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stevew24963's Avatar stevew24963 10:00 AM 08-13-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
Honda is back next year powering McLaren !!!


Honda has years of experience with turbocharge racing engines and I expect that they will copy Mercedes turbo design.


So we likely will see a real contest again.
While it will be good to see Honda back,I seriously doubt they will copy Mercedes. Honda always does there own thing.

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trumperZ06's Avatar trumperZ06 11:17 AM 08-13-2014
The Mercedes turbocharger unit is split into two sections...


The impeller is at the aft end of the engine using engine exhaust to drive the compressor located at the forward section using a drive shaft.


This reduces heat there by increasing horsepower.


Expect other engine manufacturers to follow.


This is the "simple" explanation" !!!
BGLeduc's Avatar BGLeduc 11:47 AM 08-13-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
The Mercedes turbocharger unit is split into two sections...


The impeller is at the aft end of the engine using engine exhaust to drive the compressor located at the forward section using a drive shaft.


This reduces heat there by increasing horsepower.


Expect other engine manufacturers to follow.


This is the "simple" explanation" !!!
I think when this came to light earlier this season, it was debunked as being a significant advancement, and IIRC, either Ferrari or Renault were actually doing something similar. If you read back a few months in the thread, I think we had some discussion about it.
BGLeduc's Avatar BGLeduc 12:29 PM 08-13-2014
Massa makes it to TheChive:

http://thechive.com/2014/08/13/dont-...out-37-photos/

He is down toward the end of the gallery.

Be forewarned, the photo gallery I am linking is completely family friendly, but the site itself has some low level T&A and other content that would probably be considered NSFW in most companies.
Tack's Avatar Tack 12:29 PM 08-13-2014
Yeah, it's not so much what they did but how they did it. Obviously they nailed just about everything.
trumperZ06's Avatar trumperZ06 03:49 PM 08-13-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post
I think when this came to light earlier this season, it was debunked as being a significant advancement, and IIRC, either Ferrari or Renault were actually doing something similar. If you read back a few months in the thread, I think we had some discussion about it.
F1 engine rules restricted other engine manufacturers from making changes this year,


Caution regarding competitors downplaying improved designs that they didn't develop seems to be in order.


Honda should be as advanced with turbocharged race engines as anyone. Wonder what they will bring to the table.


In a few months we'll see who... if any other engine manufacturers... copy the Mercedes design.
Tack's Avatar Tack 07:58 PM 08-13-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
F1 engine rules restricted other engine manufacturers from making changes this year,
ALL manufacturers are subject to this rule.


Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
Caution regarding competitors downplaying improved designs that they didn't develop seems to be in order.






Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
Honda should be as advanced with turbocharged race engines as anyone. Wonder what they will bring to the table.


In a few months we'll see who... if any other engine manufacturers... copy the Mercedes design.
Honda, after a lifetime of being accused of copying, has been intent on showing that it doesn't need any outside influence to produce state of the art designs. They are actually kind of particular about that. Their design will stand on it's own for better or worse.




Sharp1080's Avatar Sharp1080 09:46 PM 08-13-2014
Just look at what Honda accomplishes in MotoGP! State of the art race bikes that others are copying. I'm sure they have a good idea on what to build to be competitive in F-1..
Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007 10:36 PM 08-13-2014
Bah! Japanese excrement.
stevew24963's Avatar stevew24963 03:06 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
Bah! Japanese excrement.
[emoji107]

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BGLeduc's Avatar BGLeduc 05:55 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
Bah! Japanese excrement.
Not to be confused with the current offering of Italian and French excrement? :-)

Seems like the only non-excremental power plant on the grid today is the Kraut motor, and even that comes up short in the wrong chassis.

Anyone dispariging Honda does so at their own risk, IMHO. But if the Macca chassis remains the crapwagon it is now, it won't matter if Honda produces a motor on equal terms with the Merc.

I look forward to seeing what the Rice-boys are able to do. Back in the day I had an Integra Type R, and that 1.8 VTEC mill was a damn sweet motor. Honda knows what they are doing.
Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007 07:04 AM 08-14-2014
Youre right of course. My brother had an Integra. Nice ride.
Honda does well in IndyCar so no reason they cant do well in F1. If F1 is fortunate enough maybe some of Hondas IndyCar technology will trickle down to F1.
stevew24963's Avatar stevew24963 07:05 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
Youre right of course. My brother had an Integra. Nice ride.
Honda does well in IndyCar so no reason they cant do well in F1. If F1 is fortunate enough maybe some of Hondas IndyCar technology will trickle down to F1.
LOL [emoji2]

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Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007 07:06 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevew24963 View Post
LOL [emoji2]

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Get back to work.
Scott Simonian's Avatar Scott Simonian 08:49 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
Bah! Japanese excrement.
Ahem!




lobosrul's Avatar lobosrul 09:02 AM 08-14-2014
Whenever someone mentions Honda I have to intentionally clear my personal bias. I immediately think of all the kids around here who have modded their Civic with a ridiculous spoiler, and their muffler, so it sounds all loud and horrible (like the a-whole who lives across my street and wakes me up at 2AM from time to time). I think perhaps Bond has a similar experience.
stevew24963's Avatar stevew24963 09:04 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by lobosrul View Post
Whenever someone mentions Honda I have to intentionally clear my personal bias. I immediately think of all the kids around here who have modded their Civic with a ridiculous spoiler, and their muffler, so it sounds all loud and horrible (like the a-whole who lives across my street and wakes me up at 2AM from time to time). I think perhaps Bond has a similar experience.
Mr. Bond is just a bitter person.[emoji15] Going back to work.😄

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Scott Simonian's Avatar Scott Simonian 09:21 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by lobosrul View Post
Whenever someone mentions Honda I have to intentionally clear my personal bias. I immediately think of all the kids around here who have modded their Civic with a ridiculous spoiler, and their muffler, so it sounds all loud and horrible (like the a-whole who lives across my street and wakes me up at 2AM from time to time). I think perhaps Bond has a similar experience.
Trust me I hear ya on that front. Too much of that going on around here as well.

But... I could say the same thing for pretty much any kind of car that attracts the young and dumb. Lol and not always young either.
trumperZ06's Avatar trumperZ06 09:29 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tack View Post
ALL manufacturers are subject to this rule.












Honda, after a lifetime of being accused of copying, has been intent on showing that it doesn't need any outside influence to produce state of the art designs. They are actually kind of particular about that. Their design will stand on it's own for better or worse.






Hhmmmm.... Honda won't copy....


Where do you get your information?


Honda changed from using a large SINGLE TURBO indy car set up to....


using TWO smaller turbos for this year's (2014) Indy Series.


This follows Chevy's (Ilmor racing) design which has been using twin turbo's which is


now in it's... THIRD GENERATION !!!


If you don't understand why a twin turbo set up is preferred.... smaller turbos "spool up faster"


do your homework !!!
gprace's Avatar gprace 09:35 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by lobosrul View Post
Whenever someone mentions Honda I have to intentionally clear my personal bias. I immediately think of all the kids around here who have modded their Civic with a ridiculous spoiler, and their muffler, so it sounds all loud and horrible (like the a-whole who lives across my street and wakes me up at 2AM from time to time). I think perhaps Bond has a similar experience.
For some time I was involved in supplying these exhaust systems, wheels, accessories, etc. This is true, at times it can be annoying, but I have seen many of these mature into the BMW and Porsche (used as well as new) owners as they matured in the past 10 years. Also remember that they are not only driving Hondas as I have seen many VWs set up the same way. Some now even participate in track days and SCCA racing.
Tack's Avatar Tack 09:49 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
Bah! Japanese excrement.



stevew24963's Avatar stevew24963 09:50 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
Hhmmmm.... Honda won't copy....


Where do you get your information?


Honda changed from using a large SINGLE TURBO indy car set up to....


using TWO smaller turbos for this year's (2014) Indy Series.


This follows Chevy's (Ilmor racing) design which has been using twin turbo's which is


now in it's... THIRD GENERATION !!!


If you don't understand why a twin turbo set up is preferred.... smaller turbos "spool up faster"


do your homework !!!
The two turbo is mandated by the rules. Not the same as copying

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Tack's Avatar Tack 09:54 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
Hhmmmm.... Honda won't copy....


Where do you get your information?


Honda changed from using a large SINGLE TURBO indy car set up to....


using TWO smaller turbos for this year's (2014) Indy Series.


This follows Chevy's (Ilmor racing) design which has been using twin turbo's which is


now in it's... THIRD GENERATION !!!
I suppose if we are considering twin turbos a "design" then you must be correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trumperZ06 View Post
If you don't understand why a twin turbo set up is preferred.... smaller turbos "spool up faster"


do your homework !!!
Of course I know why a twin turbo set up is preferred. Its MOAR TURBO!



Thanks for being a good sport
Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007 10:24 AM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevew24963 View Post
Mr. Bond is just a bitter person.😄
Darn tootin'! And its all Tacks fault.
Now go back to work.
BGLeduc's Avatar BGLeduc 09:22 PM 08-14-2014
I note that Spa quali is live on CNBC, then tape delayed on NBCS.

When I was checking my guide data, I also found a 30 minute documentary on CNBW called One Second In:F1 Racing. It airs on 8/23 at 6:30 Eastern. No clue what this is. The guide info shows that it first aired in May. Clearly I missed it.
Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007 09:26 PM 08-14-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post
I note that Spa quali is live on CNBC, then tape delayed on NBCS.

When I was checking my guide date, I also found a 30 minute documentary on CNBW called One Second In:F1 Racing. It airs on 8/23 at 6:30 Eastern. No clue what this is. The guide info shows that it first aired in May. Clearly I missed it.
Thanks for the heads up.
BGLeduc's Avatar BGLeduc 06:23 AM 08-15-2014
Time to fess up. Which one of you Tifosi threw down on this car:

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/171161.html
Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007 06:33 AM 08-15-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by BGLeduc View Post
Time to fess up. Which one of you Tifosi threw down on this car:

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/171161.html
I read in an article a while back that someone paid $42 mil for one in a private sale. Its been the record setter at auction for quite a while. I remember a guy paid $25 mil for one back in the 80s. They made very few of them (less than 10?) so it seems strange that they seem to get sold fairly often.
gwsat's Avatar gwsat 09:44 AM 08-15-2014
Thanks indeed to BGLeduc for the heads up that Spa qualifying is being carried live on MSNBC! I checked it myself a couple of days ago but didn't find it.
Scott Simonian's Avatar Scott Simonian 09:46 AM 08-15-2014
Yes, thank you! I don't want to miss any race at SPA.
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