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post #91 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 05:31 AM
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i thought you needed national command authority to retarget the tridents. the sub captain couldn't do it on his own. to prevent him from going rogue.
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post #92 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 06:08 AM
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Even if that is the case, it still takes two people to get at the keys. Plus, it takes a crewman to do the actual retargeting. The odds of the captain, or even the XO, knowing how to sit at the keyboard and doing that is slim.

In other words, it would take the sub's screw to go rogue, not just the CO.

It was kinda like the KWT-26 and KWR-26 (I think I remembered those designations correctly) coding transmitter and coding receiver. If someone wanted to restart the code stream over again, therefore allowing anyone to break the new transmissions, as well as the old (like we did with the Russians a lot), it would have taken four people in which to do it.

The equipment used IBM punch cards to create the encoded stream (this was the early 1970s afterall biggrin.gif ). When the cards are inserted, they are cut in half when the door is closed. When the door is opened, the spring loaded loaded would split apart and were impossible to get back together again. But, I was shown a little trick whereby the door could be partially opened and the sensing switch would indicate that the door was opened, without the card sprining apart.

The problem is that two people at the KWT site and two people at the KWR site were required to change the cards. The enlisted due that did the actual card changing and the duty officer that had to sign for the card. Sure, it really only takes the two enlisted operator to do the card changing and transmission restarting, others in the room would see it happening.

The Russians, on the other hand, seemed to have really lax procedures and or crappy equipment, as we got at least one "bust" a shift, if not more. The tape that was recording the transmission would be marked as well as the tapes of previous and future recordings that used that code stream.

I was a CTM2 (E5 Communication Technician Maintenance), or what was affectionately known as a lightning fast chicken plucker. Look at the rating badge and you'd understand why. biggrin.gif

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post #93 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Cal1981 View Post

That was odd to me as well. Each modern Trident has, I think, 8 MIRV warheads. A Trident strike with one warhead would seem unlikely. The two strikes on Pakistan appeared to be single warhead hits also. Also, how could the Captain have reprogrammed one Trident's targeting to Washington on his own? I suppose we could tear the show's technical missteps apart ad nauseum but in spite of them, the episode was very intriguing so I'll just roll with it.

According to Wikipedia:
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Warhead (in USA usage only): nuclear MIRV. Up to four W88 (475 kt) warheads (Mark 5) or eight W76 (100 kt) warheads (Mark 4). The Trident II can carry 12 MIRV warheads but START I reduces this to 8 and SORT reduces this yet further to 4 or 5.

Another thing noted was a range of 7000 mi. which would put DC out of the range of the Colorado no matter where in the Indian Ocean it was located. Of course, actual range and capacities frequently exceed published numbers, so it would depend on that range accuracy.
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post #94 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 08:59 AM
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i realize that i'm beating a dead horse here but what you're telling me is that the captain couldn't have done this on his own. which then brings up an interesting question how does the weapon end up aimed towards dc?
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post #95 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

According to Wikipedia:
Another thing noted was a range of 7000 mi. which would put DC out of the range of the Colorado no matter where in the Indian Ocean it was located. Of course, actual range and capacities frequently exceed published numbers, so it would depend on that range accuracy.
It not only had to reach DC, but well beyond out in to the ocean, since apparently the path was overland over the US to get there.
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post #96 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

It not only had to reach DC, but well beyond out in to the ocean, since apparently the path was overland over the US to get there.

Maybe it's closer to come at DC from the other side...? East, west, it's all just a matter of meridians.
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post #97 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CPanther95 View Post

According to Wikipedia:
Another thing noted was a range of 7000 mi. which would put DC out of the range of the Colorado no matter where in the Indian Ocean it was located. Of course, actual range and capacities frequently exceed published numbers, so it would depend on that range accuracy.

Hmm.. Maybe the Trident docked with a "Refueling Missile" somewhere up in the Thermosphere. Hey, I'm just saying biggrin.gif
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post #98 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Cal1981 View Post

Hmm.. Maybe the Trident docked with a "Refueling Missile" somewhere up in the Thermosphere. Hey, I'm just saying biggrin.gif

Great idea Cal, maybe you should patent that before somebody steals it..smile.gif

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post #99 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by rviele View Post

i realize that i'm beating a dead horse here but what you're telling me is that the captain couldn't have done this on his own. which then brings up an interesting question how does the weapon end up aimed towards dc?

I wondered the same thing, i.e., who on the crew reprogrammed the missile. It would have had to have been one of the con crew, yet we never saw/heard it happening.

Like a lot of stuff, you have to let it go.

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post #100 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Maybe it's closer to come at DC from the other side...? East, west, it's all just a matter of meridians.
I understand that - and it probably is. I was just pointing out it was DC+ mileage, so if DC was a stretch, dumping it well out into the Atlantic was more so.
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post #101 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by mrvideo View Post

I wondered the same thing, i.e., who on the crew reprogrammed the missile. It would have had to have been one of the con crew, yet we never saw/heard it happening.
Like a lot of stuff, you have to let it go.
Maybe while he was tucked away in his quarters, he called up Matthew Broderick and got him to hack the system...

"Greetings, Professor Falken...shall...we...play...a...game?"
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post #102 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

It not only had to reach DC, but well beyond out in to the ocean, since apparently the path was overland over the US to get there.

Yeah you're right, they said "missile is heading over Indiana". That means rather than the shortest route, coming down to DC roughly from the North, it went a much longer route - probably by a couple thousand miles. And coming from the North, hitting DC or a couple hundred miles to the East wouldn't make much difference.

... unless it came down to Indiana from the North, then hung a left - then it might have only gone about 500 miles further than needed.
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post #103 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by NetworkTV View Post

Maybe while he was tucked away in his quarters, he called up Matthew Broderick and got him to hack the system...
"Greetings, Professor Falken...shall...we...play...a...game?"

ROTFL biggrin.gif

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post #104 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 11:49 AM
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Crossing the Equator for the first time in the Navy is a big celebration. Any Navy members out there?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line-crossing_ceremony

My son was laughing at what he thought was absurd for a submarine crew. Then I showed him the "certificate" and other things that my father received in WWII when his submarine (USS Shark) crossed under, or over, the equator. He was amazed.
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post #105 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 11:50 AM
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Did any one else have audio issues during the show? My audio volume would dip big time during action scenes and get louder during non action scenes. It was very annoying.

Not really. The audio was just fine OTA.
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post #106 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 03:15 PM
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Oh yeah....destroyers and ammo supply ships during the Nam era. I still remember the "ceremony", but no babes mad.gif

Also a Vietnam Navy vet on the USS Prairie AD15, destroyer tender... Yea, they also skipped the abuse first timers have to go through (I won't go into the details but it was no "fun". Being on the receiving end, I sure don't remember a "party" my one and only crossing and there certainly weren't any "babes".
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post #107 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 03:21 PM
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"CPU cooler and fan externally mounted to panels?" Short answer: NO! Fans make noise, NOISE = DEATH to a submarine. Stealth and quiet are paramount to staying alive on a sub so I highly doubt you would ever see an external fan mounted to a panel... this isn't 1940 sub warfare.
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post #108 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Jmouse007 View Post

"CPU cooler and fan externally mounted to panels?" Short answer: NO! Fans make noise, NOISE = DEATH to a submarine. Stealth and quiet are paramount to staying alive on a sub so I highly doubt you would ever see an external fan mounted to a panel... this isn't 1940 sub warfare.

How did 1940s submarines keep their CPUs cool? smile.gif
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post #109 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Jmouse007 View Post

"CPU cooler and fan externally mounted to panels?" Short answer: NO! Fans make noise, NOISE = DEATH to a submarine. Stealth and quiet are paramount to staying alive on a sub so I highly doubt you would ever see an external fan mounted to a panel... this isn't 1940 sub warfare.
You really think noise from a CPU fan can penetrate the hull of a sub strong enough to avoid being crushed by the under water pressure hundreds of feet below sea level?

If that were the case, they would have to issue commands with sign language. Opening the torpedo and missile doors likely makes infinitely far more noise than that fan.

Further, their little crossing party would have attracted ships and subs for miles.
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post #110 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 04:00 PM
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I didn't mind this. Of course I didn't dwell on the military inaccuracies either. It kinda reminded me of a cross between Lost and Crimson Tide.

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post #111 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 05:35 PM
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I wish more people would comment on how enjoyable (or not) the show was than quibble about technical errors.

We don't demand NBC news be truthful, why demand a fiction show be truthful?
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post #112 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 08:30 PM
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I wish more people would comment on how enjoyable (or not) the show was than quibble about technical errors.

If you think this thread is bad, try reading one of the topics for a science fiction show. We need separate forums (or at least topics) for discussing TV programming versus complaining about it.

This will probably be one of my top shows this season, so I hope the poor reviews that the next few episodes are getting don't apply to the entire season. It would also be nice if it got picked up for another ten episodes, but it's too early to tell if that would be a blessing or a curse.
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post #113 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 09:06 PM
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My son was laughing at what he thought was absurd for a submarine crew. Then I showed him the "certificate" and other things that my father received in WWII when his submarine (USS Shark) crossed under, or over, the equator. He was amazed.
So true. My dad was a radioman in the 5th Air Force. When he shipped out for the Pacific and crossed the equator, he got this wildly elaborate certificate making him a member of the Order of something or other.
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post #114 of 581 Old 09-29-2012, 10:17 PM
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I think the premise is the President is in political trouble and needs a diversion so he nukes Pakistan.

My thoughts also. It is established early that the President is in political trouble and is facing impeachment. No better way to "wag the dog" than to fake an attack on the U.S.

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post #115 of 581 Old 09-30-2012, 09:38 AM
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I think the premise is the President is in political trouble and needs a diversion so he nukes Pakistan.

If there is one place (other than Iran) that needs to be fake nuked, its Pakistan.

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post #116 of 581 Old 09-30-2012, 10:02 AM
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If there is one place (other than Iran) that needs to be fake nuked, its Pakistan.

With friends like them......
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post #117 of 581 Old 09-30-2012, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by grittree View Post

I wish more people would comment on how enjoyable (or not) the show was than quibble about technical errors.
We don't demand NBC news be truthful, why demand a fiction show be truthful?

Agreed. I like the show (so far). It is television after all so technical accuracy is expected to be suspended to a point. I think it's more "believable" so far than Revolution wink.gif
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post #118 of 581 Old 09-30-2012, 05:04 PM
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I wish more people would comment on how enjoyable (or not) the show was than quibble about technical errors.
We don't demand NBC news be truthful, why demand a fiction show be truthful?

Actually, we do demand it of NBC News, but they fail to comply. Many in Detroit, even those who work for the others guys, will NEVER forgive them for the bomb in the pickup truck fuel tank.
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post #119 of 581 Old 09-30-2012, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Cal1981 View Post

So true. My dad was a radioman in the 5th Air Force. When he shipped out for the Pacific and crossed the equator, he got this wildly elaborate certificate making him a member of the Order of something or other.

I think it was the Order of Trident but I'd have to check. I didn't really pay attention to the cert when I showed it to my son.
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post #120 of 581 Old 10-01-2012, 08:04 AM
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I liked the first episode a lot.
But what really sucks is the commercials they've been airing the last few days where they call it an "epic love story"....rolleyes.gif
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