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post #2371 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by MeatChicken View Post
Seemed to be a bit of a slow moving episode, especially for the season finale ...
Honestly, no real "Wow" moments, lots of long stares and pauses...
..
Nothing about Oleg ...
When it was close to the end I actually though to myself , "Is this really the season finale ?" ...
Do you not remember last season's finale? Snoresville more so than this one. That's my recollection of it anyway. Final scene with Philip walking Paige back home from across the street, Philip with a gentle admonishment to Paige about the road she appeared to be traveling down (cozying up to Stan's son). No outwardly dramatic fireworks.

I also seem to recall that a character or two (Martha? Oleg?) & their stories were left hanging in last season's finale too, with a similar complaint in this thread.

Having said that, I do sort of wish the show would go out of character a little and bring a higher level of drama to their season finales. But perhaps I should be respecting their discipline more. I guess my thought process here is that if they were to write more of a cliff hanger, they would better ensure a higher percentage of a returning audience.
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post #2372 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by wco81 View Post
... But looked like even Elizabeth was having second thoughts about leaving her wardrobe and shoes.
I was stuck between that same thought (showing a twinge of regret or appreciation for the material goods she was leaving behind) or maybe it was more simply a mental accounting about her life as it had been vs. what it will probably be (making do with a lot less).

The scene reminded me of an earlier one from 2-3 seasons ago:


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post #2373 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 07:52 PM
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This show is a slow train wreck, and it's going to be a tragic ending for all of them. If you enjoy depressing this is it and will Paige and Tuan team up? Henry commit suicide and Stan kill the parents? Whatever happens it's going to be ugly.
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These are just my opinions.
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post #2374 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by zalusky View Post
1) I was expecting Paige to get jumped as she walking to her car in the dark of night and given all her training to make mincemeat of the attacker but nope.
I thought of that too, of course. When it didn't happen, then the scene became clear. It was an expression and reinforcement of Paige toughening up and overcoming her fears. She's progressing to more fully become her Mother's daughter.
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post #2375 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by gwsat View Post
I thought Elizabeth had another good moment, when she told Tuan that unless he got a partner, he was going to either get caught or die. The message I got from this was that Tuan's zealotry is going to kill him if he doesn't get somebody to temper his enthusiasm and save him from himself.
Hmm, (the part above I bolded from your post) didn't occur to me at all. Interesting take.
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post #2376 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I agree that the show's use of Elton John's Yellow Brick Road was well done.
And the lyrics so fitting...
Can't hold me forever
Going back to my (🌽) plough
I've finally decided my future

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Goodbye Yellow Brick Road (Remastered 2014)

Elton John

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When are you gonna come down
When are you going to land
I should have stayed on the farm
I should have listened to my old man

You know you can't hold me forever
I didn't sign up with you
I'm not a present for your friends to open
This boy's too young to be singing the blues

So goodbye yellow brick road
Where the dogs of society howl
You can't plant me in your penthouse
I'm going back to my plough

Back to the howling old owl in the woods
Hunting the horny back toad
Oh I've finally decided my future lies
Beyond the yellow brick road

What do you think you'll do then
I bet that'll shoot down the plane
It'll take you a couple of vodka and tonics
To set you on your feet again

Maybe you'll get a replacement
There's plenty like me to be found
Mongrels who ain't got a penny
Sniffing for tidbits like you on the ground

So goodbye yellow brick road
Where the dogs of society howl
You can't plant me in your penthouse
I'm going back to my plough

Back to the howling old owl in the woods
Hunting the horny back toad
Oh I've finally decided my future lies
Beyond the yellow brick road
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post #2377 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeatChicken View Post
Seemed to be a bit of a slow moving episode, especially for the season finale ...
Honestly, no real "Wow" moments, lots of long stares and pauses...
A break to hear the entire album version of Elton John's Yellow Brick Road before returning to our regularly scheduled program ..
Nothing about Oleg ...
When it was close to the end I actually though to myself , "Is this really the season finale ?" ...
Yup. Agreed. Their finales leave me wanting. "Disciplined" is about the best possible way to describe it, while I'll go with Uneventful. For me, it wasn't so much about the pacing , as it was the lack of content. Slightly further along for Paige (like every other week), Henry's sub-plot and the suicide. Just seemed lacking for a finale..
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post #2378 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 08:53 PM
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In the pilot episode, Philip asked Elizabeth if she wouldn't admit that things are nicer, with things like reliable electricity.

Then Elizabeth spouted the usual Soviet propaganda about the decadent West.

But she has to have seen that the Soviets have a problem with the truth, including lying to them. They lied about why they wanted the virus and they may have lied about the wheat poisoning plot, to get Philip and Elizabeth to steal the bioengineered wheat.

So as she looked at her clothes and other belongings which would be luxuries back in Russia, she has to recognize the lies and alibis that the Soviets used to explain why the West had achieved such a superior standard of living for the average citizen, compared to the Soviet system.
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post #2379 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gwsat View Post
The message I got from this was that Tuan's zealotry is going to kill him if he doesn't get somebody to temper his enthusiasm and save him from himself.
I had a different reaction to that. I thought the message was that for all of Tuan's zealotry, it won't be enough to sustain him through the long and lonely years of this job. Elizabeth sees much of herself in Tuan, and we can see some of it, too, based upon how Elizabeth acted at the beginning of the show and the way she looked down on Philip for being less devoted to the cause than she was.

All these years later, though, she's starting to realise that she couldn't have done it without him, because not only would she have been unable to complete all of her operations alone, but the weight of her job and the things she had to do would have crushed her without Philip's support. She used to see herself as just as invincible as Tuan sees himself now, but now that the zealotry of her youth has been tempered with experience, she knows that she was more frail than she thought, and she wants to pass that lesson on to Tuan before he has to learn it the hard way.

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Keri Russell and Matthew Rhys are both so talented, their expressions effectively told a lot of the story.
That last scene in particular was exceptional. The look on Elizabeth's face as Philip told her about Kimmy's dad's promotion was priceless.

Regarding the content of the season finales, I think they are purposefully low key, because each season is a slow burn, and the fact that the show is already likely planned out for next season means that they don't have to rely on a lot of whizz bang action to try to sell the next year. It reminds me of an interview where Rhys remarked that he thought it was so great that he hadn't even held a gun since season 1, and I think that is a basic summary of what the show is trying to do. This is a study of how spycraft affects people's lives. It's not an action-adventure show, and the finales of the last few seasons have been masterful demonstrations of it.
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post #2380 of 2394 Old 05-31-2017, 09:51 PM
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The scene with Stan telling his gf that he wanted out and her trying to talk him into staying, more proof she is a spy or red herring?

Paige is growing up and becoming independent. Walking through the same parking lot as she was attacked, driving, being happy for Pastor Tim ... all mature acts. Tuan's future partner? Good observation and a possibility.

Staying in America ... who saw that coming?
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post #2381 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 07:45 AM
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I felt the finale was excellent .. although a touch of Gabriel (not just a note) would have been nice .. Elizabeth is hard core, I don't think the allure of the comforts afforded her in the USA will sway her devotion to the cause .. you could take the scene with the shoes/appliances as a "Wow, I'm going to miss all this .." or as a "This is just another example of the decadent West .." at any rate, I believe she wants to stay because she honestly believes she's making a difference for the Commies .. and now, I don't believe Phillip is headed back to the USSR .. I'd go out on a limb and say if his softness continues, Elizabeth may end up getting the orders to take him out .. and, what else might be in Tuan's "report" .. ??

Phillip had his moment of reflection as well, with Stan on the racket ball court .. Phillip and Stan are real friends, oddly enough ..

The use of "Yellow Brick Road" was as perfect a placement as possible .. in fact, it almost choked me up some ..

Oleg, we know, is planning on his own form of law enforcement, so next season gives him a clean start on that new sub plot ..

Tuan and Paige .. ?? I hope not ..

I'll surely miss this show when it's gone

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post #2382 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 08:45 AM
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Interesting development with Stan's GF strongly suggesting (out of the blue) that he stays at his current job... hmmmm?
Even clueless Stan seemed surprised!

IDK if it's just me... but I'm a always bit uneasy with the Kimmy-Philip scenes as I keep expecting her to make a move on him... I certainly hope we don't go there


One scene that wasn't particularly well done IMO was Philip's outburst "this family stays together!" as the reason to withdraw permission for Henry to attend the boarding school.
So what does that mean? Neither of the kids will ever be able to attend college (other than local community college)? No sharp minded teen would have let dad get off the hook with that bizarre one liner.

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post #2383 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 09:01 AM
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IDK if it's just me... but I'm a always bit uneasy with the Kimmy-Philip scenes as I keep expecting her to make a move on him... I certainly hope we don't go there
I was a little surprised they dredged up "Phillip the Cool Guru Dude" this season ..

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post #2384 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 09:03 AM
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One scene that wasn't particularly well done IMO was Philip's outburst "this family stays together!" as the reason to withdraw permission for Henry to attend the boarding school.
So what does that mean? Neither of the kids will ever be able to attend college (other than local community college)? No sharp minded teen would have let dad get off the hook with that bizarre one liner.
Or Georgetown, American University, George Washington University, U of Maryland or many other colleges in the DC area.
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post #2385 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 09:23 AM
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Or Georgetown, American University, George Washington University, U of Maryland or many other colleges in the DC area.
Well, considering there are over 4,000 colleges in the USA... that's pretty slim pickins

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post #2386 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Aleron Ives View Post
I had a different reaction to that. I thought the message was that for all of Tuan's zealotry, it won't be enough to sustain him through the long and lonely years of this job. Elizabeth sees much of herself in Tuan, and we can see some of it, too, based upon how Elizabeth acted at the beginning of the show and the way she looked down on Philip for being less devoted to the cause than she was.

All these years later, though, she's starting to realise that she couldn't have done it without him, because not only would she have been unable to complete all of her operations alone, but the weight of her job and the things she had to do would have crushed her without Philip's support. She used to see herself as just as invincible as Tuan sees himself now, but now that the zealotry of her youth has been tempered with experience, she knows that she was more frail than she thought, and she wants to pass that lesson on to Tuan before he has to learn it the hard way.


That last scene in particular was exceptional. The look on Elizabeth's face as Philip told her about Kimmy's dad's promotion was priceless.

Regarding the content of the season finales, I think they are purposefully low key, because each season is a slow burn, and the fact that the show is already likely planned out for next season means that they don't have to rely on a lot of whizz bang action to try to sell the next year. It reminds me of an interview where Rhys remarked that he thought it was so great that he hadn't even held a gun since season 1, and I think that is a basic summary of what the show is trying to do. This is a study of how spycraft affects people's lives. It's not an action-adventure show, and the finales of the last few seasons have been masterful demonstrations of it.
I think our reactions to Elizabeth having told Tuan that he needed a partner are much the same. Elizabeth did indeed see the young version of herself in Tuan and recognized how often Philip’s moderating influence on her had saved her from her own zealotry. Elizabeth is still an ideologue but as we saw in the scene in which she contemplated her large collection of nice clothes and her modern appliances, she is much more measured about it these days.

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Or Georgetown, American University, George Washington University, U of Maryland or many other colleges in the DC area.
The D.C./Northern VA/Maryland megalopolis has more than 6 million residents and is the sixth largest metro area in the country. Nearby Baltimore has nearly 3 million more. Bottom line, there is no shortage of fine universities in the area and several of them are elite.

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post #2387 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 12:28 PM
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Tuan and Paige .. ?? I hope not ..
The Americans: Next Generation !!!
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post #2388 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 12:53 PM
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There's a lot of gaps in logic to these plots.

First of all, they were running the operation on the family which had defected. So they get Tuan to befriend the son and Philip and Elizabeth socializes with them over a period of months.

Presumably the target was to get the father, who was some kind of agricultural expert. But to do what, get him to return to the USSR? To kill him?

Then by happenstance, the mother gets a job with the CIA meaning they could tail her and find out who the CIA spies are going to be. Turns out she's having an affair with one of them so now, they want to prod them to return the SU. First of all, how many defectors go back? Seems a pretty unlikely event. So the kid was bullied at that school, because of Tuan talking the kids into bullying him. Why would the kids in that school do what this Vietnamese guy wanted them to do?

Now they get what they want, the mother is going to take the kid back, which the Center wants because they will blackmail her over the affair. But the father knows better than to go back, because he will be imprisoned for his outspoken criticisms of the USSR. OK, so why do they need the mother back to blackmail the CIA guy? They already have the pictures of them meeting in the motel rooms. And now the Center doesn't care if the father doesn't return? What happened to the original reason that Philip and Elizabeth was sent to manipulate them?

Then there's the plot with Philip finding out Kimmy's father will be a big shot at the CIA. OK, that's a reason for them to stay instead of returning to Russia. But Philip has been cultivating Kimmy for months. It's one thing if Kimmy is infatuated with Philip to spend a lot of time with him, especially in her home where Philip can access her father's office to bug his briefcase. But to do it years? How long is Kimmy going to be living at home? How long does this 40-something dude get to hang out with Kimmy and her friends before people notice and her father and the CIA finds out about it?

They didn't want to go there as far as having Philip have a sexual affair with a minor, because they want to make his character sympathetic. But it's still an unusual situation that people would notice and Kimmy herself is going to stay infatuated that long with guy old enough to be her father?

This show is going to have to bounce back in its final season. All the praise it's received were mostly deserved for earlier seasons. This season started out promising with the whole food issue, because we know that the USSR was having problems with food shortages, which was one of the reasons it ultimately collapsed, not too long after the time period depicted in this season. Maybe they'll continue with this plot, since it was historically important. It is interesting that the end of the series is kind of merging with the timeline when the USSR ends, even though we know that Russian continued the illegals program well after the fall of the SU.
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post #2389 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 02:22 PM
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If they ever took Henry back to Russia without his knowledge, he would wind up like Pasha; the only difference is that he would have no where to go.
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post #2390 of 2394 Old 06-01-2017, 06:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CruelInventions View Post
Referring to the fact that they were all set to leave to go back home and in...


Spoiler!
Really, I must have dozed off then. I've been nursing a cold that affects my sleep so I've been kind of a "zombie" the last few days, maybe I should re-watch the finale with a clear sinus/head.

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post #2391 of 2394 Old Yesterday, 12:02 PM
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Seemed to be a bit of a slow moving episode, especially for the season finale ...
Honestly, no real "Wow" moments, lots of long stares and pauses...
A break to hear the entire album version of Elton John's Yellow Brick Road before returning to our regularly scheduled program ..
Nothing about Oleg ...
When it was close to the end I actually though to myself , "Is this really the season finale ?" ...
The silence is used to great effect in this series, sometimes more is less.
It also doesn't conform to the cliche' of season ending cliffhangers, explosions, etc...
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post #2392 of 2394 Old Yesterday, 01:24 PM
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It also doesn't conform to the cliche' of season ending cliffhangers, explosions, etc...
Seriously? That is one of the things I REALLY don't like about the series -- all the obvious cliffhangers. I find myself often rolling my eyes and I can most times predict them. Maybe not season to season -- but episode to episode.
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post #2393 of 2394 Old Yesterday, 02:04 PM
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Seriously? That is one of the things I REALLY don't like about the series -- all the obvious cliffhangers. I find myself often rolling my eyes and I can most times predict them. Maybe not season to season -- but episode to episode.
You do realize that you're in The Americans show discussion thread?
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post #2394 of 2394 Old Today, 08:10 AM
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You do realize that you're in The Americans show discussion thread?
I do. But I do not like the show near as much as most people here. I binged watched the first four seasons in February and have been watching since. I will keep watching Season 6 since I am curious how it ends but I am not overly impressed.
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