"ORPHAN BLACK" on BBC America in HD - Page 36 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1051 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by philw1776 View Post
Season One Helena had killed and was killing several clones. Remember the kraut clone in the car? And others. She's a serial killer.

Love the character as this show's black comedy is not to be taken too seriously.

Soccer Mom family is into multiple murder or at least manslaughter too.
Good point - it's easy to forget their homicidal misadventures. Classic example of the maxim "the family that slays together stays together"...

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post #1052 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 01:12 PM
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Good point - it's easy to forget their homicidal misadventures. Classic example of the maxim "the family that slays together stays together"...
It's actually clonicide, not homicide.
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post #1053 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 01:19 PM
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I hope none of you questioning the moral issues with Helena and Orphan Black find the rampant killings in a show like Sons of Anarchy any less questionable. I just finished watching the final season of SoA, and street gangs or not, the National Guard would've been called out IRL with the death toll rising to those levels.

Helena's killing of the drug dealers was obviously done purely for the sake of the dark humor...just like Alison's negligent killing of her neighbor. The morality of stuff like that generally gets a pass in show with dark humor -- similar to Buffy killing dozens of high school aged students who happened to be vampires back in the day.
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post #1054 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by philw1776 View Post
Season One Helena had killed and was killing several clones. Remember the kraut clone in the car? And others. She's a serial killer.

Love the character as this show's black comedy is not to be taken too seriously.

Soccer Mom family is into multiple murder or at least manslaughter too.
Helena's killing of other clones is morally ambiguous... since the world at large doesn't even know clones exist, and if they did, it might be hard to prosecute with the clones being manufactured and all... it's likely "the company" behind everything would argue their copyrights and patents and say it wasn't murder, but destruction of property or something like that.

Also... most of the clones are genetically flawed and at least the one we saw Helena kill for sure was about to die of whatever that illness is anyway... not saying it makes Helena "nice" for doing it... just that arguably the clones she killed were dying anyway.

Meanwhile... soccer mom club... Her husband killed a badguy doctor at least... but Allison killing her neighbor who turned out not to be her monitor after all? Yeah, that one is the one I can't explain for her... Allison is a notch above Helena in that regard to me because Allison no doubt killed a completely innocent person. Helena mostly killed bad guys, some clones, and her "mother"... who probably was innocent but we can't be 100% certain.

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post #1055 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 02:32 PM
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It's actually clonicide, not homicide.
How is that? Donnie killed Leekie and Allison let the neighbor choke to death...

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post #1056 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 02:57 PM
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Helena's killing of other clones is morally ambiguous... since the world at large doesn't even know clones exist, and if they did, it might be hard to prosecute with the clones being manufactured and all... it's likely "the company" behind everything would argue their copyrights and patents and say it wasn't murder, but destruction of property or something like that.

Also... most of the clones are genetically flawed and at least the one we saw Helena kill for sure was about to die of whatever that illness is anyway... not saying it makes Helena "nice" for doing it... just that arguably the clones she killed were dying anyway.

Meanwhile... soccer mom club... Her husband killed a badguy doctor at least... but Allison killing her neighbor who turned out not to be her monitor after all? Yeah, that one is the one I can't explain for her... Allison is a notch above Helena in that regard to me because Allison no doubt killed a completely innocent person. Helena mostly killed bad guys, some clones, and her "mother"... who probably was innocent but we can't be 100% certain.
Say what?
So if Helena killed our heroine it would be somewhat OK because she's a clone??? Who cares what the company claims.

It's not morally ambiguous to murder a human being who arose from cloning anymore than it is to kill one that arose from in vitro fertilization.

And what if she killed Cosima, well she's sick and possibly dying. WTF?

Then again, this is just a black humor television show.
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post #1057 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zookster View Post
I hope none of you questioning the moral issues with Helena and Orphan Black find the rampant killings in a show like Sons of Anarchy any less questionable. I just finished watching the final season of SoA, and street gangs or not, the National Guard would've been called out IRL with the death toll rising to those levels.

Helena's killing of the drug dealers was obviously done purely for the sake of the dark humor...just like Alison's negligent killing of her neighbor. The morality of stuff like that generally gets a pass in show with dark humor -- similar to Buffy killing dozens of high school aged students who happened to be vampires back in the day.
Spot on. It's just a TV show with a sick dark humor bent that appeals to preverts (sic) like moi.
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post #1058 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by cc_in_oh View Post
How is that? Donnie killed Leekie and Allison let the neighbor choke to death...
I was referring to Helena's killing of the other clones only.

Quote:
Originally Posted by philw1776 View Post
Season One Helena had killed and was killing several clones. Remember the kraut clone in the car? And others. She's a serial killer.

Love the character as this show's black comedy is not to be taken too seriously.

Soccer Mom family is into multiple murder or at least manslaughter too.
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post #1059 of 1075 Old 07-16-2015, 04:00 PM
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Alison did indeed get away with murder-by-negligence. She didn't actually feed her neighbors scarf into the disposal but watched it happen and didn't rescue her either. Donny got away with murder-by-accident. He didn't actually mean to kill Leekie but didn't know how to properly operate a firearm. That might give them an out by TV land logic.

OTOH, there is usually retribution for violating TV's unwritten moral code about killing people, so... my prediction is when the show finally wraps, Alison and Donnie will also get their just desserts and end up dead. Remember, you heard it first here.
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post #1060 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 07:10 AM
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Ya know, Jerry, George, Elaine and Kramer ended up in jail after watching and failing to report a robbery in that TV show finale. You don't suppose
Alison and Donny could end up with them?
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post #1061 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 09:02 AM
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Bought the two-season Blu-ray set a while back, mostly to attempt unscrambling the plot. Helena has always been a favorite here, too, despite what her character has done. An amazing voice-image transformation. Concluded her treatment by the Quasimodo-like man who bashes her about, and what the nuns apparently did to her, didn't (ah) help her personality. Recalled the "I'll gut you like a fish" scene, as she pins the nasty childcare woman by the throat against a wall. But still, stabbing her birth mother to death, or zapping the German clone early on, is hard to follow, unless her clone-assassination 'job' is attributed only to brainwashing and dementia. It doesn't seem Helena slicing up the dude who has already started carving up a strung-up Sarah, or the bloody unseen butchering of those egg-robbing, finger-lopping guys in the garage, etc., can really counter all her actions. Makes her such a warm loving human being though.. -- John
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post #1062 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philw1776 View Post
Say what?
So if Helena killed our heroine it would be somewhat OK because she's a clone??? Who cares what the company claims.

It's not morally ambiguous to murder a human being who arose from cloning anymore than it is to kill one that arose from in vitro fertilization.

And what if she killed Cosima, well she's sick and possibly dying. WTF?

Then again, this is just a black humor television show.
Well, no, killing her seestra Sarah would be bad... but by the show's rules... the clones are "property" of Dyad... and if push came to shove, we've seen them send a lawyer in to clean up behind things... they could very easily (within the show's reality) invalidate the existence of any of those clones... I mean, they all have the same DNA except for the patent tweaks to identify them... In sci-fi shows like this, early clones and robots usually are treated by the law as "property" and "invention" more than they are life. It's just how these stories roll... there was even a time when Sarah herself actually tried to kill Helena, thought she had in fact, but Helena got better... and then Sarah would also have killed a clone club founding member!

Morality gets muddled... real-life science is far away from this, but scientists have discussed the ramifications of cloning. How about cloning for body parts... what if you set aside DNA to clone you replacement organs? At what point does that clone you funded the creation/growing of become its own person instead of your spart part backup? Real-life isn't going to have to deal with this for a long time, if ever... but everyone acknowledges the water gets muddy when you start tinkering with how babies are made.

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post #1063 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 06:38 PM
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Tatiana finally gets her well deserved Emmy nomination!

http://www.nytimes.com/live/emmy-nominations-2015/

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/...ry?id=32479252

Let's hope she wins over the same old-same old.
I shouldn't even be here, as I'm just a cord cutter awaiting the next season to go up on Amazon Prime

Glad I found your post before getting spoiled!

Just wanted to chime in and say congrats to Tatiana!

The Emmy Awards are improved by her being recognized.

If she doesn't win, they are just the closed loop farce, many accuse them of being
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post #1064 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 06:39 PM
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This show is amazing
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post #1065 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 08:14 PM
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Tatiana finally gets her well deserved Emmy nomination!

http://www.nytimes.com/live/emmy-nominations-2015/

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/...ry?id=32479252

Let's hope she wins over the same old-same old.
Cheers and Good Luck to Ms. Maslany. It's long overdue!
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post #1066 of 1075 Old 07-17-2015, 08:15 PM
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Bought the two-season Blu-ray set a while back...
How's the PQ on blu-ray? It's hard to watch the show on BBC-America cos the compression is so severe. I can tell the cinematography is nice, even through the murk.
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post #1067 of 1075 Old 07-18-2015, 05:57 AM
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How's the PQ on blu-ray? It's hard to watch the show on BBC-America cos the compression is so severe. I can tell the cinematography is nice, even through the murk.
Pretty good. Wouldn't disagree with anything in Blu-ray.com's write-up .


Thanks for the reminder BTW; hadn't occurred to me: Maybe if BBCA, via my gradually choking (3 versus the former 2 channels per QAM) Verizon FIOS source replays season 1 or 2 episodes, I'll DVR it and give both recordings my multiburst comparison tests to pinpoint effective or visible resolutions. I've been long awaiting a non-VOD replay of "The Tree of Life," originally from 35mm and a 4k-DI master to my Blu-ray, for such a resolution comparison.. -- John

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post #1068 of 1075 Old 07-19-2015, 10:47 AM
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BBC America released some humorous parody videos at last weekend's Comic Con in San Diego. Here they are:
EDIT: note, any of these videos posted below will have massive season 3 spoilers




And here is the complete Orphan Black panel discussion featuring most of the main actors, including Tatiana:



And a Fan (Family) Feud game with OB actors also from Comic Con



Edit: Just came across an additional interview panel done outside of the main Comic Con by Nerdist last weekend:


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post #1069 of 1075 Old 07-19-2015, 07:18 PM
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What a great show and Tatiana Maslany is beyond amazing and it is about time she got some credit with the Emmy nod. If she doesn't win then well, talk about a useless award.

I can actually say when I watch this show I BELIEVE that it is 5 different women who look the same rather than just one actress doing it all. I can't say that when I have watched other content of the same person taking on multiple roles or playing clones as in those cases I just see it as the same actor/actress. What I really like about her is the attention of detail she brings to the roles. You can see it when she is playing Sarah who is pretending to be someone else and she throws in a bit of the English accent at times rather than just mimicking the expected character's voice. So a non English accent actress playing a character with an English accent who imitates non English accent clones yet still has a bit of the accent showing through. That's good acting. She also just slightly changes the characters when they are pretending to be someone else which is another great attention to detail.

My ranking of the clones is like this

Helena (by far the best character for me in the show and one of my favourites in any show. She's awesome)
Alison
Cosima
Sarah
Rachel
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post #1070 of 1075 Old 07-21-2015, 04:32 PM
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What a great show and Tatiana Maslany is beyond amazing and it is about time she got some credit with the Emmy nod. If she doesn't win then well, talk about a useless award.

I can actually say when I watch this show I BELIEVE that it is 5 different women who look the same rather than just one actress doing it all. I can't say that when I have watched other content of the same person taking on multiple roles or playing clones as in those cases I just see it as the same actor/actress. What I really like about her is the attention of detail she brings to the roles. You can see it when she is playing Sarah who is pretending to be someone else and she throws in a bit of the English accent at times rather than just mimicking the expected character's voice. So a non English accent actress playing a character with an English accent who imitates non English accent clones yet still has a bit of the accent showing through. That's good acting. She also just slightly changes the characters when they are pretending to be someone else which is another great attention to detail.

My ranking of the clones is like this

Helena (by far the best character for me in the show and one of my favourites in any show. She's awesome)
Alison
Cosima
Sarah
Rachel
I'm gradually re-watching season 1 and 2, and I still forget when there are multiple clones in the same scene that it's the same actress. When it's done in certain movies or TV shows, it's almost as if part of the humor or gimmick is that the viewer is very well aware that it's the same actor (like Eddie Murphy, Tyler Perry, or Adam Sandler).
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post #1071 of 1075 Old Yesterday, 02:03 PM
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OTOH, there is usually retribution for violating TV's unwritten moral code about killing people, so... my prediction is when the show finally wraps, Alison and Donnie will also get their just desserts and end up dead. Remember, you heard it first here.
I think they will end up in jail, that's much more embarrassing. I'm pretty sure Alison would rather die.
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post #1072 of 1075 Old Today, 07:42 AM
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I think they will end up in jail, that's much more embarrassing. I'm pretty sure Alison would rather die.

Alison is a survivor and can adapt. From drug dealer Alison to School Board Alison in one season. She would probably be Queen Bee of the prison after a while.
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post #1073 of 1075 Old Today, 09:37 AM
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Alison is a survivor and can adapt. From drug dealer Alison to School Board Alison in one season. She would probably be Queen Bee of the prison after a while.
Orange is the New Orphan Black.
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post #1074 of 1075 Unread Today, 12:22 PM
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Orange is the New Orphan Black.
Orphan is the new Black.
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post #1075 of 1075 Unread Today, 02:21 PM
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It does not appear that Alison was legally required to render aid, in Ontario. Check out Wikipedia "Duty to Rescue" topic by state or province. In surprisingly few circumstances are you under legal obligation to rescue a dying person, and in most cases your obligation is limited -- often meaning only that you must contact law enforcement, not that you have to rescue the person yourself. Duty to rescue seems to be under special circumstances -- e.g., it's your spouse, your child, your invited guest, or your commercial business that caused the potential harm.

Alison appears to be in legal trouble only for helping Donnie hide the body of the man Donnie shot by accident -- and Donnie's crime would likely be manslaughter, not murder. If it's involuntary manslaughter, he might not even get jail time, although hiding the body will have additional penalties. He could even argue it was a clone who got accidentally shot, since the corporation must already have bogus evidence that he died from heart attack on a company plane. And didn't Alison fax Rachel the agreement that essentially made her patented property? If she's property, maybe she can't be held responsible, and if the court decides she's not property, it's still a reasonable defense.
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