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post #181 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 09:24 AM
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I too think that Smith is a pretty weak doctor. I have been watching since Pertwee, and aside from Davison, I have mostly liked all of the Doctors. I don't think Smith is BAD, just not as good as the others. I really liked Tennant.
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Same.

Yeah, I can subscribe to this too. While Smith has been adequate and maybe a bit better than that, he has not been as good as Tennant was. I think it's fair to say that the Dr. Who franchise has been blessed with more than its share of talented actors who have played the Doctor.
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post #182 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 11:02 AM
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Yeah, I can subscribe to this too. While Smith has been adequate and maybe a bit better than that, he has not been as good as Tennant was. I think it's fair to say that the Dr. Who franchise has been blessed with more than its share of talented actors who have played the Doctor.

And at the same time it's catering to a younger generation for better or worse. I've been throwing this article around a lot lately and I feel it applies.
http://michaeldstark.wordpress.com/2013/05/23/cultural-indictment-the-new-star-trek/
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Star Trek used to be about enlightenment, progress, collaboration, and intelligence.

Now, Star Trek is about fun and games.

And sex.

And action.

And prolonged adolescence.
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post #183 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by darthrsg View Post

And at the same time it's catering to a younger generation for better or worse. I've been throwing this article around a lot lately and I feel it applies.
http://michaeldstark.wordpress.com/2013/05/23/cultural-indictment-the-new-star-trek/
Thanks for that link, very good read.
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post #184 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 11:55 AM
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And at the same time it's catering to a younger generation for better or worse. I've been throwing this article around a lot lately and I feel it applies.
http://michaeldstark.wordpress.com/2013/05/23/cultural-indictment-the-new-star-trek/

It's an interesting read, but in his analysis of the reboot characters, he completely missed the worst offender: Khan.

Khan was the most educated, most charismatic, and most eloquent villain of the Star Trek universe. He had an imperious attitude because at one point in the Star Trek history, he had ruled over 1/4 of the Earth before being overthrown. While possessing genetically engineered super strength, his ability to manipulate people with words was even more dangerous. He regularly quoted classic literature. And he was meant to be a warning against the idea of genetically manipulating human nature. A cautionary tale that with increased strength and intelligence come increased ego and aggression.

All of that was glossed over in about 3 sentences in the movie, as if it didn't matter in the least. And worse yet, they cast one of the better actors of the current generation, to play the most eloquent character in the Star Trek universe. And then gave him hardly any lines. And instead of having him talk and mess with people's heads verbally, they had him in non-stop action scenes fighting like a freakin' ninja or Jedi Knight or something. It destroyed his character. Khan has been voted one of the top 10 all time greatest film villains, and JJ Abrams managed to make him a completely generic sci-fi cliche. Benedict Cumberbatch certainly did well with what little part he was given, but it could have been a brilliant role if it had been written and directed properly. As it was, the character was a complete waste of Cumberbatch's talent.

I'm glad Abrams is moving on to Star Wars, where the characters have always been one dimensional cliches. It suits him much better.
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post #185 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 04:25 PM
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Matt Smith is great as the Doctor, but I miss the good old days when the Doctor and his companions would not know where they are going and basically blunder into a bad situation. I always liked it when someone in the story would questions the Doctor's sanity. In many stories he is portrayed as some sort of all-powerful god. Still love the show though. Just wish it retained some of its nerdy cult show qualities, it so mainstream now.

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post #186 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 04:37 PM
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I think Matt Smith is fine as the Doctor... I think he has been hampered by weak plots/scripts... I hate to see him go... was actually hoping to see Moffat step down instead... but now we'll get to see another actor try to carry the show that is less about the Doctor and more about the companions since Moffat took over.

I am a bit confused, though... as Matt Smith had been publicly denying rumors that he had quit for months... he had been speaking about series 8 for a while... so I wonder if something happened to recently/suddenly change his mind.
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post #187 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 05:18 PM
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Hope they pick someone older this time. Maybe make him a little grumpier, put some Hartnell and Pertwee in him. Wouldn't mind if Moffat left too.

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post #188 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 08:47 PM
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post #189 of 351 Old 06-02-2013, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeffer65 View Post

Matt Smith is great as the Doctor, but I miss the good old days when the Doctor and his companions would not know where they are going and basically blunder into a bad situation. I always liked it when someone in the story would questions the Doctor's sanity. In many stories he is portrayed as some sort of all-powerful god. Still love the show though. Just wish it retained some of its nerdy cult show qualities, it so mainstream now.

You know, I've been toying with the idea that the Doctor's given/true name is actually ... (pause for dramatic effect) ... Lucifer ... think about it for a while. smile.gif

Hint: He always tries to give his "opponents" the choice to do the right thing, before he takes any action to "vanquish" them.
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post #190 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 06:55 AM
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Yeah, I can subscribe to this too. While Smith has been adequate and maybe a bit better than that, he has not been as good as Tennant was. I think it's fair to say that the Dr. Who franchise has been blessed with more than its share of talented actors who have played the Doctor.

Of the recent Doctors, it would also be Tennant for me.biggrin.gif
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post #191 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 07:10 AM
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I have a soft-spot for Chris Eccleston, who was the first Doctor of the "modern era", and my introduction to the Dr. Who universe. He shaped my vision of what and "who" the Doctor is. And Rose Tyler (Billie Piper) has been my favorite companion, possibly again by virtue of her being the first I'd seen.

I liked Tennant as well, and if you twisted my arm he would probably be my favorite, but the truth is I've enjoyed them all and what each has brought to the role. It will be a challenge to make sure the next actor is equally up to snuff and capable of carrying on a storied tradition. Me, I'd be a little nervous about taking on this role.
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post #192 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeffer65 View Post

Hope they pick someone older this time. Maybe make him a little grumpier, put some Hartnell and Pertwee in him. Wouldn't mind if Moffat left too.

Yep. One UK newspaper made the point that kids don't have a problem with older leads in family TV shows - when sometimes adults think they will. The success of The Sarah Jane Adventures was a quoted example.
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post #193 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 07:50 AM
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I have a soft-spot for Chris Eccleston, who was the first Doctor of the "modern era", and my introduction to the Dr. Who universe. He shaped my vision of what and "who" the Doctor is. And Rose Tyler (Billie Piper) has been my favorite companion, possibly again by virtue of her being the first I'd seen.

I liked Tennant as well, and if you twisted my arm he would probably be my favorite, but the truth is I've enjoyed them all and what each has brought to the role. It will be a challenge to make sure the next actor is equally up to snuff and capable of carrying on a storied tradition. Me, I'd be a little nervous about taking on this role.

My Doctor is Baker and the standard for me. Smith was no where near that. Tennant and Eccleston were.
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post #194 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 08:25 AM
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My first Doctor was Baker too. I think it was the scarf smile.gif. I've been watching the specials they have every month featuring the Doctor's in order and I find it interesting how each actor plays him. I've enjoyed them all and I can't wait to see who the next one will be.

I'm a 'hooker' and a knitter. I guess that makes me bi-stitchual :). Crap I say
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post #195 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 08:26 AM
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My first Doctor was Baker too. I think it was the scarf smile.gif. I've been watching the specials they have every month featuring the Doctor's in order and I find it interesting how each actor plays him. I've enjoyed them all and I can't wait to see who the next one will be.

Nick Cage would rule as a Timelord.
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post #196 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 08:35 AM
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Ultimately, for me, as long as the actor embraces the role and the mythos and the crazy fan base, then I will accept him. Nothing irks me more than an actor who has been in an iconic movie or role, gives interviews after the fact that he wasn't really into it and doesn't get what the whole fuss is about and doesn't want to be associated with it anymore even though the role was a milestone in his career. Ecclestone has obviously taken this tact. But Alec Guinness and Ewan McGregor expressed similar attitudes towards Star Wars. Guinness you can kind of give a pass to because no one knew SW was going to blow up like that and he was a well established actor (and old) when he appeared in SW. McGregor and Ecclestone knew what to expect going in.

Last year, I went to convention where Alex Kingston was the main star and she seemed genuinely immersed in "Who-ville" and patiently answered questions from the audience from the intelligent to the inane and she never once rolled her eyes or gave a sarcastic answer no matter how stupid the question was. And she is a classically-trained actress who's appeared in hit television shows and has received critical awards.
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post #197 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 08:53 AM
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Last year, I went to convention where Alex Kingston was the main star and she seemed genuinely immersed in "Who-ville" and patiently answered questions from the audience from the intelligent to the inane and she never once rolled her eyes or gave a sarcastic answer no matter how stupid the question was. And she is a classically-trained actress who's appeared in hit television shows and has received critical awards.

Alex Kingston is a seriously class act. Ultra professional and a joy to work with. The exact opposite of most American television stars (I'm looking at you, Kiefer).
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post #198 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 09:44 AM
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Nick Cage would rule as a Timelord.

I'm sure Cage would be great, but they would never pick an American actor, and they shouldn't. Henry Ian Cusick (Desmond from LOST) would be terrific. Classically trained, wide acting range. He's one that immediately comes to mind right now. Like Tenant, he is Scottish.

They need to make sure this one is different from Matt Smith. Maybe the Doctor will finally be ginger.

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post #199 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeffer65 View Post

I'm sure Cage would be great, but they would never pick an American actor, and they shouldn't. Henry Ian Cusick (Desmond from LOST) would be terrific. Classically trained, wide acting range. He's one that immediately comes to mind right now. Like Tenant, he is Scottish.

They need to make sure this one is different from Matt Smith. Maybe the Doctor will finally be ginger.
No doubt but Cage has the quirk required. I'd like to see Lennie James.
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post #200 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 10:27 AM
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Ultimately, for me, as long as the actor embraces the role and the mythos and the crazy fan base, then I will accept him. Nothing irks me more than an actor who has been in an iconic movie or role, gives interviews after the fact that he wasn't really into it and doesn't get what the whole fuss is about and doesn't want to be associated with it anymore even though the role was a milestone in his career. Ecclestone has obviously taken this tact. But Alec Guinness and Ewan McGregor expressed similar attitudes towards Star Wars. Guinness you can kind of give a pass to because no one knew SW was going to blow up like that and he was a well established actor (and old) when he appeared in SW. McGregor and Ecclestone knew what to expect going in.

I agree that Guinness had a point. Although he was generally regarded as one of the greatest, if not the greatest, character actors of the 20th Century, his Star Wars performances doomed him to be remembered best for having portrayed a two dimensional cartoon character. It really is sad. I also sympathize with McGregor who, thanks to George Lucas' ham fisted direction, was made to look talentless in his Star Wars performances. On the other hand, nobody ever handled that kind of misuse better than the author, Tom Wolfe. Whenever Wolfe has been asked about the horrible mess of his terrific novel, The Bonfire of the Vanities, the Brian De Palma film had made, Wolfe has smiled enigmatically and said, "I cashed the check."smile.gif
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I'm sure Cage would be great, but they would never pick an American actor, and they shouldn't. Henry Ian Cusick (Desmond from LOST) would be terrific. Classically trained, wide acting range. He's one that immediately comes to mind right now. Like Tenant, he is Scottish.

They need to make sure this one is different from Matt Smith. Maybe the Doctor will finally be ginger.

I agree that there is no chance Nick Cage would ever portray the Doctor but agree, he would be wonderful. No actor working does a better job of projecting charm and craziness than Cage.
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post #201 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 11:18 AM
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post #202 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 11:43 AM
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Yes he does! smile.gif

I agree that Cage would make a good Doctor but I'm not sure how well an American actor would be received in a mostly British series. It sure would be different!

I'm a 'hooker' and a knitter. I guess that makes me bi-stitchual :). Crap I say
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post #203 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 12:08 PM
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Yes he does! smile.gif

I agree that Cage would make a good Doctor but I'm not sure how well an American actor would be received in a mostly British series. It sure would be different!
If Chris Hardwick drags it down just a little further....
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post #204 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 04:22 PM
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I have a soft-spot for Chris Eccleston, who was the first Doctor of the "modern era", and my introduction to the Dr. Who universe. He shaped my vision of what and "who" the Doctor is. And Rose Tyler (Billie Piper) has been my favorite companion, possibly again by virtue of her being the first I'd seen.

I liked Tennant as well, and if you twisted my arm he would probably be my favorite, but the truth is I've enjoyed them all and what each has brought to the role. It will be a challenge to make sure the next actor is equally up to snuff and capable of carrying on a storied tradition. Me, I'd be a little nervous about taking on this role.

Amazingly, your reaction is very typical of many, if not most, Who fans. Whoever was playing the Doctor when they first started watching it, is their favorite. You hear this over and over again. Mine is Tom Baker, but I have liked most of them. I liked Davison the least, and Smith, just a bit more--and that's saying something because Colin and Sylvester were not too popular with many of the fans.

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post #205 of 351 Old 06-03-2013, 04:48 PM
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Nicholas Cage as the Doctor?

NNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! eek.gif
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post #206 of 351 Old 06-05-2013, 07:03 AM
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I don't really have a favorite Doctor or a least favorite either. I have several favorite stories from each era of the show. Really wish they could track down the missing Hartnell and Troughton stories. Really want to see Marco Polo and The Web of Fear. All the hard work that went into those shows, and the BBC wipes the tapes. Good grief!


An American cast as the Doctor? Won't happen. If it does, the show is finished.

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post #207 of 351 Old 06-05-2013, 07:13 AM
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I don't really have a favorite Doctor or a least favorite either. I have several favorite stories from each era of the show. Really wish they could track down the missing Hartnell and Troughton stories. Really want to see Marco Polo and The Web of Fear. All the hard work that went into those shows, and the BBC wipes the tapes. Good grief!


An American cast as the Doctor? Won't happen. If it does, the show is finished.

I would like to argue the because the Doctor is not even human, he shouldn't necessarily have to be British either. On the other hand, when I recall that the Doctor flies around time and space in a mid 20th Century British police call box, I realize that your point is well taken.
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post #208 of 351 Old 06-05-2013, 02:29 PM
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I would like to argue the because the Doctor is not even human, he shouldn't necessarily have to be British either. On the other hand, when I recall that the Doctor flies around time and space in a mid 20th Century British police call box, I realize that your point is well taken.

I understand your point. I just can't see British Whovians accepting an American actor, at least not a well known one, cast as the Doctor. Back in the 80s, the show's producers were accused of trying "Americanize" Dr. Who when they made Peri an American girl. I know its more mainstream and more international now, but still I can't see it. I see your point though.

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post #209 of 351 Old 06-05-2013, 02:35 PM
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post #210 of 351 Old 06-05-2013, 05:14 PM
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Despite its universal appeal, Doctor Who is a British show, has always been a British show, and should always be a British show. The Doctor needs to remain British or else the identity of the show will be ruined.

Need we look any further than Torchwood? Torchwood was great as a completely British show, but it sucked big time when it was Americanized. Contrary to popular American belief, we as Americans cannot do everything better. We need to learn to appreciate the uniqueness of other countries' contributions instead of feeling like we have to conquer them.

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