and Michael Andretti are testing the camera car to make sure it's safe and Mario says "Wow" when he hears the lap times that the camera car is turning.

The IRL of 1996 used the CART equipment of the year prior, then used more turbo boost to get additional HP at indy that year. TG's form or one-ups-manship you could say. It's been argued that Scott Brayton payed dearly for that move. When the IRL used their own formula, the speeds dropped drastically.

The IMAX camera car had quite a bit more boost to compensate for the weight and high positioning of the extra filming equipment.
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post #24 of 24 Old 06-25-2012, 02:18 PM
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All in all, the coverage was adequate. I think audio could be better. Regardless of all that, the current car/formula is offering up superb races at facilities whereby they can race. This is what's important, their product,..and the product is superb. IMO, the mix of talent right now is stunning.

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